Before you go defending Phil Fish...

[NiPah]

How about you stop going out of your way to hate him. I don't think there's a single person on the internet who'd keep up this witch hunt if they had to go through what he's gone through recently. This "fuck everyone and everything that isn't perfect forever" mindset is literally the worst part of the gaming community.

EDIT: Not saying he doesn't deserve criticism, before someone brings that up.

Blind siding an obviously nervous fan who was respectfully asking a question is pretty damn far from perfect, any hate garnered from this is well earned. The guy uses being an edgy asshole to get mass amounts of PR, it's just a trick to get more money and to have more people buy his games/products.

Don't start crying foul on the gaming community when it outs an asshole (god just saying gaming community makes me feel dirty), he's been stoking this fire and it's become exactly what he wants it to be: big enough for people like us to talk about him when he and his little game should be ignored.

And it's fucking working, I hate this hive mind mentality but even I have to admit defeat and call him out on being a shit, otherwise some random internet user may not know my useless opinion.

 

[RaikuFA]

No one is going to bring up that incident where he lied to judges at a indie festival so he could win?

 

[Awesomesauce123]

No one is going to bring up that incident where he lied to judges at a indie festival so he could win?

I've never heard about this. What did he say?

 

[Lunar Templar]

why would I defend some one I've never met, had no interest in, and have never heard anything good about besides his game didn't suck?

 

[WoW Killer]

The answer is 'yes.' Pretty much the only time you will see a Japanese indie game in English is through a fan translation, and that means most of the English-speaking gaming community will never here about them at all. 　A lot of Japanese indie games are made with even smaller teams and fewer resources than their Western counterparts, and a fair number of them don't even end up being sold for profit. Unless the people in that video can read Japanese, it is literally impossible for them to have any idea what they are talking about. They can't even talk about non-indie Japanese games, because a pretty significant number of those never leave Japan either.

Yes, that's what I was thinking. But anyway, I should probably reiterate my earlier point (not directing this at you, obviously). They weren't asked to compare Japanese indie games to Western (how I hate that term) indie games. What they were asked to compare is older Japanese games with more modern Japanese games. Somehow the topic got on towards the aforementioned (and this wasn't anything to do with Phil Fish btw). So yeah, I have to see this as pretty innocent banter. This definitely isn't incriminating evidence against Fish (and I've no idea why certain people would suggest it's Fish taking down videos).

BTW, this whole thing with being rude because it's cool: I've put this accusation towards a certain big YouTuber in the past and a lot of people on this site seem to be fine with it. I don't think particularly that Fish or anybody else in that video were being purposely rude however. I know when somebody is being purposefully rude. There is a lot of that out there, I'll admit - it's the whole Gordon Ramsay effect (or so the perpetrators would have you think; mostly they're just being rude without being charming) - but you can tell when someone is rude or abrasive because they're under pressure (from customers) as opposed to being rude for the sake of it. I've worked in customer service for a long time so I suppose I know a bit more about how to handle people. Sometimes you see people who don't know what they're doing and they fuck up, but you see certain people who seem to know where the lines are and purposefully cross them. Seriously, there's a difference.

 

[Mike Richards]

The problem with discussing things like this is if you say Fish is known to act like kind of a dick, it automatically makes it sound like the people on the internet he interacts with aren't, and the other way around. The real issue is that there are dicks and assholes on both sides, and calling out one doesn't immediately salvage or damn the other.

Fish frequently sounds like a combative, aggressive, pompous, arrogant douche. I have no way of knowing if that's really what he's like but that's more or less how he's come across in everything I've ever seen of him, which to be fair is not much but the point still stands.

Likewise the internet is fucking overflowing with aggressive, arrogant, mind-shatteringly idiotic people. As more then a few people have pointed out lately in the wake of things like this or that COD balancing thing, the gaming community doesn't always put out a very good image of itself and we aren't always very kind to the people who create and maintain our hobby.

If he wants to leave the industry that's his call, best of luck in whatever he does next. But I don't think he gets a pass to act whiny and obnoxious about it because people were assholes to him. On the other hand, we as gamers don't get to issue death threats because they slightly changed the stats of a gun we liked or we got an ending we were disappointed in.

Basically, everyone across the board needs to just chill the fuck out, grow the fuck up, and get some damn perspective.

 

[RaikuFA]

No one is going to bring up that incident where he lied to judges at a indie festival so he could win?

I've never heard about this. What did he say?

He voted against everyone else then he told judges that other games in the competition were being published by big developers(thus not making them indie). I dunno if any were disqualified but he still won. Also didn't help that people who worked on Fez were judges.

 

[Caiphus]

They didn't seem too dickish to me. Slightly unfortunate for the friendly, trembling, Asian man who asked the question, but at least they were honest, albeit brutally so. Phil was clearly the worst of the group, but worthy of internet hate? Well, I guess internet hate gets doled out rather arbitrarily, so whether he deserves it might not actually be all that relevant.

Who was the well spoken man sitting to the right of the lectern though? The one who looks suspiciously like Gabe from Penny Arcade.

 

[The Preened Mr. Fust]

The problem folks is that the criticism was entirely unwarranted, it had no place. He did not ask Fish about this thoughts on Japanese games, he asked Fish what about Japanese games inspired him.

We clear on that? He attacked the guy for absolutely no reason, and that's why there's a witch-hunt and it's deserved.

 

[Caiphus]

The problem folks is that the criticism was entirely unwarranted, it had no place. He did not ask Fish about this thoughts on Japanese games, he asked Fish what about Japanese games inspired him.

We clear on that? He attacked the guy for absolutely no reason, and that's why there's a witch-hunt and it's deserved.

Well, the Japanese man's actual question was "What do you think about recent Japanese games?"

 

[SomebodyNowhere]

I've seen someone post that video before and while I don't know much about him it seems as though Mr. Fish's initial response is part of his sense of humor. He's blunt and a fair bit dickish, but while he could have been a bit softer in delivering his answer that would have been contrary to the strength of his apparent viewpoint on the issue.

 

[The Preened Mr. Fust]

Actually, I'm putting this out there so people know about and it is working just as I'd hoped.

Someone mentioned the similarities between Cave Story and Fez, here's something I came across: (Warning: Image contains potentially inflammatory words)
http://24.media.tumblr.com/b9642573cdf6d2092193f8ca017995ea/tumblr_mloc313hHa1qhmzmho1_1280.jpg

 

[V8 Ninja]

You know, I've been thinking about the whole Phil Fish issue and I've come to a (personal) conclusion;

While I think that people are going a bit overboard, I will not defend Phil Fish in any way.

Let's think about this, everybody; you are ragging someone who has only made a pretty-looking 2D puzzle-platformer and went through a long and stressful legal period to actually release that game. I think you may want to tone down your hatred just a bit.

...HOWEVER, I won't blame anybody for calling out Phil Fish on his lack of any professionalism in his persona. He has continued to show that he would rather argue/brag like a child instead of try to have some sort of dialogue or present his opinions in a non-inflammatory manner.

 

[MeChaNiZ3D]

It seemed dickish to begin with, and he was certainly more blunt than he could have been, but in the end that is what he thinks. This was a panel, that's what questions do, they invite opinions. So while I personally would have been a bit more tactful, especially considering this is a Japanese person who has deliberately attended from overseas, Phil did explain his position.

 

[Johnny Novgorod]

I really don't know who this Phil Fish is. He seems kind of an asshole. But then people cheered for him a lot in that video, so I guess some people are totally for that.

 

[wulf3n]

The guy asking the question did identify himself as a japanese game designer

I missed that part, it was hard to understand him.

 

[RaikuFA]

Did you even watch the video? That's not what he asked.
He asked "what do you think about recent japanese games?"

And Phil's response "they suck".
Then if you watch the last part of the video, he compares two Zelda games, old and new to expand upon his rather undiplomatic first bit. They don't bully or humiliate the guy, they talk about the games.

Really buddy, you're just looking for reasons to hate on the guy, and while there might be stuff out there that would support your desire this video is not one of them.

Did you notice how they all patiently waited for the guy with bad english to ask his question? He was nervous, took a while, but they all waited and no one interrupted or commented on him. They commented on the games. They're game designers. And they don't like current japanese games. And they answered his question and gave reasons why.

Nothing more. Nothing less.

I think the problem isn't with the rationale behind what Fish is saying, it's how he says it, and his tendency to blur the subject of his sentences between Japanese games and Japanese People.

The video starts off with Fish saying Japanese games suck, which is fair enough, but he then starts talking about the people with quotes like "You people need to get with the times" and "You people need to design better Interfaces".

The guy asking the question did identify himself as a japanese game designer, so when he responded he was saying "you Japanese designers" essentially, including the guy asking the question. And yeah, so Phil lumped game him and all those designers into the same group but, is he the only one guilty of that? Yahtzee doesn't like JRPGs for example.

Point is, just because the guy is a bit brazen in how he delivers his opinions doesn't mean he deserves to be treated like garbage. He made a joke and generalized, then the other guy piped in with a more balanced response, and then Phil responded in kind with a balanced response himself.

The programmer on Super Meat Boy, at one point basically dismisses all AAA studios as being complete trash or something to that effect. Or, he'll never work their because of *reasons*. Is not that equally damnable? People are people.

Actually, he does a bit, he just dosen't like how many these days care more about how they look than story/gameplay. He's said he loves Earthbound, FF6, Chrono Trigger and The World Ends with You.

 

[Charli]

It just seems to me like another person shot to stardom who never learned the subtle art of tact and is now suffering for not learning it.

And finding it very hard to deal with.

He needs to get it together.

I will not defend nor comment on such arrogance since I myself have never been in his position.

 

[Dr Pussymagnet]

The problem folks is that the criticism was entirely unwarranted, it had no place. He did not ask Fish about this thoughts on Japanese games, he asked Fish what about Japanese games inspired him.

We clear on that? He attacked the guy for absolutely no reason, and that's why there's a witch-hunt and it's deserved.

wat

No seriously, what? That was exactly the dudes question. He wanted to know what they thought of modern Japanese games so they...*gasp*... answered the question! I know it was blunt answer from Fish but I'm much more willing to believe it was just an attempt at humor gone wrong and not any sort of malice on his part.

Could he have answered it better? Sure, but I can't believe this is what the internet decided to latch onto to direct their hate towards Fish

 

[Vigormortis]

Are the recent Zeldas and Marios not too hand-holdy? What exactly am I supposed to be disagreeing with? The majority of the video was people other than Fish talking, and they all happened to agree with him. Why is this video directed at Fish?

This is a witch hunt and a hate campaign. I will take no part in this.

Pretty much exactly what this is. A witch hunt.

Most of the animosity towards Fish stems from his "they suck" comment. Most of the rest is predicated on the already-present hatred from that comment.

Yet, if people would actually take the fucking time to listen to what he and the other panel members were saying, they'd realize that the panel members actually like Japanese games, but they don't like the direction that industry is trending in.

Hell, they even criticized western game design. But no one brings that up, of course.

Granted, the man could have worded his initial response in a...less twat-y fashion. But that doesn't change the fact that the man in the audience asked for his opinion on the current-gen of Japanese games, and Fish then responded with his opinion.

'Course, that hasn't stopped people from tunnel-visioning on the "they suck" comment and acting as though Fish simply brow-beat the guy.

Now to be fair, Fish has made other crude comments since that panel. But you know what? Most of them were on the back of being incessantly harassed by asshole gamers and dick-bag media pundits. All of whom seemed to make it their personal mission to make Fish pay for that "they suck" comment.

That said, will I defend Fish? Hell no. Not entirely, anyway. The guy can be pretty damn crass. There's no denying that.

However, I'm sure as hell not hopping on the hate train people like the OP seem hell-bent on pushing forward. The internet and gaming community at large have been far more cruel and "douche-y" than Fish has ever been.