Blizzad reveals new characters for Overwatch

[NPC009]

Wait..."Tumblr" is supposed to hate Zarya? All I've seen is talk about how hot she is, gif sets,fan art, and porn. People are already shipping her with Tracer and cross shipping her with Heavy weapons guy. There are even people talking about creating cosplaying her.

I think the divide is pretty much between people who see female characters as potential fap material (and feel insulted when characters don't live up to their standards) and the ones that just want the characters they play to look cool (and cool can mean anything from a high tech gorilla to an angelic medic).

The first group is going on about how ugly she is, man with boobs, and so on. They're bothered, because Zarya is not the type of woman they like to see and they view her as a waste of space. Her valuable slot could have gone to someone they do want to stick their (figurative) dick in. They may even feel as if she was created with the explicit purpose of pissing them off. How dare Blizzard, catering to some attention whoring feminists instead of loyal custumers!

Then there's the group that's like: Muscular woman with pink hair and some sort of gravity gun? Sure, sound fun. Always nice to see different types of characters and playstyles (even if they're Street Fighter level cliche).

And then there's a smaller group that does consider Zarya fap material and they're the ones drawing porn.

 

[EternallyBored]

Then there's the group that's like: Muscular woman with pink hair and some sort of gravity gun? Sure, sound fun. Always nice to see different types of characters and playstyles (even if they're Street Fighter level cliche).

Maybe it's just the genre and setting, but the roster really does have kind of a national stereotype vibe like Street fighter.

Character from Nepal? it's a buddhist robot that kind of reminds me of that generic asian mysticism that inspired Dhalsim.

Sexy French assassin? check, and she's got a catsuit and blue skin.

Generic mystery character with spooky "age unknown" in his bio? Reaper has all that in spades

German medic? making her female and giving her a jetpack isn't going to stop the TF2 comparisons Blizzard, I'm sure Tumblr is already shipping her with Medic EDIT: I got her mixed up with Reinhardt, looks like Mercy is Swiss, which fits with the neutral stereotype a little, but Switzerland doesn't have a good stereotype I can think of for apapting to an FPS game.

American? of course he's a Western cowboy. Are we sure this isn't being made by Japan?

Japanese character? I don't know if giving him a bow is really that original, his super is still two Chinese looking dragons

British character? small speedster with a cockny accent, she's basically british Scout from TF2.

Egyptian character? Of course she has ancient Egyptian styled hair and makeup designs despite being a dead civilization for thousands of years, becuase ancient Egypt is the only Egypt most people know anything about

And of course we can't forget our Russian heavy weapons character.

It's like someone took a Street fighter roster and adapted it for a futuristic FPS

 

[Mutant1988]

Then there's the group that's like: Muscular woman with pink hair and some sort of gravity gun? Sure, sound fun. Always nice to see different types of characters and playstyles (even if they're Street Fighter level cliche).

Maybe it's just the genre and setting, but the roster really does have kind of a national stereotype vibe like Street fighter.

Character from Nepal? it's a buddhist robot that kind of reminds me of that generic asian mysticism that inspired Dhalsim.

Sexy French assassin? check, and she's got a catsuit and blue skin.

Generic mystery character with spooky "age unknown" in his bio? Reaper has all that in spades

German medic? making her female and giving her a jetpack isn't going to stop the TF2 comparisons Blizzard, I'm sure Tumblr is already shipping her with Medic EDIT: I got her mixed up with Reinhardt, looks like Mercy is Swiss, which fits with the neutral stereotype a little, but Switzerland doesn't have a good stereotype I can think of for apapting to an FPS game.

American? of course he's a Western cowboy. Are we sure this isn't being made by Japan?

Japanese character? I don't know if giving him a bow is really that original, his super is still two Chinese looking dragons

British character? small speedster with a cockny accent, she's basically british Scout from TF2.

Egyptian character? Of course she has ancient Egyptian styled hair and makeup designs despite being a dead civilization for thousands of years, becuase ancient Egypt is the only Egypt most people know anything about

And of course we can't forget our Russian heavy weapons character.

It's like someone took a Street fighter roster and adapted it for a futuristic FPS

The likeness to a fighting game really is spot on. And it's sad too that the genre with the most stereotypes and fan service is also one of the more diverse, because a lot of different characters can work in a fighting game narrative (Which is usually insanely loose). That's coming from someone that loves fighting games. But it's a genre where it's absolutely necessary to exaggerate traits to make characters stand out. It can be any trait really. Nationality, martial art discipline, character archetypes or just unique clothing (SNK is big on this) or look otherwise.

And especially for a team based competitive multiplayer game, it's important to differentiate silhouettes, so that you can tell who is which character at a glance.

 

[inmunitas]

Then there's the group that's like: Muscular woman with pink hair and some sort of gravity gun? Sure, sound fun. Always nice to see different types of characters and playstyles (even if they're Street Fighter level cliche).

Maybe it's just the genre and setting, but the roster really does have kind of a national stereotype vibe like Street fighter.

Character from Nepal? it's a buddhist robot that kind of reminds me of that generic asian mysticism that inspired Dhalsim.

Sexy French assassin? check, and she's got a catsuit and blue skin.

Generic mystery character with spooky "age unknown" in his bio? Reaper has all that in spades

German medic? making her female and giving her a jetpack isn't going to stop the TF2 comparisons Blizzard, I'm sure Tumblr is already shipping her with Medic EDIT: I got her mixed up with Reinhardt, looks like Mercy is Swiss, which fits with the neutral stereotype a little, but Switzerland doesn't have a good stereotype I can think of for apapting to an FPS game.

American? of course he's a Western cowboy. Are we sure this isn't being made by Japan?

Japanese character? I don't know if giving him a bow is really that original, his super is still two Chinese looking dragons

British character? small speedster with a cockney accent, she's basically british Scout from TF2.

Egyptian character? Of course she has ancient Egyptian styled hair and makeup designs despite being a dead civilization for thousands of years, becuase ancient Egypt is the only Egypt most people know anything about

And of course we can't forget our Russian heavy weapons character.

It's like someone took a Street fighter roster and adapted it for a futuristic FPS

"British character? small speedster with a cockney accent, she's basically british Scout from TF2."
Cockney isn't "British", that's just London and typically East End at that.

 

[inmunitas]

"British character? small speedster with a cockney accent, she's basically british Scout from TF2."
Cockney isn't "British", that's just London and typically East End at that.

No, Cockney is objectively British. Cockney Geezer and all that.

See this is exactly the kind of discrimination we have to put up within UK. I'm not from "down south", you need to add a Northerner or I'm not going to feel represented (and they better not be from Lancashire). Not to mention a Welsh character for Wales, and Scottish character for Scotland, and an Irish character for Northern Ireland.

 

[theNater]

See this is exactly the kind of discrimination we have to put up within UK. I'm not from "down south", you need to add a Northerner or I'm not going to feel represented (and they better not be from Lancashire).

Well, let's make this criticism constructive with a bit of brainstorming. What would you like to see in the Northerner? Are there powers, weapons, phrases, physical attributes, or particular behaviors you think would be good for such a character? What would be representative of you?

 

[inmunitas]

"British character? small speedster with a cockney accent, she's basically british Scout from TF2."
Cockney isn't "British", that's just London and typically East End at that.

No, Cockney is objectively British. Cockney Geezer and all that.

See this is exactly the kind of discrimination we have to put up within UK. I'm not from "down south", you need to add a Northerner or I'm not going to feel represented (and they better not be from Lancashire). Not to mention a Welsh character for Wales, and Scottish character for Scotland, and an Irish character for Northern Ireland.

Well no, they don't. They don't need to do anything.

Also "discrimination" and "not represented" are two completely different things.

You're putting in a Southerner and claiming they represent all of Britain, that is discrimination.

 

[NPC009]

"British character? small speedster with a cockney accent, she's basically british Scout from TF2."
Cockney isn't "British", that's just London and typically East End at that.

No, Cockney is objectively British. Cockney Geezer and all that.

See this is exactly the kind of discrimination we have to put up within UK. I'm not from "down south", you need to add a Northerner or I'm not going to feel represented (and they better not be from Lancashire). Not to mention a Welsh character for Wales, and Scottish character for Scotland, and an Irish character for Northern Ireland.

Well no, they don't. They don't need to do anything.

Also "discrimination" and "not represented" are two completely different things.

You're putting in a Southerner and claiming they represent all of Britain, that is discrimination.

Wait, what? The bit you said before wasn't a joke?

Dude, it's just a silly little stereotype and pretty much every Overwatch introduced thus far seems to have a few of those. Cockney is just something people from outside of the UK recognise as something English, so that's what they went with.

 

[EternallyBored]

"British character? small speedster with a cockney accent, she's basically british Scout from TF2."
Cockney isn't "British", that's just London and typically East End at that.

No, Cockney is objectively British. Cockney Geezer and all that.

See this is exactly the kind of discrimination we have to put up within UK. I'm not from "down south", you need to add a Northerner or I'm not going to feel represented (and they better not be from Lancashire). Not to mention a Welsh character for Wales, and Scottish character for Scotland, and an Irish character for Northern Ireland.

Well no, they don't. They don't need to do anything.

Also "discrimination" and "not represented" are two completely different things.

You're putting in a Southerner and claiming they represent all of Britain, that is discrimination.

That's not what Pluvia said, cockney is a part of British culture, representing one aspect of culture and not another is not in any way discrimination, unless you are seriously trying to contend that we can't call McCree a stereotypical American portrayal, because, "OMG Americans were more than just cowboys, cowboys are really only in the Western states"

Also, Tracer is from London, her having a cockney accent is stereotypically British, just because it doesn't represent ALL of Britain does not change this fact, Cowboys are not ALL Americans, but pointing out McCree as a stereotypical American character archetype is not in any way, shape, or form discrimination.

Basically, you don't seem to understand what discrimination means.

 

[Overusedname]

What the hell is going on in this thread?

There's an awful lot of random hyperbole and accusations of xenophobia going on here for a post about a space cowboy and a woman with biceps.

 

[theNater]

What the hell is going on in this thread?

Helpfully, inmunitas has laid out pretty much what's going on in this thread back on the first page.

Nobody really cares what a character looks like in game. I'd rather Blizzard created diverse body types etc (like they've done in previous titles) because that's what they wanted to do, and not out of fear of being harassed by a bunch of incompetent morons.

Fortunately, we have inmunitas(and a few others) to protect poor, helpless Blizzard from these terrifying "incompetent morons" who, despite not caring about it(because nobody does), are forcing Blizzard to do something they want to do anyway.

 

[inmunitas]

What the hell is going on in this thread?

Helpfully, inmunitas has laid out pretty much what's going on in this thread back on the first page.

Nobody really cares what a character looks like in game. I'd rather Blizzard created diverse body types etc (like they've done in previous titles) because that's what they wanted to do, and not out of fear of being harassed by a bunch of incompetent morons.

Fortunately, we have inmunitas(and a few others) to protect poor, helpless Blizzard from these terrifying "incompetent morons" who, despite not caring about it(because nobody does), are forcing Blizzard to do something they want to do anyway.

I'm just trying to gauge where we are intending to go with this long term.

 

[kris40k]

What the hell is going on in this thread?

There's an awful lot of random hyperbole and accusations of xenophobia going on here for a post about a space cowboy and a woman with biceps.

I dunno, but apparently Tracer is Satan, now.

Do...do we have to hate Tracer?

 

[theNater]

I'm just trying to gauge where we are intending to go with this long term.

I can't speak for anybody else, but I'm hoping it takes us to a place where things go a little something like this:

People who see something they don't want in a game, or don't see something they do want, complain loudly about it in game-discussion parts of the internet. Then developers analyze those complaints, and decide how they wish to react, based on whatever criteria they think is important. Then, the developers clearly and publicly identify the complaints, and explain or demonstrate their reaction and the reasons behind it. Through this process, games get designed, which some people buy and play.

That's exactly what has happened here, which is why it drives me batty that some people are pointing to this event as if it were a harbinger of doom. Blizzard is happy, the people who were complaining about body type diversity are happy, and everybody knows that complaints get heard(encouraging future complaining). If at some future point a developer changes a game in a way you don't like in response to other people's complaints, complain about the new state of the game at that time. Your complaint will be heard, and if the developer agrees with your conclusions, they'll change it back.

I dunno, but apparently Tracer is Satan, now.

I missed that one. When did this happen?

 

[inmunitas]

I'm just trying to gauge where we are intending to go with this long term.

I can't speak for anybody else, but I'm hoping it takes us to a place where things go a little something like this:

People who see something they don't want in a game, or don't see something they do want, complain loudly about it in game-discussion parts of the internet. Then developers analyze those complaints, and decide how they wish to react, based on whatever criteria they think is important. Then, the developers clearly and publicly identify the complaints, and explain or demonstrate their reaction and the reasons behind it. Through this process, games get designed, which some people buy and play.

That's exactly what has happened here, which is why it drives me batty that some people are pointing to this event as if it were a harbinger of doom. Blizzard is happy, the people who were complaining about body type diversity are happy, and everybody knows that complaints get heard(encouraging future complaining). If at some future point a developer changes a game in a way you don't like in response to other people's complaints, complain about the new state of the game at that time. Your complaint will be heard, and if the developer agrees with your conclusions, they'll change it back.

Is that... like... how it's always been done though? Only real difference this time is that you have the incompetent morons siding with those who want the change, instead of slandering them for being "self-entitled hyper-consumers".

 

[inmunitas]

Is that... like... how it's always been done though? Only real difference this time is that you have the incompetent morons siding with those who want the change, instead of slandering them for being "self-entitled hyper-consumers".

No. How it's always been done is that specific audiences have been completely ignored because they aren't the "core" audience. A pervasive attitude that the opinion of the majority audience is the only one that matters. Enforced by a misrepresentation of the majority audience only being a specific kind of person (Male, 20-30), to which nearly all marketing and design is directed to.

And your slippery slope fears are ridiculous. How would it in any way cause you harm that people "force" inclusion of fictional characters representing their culture, sexuality or body type? By your own admission that stuff doesn't matter.

So what are you so afraid of happening, exactly? That other people get what they want and that it's something you don't care about personally?

Oh the horror!

As for your claim that anyone that supports this is an incompetent moron. Well... You're the only one resorting to insults in lieu of actual arguments. That I believe is something to consider in determining who really is the moron in a debate.

Spoiler

It's the one that uses insults in lieu of arguments.

That's just a strawman argument and none of it is what I've said or even implied.

 

[Mutant1988]

Is that... like... how it's always been done though? Only real difference this time is that you have the incompetent morons siding with those who want the change, instead of slandering them for being "self-entitled hyper-consumers".

No. How it's always been done is that specific audiences have been completely ignored because they aren't the "core" audience. A pervasive attitude that the opinion of the majority audience is the only one that matters. Enforced by a misrepresentation of the majority audience only being a specific kind of person (Male, 20-30), to which nearly all marketing and design is directed to.

And your slippery slope fears are ridiculous. How would it in any way cause you harm that people "force" inclusion of fictional characters representing their culture, sexuality or body type? By your own admission that stuff doesn't matter.

So what are you so afraid of happening, exactly? That other people get what they want and that it's something you don't care about personally?

Oh the horror!

As for your claim that anyone that supports this is an incompetent moron. Well... You're the only one resorting to insults in lieu of actual arguments. That I believe is something to consider in determining who really is the moron in a debate.

Spoiler

It's the one that uses insults in lieu of arguments.

That's just a strawman argument and none of it is what I've said or even implied.

Is it a strawman argument that you call anyone supportive of this an "incompetent moron"? Or is it just that cabal of ultrafeminists I've been hearing about that are incompetent morons? It's hard to tell which imaginary foe you're fighting if you aren't specific.

Didn't you get moderated as well, for dismissing absolutely everything I said as bullshit? Tsk tsk. And then there's asking me to take a personality test instead of disproving my arguments. . That's sure some good rhetorical skills you got there buddy.

Do tell me your true feelings then, if I misinterpret everything you say. I'd chalk misinterpretation up to how poorly you communicate though.

Also, for the record:

You're putting in a Southerner and claiming they represent all of Britain, that is discrimination.

Except not. You added the "Represent all" bit to that yourself. No one else claimed it represented "ALL" of Britain. Only that it represented Britain in any capacity whatsoever.

Which it does.

 

[inmunitas]

Is that... like... how it's always been done though? Only real difference this time is that you have the incompetent morons siding with those who want the change, instead of slandering them for being "self-entitled hyper-consumers".

No. How it's always been done is that specific audiences have been completely ignored because they aren't the "core" audience. A pervasive attitude that the opinion of the majority audience is the only one that matters. Enforced by a misrepresentation of the majority audience only being a specific kind of person (Male, 20-30), to which nearly all marketing and design is directed to.

And your slippery slope fears are ridiculous. How would it in any way cause you harm that people "force" inclusion of fictional characters representing their culture, sexuality or body type? By your own admission that stuff doesn't matter.

So what are you so afraid of happening, exactly? That other people get what they want and that it's something you don't care about personally?

Oh the horror!

As for your claim that anyone that supports this is an incompetent moron. Well... You're the only one resorting to insults in lieu of actual arguments. That I believe is something to consider in determining who really is the moron in a debate.

Spoiler

It's the one that uses insults in lieu of arguments.

That's just a strawman argument and none of it is what I've said or even implied.

Is it a strawman argument that you call anyone supportive of this an "incompetent moron"? Or is it just that cabal of ultrafeminists I've been hearing about that are incompetent morons? It's hard to tell which imaginary foe you're fighting if you aren't specific.

Didn't you get moderated as well? Tsk tsk. And then there's asking me to take a personality test instead of disproving my arguments.

Do tell me your true feelings then, if I misinterpret everything you say. I'd chalk that up to how poorly you communicate though.

That's still a strawman, you're making assertions I've not made. Who do you think usually slanders gamers for demanding higher standards from developers? The gaming press of course.

edit:
Also, if had bothered to look at that test, it's a way of allowing me to gauge how you think, as I don't understand your reasoning.

 

[Gengisgame]

That's still a strawman, you're making assertions I've not made. Who do you think usually slanders gamers for demanding higher standards from developers? The gaming press of course.

edit:
Also, if had bothered to look at that test, it's a way of allowing me to gauge how you think, as I don't understand your reasoning.

I just starting ignoring mutant, not only did he put words in my mouth with every reply, he did so with statements in my comments that contradicted what he said, continued to do so even after I pointed that out.

 

[Mutant1988]

Is that... like... how it's always been done though? Only real difference this time is that you have the incompetent morons siding with those who want the change, instead of slandering them for being "self-entitled hyper-consumers".

No. How it's always been done is that specific audiences have been completely ignored because they aren't the "core" audience. A pervasive attitude that the opinion of the majority audience is the only one that matters. Enforced by a misrepresentation of the majority audience only being a specific kind of person (Male, 20-30), to which nearly all marketing and design is directed to.

And your slippery slope fears are ridiculous. How would it in any way cause you harm that people "force" inclusion of fictional characters representing their culture, sexuality or body type? By your own admission that stuff doesn't matter.

So what are you so afraid of happening, exactly? That other people get what they want and that it's something you don't care about personally?

Oh the horror!

As for your claim that anyone that supports this is an incompetent moron. Well... You're the only one resorting to insults in lieu of actual arguments. That I believe is something to consider in determining who really is the moron in a debate.

Spoiler

It's the one that uses insults in lieu of arguments.

That's just a strawman argument and none of it is what I've said or even implied.

Is it a strawman argument that you call anyone supportive of this an "incompetent moron"? Or is it just that cabal of ultrafeminists I've been hearing about that are incompetent morons? It's hard to tell which imaginary foe you're fighting if you aren't specific.

Didn't you get moderated as well? Tsk tsk. And then there's asking me to take a personality test instead of disproving my arguments.

Do tell me your true feelings then, if I misinterpret everything you say. I'd chalk that up to how poorly you communicate though.

That's still a strawman, you're making assertions I've not made. Who do you think usually slanders gamers for demanding higher standards from developers? The gaming press of course.

edit:
Also, if had bothered to look at that test, it's a way of allowing me to gauge how you think, as I don't understand your reasoning.

Slanders gamers for demanding higher standards how? If anything, the gaming press has criticized the vocal critics of progressive changes and minority groups interests (Or hell, women, which is anything but a minority) being catered to as being wholly non-constructive and insanely hostile.

And no, I'm not making assertion of things you've not "made". You said that the incompetent morons side with the critics this time. Who is the incompetent morons, why are they incompetent and how are you any better when you don't describe WHAT they do wrong?

And again, what in the current development is so bad. And how is this design bad when it's unnecessary by your own admission. Why then does it matter either which way?

As for the idea that people don't relate to design or video game characters, that's just wrong. People do relate to design, to character, to narrative. Not just any one thing, to all of it.

As for my personality, that's none of your fucking business. Meet my arguments instead of trying to derail the discussion to center around my (Many) personal faults.

Feel free to tell me which parts were bullshit. I'm still curious about that.