China: We're Beating the Pirates
- Thread starter The Wooster
- Start date
Because there isn't any piracy in Russia or Western countries. Don't forget, the pirate bay is hosted in Sweden.Paragon Fury said:
Yep, because the smarter ones block their IP so yeah, take it China.Robert Ewing said:
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Piracy is neither good nor bad and can't be quantified as a whole as either. Saying they beat the pirates is only the dumb ones and to beat it they had to essentially internet censor as much as possible.
"Piracy in China has dropped 38%. The rest paid their bribes on time."
That's how I read this. Needless to say there is probably some truth in there somewhere but it's so misrepresented there's no point. Remember that tank convoy didn't run that student over but it doesn't mean he spent the whole day having staring contests with the PLA armoured brigades (though you could make it look like that).
http://www.guardian.co.uk/media/pda/2010/mar/23/google-china
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/w...ull-out-of-china-over-censorship-1925052.html
HK is a different issue because it's a "Special Administrative Region" with its own laws (and no censorship on google.hk which is where google.cn now directs you).
That's how I read this. Needless to say there is probably some truth in there somewhere but it's so misrepresented there's no point. Remember that tank convoy didn't run that student over but it doesn't mean he spent the whole day having staring contests with the PLA armoured brigades (though you could make it look like that).
That was a non-starter. Dead in the water before it even got off the ground because of public outcry and both the opposition Liberal (Tories technically) and Green parties opposed it. Try that in China and the only thing dead will be you (not to mention the distinct lack of opposition parties).Li Mu said:
Again, dead as a dodo, mostly due to widespread public protest from both members of the public and independent corporations (on both sides). Again, let's see that happen in China, and then you might have a leg to stand on.Li Mu said:
You sure you haven't swallowed some of the water you've been swimming in? No-doubt there is corruption in the Japanese government but to claim that the Chinese media would drag anyone through the mud for corruption allegations (because that's what they are, allegations) such as this is preposterous.Li Mu said:
As opposed to machine gunning them? Imagine riots on the scale of those in London in China: the Chinese police wouldn't hesitate to use automatic weapons (they have before). In contrast the British were torn about using plastic bullets (baton rounds) and water cannons when confronted with that sort of disorder. A few (obstructing) protestors getting a bit of pepper spray in their eyes is hardly the actions of an evil police state as you might like to make out.Li Mu said:
The thing is you didn't have access to them. Why is that? Websites going offline randomly, news sites being blocked and generally restrictions on your ability to access information should all set alarm bells ringing.Li Mu said:
You're half right actually. Google isn't banned in China because they no longer operate there:hazabaza1 said:
http://www.guardian.co.uk/media/pda/2010/mar/23/google-china
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/w...ull-out-of-china-over-censorship-1925052.html
HK is a different issue because it's a "Special Administrative Region" with its own laws (and no censorship on google.hk which is where google.cn now directs you).
You clearly missed his point.Li Mu said:
See, when the Americans wage war with China and the inevitable exchange of nukes occur, the world goes to hell and becomes incapable of sustaining life. Then there will be no pirates left. Problem solved, fuck yeah!
Though of course, considering nearly every American action always came back to bite 'em in the ass some time later (the Talibans, Saddam's regime, the Iranian Shah, etc), I would say we'll end up with something worse. Radioactive pirates, maybe?
I will concede that you have a fair point here.Grey Day for Elcia said:
Unfortunately this is wrong and I'm not sure how you missed the endless articles about China's growing middle class.
To quote CNN's examination of the growing Chinese middle class. *
. It is estimated that it's more than 300 million -- already larger than the entire population of the United States.
About 25% of the population is middle class. It's about 50% of the urban population.
So you consider 300 million to be virtually nothing? 25% = one quarter. It's not great but you cannot say it's 'virtually' nothing.
Misleading. The cost of living in China is far lower than in a 'nice country'. You can live fairly comfortably on $5 per day.
The Average wage for someone in Shanghai is probably about $200-300 a month. When you take into account the cost of food and rent you actually come out pretty even. I lived in a fairly large 3 bedroom apartment in Xujiahui and was paying ?250 per month in rent. But of course, there are cheaper places for people earning less.
How about this for a comparison; I currently live in Germany and am looking for a new job. Most of the jobs/internships being offered actually provide a wage which is comparatively worse than the average wage in China. It sounds crazy but it's true. I was offered a job here which paid ?600 per month. This is perfectly legal and fairly common place (at least in Berlin).
I was actually joking with a friend the other week that the Chinese have it better than Berliners when it comes to having a wage you can live on.
I'm not sure what you are getting at. Are you suggesting that they have no health care or that they have no 'free' health system? Indeed, there is no free social health care, but neither is there in the US or most of Europe. You pay have health insurance (just like in most countries). I got very sick whilst there and spent 2 weeks in hospital and actually have to say that the care I received was better than I ever got in the UK.
Again, not true. Recently many police and judges have been imprisoned for abusing their power
There is currently a huge crack down on corruption in the police force and legal system.
True and I'll agree with you on this; Mao really fucked things up for them. They were the country which invented paper, gunpowder, the compass...etc. But since the cultural revolution they have done nothing but copy.
Recently the policy in schools has changed and it is now taught that Mao is a dumbass who fucked a lot of things up for China. Of course, they do it in a rather respectful way, but most Chinese kids have a disliking for Mao.
Umm...no. You were giving quite a good argument until you decided to evoke Godwin's law. That's quite insulting.
It's not opinion, I am presenting you with as many facts as I can. You just chose to ignore them. But as I have stated, we have agreed on a few things.
*http://money.cnn.com/2012/04/25/news/economy/china-middle-class/index.htm
You clearly missed his point.
See, when the Americans wage war with China and the inevitable exchange of nukes occur, the world goes to hell and becomes incapable of sustaining life. Then there will be no pirates left. Problem solved, fuck yeah!
Though of course, considering nearly every American action always came back to bite 'em in the ass some time later (the Talibans, Saddam's regime, the Iranian Shah, etc), I would say we'll end up with something worse. Radioactive pirates, maybe?[/quote]
Oh well, if that was his point then I clearly did miss it. Good point, nuke everyone and then there wont be pirates...unless we end up in a Mad Max scenario and we have desert pirates! shiiiit.
I recently learnt that the US armed Ho Chi Mihn to fight against the French just 10 years before the US/Vietnam war. I never knew that, but it pretty much completes the pattern.
US gives guns and training to a country -> Within 10 years the US is fighting them.
I see a radical solution...stop giving these people training and weapons!
See, when the Americans wage war with China and the inevitable exchange of nukes occur, the world goes to hell and becomes incapable of sustaining life. Then there will be no pirates left. Problem solved, fuck yeah!
Though of course, considering nearly every American action always came back to bite 'em in the ass some time later (the Talibans, Saddam's regime, the Iranian Shah, etc), I would say we'll end up with something worse. Radioactive pirates, maybe?[/quote]
Oh well, if that was his point then I clearly did miss it. Good point, nuke everyone and then there wont be pirates...unless we end up in a Mad Max scenario and we have desert pirates! shiiiit.
I recently learnt that the US armed Ho Chi Mihn to fight against the French just 10 years before the US/Vietnam war. I never knew that, but it pretty much completes the pattern.
US gives guns and training to a country -> Within 10 years the US is fighting them.
I see a radical solution...stop giving these people training and weapons!
Yeah, but these arent exactly the guys who seem like they are doing anything good for the market. With that amount of disrespect for the original content I wasnt expecting them to care about piracyGatx said:
Well, piracy makes things available for free so no one gets any money. So obviously for domestic creations, even extremely unoriginal ones, a Chinese company isn't getting any of the profits, and for foreign releases, the companies that do the licensing aren't getting a cut, so of course China would want to cut down on piracy if they want their legitimate companies to grow.josemlopes said:
Are you sure this is a good issue to debate? Even by your own admission China can't be generalised in any way, shape, or form.Li Mu said:
Speaking from an European experience I can confidently say that generalising social conditions, government policies, or average wealth in Europe would be a joke - and China is easily a few times larger.
So a state funded paper is making this claim, in China? Seems legit.
Even if they were making a modicum of progress, they broke the first rule of the war on piracy. NEVER ANNOUNCE PROGRESS. The culture of piracy and hackers is such that they will go out of their way to prove you wrong. It happens every time someone comes out with "unbreakable" DRM or blockades a torrent site.
Even if they were making a modicum of progress, they broke the first rule of the war on piracy. NEVER ANNOUNCE PROGRESS. The culture of piracy and hackers is such that they will go out of their way to prove you wrong. It happens every time someone comes out with "unbreakable" DRM or blockades a torrent site.
I think part of the problem is that a great deal of media is wholesaled to China at Western prices.
Look at it this way; Ipad is made in some factory in Chengdu for $50. The employee is paid $200 per month to make these Ipads. The very same Ipad is then sold back to the Chinese at $600.
But how can the average Chinese afford such a thing? He can't, so in comes the black market.
Some products make fairly small profit margins, but other things make huuuge profits (I'm looking at you Apple).
But of course, if Apple decided to sell the Ipad at an affordable price for Chinese (lets say $200) then who would buy the $600 model? We'd all just import the cheaper Chinese version.
This means that Chinese cannot afford our stuff simply because their cost of living is different to our own. But they still want these products, so there will be piracy.
Lets get hypothetical for a moment...
Imagine if you lived in France. Everywhere in the world people earn ?1000 per month, but in France you earn ?10. ?10 in France is actually a very good wage and you have more than enough food and a nice house. But when the 'Okama Gamesphere' is released in Japan and goes on sale for ?500 (a reasonable price everywhere else) you just have no way to ever buy one.
But suddenly your friend, who happens to have an eye patch and a wooden leg, offers you a pirate version...what do you do?
Basically, as long as there is a difference in the cost of living between countries in this world there will be piracy.
Look at it this way; Ipad is made in some factory in Chengdu for $50. The employee is paid $200 per month to make these Ipads. The very same Ipad is then sold back to the Chinese at $600.
But how can the average Chinese afford such a thing? He can't, so in comes the black market.
Some products make fairly small profit margins, but other things make huuuge profits (I'm looking at you Apple).
But of course, if Apple decided to sell the Ipad at an affordable price for Chinese (lets say $200) then who would buy the $600 model? We'd all just import the cheaper Chinese version.
This means that Chinese cannot afford our stuff simply because their cost of living is different to our own. But they still want these products, so there will be piracy.
Lets get hypothetical for a moment...
Imagine if you lived in France. Everywhere in the world people earn ?1000 per month, but in France you earn ?10. ?10 in France is actually a very good wage and you have more than enough food and a nice house. But when the 'Okama Gamesphere' is released in Japan and goes on sale for ?500 (a reasonable price everywhere else) you just have no way to ever buy one.
But suddenly your friend, who happens to have an eye patch and a wooden leg, offers you a pirate version...what do you do?
Basically, as long as there is a difference in the cost of living between countries in this world there will be piracy.
Meanwhile China has bugs in Western computers that allow them access into western computers that control nuclear reactors and weapon guidance systems.