Bashing the P0rnz

[Canadamus Prime]

Violent crime is down. People are waiting longer to get pregnant. Condoms are more available than ever.

Sex is the most natural thing in the world. Wanting to fuck as much as you can as often as you can is in our DNA.

There is no problem here.

I guess the emotional/intimate aspect of sex is easily thrown around these days.

Discuss.

I'm currently in a long-term relationship with the love of my life, whom I've known for twelve years. I know all about the emotional side of sex.

Porn =/= real sex =/= love.

Lest I misunderstood, that was part of the OP's whole point. Porn is a piss poor introduction to sexuality.

Personally I will never understand porn, why the hell would anyone want to see that shit??
I can understand the appeal of a nude woman, but the sight of another man's junk makes me queasy.

 

[Gentile]

.................are you debating that people watch porn, that we should expose our children to sex ed earlier, or that porn is good/evil? I got confused reading and didn't click the link.

But yeah, sex is natural, the consequences are the results of the act itself, and "I'm fairly sure if they took porn off the internet there'd only be one website left and it'd be called Bring Back the Porn" - Dr Perry Cox, Scrubs.

I never quite believed in taking people's desires away, even if it is something in which I am against. Free choice is something that I have to respect if I expect others to respect me for making my choices.

/Proof http://www.spike.com/video/truth-about-internet/3052562

I kind of quit taking you seriously after you posted a from Spike TV link...(Which is a hugely sexualized site IMO)

OT: I wouldn't actually say that children are exposed to sex for the first time through Pornography. Every single person that I know well was first exposed to sex with all this talk about "condoms" and "boners"....notice how I said "condoms"?

Your claims of all teenagers now being "hedonistic" are kind of over-blown. Sure, a lot of us want sex at this age, but that doesn't actually mean that we all just go out and fuck whenever we feel like. It's more common for people to just whack it off(which is what the afromentioned porn is for), and not have to deal with the potential STDs and pregnancy. I know this because I AM a teenager in a pretty "sexualized" highschool.

As for the exploitation of pornstars, 95 times out of a hundred they have willingly walked into the industry, so they're obviously prepared to get an STD, get railed in the ass, and fake moaning for hours on end. Only pornstars really have sex with pornstars, so it isn't like they're spreading a lot of it. They also have birth control that they require the stars to take, and government enforced AIDS tests that they need to take once every month.

All that being said, I'd rather have a generation of kids fapping off to consenting adults having sex in front of camera instead of becoming promiscuous and doing sexual acts on camera themselves.

I used the link because it featured semi-erotic imagery as well as a bunch of statistics - which I thought would appeal to you~ But I guess you focus on the superficial.

condoms and boners are probably ideas that they got somewhere on the web anyway. Personally, I never even heard about those terms prior to moving to North America from Thailand at age 9, but I did view porn as a young kid back then.

whacking off is essentially a hedonistic activity isn't it? You can argue that it's the safest form of sex but that doesn't explain how I am wrong to assume (based on personal observations) that many high school students these days have developed a strong affinity for physical pleasures.

As for your last point, you give a statistic that basically says "95% of people would like to suffer irreversible physical and emotional damage to make a living." But I guess we're not pornstars - we're real human beings, so we don't need to care about them.

 

[Ham_authority95]

Yeah, porn and prostitution are two different things. The only commonalities are that sex is involved and they're considered paying work. Working conditions and standards are entirely different.

This very much true. Pornography, is a regulated, standardized industry. There are birth control pills that are enforced to be taken. There are contracts outlining EXACTLY what the porn actor will be doing. STD tests are given regularly.

With pure, unadulterated street prostitution, there is NO regulation because it's illegal in most countries. It happens all on street level, and the street can be a dirty place.

 

[Gentile]

Err... I actually pretty much agree with this.
I know a lot of people who have excellent self control when it comes to sex as well.

Define "excellent self control."

 

[Nouw]

SNIP

In the U.S, all violent crime is down - it's as low as it has been since the 70's.

Google around for the facts

And although violence is natural, without sex we wouldn't be here. Thus, sex > violence.

Thank you, always good to have a nice response.

And also, without violence we wouldn't be here either.
Our ancestors hunted for food, we can reproduce all we want but without violence we wouldn't have any means of nutrition.

 

[Gentile]

A non issue for you, an issue perhaps for others. Move on, and have a good day~

Can I please comment on your tone? You sound very hostile. Why would you assume all viewers of this site also view porn? And why would you also seem to assume that they are going to leap to the defense of porn?

You seem to be saying that porn is bad. But you really haven't given many reasons except that children can access it on the internet and thusly lose their innocence, and that you wouldn't want any relative of yours to be an actor in such videos.

The first reason can be countered with the fact porn sites always ask you if you're over 18 when trying to view their videos. If a child answers "yes", isn't that their fault - or, more accurately, the fault of their parents who are not supervising their browsing or giving them guidelines to follow whilst on the net? I'm much more in favour of education over prohibition.

And if you wouldn't want to see a relative of yours in porn, why wouldn't you support them to get out of such a business, instead of condemning? There's multiple reasons why someone would do such work. In the end, if it's of their own free will, they must be left to do it. If it's from neccessity, condemnation will never work. Why not find (or found) some organisation that works with such people and support them?

I personally don't watch porn, nor enjoy it. But I cannot sympathise with you, maybe because I don't identify with your concerns.

- Sexual promiscuity being promoted
- Sexually transmitted infections
- Emotional strain
- Abortions
- Serious implications on people's spiritual lives (AKA Religious People)

 

[Something Amyss]

It has perhaps unintentionally become the main outlet by which children get introduced to sexuality these days.

Really? I'd say the prevalence of television still has a lock on that. I have trouble believing teh pronz are more a part of the problem than racy programming and even exposure in public.

Which seems to give public schools greater incentive to lower the grade in which sexual education begins.

Oddly enough, the "lowered grades" seem to be higher than when I was in school.

My take on your normal teenager in high school is that they are essentially hedonists, although most try to hide that fact. If you have any historical perspective on this sort of thing, its actually a recent development in the free world.

That's like saying homosexuality is new because of the lack of historical prevalence in our culture. Teens have historically been hedonists; what's changed is how honest we are about it. Rates of STIs and teen pregnancy are lower in places with a more open policy towards sex for some odd reason.

I could go on to talk about the effect of the industry on the actors and actresses involved, but i'm sure we can all agree that we would definitely not wish for anybody we care about to be involved in this business for their own good. What with all the chances of diseases, unwanted pregnancy, physical and emotional turmoil, and such. Right? :]

Where to begin....

I'm not sure where all this came from, honestly. Assumption? Everything I've read on STIs in the porn industry indicates it's an amazingly self-regulating industry. There's probably a good reason for that: One AIDS outbreak could virtually destroy them. There doesn't seem to be much pregnancy outside of fetishists, and that's hardly due to any form of rampant sex. And to both issues, the rise of the number of condoms used in porn is pretty self-evident.

As far as physical and emotional turmoil, there's a tendency for porn stars to come from broken homes, but I know of little to support the notion that porn causes emotional turmoil. People aren't readily forced into porn outside of socio-economic reasons, and hardly made to stay if there's abuse involved. And honestly, I'd rather my child grew up and decided to become a porn starlet than grew up being the product of a broken home.

I'd rather neither, but the problem isn't so much the industry as it is why they tend to be there.

I can see arguments against pornography. I can see the argument that it's exploitative and degrading to women (I disagree, at the very least that it all is). I can see the argument that it creates unrealistic expectations (I agree) and promotes unheathly body images (Agreed, but considering other media does the same....). I can see the argument that it's disgusting (but all good sex should be), and so on. But I'm not seeing the plausibility of your case against porn.

And this isn't just because I enjoy porn. It's because it seems as specious as the "video games cause violence" argument.

 

[Ham_authority95]

whacking off is essentially a hedonistic activity isn't it? You can argue that it's the safest form of sex but that doesn't explain how I am wrong to assume (based on personal observations) that many high school students these days have developed a strong affinity for physical pleasures.

Fair enough. I mistook your use of the word "hedonism" to be entirely negative...

Yes, they may engage in quick-fix desire fulfillment, but once they get into a true romantic relationship, they'll find out that sex is more than just cum and orgasms.

As for your last point, you give a statistic that basically says "95% of people would like to suffer irreversible physical and emotional damage to make a living." But I guess we're not pornstars - we're real human beings, so we don't need to care about them.

The thing about this is, they really don't suffer as much emotional trauma as you think(although after years on end as a porn star, your body will turn into a prune). Word would spread quickly if tons of porn stars developed post-traumatic stress disorder or similar emotional conditions.

That being said, most people that enter the adult industry are scared off pretty quickly by it because it isn't for them. Those that stay most likely don't have any emotional damage.

 

[Gentile]

It has perhaps unintentionally become the main outlet by which children get introduced to sexuality these days.

Really? I'd say the prevalence of television still has a lock on that. I have trouble believing teh pronz are more a part of the problem than racy programming and even exposure in public.

Which seems to give public schools greater incentive to lower the grade in which sexual education begins.

Oddly enough, the "lowered grades" seem to be higher than when I was in school.

My take on your normal teenager in high school is that they are essentially hedonists, although most try to hide that fact. If you have any historical perspective on this sort of thing, its actually a recent development in the free world.

That's like saying homosexuality is new because of the lack of historical prevalence in our culture. Teens have historically been hedonists; what's changed is how honest we are about it. Rates of STIs and teen pregnancy are lower in places with a more open policy towards sex for some odd reason.

I could go on to talk about the effect of the industry on the actors and actresses involved, but i'm sure we can all agree that we would definitely not wish for anybody we care about to be involved in this business for their own good. What with all the chances of diseases, unwanted pregnancy, physical and emotional turmoil, and such. Right? :]

Where to begin....

I'm not sure where all this came from, honestly. Assumption? Everything I've read on STIs in the porn industry indicates it's an amazingly self-regulating industry. There's probably a good reason for that: One AIDS outbreak could virtually destroy them. There doesn't seem to be much pregnancy outside of fetishists, and that's hardly due to any form of rampant sex. And to both issues, the rise of the number of condoms used in porn is pretty self-evident.

As far as physical and emotional turmoil, there's a tendency for porn stars to come from broken homes, but I know of little to support the notion that porn causes emotional turmoil. People aren't readily forced into porn outside of socio-economic reasons, and hardly made to stay if there's abuse involved. And honestly, I'd rather my child grew up and decided to become a porn starlet than grew up being the product of a broken home.

I'd rather neither, but the problem isn't so much the industry as it is why they tend to be there.

I can see arguments against pornography. I can see the argument that it's exploitative and degrading to women (I disagree, at the very least that it all is). I can see the argument that it creates unrealistic expectations (I agree) and promotes unheathly body images (Agreed, but considering other media does the same....). I can see the argument that it's disgusting (but all good sex should be), and so on. But I'm not seeing the plausibility of your case against porn.

And this isn't just because I enjoy porn. It's because it seems as specious as the "video games cause violence" argument.

Television only does so much because everybody has access to it. It's what people do when they're alone that really shows who they are. And what they're really into.

Sexual education begins at grade 3 where I am from, And I went through it in grade 5. Maybe it's a regional thing.

Shockingly, I do have plenty of friends who have a greater affinity for spiritual wellness as opposed to physical pleasure. There was a time not too long ago where sex was taboo to the point where people can at least respect the fact that there is a time and place to talk about it. Oh, by the way - you should also know that I am of the belief that it is important for boys to work toward being fathers. Meaning that if the basic instinct is hedonism, then sexual promiscuity would seem far more tempting than sleeping with a wife for the rest of his life.

As for your last point. All I have to say is - do your research on retired pornstars. Please.

 

[SL33TBL1ND]

I was under the impression that it only took up 1%. At least that's what they said on QI. They also mentioned the most of the internet was taken up by spam.

That's sad. Clearly the internet requires more porn.

No arguments here.

 

[Gentile]

Television only does so much because everybody has access to it. It's what people do when they're alone that really shows who they are. And what they're really into.

Sexual education begins at grade 3 where I am from, And I went through it in grade 5. Maybe it's a regional thing.

Shockingly, I do have plenty of friends who have a greater affinity for spiritual wellness as opposed to physical pleasure. There was a time not too long ago where sex was taboo to the point where people can at least respect the fact that there is a time and place to talk about it. Oh, by the way - you should also know that I am of the belief that it is important for boys to work toward being fathers. Meaning that if the basic instinct is hedonism, then sexual promiscuity would seem far more tempting than sleeping with a wife for the rest of his life.

As for your last point. All I have to say is - do your research on retired pornstars. Please.

I digress. People have access to television in a PUBLIC setting as well as private. Porn is almost entirely for private viewing.

 

[RaphaelsRedemption]

A non issue for you, an issue perhaps for others. Move on, and have a good day~

Can I please comment on your tone? You sound very hostile. Why would you assume all viewers of this site also view porn? And why would you also seem to assume that they are going to leap to the defense of porn?

You seem to be saying that porn is bad. But you really haven't given many reasons except that children can access it on the internet and thusly lose their innocence, and that you wouldn't want any relative of yours to be an actor in such videos.

The first reason can be countered with the fact porn sites always ask you if you're over 18 when trying to view their videos. If a child answers "yes", isn't that their fault - or, more accurately, the fault of their parents who are not supervising their browsing or giving them guidelines to follow whilst on the net? I'm much more in favour of education over prohibition.

And if you wouldn't want to see a relative of yours in porn, why wouldn't you support them to get out of such a business, instead of condemning? There's multiple reasons why someone would do such work. In the end, if it's of their own free will, they must be left to do it. If it's from neccessity, condemnation will never work. Why not find (or found) some organisation that works with such people and support them?

I personally don't watch porn, nor enjoy it. But I cannot sympathise with you, maybe because I don't identify with your concerns.

- Sexual promiscuity being promoted
- Sexually transmitted infections
- Emotional strain
- Abortions
- Serious implications on people's spiritual lives (AKA Religious People)

Ok, thanks for expanding. However, while you have given me a list of concerns that may be related to the prevalence of porn, you haven't really explained what you would do with porn. Even if it is directly responsible for all those concerns, would you ban porn? Would you make it illegal? What are you going to do about it?

As far as I can tell from your posts, you are very worried about porn, particularly on young people today, and on the effect it may have on their behaviour. You seem to be discussing this on this forum - maybe to educate people about the negative follow-on effects of viewing porn?

I could argue each concern is not directly the result of viewing porn. But, I going to assume each one is true. Even if it is so, how do we handle something without limiting people's freedoms? If a person is old enough to make decisions for themselves, who are we to dictate what they can and cannot view? I know of some places that do this. One of them is called China. Are you really advocating we take an approach of censoring everything that we personally do not agree with?

Are you advocating scare tactics? Tell people just how bad viewing porn can be for them? Thats commendable (assuming, of course, you really can link porn to issues such as abortion and STD's). However, history will show us that such tactics are usually ineffective. People know smoking is bad for them. However, there are still smokers. You may find a similar effect if a large-scale scare compaign against porn is put into motion.

So, before I go further, what would you do? I know I take responsibility for myself and regulate my own viewing habits, but I would be profoundly uncomfortable with making such decisions for others.

 

[OptimisticPessimist]

As a young person that was introduced to sexuality at a young age through pornography, I can honestly say...it's really not that big a fucking deal. Actually, now that I think about it, it's probably benefitted me sexually. I mean, not only have I had more time to become comfortable with sexuality, but I know more about the act itself. Speaking of which, why do opponents of porn always seem to think that young people are stupid enough to be confused by it? Granted, my generation isn't the brighteset ever, but I've never met a single one of my peers that mistook pornography for an accurate analogue for sex in the real world; or if they did, they were swiftly disillutioned.
As for concerns about people participating in the porn industry itself, sure it's probably unpleasant at times, but then again how many porn stars do you know? I'm guessing none. For all the average guy knows, it's the best job ever. On the other hand, let's say it is as horrible and gritty as some people seem to think. From a practical standpoint, how is it any different from any other unpleasant or dangerous occupation?
I guess my point in this is...what's the big deal?

 

[Ham_authority95]

Shockingly, I do have plenty of friends who have a greater affinity for spiritual wellness as opposed to physical pleasure. There was a time not too long ago where sex was taboo to the point where people can at least respect the fact that there is a time and place to talk about it. Oh, by the way - you should also know that I am of the belief that it is important for boys to work toward being fathers. Meaning that if the basic instinct is hedonism, then sexual promiscuity would seem far more tempting than sleeping with a wife for the rest of his life.

As for your last point. All I have to say is - do your research on retired pornstars. Please.

The highlighted section point to you having traditional values, yes? Because if you do have traditional values, coming to a Gaming forum won't promote much discussion into considering your own beliefs because ours are so much different than yours.

 

[Madara XIII]

Porn only makes up 12% of the internet?

....is this the same internet they're talking about!?

 

[Something Amyss]

I'm currently in a long-term relationship with the love of my life, whom I've known for twelve years. I know all about the emotional side of sex.

Porn =/= real sex =/= love.

Indeed. It's possible to enjoy casual sex and still have actual emotional intimacy. Probably not very successfully at once, but I've never tried.

Also where is the proof that violent crime is down? Sorry if I sound a bit demanding, I'm just tired of people voicing their opinion and slapping it on the wall of 'facts.'

The Bureau of Justice is likely her source. The numbers are a bit outdated, but the thirty year low number based on those statistics is correct.

Lest I misunderstood, that was part of the OP's whole point. Porn is a piss poor introduction to sexuality.

Personally I will never understand porn, why the hell would anyone want to see that shit??
I can understand the appeal of a nude woman, but the sight of another man's junk makes me queasy.

Another part of his point was that it was a primary introduction. What he said that's wrong seems to overshadow anything potentially agreeable.

As for porn, I've always found heterosexual sex slightly squicky to begin with, but I've never gotten the appeal of a guy watching another guy having sex. Especially with how homophobic male culture is. Then again, I can see the appeal to some other types...

>.>

condoms and boners are probably ideas that they got somewhere on the web anyway. Personally, I never even heard about those terms prior to moving to North America from Thailand at age 9, but I did view porn as a young kid back then.

I heard about boners and condoms by the age of nine, and we hadn't even hit the 90s yet. Really, at that point you had to find your dad's skin mags under the bed, if he had any for you to even find (mine didn't, or was more clever in hiding them). This stuff was perpetuated around schoolyards in the 80s without the assistance of internet porn.

This all seems rather presumptuous.

 

[Madara XIII]

Meh, in my opinion I find it distasteful and though some may see it as entertainment, that's their thing. I can't change peoples opinions on it, but mine stays firm.

 

[Worgen]

historicly kids have probably been exposed to sex much younger then they are today even with porn considering that for more of human history families would live together in single room houses

think about that for a min