BioWare Lifts the Lid on Dragon Age 2 DRM

Apr 28, 2008
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unwesen said:
Irridium said:
Sovvolf said:
I agree and admit that DRM is not the way to go about it. They need a much better system, this is punishing the customers true enough and I don't find it fair at all. However, people are putting the blame squarely on the companies who are just trying to protect their property. Very few are pointing their fingers at the real bad guys here, the worse thing about it is that people are actually cheering these people on.
I know, and that pisses me off just as much. I'm sick of people seeing pirates as digital Robin Hoods, and I'm sick of all the love they seem to get.

They may not be "stealing" in traditional terms, but they're still massive cock-heads who are the cause of all this.
I don't condone piracy, let me get that out first. But no, it's not the pirates who are causing this. I'm not saying they're innocent in this either, but as in any other conflict, it requires both sides to continue or stop it. One side alone won't manage, and when they fail, it's easy to blame the other side for that failure.

Interestingly enough, historically, it's content creators that called publishers "pirates", because they were well known for taking content, monetizing it, and giving little back to the content creators. That what copyright laws were originally invented for, for protecting content creators. Now it protects distributors, who still don't give much back to the creatives in the industry.

Pointing your finger at pirates alone in this is ignoring half the picture. Sadly, some content creators will echo what their distributors tell them is the reason for why they can't pay out more. But repeating something often enough doesn't really make it true, it just makes it sound true. There's a difference.

If publishers/distributors had any interest in solving this issue, they would find a way that awards paying customers instead of punishing them. Here's an interesting model: DDO and LotRO are both free to play. There's no way pirates can pirate, because you can't pirate what's free.

Paying customers? They get points. Points get them extra stuff. Extra stuff gives them a competitive advantage in-game, or just more fun. Paying customers are awarded. And you know what? Looking at Turbine's press releases when they made DDO and LotRO free to play, that model works pretty well in their favour.

Granted, this works because there's a strong online component that not every game shares. And games that require an online component when they don't technically need it, well, they're annoying. For those games, publishers need a different model. And they've got one and use it already, they pack goodies with games boxes, for example. Special editions. Stuff that only paying customers get. Might not work as well as fro DDO and LotRO, but it's an idea that can be improved upon.

The fact that this is not the norm just goes to prove that publishers have no interest in stopping piracy. If they did, they'd get smart about the issue.
Its funny, about a decade or so ago, thats how PC games were normally released. With lots of extra's, minimal DRM, and basically stuff that rewarded legitimate buyers. And now they don't do that.

However it seems at least one developer, CD Projeckt Red, is doing it with The Witcher 2.

Have you seen all the stuff [http://www.amazon.com/Witcher-2-Assassins-Kings-Pc/dp/B003VJNPPE/ref=sr_1_1?s=videogames&ie=UTF8&qid=1296579422&sr=1-1] the game includes? And thats just the normal edition. The collector's one is insane. And they're doing it all while not putting in any DRM.

And that is why I pre-ordered it as soon as I possibly could. And I may pre-order it again from GoG.com, simply because what they're doing is amazing.
 

BENZOOKA

This is the most wittiest title
Oct 26, 2009
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Baresark said:
Sounds like the retail version and non-Steam digital versions use the same kind of system as Steam. I have never had a problem with Steam games, you can even play them offline for a set amount of time before requiring you to sign in again to verify. This is security that makes sense and won't ruin the game for anyone. Though, if you don't have an internet connections it's complete bollocks. I am not a big fan of required internet connection to play a single player game. I raged against this for like 2 years when Half Life 2 came out.

On the other hand, this is nothing to software pirates, but it's best to just forget about those folks. They aren't lost sales anyway, just people who didn't pay to play the game. In the end, even the most draconian security measures doesn't stop them.
My thoughts exactly. Even with the Half-Life 2. This doesn't happen often.

Pirates will always get around the obstacles, so the less those obstacles do to annoy the actual buyers, the better.
 

Sovvolf

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Mar 23, 2009
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Garak73 said:
If someone is coming into your yard and stealing flowers and your response is to install landmines in your yard thereby killing the innocent paper boy and the innocent girl selling Girl Scout cookies, should we blame the flower thief for your bad reaction?
If a group is going around shooting innocents and bombing buildings and the city is put in a state of martial law... Who do you blame?
 
Apr 28, 2008
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p3t3r said:
who exactly is this screwing does anybody no anybody who is buying this game for pc and has 6 gaming computers that they plan on using to play this game in a single day. or someome with no internet at all ever. i mean come on you have something that will run this game you have internet.
Because it shows the Publishers do not trust you. To them all you are is a potential pirate.

5 years ago none of this DRM crap was happening. Now it is. Its becoming more restricted and the only ones who suffer are those who buy the game.

And not everyone has a stable connection. If your internet is down in time for one of these login checks, you won't be able to play the game you bought, because it thinks your a pirate.

I really shouldn't have to explain why thats just wrong on many levels.
 

Sovvolf

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Garak73 said:
Sovvolf said:
Garak73 said:
If someone is coming into your yard and stealing flowers and your response is to install landmines in your yard thereby killing the innocent paper boy and the innocent girl selling Girl Scout cookies, should we blame the flower thief for your bad reaction?
If a group is going around shooting innocents and bombing buildings and the city is put in a state of martial law... Who do you blame?

I'll answer your question if you answer mine.
The fact is, your analogy doesn't work. Your showing the criminal of doing and minor act of picking up a flower and my reaction is do something that puts a person in direct danger using explosives. That has no relevance to what is happening here.

The DRM is more of a' "If a group of drunks at a party start breaking shit, and I kick everyone out... Who is to blame". Yours is a "If someone steals a plant and I kill someone because of it... Who is to blame".
 

Sovvolf

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Mar 23, 2009
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Garak73 said:
Sovvolf said:
Garak73 said:
Sovvolf said:
Garak73 said:
If someone is coming into your yard and stealing flowers and your response is to install landmines in your yard thereby killing the innocent paper boy and the innocent girl selling Girl Scout cookies, should we blame the flower thief for your bad reaction?
If a group is going around shooting innocents and bombing buildings and the city is put in a state of martial law... Who do you blame?

I'll answer your question if you answer mine.
The fact is, your analogy doesn't work. Your showing the criminal of doing and minor act of picking up a flower and my reaction is do something that puts a person in direct danger using explosives. That has no relevance to what is happening here.

The DRM is more of a' "If a group of drunks at a party start breaking shit, and I kick everyone out... Who is to blame". Yours is a "If someone steals a plant and I kill someone because of it... Who is to blame".
Let's use your example then.

Let's say that people were blowing up buildings and so the government called for martial law. Let's say that by doing so they were only punishing the people who are NOT breaking any laws and in fact has now trapped them in buildings (that the law breakers are blowing up).

Now, you still haven't stopped the law breakers but you have now made things worse by punishing those who are not breaking the law.

DRM doesn't stop piracy and it never will, what it does do is punish paying customers. Who decides 1) If there is to be DRM on a title 2) What type of DRM to use? It isn't the pirates.

Let me put it another way that just came to mind. Just because some people speed doesn't make it right to pull over everyone.
However, the city wouldn't be in martial law in the first place if those lawbreakers hadn't started shooting people and blowing up buildings. Even if people are suffering because of it, the police aren't the ones that started this, they put in methods to prevent it that have been less than successful but if the thugs hadn't been shooting the place up and blowing up buildings it wouldn't be happening.

Also you speeding analogy... How in the hell is that relevant is that like "Just because some people break the law, doesn't mean they should all be punished for it?".
 

suubersnake

The Wizard
Nov 30, 2009
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While this is better than most DRM, it's still annoying enough to make me wanna download some work around for it, even though I pre-ordered the signature edition of the game.

The problem is that saying it's light compared to other DRM is like saying well, these handcuffs are better than being locked in a Iron Maiden. It's very true, but still not something I paid sixty dollars for.

I'm not really ultra pissed about this, it's simply ironic that paying customers, like myself, legitimately purchase games only to grab something to circumvent the DRM post-purchase. I also would have forgone Dragon Age II had I known about this two months ago.
 

Sovvolf

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Garak73 said:
Martial law also wouldn't be in place if the police had stopped the law breakers without resorting to punishing everyone. Martial law is a last
True enough, however that doesn't mean the police are the bad guys here. Your blaming the police for having a poor system rather than blaming the bombers and murders for causing it all in the first place.

Garak73 said:
My speeding analogy fits DRM perfectly, punish everyone for the actions of the few instead of punishing just the few.

I hate captcha!
True, it does fit the analogy. However its those that fucked it up for everyone who are at fault not those that now have to enforce a law.

Same goes for my party analogy. You go to a party and a group get way too drunk and start breaking the owners furniture and puking on the walls. Said owners kick the whole lot of us out... You know who I blame? The drunken arseholes for ruining it for the rest. Yeah I'd wish the bloke had just kicked them lot out as the rest weren't doing anything however he's not the one to blame for it all.

If the group hadn't fucked it up and went around screwing up the house then we'd all still be partying and having fun.
 

Gindil

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Nov 28, 2009
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Lord Ammolds said:
Yet another blow against piracy... now... only time will tell how they'll react.
I'm one of the largest opponents of DRM, yet... This is pretty good. It's not draconian and a lot of thought went into this. It allows flexibility on the devices you have (console, laptop, etc) without it being so over the top that it arbitrarily limits what you do with the CDs you purchased. It isn't the best, but it's pretty forgiving given EA's past experiences.

Sovvolf said:
Nutcase said:
EA isn't going to get a cent from me.
Nope, because putting up measures to protect their property means they are the evulz. I love it how people blame the companies for putting up the DRM and very little blame goes to the pirates, who, if it hadn't been for them we wouldn't be in this predicament.

I guess its easier to blame the big "evilz" company with a face rather than blaming the thieves. Because you know, they are the virtual Robin Hoods that steal from the rich and give to the poor meaning that game companies have to increase security which harms the paying customer.

Christ these pirates are ruining the gaming, music and movie industries and people are cheering them on as they are doing it.
Please prove that with economic data.

Dorkmaster Flek said:
And a version with the DRM completely removed will appear on torrent sites within weeks, thus rendering the DRM completely pointless and providing pirates with an unarguably superior product. I love how we've gotten to the point where a limit of 5 installs and periodic online verification is considered "generous". And by love, I mean hate. Oh, how "generous" of Bioware to allow me to play the game I legally purchased! That's so considerate of them, you know?
That... wasn't what was said. You have unlimited installs, just can only play on 5 computers at one time. And as I said to someone else, it's not the best nor ideal, but it's pretty good considering what EA did in the past.

Now if they ever go to a GoG system...
 

Exort

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Oct 11, 2010
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ShadowKirby said:
To anyone bitching about not having the internet: " Downloads from other providers..."

If you download the game, it's pretty much assumed you can have an internet connection from time to time right.
But they might want to play "all the time" not just "time to time"
 

Zacharine

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Apr 17, 2009
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Mmh, yeah, not happening. If I buy a single-player game, it better darn well work without any kind of internet connect at all, ever.

What I will most likely do? Buy the game, open the box, install, crack and play. Or download, block it on firewall, and then continue as before.

Seriously, DRM is stupid because there is no such thing as unbreakable DRM and those acquiring the game illegally get a better product because of it. That's kinda backwards, now isn't it? Kudos for taking a step back towards the rational corner there BioWare, but you're still a few meters away.
 

Keava

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Mar 1, 2010
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Jatyu said:
Hell it's not "bad" merely so-so. And if you really hate the DRM THAT MUCH... JUST BUY IT ON A CONSOLE.

It's not hard people.
Sure. Will do. Will you just, like, i don't know.. fund me a console to play single game? Since, you know, i don't really feel like buying piece of electronics junk i won't ever use for majority of games i do play?

As to the DRM itself, it could be worse sure, but i still dont like the whole idea of 'Hai be online or suck it'. It is a limit, maybe no concern to me personally, but a problem in general.
 
Jul 27, 2009
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I wonder when these companies will begin to realize that they probably spend more money to develop this DRM that hinders people who actually buy the game more than it hinders pirates, because pirates will just crack it anyhow. The time, effort, and money in takes to program and implement a DRM system is most likely more than that wasted when all pirated copies are taken into account(being that most pirated copies are not actually lost sales)


P.S: I am not advocating piracy, just making a valid point, think before you flame.