Discuss and Rate the Last Film You Watched

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BrawlMan

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I’m going to guess that it may have something to do with a person who was clearly going to get fridged from the moment you saw him. Nowadays, you gotta at least pretend their a real person. She also is very quick to ‘learn’ things. The 90s were full of protags that were exceptional, with no flaws. Also full of protags that learn nothing but get better by upgrading their weapons.
Alita is flawed, we've been over this in the Mary Sue topic (which she is not). Read the manga. The film does show this. She can be mischievous and a blood knight. Plus, she does get her ass kicked a couple of times, while getting in an epic "Fuck your mercy!" in one of them. Hell, she's been torn apart in the source material several times. Hugo's case is obvious if you read the manga, but I've met several people who thought he would survive. And these are people who do watch movies, but never read the manga nor have seen the OVA. She was an elite soldier (once again in the manga), so of course her memories of fighting are going to come back to her. Not that different from Jason Bourne. Sure, he takes few more licks, but we're getting into different genres at this point.
 
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Ezekiel

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Alita is flawed, we've been over this in the Mary Sue topic (which she is not). Read the manga. The film does show this. She can be mischevious and a blood knight. Plus, she does get her ass kicked a couple of times, while gettting in an epic "Fuck your, mercy!" in one of them. Hell, she's been torn apart in the souce material several times. Hugo's case is obvious if you read the manga, but I've met several people who thought he would survive. And these are people who do watch movies, but never read the manga or seen the OVA. And she was an elite soldier (once again in the manga), so of course her memories of fighting are going to come back to her. Not that different from Jason Bourne. Sure he takes few more licks, but we're getting in to different genres at this point.
To be fair to Trunkage, the story does revolve more around her than it did in the manga. Especially motorball. In the manga, she was just one of the players. She played to challenge herself and learn something about herself. In the movie, the game is used as a ploy to kill her. The game revolves around her. There was so little time for motorball in Hugo's chapters. It should have been in a second movie. If they never made a second movie, then oh well. The logic of trying to do more awesome (be more significant and grand as Gordon_4 said earlier) is like trying to nonsensically squeeze the freeway chase from Reloaded into The Matrix. It has no place in the first movie.

Speaking of being exceptional, she doesn't even earn her stripes before running her mouth off at the bar. Her speech makes sense in the manga, because the Grewishka character (a combination of Zapan and Makaku) is a bounty who has killed hunter warriors. In the movie, he is after Ido and Alita. So what? Why should the other hunter warriors care? He doesn't even have a bounty. She looks like an idiot talking down to them, calling them cowards. It's no wonder they all conspire to kill her at the end, lol. Some hunter warriors use Ido’s business, but not all or probably even most. He can’t service a whole city for free. If the visitors there went to him, she would have mentioned it in her speech, called them out for not helping him after he helped them. She simply asks for their help against a "common" enemy (though I don’t remember the film ever establishing him as a common enemy), tells them he is protected by the system and then tells them he is now after Ido and her. There is a leap in logic there, like she forgot to explain how those things relate to everyone else. Besides, Ido only yells "No more free repairs” after everybody stops fighting, which makes the scene chronologically confusing and ineffective. She already made her speech and started hurting people before he yelled that. He yelled that after I had already made a mental note of the nonsense. He is an enemy to the others only indirectly. It would have been more effective to develop that character more beforehand, like in the book, and make him a bounty they have a reason to kill, like in the book.



There! That is adequate setup and sufficient dialogue! He has a big bounty and he has killed the hunters who have tried to take him, two things that are not true in the movie. The stakes are clear in the book and her stance is immediately understandable. It's a job, not just a personal problem. She calls them cowards for not having the spines to do their jobs and take this bounty. An actual bounty! If the scene wasn't going to work for their movie, then they should have built the story differently and possibly even dropped the scene.

Speaking further about being exceptional, the way the Berzerker body conforms to her looks too fantastic and fake in the movie. Regenerating instantly in the movie makes her too powerful.
 

Ezekiel

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To elaborate on what I was saying about not earning her stripes prior to running her mouth off at the bar, what I meant is that she doesn’t even have a bounty kill to her name. She doesn't earn any bounties under her name in the book before then either, but she does face off against Makaku, takes his eye out in a dramatic fight and then shows intense determination after, swearing to crush his brains in her fist. In the movie, she acts like she's such hot shit after she's only had one brief fight.
 

Gordon_4

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To be fair to Trunkage, the story does revolve more around her than it did in the manga. Especially motorball. In the manga, she was just one of the players. She played to challenge herself and learn something about herself. In the movie, the game is used as a ploy to kill her. The game revolves around her. There was so little time for motorball in Hugo's chapters. It should have been in a second movie. If they never made a second movie, then oh well. The logic of trying to do more awesome (be more significant and grand as Gordon_4 said earlier) is like trying to nonsensically squeeze the freeway chase from Reloaded into The Matrix. It has no place in the first movie.

Speaking of being exceptional, she doesn't even earn her stripes before running her mouth off at the bar.
And the bar's response to that speech was to laugh at her. Zappan spends the entire time he's taking to her taking the piss. Until she puts his face through a table of course. But that's the thing; you can be exceptional and still make utterly braindead decisions.
 
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Ezekiel

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And the bar's response to that speech was to laugh at her. Zappan spends the entire time he's taking to her taking the piss. Until she puts his face through a table of course. But that's the thing; you can be exceptional and still make utterly braindead decisions.
But that makes her look more ridiculous and dumb than naive. Her behavior there is so unbelievable.
 

BrawlMan

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But that makes her look more ridiculous and dumb than naive. Her behavior there is so unbelievable.
I am well aware of the differences in your previous posts with the pictures, and I thank you for the details and being thorough. While there are many side and supporting characters with more focus in the manga, there is only so much you can add in a two and a half hour film. If they started adding all of those characters, the movie would of had additional problems. That the thing with adapting, you win some, you lose some. Not every single thing needs to be 1 to 1. Hence why it is called an adaption. The different piece of media is supposed to adapt. It kinda why I hate the whole, if an anime is exactly 100% like the manga then it automatically good card. Which is bull. If the manga already suffers from plot, story, or characters problems and the anime does not improve or remove any unnecessary elements, than it is pointless.

As for the bar scene, it's clear she has some naivety, but she ain't stupid. It's clear right from the get go Alita had a plan/improvised on it.
 

Thaluikhain

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Bridge over the River Kwai

Classic movie, but apparently not very historically accurate, in that everything was wrong. You name it, it didn't happen that way.
 

gorfias

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Bridge over the River Kwai

Classic movie, but apparently not very historically accurate, in that everything was wrong. You name it, it didn't happen that way.
I've always known it was a work of fiction but it does appear to have been inspired by real historical facts:


"Between 180,000 and 250,000 Allied prisoners of war were subjected to forced labour during its construction. About 102,000 Allied prisoners died. "

Japan had not signed the Geneva Convention as it pertained to exempting sergeants and above from physical labor so calling it a war crime for them to have forced officers to engage in such labor?
 

Ezekiel

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I am well aware of the differences in your previous posts with the pictures, and I thank you for the details and being thorough. While there are many side and supporting characters with more focus in the manga, there is only so much you can add in a two and a half hour film. If they started adding all of those characters, the movie would of had additional problems. That the thing with adapting, you win some, you lose some. Not every single thing needs to be 1 to 1. Hence why it is called an adaption. The different piece of media is supposed to adapt. It kinda why I hate the whole, if an anime is exactly 100% like the manga then it automatically good card. Which is bull. If the manga already suffers from plot, story, or characters problems and the anime does not improve or remove any unnecessary elements, than it is pointless.

As for the bar scene, it's clear she has some naivety, but she ain't stupid. It's clear right from the get go Alita had a plan/improvised on it.
I agree, a movie doesn't have to follow the same story exactly. But if a scene doesn't work, like the bar scene, then it means you have to change the events surrounding the scene or remove the scene. Comic book movies do this all the time, tell original stories that are still true to the comic and its characters.
 

Thaluikhain

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I've always known it was a work of fiction but it does appear to have been inspired by real historical facts:
Somewhat, yes, in a very vague way.

Japan had not signed the Geneva Convention as it pertained to exempting sergeants and above from physical labor so calling it a war crime for them to have forced officers to engage in such labor?
Huh, I've no idea how that was supposed to work. I personally don't see why officers should be exempted if you can force enlisted personnel.
 
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Ezekiel

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Bridge over the River Kwai

Classic movie, but apparently not very historically accurate, in that everything was wrong. You name it, it didn't happen that way.
I've always known, but never cared. It's still a masterpiece. I just don't think most historical movies need to be historically accurate, because they're made for entertainment purposes. I prefer it slightly over Lean's later film Lawrence of Arabia, which is more historically accurate.
 

Thaluikhain

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I just don't think most historical movies need to be historically accurate, because they're made for entertainment purposes.
Dunno, there was a lot of more or less treason in that film, and the people involved in the thing the film was based on didn't do that. Seems a bit insulting.

Not saying it's a bad film, though, just that sort of thing bugs me. Think I prefer Lawrence of Arabia, myself, has that epic thing to it which Bridge over the River Kwai didn't so much.
 

Ezekiel

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Really tempted to get this new 4K collection featuring Lawrence, but my future is uncertain again because of this virus and 109 dollars isn't nothing.

 
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hanselthecaretaker

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I've always known, but never cared. It's still a masterpiece. I just don't think most historical movies need to be historically accurate, because they're made for entertainment purposes. I prefer it slightly over Lean's later film Lawrence of Arabia, which is more historically accurate.

Speaking of historical movies, on topic I just watched Ford VS Ferrari last night. I like to check out the IMDb trivia for stuff like this especially, but it wasn’t especially helpful in this case. I wanted to know if The Deuce really lost it like that during the test drive.


Apparently he did get emotional, but I know Hollywood dramatizes everything. Was interesting to read that Christian Bale once again lost a bunch of weight for a role (70bs) and was hands down the best actor the trainer at Bondurant High Performance Driving School worked with. Its founder was also friends with the real Ken Miles, and Bale got a good account on the race scene from back then. All in all it was a solid movie with good performances all around, if a bit tropey feeling with the Leo Beebe villainy.

Also, we’d never hear a speech like this in today’s automotive factories -


I wonder about that scene’s accuracy as well, although I’m sure the gist was the same.
 

SupahEwok

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Huh, I've no idea how that was supposed to work. I personally don't see why officers should be exempted if you can force enlisted personnel.
Military tradition, going all the way back to officers being nobility. Officers today still have all sorts of privileges over enlisted men, but back in the day officers were expected to be treated with dignity when captured, often being given better quarters than the enlisted men of the side that captured the officer. It was even considered dishonorable to purposefully kill an officer in battle.

Such privilege eroded over time (notably, at a similar rate to nobility), but more traditionalist armies such as Japan's in the early 20th century would still favor them in such a way.

That said, sergeants are not officers like that. Commisioned officers are the line from lieutenants up to generals, sergeants are still enlisted, but have achieved a rank which makes them Non-Commisioned Officers. In general they're still treated far more like enlisted than commissioned officers. And so far as the Geneva Convention goes, the closest thing I could find to what Gorfias mentioned was from the 1907 Hague Regulations, which only say "The State may utilize the labour of prisoners of war according to their rank and aptitude, officers excepted. The tasks shall not be excessive and shall have no connection with the operations of the war." I did not find a corresponding passage exempting officers in the Geneva Conventions, so I think that point is moot. The more probable Geneva Convention violation is using POW labor for purposes of war; the regulations stated that you can't force POWs to make weapons or infrastructure conducive to conducting warfare.
 

Johnny Novgorod

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A very effective, very taut thriller starring Joseph Gordon Levitt about a plane hijacking, shot almost entirely from inside the cockpit, which basically becomes a panic room for Levitt (he plays the co-pilot) shortly after takeoff. It's very good filmmaking and very good acting although the story left me cold; the movie doesn't really make a point or say something about anything. It's all shock. I wasn't sure if it was supposed to be based on a real-life hijacking, and it might as well be, plot points being so sparse and grounded, everything being treated with a cold, procedural energy. It becomes easy to put yourself in the situation and sync with the protagonist, until he handles things in a way that you think you wouldn't, and that pissed me off, but whatever. I was backseating the whole movie but for me that means being engaged in the thing.
 

Phoenixmgs

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Speaking of historical movies, on topic I just watched Ford VS Ferrari last night. I like to check out the IMDb trivia for stuff like this especially, but it wasn’t especially helpful in this case.
I don't really know about your specific questions but I do know that there's was no conflict in having Christian Bale's character be able to participate in those races.
 

hanselthecaretaker

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I don't really know about your specific questions but I do know that there's was no conflict in having Christian Bale's character be able to participate in those races.
So the whole “We can’t have Ken Miles racing Le Mans cuz he’s a wildcard” angle was completely dramatized fiction? Seems like they went heavy on it to not have some truth, but not surprised.

What about the three cars crossing the line together, and him deciding last minute not to just smoke them all thus sacrificing his triple crown?
 

Phoenixmgs

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So the whole “We can’t have Ken Miles racing Le Mans cuz he’s a wildcard” angle was completely dramatized fiction? Seems like they went heavy on it to not have some truth, but not surprised.

What about the three cars crossing the line together, and him deciding last minute not to just smoke them all thus sacrificing his triple crown?
From just looking a couple things up now, Ken Miles was a bit of a wildcard but not so much that Shelby had to fight to get him to be able to race. The cars did cross the line at the same time as I paused the movie and looked that up then as that seemed really odd to do in a sports competition. Just reading a bit more about it now, it was done in part to ensure the Ford drivers weren't trying to fight each other for the win and possibly crash or push the cars too much, which makes some sense. And, apparently, Shelby had to threaten Miles and Ford's other top racer (Gurney) to back off each other in a previous race, but Gurney blew a head gasket in the Le Mans race where he and Miles were going back and forth in the race so Miles easily wins because of that. From what I did just read, the douche-y Ford guy knew that Miles would lose if they tied and didn't tell nobody though.
 
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Thaluikhain

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Mad Max: Fury Road

Which is mostly one long car chase, but it's a fairly nice long car chase. Also, it's a franchise from several decades ago which has a modern reboot/remake/sequel that isn't rubbish. Which is more or less unprecedented.