BioWare Announces Post-Ending DLC for Mass Effect 3 [Updated!]

[Lovely Mixture]

then what exactly makes something art? i apologize that i jumped to my conclusions though, but so many people who say games aren't art also act like games don't deserve respect.

Art is as follows

1.The expression or application of human creative skill and imagination, typically in a visual form such as painting or sculpture,...: "the art of the Renaissance"
2. Works produced by such skill and imagination

Now ask the question. Was Mass Effect (or any videogame) made by hardworking people with creativity? or by people soullessly trying to make a buck?

It could be either.

Also, Doesn't EA's demanding involvement already ruin the prospect of it being art?

Maybe?

From what I see, me, Imbechile, and like minded people are sick of the argument that "demanding changes to the ending (is wrong/stupid because it) ruins mass effect's status as art." WHY does Mass Effect need to be art? It also falls into the dangerous straw-man logic of:

You didn't like the ending? This means you must be a ignorant plebeian cry baby who is demanding changes to a finished product.
You liked the ending? This means you're a Biodrone sheeple that will buy anything as long as it has Mass Effect written on it.


My thoughts are that video-games don't need to be art and frankly with an ending like that at the end of the Mass Effect trilogy, I don't think could be art to begin with. BUT THAT'S JUST ME. I didn't demand changes to the ending, but I understand why the hell everyone hates it.

 

[CatmanStu]

It's going to be interesting to see what they offer us this summer considering the price (or lack of) but even if it is a wonderful conclusion to the story, undoing all the bad will that they seem to have acrued, it will not change the fact that the game is sloppy throughout.

The problem as I see it is that the creators seemed to forget where the strength of the series was. Not in it's combat, not in it's overarching storyline, but in the personal connections the player makes with the characters. ME1 hinted at this with some of the conversations between teammates and then ME2 hit the ball out of the park with some of the most touching story telling I have seen in games. ME3 almost completely ignored this progress (with the exception of the Genophage arch) deciding to instead focus on the bigger picture with it's cutscenes (ironic considering Shepard doesn't get involved until the last mission.)

If I was being generous I would say they just promised more than they could deliver (the Molyneux syndrome) but based on how good the story telling was in ME2, coupled with the characters that conveniantly appear even though you sacrificed them in earlier games, I am more inclined to blame laziness.

To finish on a high though; I still think a mediocre Bioware game is better storytelling than most other games being released these days.

 

[klaynexas3]

Congratulations to all the people who pissed and moaned like entitled little bitches. You've proven that video games are not an art. You've also shown that if something is not what you want you will complain. You will *****, piss, moan, complain and whine till you get your way.

Congratulations. You're children. Entitled little kids who scream and yell till they get what they want.

Pretentious person ahoy!

Games ARE NOT ART!!!! Atleast, not AAA games. Do you think EA gives two shits about art?
And you attack people because they want something that's been promised to the for the last five years? Yo've just shown that you're more childlish than them.

i know. how dare he think games are a respectable medium for telling a story or showing an experience. shame on him. i hate it when people think games deserve any respect. which is why i hated the movement to change the ending. games aren't an art, they aren't respectable, so why care when one isn't a gift from god? if it isn't worth any respect, why should they have to work hard on games? why should we get good games if they won't be respected for it?

Whoa, hold it there!!
Respecting something =/= art, and also, not art =/= not respectable

I think most games aren't art, but I respect them and I think games are the best medium out there.
So everything I said still stands. Audacity is acting more childish than the people he critices.

then what exactly makes something art? i apologize that i jumped to my conclusions though, but so many people who say games aren't art also act like games don't deserve respect.

I wouldn't say that people who say games aren't art act like games don't deserve respect. They are probably fed up with the whole "we must push games towards art" thing that is sometimes, like in this case, used as a cheap argument to dismiss criticism.

As for what is art? I still haven't given it much thought, but most games, especially AAAs, that play it safe, are not art. They are products first and foremost, made to make as much money as possible, and no amout of passion you put in it is going to change the fact that it's still a product.

i don't think anyone has actually said so far that the game doesn't deserve to be criticized, even if they think it's an art. most of the people claiming it's art only say bioware shouldn't completely rewrite the ending, but seem to have nothing against expanding it, as they are now. but still people get up-in-arms at these statements, call the idea pretentious to say that games are an art form, and then they act like it isn't as respectable as art. i've seen these people in other threads, not as much in this one, but other ones, like the extra credits one.

and what if there are copies of a painting by, i don't know, Rembrandt. is the picture itself still not an art? i would say that even something made for mass production can still be seen as an art, like a book or a movie

 

[tzeneth]

My favorite response to people who try to claim that something that's art is above criticism is this little image, although you can argue against the image still makes its point: i116.photobucket.com/albums/o4/Vulpix1000/Artfinal.png

 

[Axyun]

Color me cautiously optimistic. The ending was utter tripe and nothing short of replacing it with something consistent with the ME universe and consistent with half-decent story-telling will make it better. But, I'll give them the benefit of the doubt.

 

[anthony87]

True the child's play thing was most organized by the level-headed ones. But that still doesn't change the fact that the movement was mostly made up of the overreactionary ones. The niceness of the child's play donation was the exception to the rule.

Care to link your source?

I'd like to know where this "mostly" is coming from.

 

[anthony87]

and it sounds like everyone wins.

You'd think that wouldn't you? But then you've still got wankers in this very thread taking shots at the people who weren't happy with the ending.

 

[Lovely Mixture]

Hopefully once this comes out people can put this silly little controversy to rest and actually find something else to talk about. It actually staggers me how this game can be 40 hours long, have 39 hrs 50 minutes of solid excellence and all people focus on is the last 10 minutes that aren't so solid.

It's not that hard to understand, conclusions can split opinions down the middle.

Look at ANY long running TV show, and then look at the reactions to the ending. It can make it or break for some people.
Mass Effect 3 is the conclusion to 5 years of build-up. The ending was already going to divide people.

 

[Awenir]

Additionally, it'll be interesting to see how the DLC will manage to provide "additional closure" at the same time as staying true to the original vision of Mass Effect 3's writers.

From what's been floating around out there the actual writers' had pretty much zero input on the ending. The ending was all Casey. Hopefully they will actually let the professionals handle things this time.

can you give some links out to prove that? It sounds _very_ probable though.

 

[mezorin]

Good, the endings to me were if anything "too short" rather than bad per say. Shepard picking the way in which the galaxy should evolve, now that the Cruxible has been finished? Okay I can get behind that, but what happens after you jump into the blue/green/red beam? Mass Effect 3 felt like a book that was just one chapter too short more than one that was poorly written.

A free DLC on the house that expands what happens and gives closure is fair enough, and assuming its at least a half decent wrap up to the game, will address what ever problems I had with the game. Haters are going to hate, but I'm looking forward to seeing what happens in the extended ending.

 

[Tigerlily Warrior]

*sigh* I just wish bioware would just tell us what they are doing instead of being all hush hush about it. Hell I would like them to come out and say "Indoctrination theory is lies" and I would be cool with that.

Since i'm about 60% sure that what is going to happen and 40% sure it isn't. But whatever..hopefully bioware explains EVERYTHING about the damn ending. Though what I found odd is that they choose to say 'Cut scenes and epilogue scenes."

Why would they do this? isn't it..you know the same thing? How can we have a epilogue scene when Shepard dead and all of our crew is on some random planet. *Sigh*..summer can't get here soon enough.

I'm just so, so, so sad.... I've lost my faith in Bioware. I want Indoctrination because it would be so epic. But the more I think about the comments, the more pessimistic the outlook seems to be.

 

[Weresquirrel]

Don't see why folks would rage over this. At least, those that would cite "art shouldn't be changed" kind of rage. They aren't changing the ending. They've said as much. They're clarifying things. No different to a director's cut, or special edition of a movie. There wasn't any rage when Rango tacked on an extra minute to the end.

There's still going to be rage from those who thoroughly hated the ending. But those who just wanted a little bit of closure and to see the state of the galaxy that they left it in, well, hopefully they'll be satisfied. Or at least less angry.

 

[klaynexas3]

then what exactly makes something art? i apologize that i jumped to my conclusions though, but so many people who say games aren't art also act like games don't deserve respect.

Art is as follows

1.The expression or application of human creative skill and imagination, typically in a visual form such as painting or sculpture,...: "the art of the Renaissance"
2. Works produced by such skill and imagination

Now ask the question. Was Mass Effect (or any videogame) made by hardworking people with creativity? or by people soullessly trying to make a buck?

It could be either.

Also, Doesn't EA's demanding involvement already ruin the prospect of it being art?

Maybe?

From what I see, me, Imbechile, and like minded people are sick of the argument that "demanding changes to the ending (is wrong/stupid because it) ruins mass effect's status as art." WHY does Mass Effect need to be art?

My thoughts are that video-games don't need to be art and frankly with an ending like that at the end of the Mass Effect trilogy, I don't think could be art to begin with. BUT THAT'S JUST ME.

how something ends defines whether or not something was art to begin with? that sounds a little backwards, i would say.

and if you ask me, what bioware did is what they should have done. they kept their ending, and only made it more encompassing and added more closure, without breaking from their story. but i think the people saying that they should do nothing are completely wrong. the guy Imbechile quoted before, calling him pretentious, that guy was childish, i'll admit to that. i just view art as something that has more respect than a simple game.

 

[Samantha Burt]

Huh, this is -exactly- what I wanted to see. It's probably just gonna be some DA:O style text over some concept art/screenshots, but that's all I wanted, I can live with the bogus ending, I was just upset with basically being left hanging at the end.

Seems a long wait for such a simple ending, if that is the case. I mean, they don't have a fixed date, but it's at least three months until this thing hits the market. They better not be using the time to eat jaffa cakes or something.

 

[Devil's Due]

If they made one of the scenes like this, I'll be thoroughly amused:

*Normandy flying away from Earth, chasing Harbinger*
*Normandy begins kicking his ass, but he flees towards the Relay*
*Normandy follows pursuit through the relay to finish Harbinger off so that their lead Reaper may be destroyed*
Hackett: Joker? Would you mind telling me what you're doing near that Relay?
Joker: Sir... FINISHING THIS FIGHT!


(Thank you, thank you, I should be a writer for BioWare. I'll be here all day.)

Anyways, I am very pleased this ending will allow them to continue their cannon ending while adding on to it, and not just rewriting the whole thing. However, I am pissed simply because I'll have to redo the entire Earth battle (which was painfully hard at times with the mass [no pun intended] banshee swarms), and then have to choose which ending I will pick again. (DO I STAY GREEN OR GO RED THIS TIME?!)

We'll see, Bioware. We'll see.

 

[Lovely Mixture]

how something ends defines whether or not something was art to begin with? that sounds a little backwards, i would say.

I did not say that applied for all things, but admittedly that was an unnecessary exaggeration on my part (there are plenty of things with questionable conclusions that I would consider artistic and I still think Mass Effect has competent writing aside from the ending), but it does convey my point. You might say it's backwards, others might not. Art is about perspective.

And interestingly when you say "without breaking from their story." The very thing people hate about the ending is that they feel it breaks from the story.

 

[Outcast107]

*sigh* I just wish bioware would just tell us what they are doing instead of being all hush hush about it. Hell I would like them to come out and say "Indoctrination theory is lies" and I would be cool with that.

Since i'm about 60% sure that what is going to happen and 40% sure it isn't. But whatever..hopefully bioware explains EVERYTHING about the damn ending. Though what I found odd is that they choose to say 'Cut scenes and epilogue scenes."

Why would they do this? isn't it..you know the same thing? How can we have a epilogue scene when Shepard dead and all of our crew is on some random planet. *Sigh*..summer can't get here soon enough.

I'm just so, so, so sad.... I've lost my faith in Bioware. I want Indoctrination because it would be so epic. But the more I think about the comments, the more pessimistic the outlook seems to be.

Idk. Bioware is teasing the hell out of us. One they are hyping the hell out of the DLC and what they are planning. yet they won't comment on anything at all. And they been saying they won't talk about the DLC tomorrow at PAX. UGH...curse bioware!