DLC for Dummies

[bootz]

the wow Dlc you talk about went to a CHARITY called make a wish.
http://www.escapistmagazine.com/news/view/105139-New-WoW-Minipets-Help-Charity-Look-Damn-Cute
Wow has 100 of pets and mounts for FREE! You dont need to buy them.

Is valve doing that? No

No valve is selling hats that make seeing a white robot against white wall better.
Why would they make the robots white. The only way to see them is with a hat you have to buy.

I have this game through gamefly. I was going to buy it but the dlc made me reconsider.
Why should I pay for an incomplete game. If they were unlockables i would buy this up.

The hats increase Visability of your coop partner so they affect gameplay. They are not entirely cosmetic.

Don't call me an idiot because I expect a full game when I Pay for one.

I loved the writing of portal 2. I wished the credits had the contributors paypal email so I could send the writers some cash.

 

[Echo136]

Just to comment on the time played, I talked to my roommate this morning and he said he finished it in about 4 and a half hours his first play through, 2nd play through in about 2 and a half. And I've been hearing from various other people on my steam friends list that they've done it in 4-5.
I personally have yet to get a crack at the game because my copy is somewhere in the mail...

Unless they're cheating or exploiting the game systems in some way, there is no possible way you, or anyone, can beat Portal 2 in 2 and a half hours. Even if you know exactly what to do all the time, it will still take at least 5 hours.

If they're going by what the Steam timer says, they should know that the Steam timer is broken. I once played New Vegas from day(about 5PM) to night(was 10 when I got off), and Steam says I played it for 2 hours.

Steam Timer is broken, it is not a good way to tell how long you've played a game. Best way to do that is to not the time when you start, and note it when you stop. Then just use simple maths to figure out the difference.

But Portal 2 is not 4 hours long. There is no possible way, except with cheats/exploits, to beat the game in under 5 hours.

Somehow I doubt this. Ive watched speed runs of Portal 1 being done in under an hour, as short as 30 minutes. Im sure someone will find a way to play Portal 2 in lets say 2 hours.

 

[AngryFrenchCanadian]

Wait, don't you get the hats for free if you have them in TF2?

 

[AngryFrenchCanadian]

Just to comment on the time played, I talked to my roommate this morning and he said he finished it in about 4 and a half hours his first play through, 2nd play through in about 2 and a half. And I've been hearing from various other people on my steam friends list that they've done it in 4-5.
I personally have yet to get a crack at the game because my copy is somewhere in the mail...

Unless they're cheating or exploiting the game systems in some way, there is no possible way you, or anyone, can beat Portal 2 in 2 and a half hours. Even if you know exactly what to do all the time, it will still take at least 5 hours.

If they're going by what the Steam timer says, they should know that the Steam timer is broken. I once played New Vegas from day(about 5PM) to night(was 10 when I got off), and Steam says I played it for 2 hours.

Steam Timer is broken, it is not a good way to tell how long you've played a game. Best way to do that is to not the time when you start, and note it when you stop. Then just use simple maths to figure out the difference.

But Portal 2 is not 4 hours long. There is no possible way, except with cheats/exploits, to beat the game in under 5 hours.

Somehow I doubt this. Ive watched speed runs of Portal 1 being done in under an hour, as short as 30 minutes. Im sure someone will find a way to play Portal 2 in lets say 2 hours.

You can't judge the length of one game by measuring the length of another, now can you?

 

[Shjade]

Unprofessional and uncool Shamus, calling people idiots for not agreeing with you is pretty much what your accusing them of.

He's not calling them idiots for disagreeing with him. He's calling them idiots for review-bombing Portal 2 on Metacritic. I would bet Shamus has no problem with people who state an opposing opinion so long as it isn't coupled with what is essentially an attempt to actively damage the game.

Disliking DLC is one thing. Voting a great game down with a 0 score because you dislike their style of marketing is being an idiot...according to Shamus, at least. I'd call it being a dick, myself.

 

[AngryFrenchCanadian]

the wow Dlc you talk about went to a CHARITY called make a wish.
http://www.escapistmagazine.com/news/view/105139-New-WoW-Minipets-Help-Charity-Look-Damn-Cute
Wow has 100 of pets and mounts for FREE! You dont need to buy them.

Is valve doing that? No

No valve is selling hats that make seeing a white robot against white wall better.
Why would they make the robots white. The only way to see them is with a hat you have to buy.

I have this game through gamefly. I was going to buy it but the dlc made me reconsider.
Why should I pay for an incomplete game. If they were unlockables i would buy this up.

The hats increase Visability of your coop partner so they affect gameplay. They are not entirely cosmetic.

Don't call me an idiot because I expect a full game when I Pay for one.

I loved the writing of portal 2. I wished the credits had the contributors paypal email so I could send the writers some cash.

Uh, WOW is subscription-based. Valve's games aren't. If you play on the PC, you don't have to pay for anything else than the initial price of purchase, unless you're impatient. Then there's the Mann Co. store for that. The hats don't affect gameplay at all. Not only do you get them for free if you have them in TF2, you also have the ability to know where your partner is at all time anyways. Plus, the game is Cooperative, not competitive.

 

[Irridium]

Just to comment on the time played, I talked to my roommate this morning and he said he finished it in about 4 and a half hours his first play through, 2nd play through in about 2 and a half. And I've been hearing from various other people on my steam friends list that they've done it in 4-5.
I personally have yet to get a crack at the game because my copy is somewhere in the mail...

Unless they're cheating or exploiting the game systems in some way, there is no possible way you, or anyone, can beat Portal 2 in 2 and a half hours. Even if you know exactly what to do all the time, it will still take at least 5 hours.

If they're going by what the Steam timer says, they should know that the Steam timer is broken. I once played New Vegas from day(about 5PM) to night(was 10 when I got off), and Steam says I played it for 2 hours.

Steam Timer is broken, it is not a good way to tell how long you've played a game. Best way to do that is to not the time when you start, and note it when you stop. Then just use simple maths to figure out the difference.

But Portal 2 is not 4 hours long. There is no possible way, except with cheats/exploits, to beat the game in under 5 hours.

Somehow I doubt this. Ive watched speed runs of Portal 1 being done in under an hour, as short as 30 minutes. Im sure someone will find a way to play Portal 2 in lets say 2 hours.

Yeah, after lots and lots of training, preparation, and full knowledge of everything. Something nobody could do within the short time its been released.

 

[PopcornAvenger]

Sure, as a consumer I want everything I can conceivably get from Valve for the same amount of money. What we need to open our minds to, though, is that the amount of content we once got in a game is no longer something we can conceivably get. Not when costs have risen as much as they have. This is the bad sort of entitlement, the sort that wants to cede no ground and still take more in return. We shouldn't just cave to the companies, of course, and buy whatever they put out - but neither can we continue to expect them to make games with production values that cost exponentially more to achieve than they used to and comparable levels of content without also expecting a commensurate increase in price. And sure, the average game price has increased by ten dollars in recent years, but we need to accept that this may not have been enough (indeed, it wasn't).

Nice post, and this portion hits the nail right on the head, for me. My sense of entitlement comes from past products (one big example would be comparing the amount of content you got, and gameplay hours, in Bioware's Baldur's Gate 2, to, say, Dragon Age 2). I am having a hard time paying more for what I perceive is less, and Day 1 DLC feels like adding insult to injury.

It's also a good point that DLC greatly differs from company to company.

I've never graduated from the view that if I buy a game, it should be a product that potentially can tie me up for weeks. As more and more unrealistic as that's becoming.

 

[satoru]

the wow Dlc you talk about went to a CHARITY called make a wish.
http://www.escapistmagazine.com/news/view/105139-New-WoW-Minipets-Help-Charity-Look-Damn-Cute
Wow has 100 of pets and mounts for FREE! You dont need to buy them.

Is valve doing that? No

No valve is selling hats that make seeing a white robot against white wall better.
Why would they make the robots white. The only way to see them is with a hat you have to buy.

I have this game through gamefly. I was going to buy it but the dlc made me reconsider.
Why should I pay for an incomplete game. If they were unlockables i would buy this up.

The hats increase Visability of your coop partner so they affect gameplay. They are not entirely cosmetic.

Don't call me an idiot because I expect a full game when I Pay for one.

I loved the writing of portal 2. I wished the credits had the contributors paypal email so I could send the writers some cash.

I fail to see how it's 'incomplete' in any way shape or form. You play through the single player. In coop your players are white so they are instantly visible under the grey/black backgrounds of the level. They are tall and skinny so that their outlines are also distinct. In TF2 the major complaint has been that hats make user LESS recogniseable, not more so. This is especially problematic at long distances, where the unique outlines of the characters make it such that you can determine if a scout is coming at you, or a heavy. The stuff you can buy is purely vanity. Doesn't impact gameplay.

Hell in coop they gave you tons of tools to see your coop player. Picture in picture views. Visible tags that you can set. Countdown timer.

It's far more valid to complain about DA2, where Sebastian was a Day0 DLC that really had no reason to be. You missed out on an entire storyline, and a potential critical decision in the end game if you didn't get it. By contrast, in Portal 2 you're missing a hat? Or look at some of the play for free games, where you are absolutely non-competitive without purchasing the DLC content.

There is nothing 'missing' in Portal 2 if you don't have the DLC content. Redirect your anger where such an argument is actually valid like Dragon Age 2, or Battlefield Heroes.

 

[Echo136]

Just to comment on the time played, I talked to my roommate this morning and he said he finished it in about 4 and a half hours his first play through, 2nd play through in about 2 and a half. And I've been hearing from various other people on my steam friends list that they've done it in 4-5.
I personally have yet to get a crack at the game because my copy is somewhere in the mail...

Unless they're cheating or exploiting the game systems in some way, there is no possible way you, or anyone, can beat Portal 2 in 2 and a half hours. Even if you know exactly what to do all the time, it will still take at least 5 hours.

If they're going by what the Steam timer says, they should know that the Steam timer is broken. I once played New Vegas from day(about 5PM) to night(was 10 when I got off), and Steam says I played it for 2 hours.

Steam Timer is broken, it is not a good way to tell how long you've played a game. Best way to do that is to not the time when you start, and note it when you stop. Then just use simple maths to figure out the difference.

But Portal 2 is not 4 hours long. There is no possible way, except with cheats/exploits, to beat the game in under 5 hours.

Somehow I doubt this. Ive watched speed runs of Portal 1 being done in under an hour, as short as 30 minutes. Im sure someone will find a way to play Portal 2 in lets say 2 hours.

Yeah, after lots and lots of training, preparation, and full knowledge of everything. Something nobody could do within the short time its been released.

You specifically said multiple times that theirs no way it could be beat in under 5 hours, Im here to tell you someone's going to do it. Whether it happens 2 days from now or 2 months from now is irrelevent.

 

[restoshammyman]

snip

science is not about why. its about why not!
why are all of our tests so deadly? why don't you marry safe science if you love it so much!
in fact why don't you invent a door that wont hit your ass on the way out!

 

[smallharmlesskitten]

Valve is one of the worst offenders when it comes to DLC.

That's with Team Fortress 2. About Portal 2, I agree with Shamus entirely.

Team Fortress 2 - there is 5 things unavailable through drops. 3 were for charity. You can still get everything by drops. the store doesn't cancel out 4 gb of content updates. Hats are cosmetic and dont change the game. Get that into your head.

Portal - a tiny button (I personally didn't notice it until after single player). With Cosmetic thingies. That you can still obtain through. Oh wait. Playing the game.

lets compare this to project 10 dollar. which locks out part of the crunt knockling actual content because you had the audactiy to buy i second hand

Lets look at Bethesda and horse armour and quest givers openly selling you extra quests.

Lets look at Other games where you pay 10 bucks and you download a 500kb unlocking key that unlocks shit already in the data file.

Get the fuck over your entitled self and take a fucking step back. They are in no way the worst offender in any regard when it comes to DLC. They do not deny you any content. They do not openly yell about the OMG SHINIES BUY at you. All actualy CONTENT has been free for Team Fortress 2 and all their other games.

 

[Irridium]

Just to comment on the time played, I talked to my roommate this morning and he said he finished it in about 4 and a half hours his first play through, 2nd play through in about 2 and a half. And I've been hearing from various other people on my steam friends list that they've done it in 4-5.
I personally have yet to get a crack at the game because my copy is somewhere in the mail...

Unless they're cheating or exploiting the game systems in some way, there is no possible way you, or anyone, can beat Portal 2 in 2 and a half hours. Even if you know exactly what to do all the time, it will still take at least 5 hours.

If they're going by what the Steam timer says, they should know that the Steam timer is broken. I once played New Vegas from day(about 5PM) to night(was 10 when I got off), and Steam says I played it for 2 hours.

Steam Timer is broken, it is not a good way to tell how long you've played a game. Best way to do that is to not the time when you start, and note it when you stop. Then just use simple maths to figure out the difference.

But Portal 2 is not 4 hours long. There is no possible way, except with cheats/exploits, to beat the game in under 5 hours.

Somehow I doubt this. Ive watched speed runs of Portal 1 being done in under an hour, as short as 30 minutes. Im sure someone will find a way to play Portal 2 in lets say 2 hours.

Yeah, after lots and lots of training, preparation, and full knowledge of everything. Something nobody could do within the short time its been released.

You specifically said multiple times that theirs no way it could be beat in under 5 hours, Im here to tell you someone's going to do it. Whether it happens 2 days from now or 2 months from now is irrelevent.

Well when someone does do it, without the help of cheats, we'll cross that bridge when we come to it. But until then, I'm saying that it can't be beaten in 2 hours.

 

[qbanknight]

Thank you calling these little damn ingrates on their BS Shamus; Blizzard, BioWare, and EA have committed far worse in terms of DLC. They are just picking on Valve because they didn't get Portal 2 a whole DAY earlier as WAS NOT promised by the Potato Sack ARG

Excuse me? WTF does Blizzard do with DLC? Activision has its moments, with COD map packs and other things that gullible people buy, but I haven't seen anything about DLC in any of their games and I've been playing since Rock N' Roll Racing.

The worst they have is the Sparkle Pony, which falls under all four of Shamus' rules.

The problem I've heard about Blizzard isn't really DLC, but it is a micro transaction. Realm transfers.

I heard arguments that this easily done, and automated, process should be free with a month long cooldown instead of $25 per character. The main reasons are, as stated before, it is so easily done that is it now automated and that it could be considered an essential part of the game.

If your raiding guild decides to move to another server, and you don't have the $25 to spare to pay for a transfer yourself then you are out of a raiding guild. I've had that happen to me, so I can see the point in that argument.

Faction change isn't an easy process. Think about it, they need to take all of your quests and reputation and switch them for alternate quests from the other faction. More to the point, the fee is there as a penalty to discourage people from doing it a lot. Even a cooldown wouldn't stop someone determined to abuse the system.

Thank you calling these little damn ingrates on their BS Shamus; Blizzard, BioWare, and EA have committed far worse in terms of DLC. They are just picking on Valve because they didn't get Portal 2 a whole DAY earlier as WAS NOT promised by the Potato Sack ARG

Excuse me? WTF does Blizzard do with DLC? Activision has its moments, with COD map packs and other things that gullible people buy, but I haven't seen anything about DLC in any of their games and I've been playing since Rock N' Roll Racing.

The worst they have is the Sparkle Pony, which falls under all four of Shamus' rules.

Based on Shamus' other Blizzard rants, like the fact that they split Starcraft II into three games instead of one. Yeah, I guess the next Starcraft II is supposed to be different from the last one since you play another race. But really, it's the same game, you're just given slightly different mechanics in the second one and need to buy it if you want the WHOLE story of Starcraft 2

Oh boo hoo hoo, you need to buy all the installments in a series to get the whole story.

You need to buy all four MGS games to get the full story, plus Portable Ops and Peace Walker. You need to see all six Star Wars movies to get the full story.

If anyone actually played SC2 and didn't think that it was a full and complete game with more value than 99% of other games released these days (including Portal 2, what with a 7 hour campaign and a 4-hour co-op campaign), then they're nuts. So what if it's getting two expansions? All other Blizzard games have a single expansion, this one has two. And its campaigns will likely be of similar length to the one in this game.

An expansion pack worth $60 (knowing Activision's prices)? Yeah, no, I'm good. I'm not paying $60 for Heart of the Swarm, which is ostensibly the same damn game as Wings of Liberty (which was a fine game and I can justify the $60 price tag with the single, multi, and mod tools). And if it has a campaign of equal length to Wings of Liebrty, so what? Rockstar has created three expansion packs in the past 3 years for GTA IV and Red Dead Redemption, priced at $15-$20 each, and each offered a meaty story campaign, side missions, and multiplayer. So yeah, if Blizzard charges $60 for Heart of the Swarm, then yes I do feel they are ripping people off

 

[Longsight]

the wow Dlc you talk about went to a CHARITY called make a wish.
http://www.escapistmagazine.com/news/view/105139-New-WoW-Minipets-Help-Charity-Look-Damn-Cute
Wow has 100 of pets and mounts for FREE! You dont need to buy them.

Is valve doing that? No

No valve is selling hats that make seeing a white robot against white wall better.
Why would they make the robots white. The only way to see them is with a hat you have to buy.

I have this game through gamefly. I was going to buy it but the dlc made me reconsider.
Why should I pay for an incomplete game. If they were unlockables i would buy this up.

The hats increase Visability of your coop partner so they affect gameplay. They are not entirely cosmetic.

Don't call me an idiot because I expect a full game when I Pay for one.

I loved the writing of portal 2. I wished the credits had the contributors paypal email so I could send the writers some cash.

http://www.joystiq.com/2011/04/09/team-fortress-2-hats-raise-430-000-for-japan/

All the other points you raise have already been addressed, but since we're bringing out the charity argument too it's only fair to point this out.

 

[Cid Silverwing]

The only reason I hated Portal 2 singleplayer was the puzzles dragged on too long, breaking the flow of the story. I ended up cheating halfway through.

 

[BehattedWanderer]

Cosmetic DLC is alright. Entirely optional. There is no prerogative or necessity to buy it. Shamus speaks the truth. Ranting against this is insipid.

 

[Longsight]

The Portal speedruns I've seen all depend on running backwards for their speed, as for whatever bizarre reason you care to imagine you move faster backwards than you do forwards. I wouldn't be surprised if Valve did that just to annoy people who like to complain about how fast the game can be completed.

More to the point though - speedrunning is all well and good, but all you're investigating is how fast you can physically progress from game start to game end. You're not actually playing the game - you're skipping anything and everything that does not directly move you along the singular shortest path possible, taking pre-defined routes to every objective, and as such you're missing half the game. The same goes for any speedrun in any game - the issue at stake is never 'how fast can you physically complete the game?', but 'how much of the game do you miss if you try?' Interestingly, this also disproves a lot of the comments about the lack of freedom in Portal 2 - at no point does the game really hold your hand or force you to take your time (except in a few of the elevators, where the next map doesn't load until a particular line of dialogue), so you're free to blast through it if you really want to. Compare this to things like Black Ops, with its 20-minute-long barely-interactive unskippable cut-scenes in place of actual levels in some places. These exist purely to pad out the game's runtime, to prevent the sort of claims about playtimes that developers know can knock a game's reputation. There's no such filler in Portal or Portal 2 - it's exactly that freedom to play the game as fast or as slow as you want that allows speedruns to exist.

 

[ANeM]

"DLC should be multiplayer-only."

Sorry, what? There is nothing more gamebreaking than being on a server with your friends and then being booted from the game when maps change because you haven't dropped $15. Multiplayer DLC splits up the community.

On the other hand DLC such as, well, anything for Fallout 3 adds unique experiences to the game without getting in the way. It doesn't split up communities, it doesn't force this sense that you need to buy it to keep playing, its just some nice extra content.

 

[RobfromtheGulag]

I pretty much agree with what's being said here. In an extreme case where everyone else is running around in loincloths and dlc allows you to sport a tux, then I might be a bit upset. But clothing additions thus far have been nothing mind blowing. All the dlc armor in bioware games seems if anything sillier than in-game clothes.

I do wonder at games with DLC making them easier/harder. In Dragon Age (1) most of the DLC I got didn't affect me until the latter half of the game, at which point everything was easy anyway. But in DA2 they give you the dog, and perhaps more if you sprang for the Simon Veil character. Some of those fights were made drastically easier due to the dog. His damage is pathetic but enemies are quite content to beat on him, which makes him essentially a multi target CC for many fights.