Blizzard and Games Workshop

[Kagim]

You guys do realize that if you look back further you can find everything GW did in older films and books right.

Every idea has been done.

It has been done a thousand fucking times.

I'm sure any of you who have grandparents who are into Science fiction would look at GW and call them stupid fucking hacks.

The idea of a space Marine goes back to silent god damn films.

Insect swarm? How about the movie THEY! where giant ants attack?

ANYTHING from the none 40k universe can be seen as a rip off of the THOUSANDS of mythological tails.

EVERY cow man is a god damn Minotaur rip off. Orcs, trolls, goblins, Dwarves, gnomes.

All that shit? Written about over a thousand god damn years ago.

Highly advanced alien race like the eldar or protoss? War of the fucking worlds people.

Everyone has ripped off someone.

Fucking, drop it you fanboys.

GW didn't do it first. Every idea they have ever had has been done. it has been done a hundred thousand times, and they probably took as much as they could from them.

God damn.

 

[Eldarion]

Yep, these similarities are nothing new, and many a flame war has been started because of them. Point is that while Blizzard may have drawn a lot (and I mean a lot) of inspiration from GW's games, they gave their own twist on the material they used and made it their own. Among other, much more lore-intensive things, the Eldar do not have to construct additional pylons, and there is not a Tauren army in Warhammer (though I would so play it if there was).

So in the end, Blizzard aren't hacks. But I will agree that the idjits attacking GW games for copying Blizzard material are gravely misinformed.

I agree 100%

Blizz borrowed a lot form GW, but that does not stop blizzard's games from being different enough that you can consider them their own games.

I wish we would not talk about this though. Like I said, blizz's games are their own thing. Warhammer just came first. End of story. Arguing about it is pointless. Why can't we spend our time either constructing additional pylons or dying for the emperor?

 

[Zaik]

Nothing is original.

Nothing has been original for a long, long time.

Every idea is related to another idea in some form or fashion.

 

[Worgen]

blizz has never been that good at being original, well the biggest point Ill give them is for making orcs something besides a monstrous race but almost all blizz's plots are copied from their other games, war 3 copied starcraft and now sc2 is copying war 3 and so on and so forth, sure they all have their own changes too it but the essence has been the same, they tell bad plots intricately, its like the metal gear games

 

[TerranReaper]

I was going to say something but then I saw the date that the thread started and I'll just say this. We should all give credit to Starship troopers, enough said.

 

[Enigmers]

I don't think the Warhammer/Warcraft comparison is fair, as there are plenty of J.R.R.Tolkien-inspired books, movies, games, and so on. 40k/StarCraft I can see a little easier, though I think StarCraft's Zerg look a lot more like the swarming insectoids from Starship Troopers (which was published in the 1950's - by comparison, the Tyranids were introduced to 40k some time in 1990, I believe).

While one can draw the connection between Eldar and Protoss, you have to remember that there really was only one direction they could go after they included humans and mindless insectoids, which was the intelligent aliens with futuristic technology (the UFO's people tend to freak out at).

Since you get to know both of these intelligent technologically-advanced aliens on a personal level when you use them either on the tabletop or in a video game, they need to have character flaws, and arrogance/infighting fits the bill perfectly.

Blizzard deserves immense credit for how well-executed their games are - even if you don't like WoW or Starcraft II, their older games are classics. And yes, I am a huge fanboy, thanks for noticing.

 

[Hiphophippo]

Planescape: Torment for example, often argued as one of the highpoints of gaming as a story-telling medium, is based off the already existing D&D Planescape setting.

I'm not following your logic. Planescape is the setting, not the inspiration. That's like saying Warcraft is a rip off of Azeroth.

 

[The Madman]

Planescape: Torment for example, often argued as one of the highpoints of gaming as a story-telling medium, is based off the already existing D&D Planescape setting.

I'm not following your logic. Planescape is the setting, not the inspiration. That's like saying Warcraft is a rip off of Azeroth.

Planescape as a D&D setting however predates the game, Azeroth does not. That Planescape: Torment was a game already building on established ideas and concepts is all I'm saying, ideas and concept which themselves are no doubt riff off other setting from both book and movie.

Doesn't make the game itself any less fantastic though, just pointing out that in gaming there are very, very few genuinely original ideas as far as story and setting are concerned.

 

[Pearwood]

Does it matter? Blizzard never did anything original in their lives. What they did do was take existing things - IPs, game designs - and perfect them. Polish them until they glowed with a perfectly balanced, easily digestible sheen. Why not enjoy the games for what they are: fun?

This is pretty much dead on, it's not just Blizzard either. Every story has been done before to some degree, we've had thousands of years to tell stories and it's very difficult to come up with something new that isn't completely incomprehensible. Even the best writers nowadays play with old stories in new settings a la Grim Fandango playing around with the afterlife; or just focussing on telling the old story in a better, slightly different way.

 

[Hiphophippo]

Planescape as a D&D setting however predates the game, Azeroth does not. That Planescape: Torment was a game already building on established ideas and concepts is all I'm saying, ideas and concept which themselves are no doubt riff off other setting from both book and movie.

Doesn't make the game itself any less fantastic though, just pointing out that in gaming there are very, very few genuinely original ideas as far as story and setting are concerned.

So then, DnD online rips off Ebberon? The point I'm making, is that while I agree that there are few original ideas, a game cannot be a rip off of it's own setting.

Planescape remains my favorite campaign setting, for what it's worth. I'd love to see a newer edition of it.

 

[The Madman]

So then, DnD online rips off Ebberon? The point I'm making, is that while I agree that there are few original ideas, a game cannot be a rip off of it's own setting.

Planescape remains my favorite campaign setting, for what it's worth. I'd love to see a newer edition of it.

I wasn't calling it a ripoff at all, where'd you get that impression? Just that it was based on a pre-existing setting not unique to video games.

And I'd also love a reboot of the setting.

 

[Krion_Vark]

Hm lets see how many "Rip Offs" we can name in 60 seconds:

Splinter Cell is the Bourne Series
CoD is BF
BF is MoH
Inception is Paprika
Inception is an episode of Scrooge McDuck
Avatar is Dances With Wolves
Avatar is Disney's Pocahontas
Ghost's of Girlfriend's Past is A Christmas Carol

I could just go on but the list would be infinite.

OT: Does it really matter whether or not they are pretty much the same? I have played enough games that are pretty much rip offs of other games. There are so many "rip-offs" of so many different things.

 

[Hiphophippo]

So then, DnD online rips off Ebberon? The point I'm making, is that while I agree that there are few original ideas, a game cannot be a rip off of it's own setting.

Planescape remains my favorite campaign setting, for what it's worth. I'd love to see a newer edition of it.

I wasn't calling it a ripoff at all, where'd you get that impression? Just that it was based on a pre-existing setting not unique to video games.

And I'd also love a reboot of the setting.

Read into it wrong given the context of the thread, I suppose. Silly internet!

 

[saber152]

Honestly... I'm just tired of everything Blizzard has been doing lately. I don't care much for them as a game company at all anymore. The only reason I keep passing glances to what they're doing is because of Diablo III. Once that's out, I won't give a shit about them once again for another 8 or so years.

or at least till they make an expansion right.

THough there are rumours of a FPS in the form of Space Hulk on the way...

There is hope yet.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Warhammer_40,000:_Space_Marine
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Warhammer_40,000_Online
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ultramarines:The_Movie (written by Dan Abnett, oh I hope its uncensored)

i'm glad that GW seem to be widening their options. but dose it always have to be about the Space Marines, i mean what about chaos marines. on to the main point of this thread, i'm a fan of both games and the companies aside from playing WoW (don't ask long story) i like each companies games and i can spot the similarities and the differences, yet i don't feel that one rips off from the other, they are both original enough for people to tell them apart and enough alike for a fan of one series to play the other and not feel out of place playing it. i started out playing starcraft when my brother noticed how much i wanted to try it he game me his old laptop with the game when i was around 7, around 3 years ago i started warhammer 40k as a hobby and never once felt that GW ripped off blizzard or the other way around.

The story I've heard is that GW had selected BLIZZ to make a RTS based on W40k, but early on in development GW apparently pulled out and took their IP with them - leaving BLIZZ with an early stage game. So instead of wasting all that time and money, they tweaked parts of it and changed parts until it became the StarCraft we know today. In my mind, anything that emulates W40k, especially if it's fun, is pretty cool.

And I'm with you there on the Space Marine point, it does get a bit boring always playing a SM (although, I do like SMs, particularly the Space Wolves) but I have to mention this - [a href=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Warhammer_40,000:_Fire_Warrior]Fire Warrior[/a]. The entire time I played this game I wanted to be anything but Kais... and the gameplay generally sucked. The only elements I liked about it were the Bolters, and the Chaos Bolters (because they screamed when you fired them).

And exploded don't forget that, and i see what ur saying about so long as a game is fun and it's worth playing, i'll admit that Fire Warrior never really grasped that concept aside from giving the player a view of the warhammer 40k war from the Tau perspective and a bit of a look into how deranged chaos (and some of their players) can really be. also note that Salamanders rule out of the Space Marine chapters.

 

[Nouw]

uh... no one cares about warhammer..

Otehr than taht inflammatory statement, I got nothing.

That's basically asking for a flaming.

Also, I think we all know this.

Finally, Starship Troopers. Enough fucking said.

 

[Kennian]

Absolutly nothing blizz has done, ever, has been completely original and that is the secret to their success. They did a interview and said they use alot of slightly modified myths and such bEcause it's easer to get people invested in the story... Blizz be trollin yo!

As for the GW connection... Yea that's where blizz got the original ideas from... Terran/empire, Zerg/ tyranids, and Protoss/ eldar... Just look at the heads! Heh...

 

[ecoho]

Gonna play FFXIII now but I see what you guys are getting at. I know you use inspiration but I just feel that the games are too similar. My point is, you could probably take the stories from Starcraft and just use 40k names and it would work in the lore of Warhammer 40k.

Depends on what you do with it. You could argue that D&D's earliest phases were "ripping off of" LoTR, and by extension most every western fantasy RPG in existence with elves, dwarves, and hobbits/halflings/munchkins does too. Sure, they've got some races in common. Sure, its very similar in general. But the devil's in the details, and that's what sets the games and stories apart.

Also, there's a difference between minotaurs and anthropomorphic amerindian cows. A big difference. One's a bunch of marauding beasts with little-to-no grasp of the world apart from killing things and wandering labyrinths. The other are a race of mystic nomads with the ability to bend the very earth to their whim. And tauren look pretti-Err, Cooler. *ahem* Yes, cooler. That's what I was going to say. [sub][sub](Don't judge me)[/sub][/sub]

That's what's fun with Warhammer, it's like D&D, you can make up a story. If you started to play, you could give them a more peaceful background and almost ignore the current lore. Tauren sure are pretty though, lemme tell you... >.> What am I saying?

Ok Lightning, here I come.

ok i agree mostly with what you said mostly conserning the first starcraft and warcraft games but after that they kinda made it up as they went. now i played warhammer 40k as a table top game though it was only breefly(store who sold the figures closed)i got through enoth of the lore to be able to say this starcraft 2 cant be turned into a warhammer game and make since but thats mostly because of the actualy good campain
oh btw good luck with final fantisy 13 i played it for 10 hours and finaly got borde hope you have a better time with it then me

 

[Nomanslander]

This thread treads on an ancient battleground that has been the site of more flames wars than any other. Personally I think blizz simply took a cool idea from games workshop (who charge way the fuck to much for their products) and made it into an even better and more marketable product.

Who stole from who is irrelevant at the end of the day, what matters is which company has cashed in the most on their respective products.

Better? Don't you mean more shiny and watered down for a mass audience?

Because there is a difference if you didn't know.

Personally I've enjoyed my time with both Blizzard's Star/Warcraft games, and I will say they do know how to make addictive gameplay. But when it comes to the worlds they've created, diving in has only gotten me wet from the waste down and wanting more.

Try diving into War and War40K and you'll be seeing submarines and sunken pirate ships...=P

 

[jamesworkshop]

the links are fairly tenuious starcraft and 40K really don't share the same atmosphere The idea of "space marines" isn't new but how many made theirs a Holy crusading force of warrior monks that owe their genetic enhancements to a direct lineage to a living but now practically dead God.

40K's biggest influence is Dune

 

[AcacianLeaves]

Really? There are still people out there who don't know that Blizzard directly plagiarized Games Workshop? It's not even a question, Warcraft is a dumbed down Warhammer Fantasy Battle.

I feel I must provide this threat to those who never played tabletop games...