Duke Nukem Forever and 'Rape'

[Ragsnstitches]

Well, yes, something similar happens in the Aliens movies. Except that in those, alien rape is depicted as some sort of terrible nightmare, which is a teensy difference.

Likewise, common-or-garden sexual abuse hasn't become a bundle of laughs just because it's been the basis of serious films.

George Lucas and Steven Spielberg raped Indiana Jones and Stormtroopers quite literally in South Park. At that, they also parodied a few scenes from movies which I have forgotten the names of, in which someone was raped.

So, common-or-garden sexual abuse has become a bundle of laughs as a result of parodies of serious films and satire.

Just because you don't find it funny, does not mean it isn't funny. Humour is subjective.

 

[Levethian]

Just because you don't find it funny, does not mean it isn't funny. Humour is subjective.

And if it isn't funny, does that make it automatically offensive?

You know this joke?

I heard that from Ally McBeal I think.
Except it was told with a limbless girl.

 

[Alucard788]

Woah woah woah!

So we men are wimps now if we find rape offence?

Really?

We've come to this in gamer culture?

We really have?

I feel genuinely sorry for any female gamers out there....this is bound to get worse...the few of us who do find offence (not because were some crazy ass conservatives) are outnumbering the ones that don't.

It's bound to get worse before it gets better.

Can you really blame people for NOT wanting to be associated with the kind of people who would defend this? If nothing else, having a huge big AAA game like this that depicts graphic rape with a smile on its face doesn't really do wonders for the game's industries already less then perfect image.

EDIT: Also it's worth noting I don't often agree with Jim Sterling, but I have to agree here.

Agreed.

 

[Von Strimmer]

Jim's just trying to cover his arse ever since those women called him out for being sexist. It doesn't bother me the gameplay sucked but the Duke is still pure Duke... And I wouldn't have him any other way

Edit* Also all this discussion. deliciously contraversial with much indepth look at Duke and the concepts revolving around this game. I dunno guys this game sure as hell seems like 'art' to me. Don't think I have seen a game with this much contraversy around it's content rather than it's mechanics or gameplay.

 

[Levethian]

Woah woah woah!

I know having a polarised opinion is fun, but I'm arguing for a middle-ground

It wasn't funny. It wasn't particularly offensive. It wasn't 'graphic rape'. It was nothing, really. And it's unfair on the game, no matter how bad we think it is, to cast such poisonous associations around without examining whether we are right to be offended.

Duke, however, plays it straight.

I don't think that was their intent. :/

 

[Alucard788]

*post removed*

I'm just sick of arguing it...sick of feeling like a freak for being offended by it...my view is my view and I'm sticking to it.

Carry on fellas...carry on...

*backs away slowly*

 

[Katana314]

If Strong Bad E-mails can make me laugh without so much as dropping a swear word, then it's obvious DNF is scraping the bottom of the barrel in terms of humor.

Maybe it made some people laugh. It didn't NEED to do it this way to accomplish that; especially when the "parody" doesn't even make any jokes, just depicts the event it's parodizing in unusual circumstances.

Here might be an example of a funny parody of pornography that, ironically, is technically completely PG (only crass when you have some image to compare to in your head)
http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x7f568_ren-and-stimpy-gay_shortfilms

 

[Lieju]

Yeah, I liked Duke Nukem 3D, but it was this kind of thing I found disgusting and offensive in the game even back then when I was 10 or so. (And one of the reasons I couldn't play this game when my mom could have seen it, because I would have been embarassed and ashamed)

And it seems to be a lot worse in this game.

There is a fine line where a character like Duke is not amusing anymore, but if you don't go close to that line, it's not really that brand of humour.
This crosses the line, though, but humour is subjective anyway.

 

[Levethian]

Sorry, Alucard. It's fine to be offended.

 

[Alucard788]

Sorry, Alucard. It's fine to be offended.

Glad to see that we see eye to eye on that at least. ^_^

To give my view some context I was originally pumped for this game...I saw one of the very first official previews (with no mention of the hive at all) and i laughed when Duke punched the alien in the nads. I figured this would be a fun if not slightly camp game.I almost pre ordered it.

Then out of curiosity I read some early reviews and I got kinda curious about 'the hive' level.

I watched it on you tube two videos of the whole thing in HD...and I'm very glad I didn't spend my money.

The gore and viscera in Clive Barkers Jericho I can stand...but not something like this...even the audio made me feel ill.

I know that judging a game on one level isn't always fair...but it really struck a chord with me and upset me, the visuals and sound are something I don't want to experience within the game.

...and perhaps a bit of my exasperation is wondering why other men were not equally taken back by the level...I guess it's just a genuine "How can you not see this as truly offensive?" kinda moment for me as a gamer.

That's my 2 copper.

 

[veloper]

Didn't Jim describe him as a "Fan of tastelessness" and then go onto support a school-shooter game? Seems inconsistant to me jim, infact it seems like you go with the opinion that will troll the most people and grab the most attention.

"I'm a lover of tasteless humor and offensive content, and as such, I've found it incredibly difficult to condemn this game as so many gamers have willfully done. In fact, it's my worry that anybody who does condemn this game is a hypocrite, because ultimately, what is School Shooter if not something that does what most games do, without the weak moral justification?"

I don't have to point out much of a hack he is. He does it for me.

Yeah he did say that here in extra consideration on the Escapist and he also said something along these lines over at Destructoid.

That's a 180 degree turn there. What happened to you Jim?

 

[Annoying Turd]

its just a game, and everybody needs to lighten up.

case closed

 

[Versuvius]

Jim sterling. Funny but most of what he says can be equated to blubblublublublublblublubl. Alien parasite rape is just one of the things Sci Fi in general enjoys be it Xenomorphs to the chimera infection thing which is basically genetic hijacking. Though i do think Jim was trying to get this response. If he was, you got trolled hard, because i do not think he really believes that anyone who enjoys DNF is a psychopath. Though i think Anyone who enjoys it is a Halotard with low standards...maybe i will get my own thread for saying that

Why thank you captcha, good luck to you too.

 

[LordLundar]

There's the biggest issue with DNF. The "jokes" and one liners are not there for satire as they were in DN3D (I don't recall duke making a one liner when he killed the bound women in that game, let alone every time as in DNF), they were one of two things:

1. A slam at pop culture that was out of date 3 years ago. (see the halo reference and Leeroy Jenkins)
2. Set up for shock value. (the bulk of the hive really)

DN3D's jokes were tasteless granted, but they were there to to garner a laugh not a chin drop and they pulled it off well even today (though people not born then might not get the jokes). DNF on the other hand has duke spouting lines that illicit more of a "what a sick FREAK!" than "satire of atypical chauvinistic pig" response. The latter would have garnered a better response at least.

So yeah, tasteless I expect. Situations like Duke treating the women as eye candy like in the start or in the strip club I expect. One liners spouted every time he had to put a woman out of their misery? That's just plain disgusting.

 

[redspud]

Alright 2 things-
#1-Its a Duke Nukem game it's going to be offensive. Also did anyone really expect anything different from this kind of game especially since they did it before?

#2-You guys are way to easily offended. Since I find it funny though here is something really offensive. Click me if you dare [http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AtrJTn6hd8c]

 

[LordLundar]

Gaming culture isn't going to collapse into an anarchic wasteland full of rapists and murders. you're sound like fox fucking news.

Cite your source before making an accusation like that if you want to even be remotely taken seriously.

It's a game, not only that, it's a game that intentionally takes things as far as it thinks it can to illicit a reaction from you.

There's a not so fine line between tasteless and disgusting and while DN3D toed that line, DNF pole vaulted it. So yeah, it got a reaction, just one that wants people associated with the game to never make a piece of crap like this again.

It's puerile teen humour and so what if someone likes it?

It's not puerile teen humor, it's I.Q. at roughly room temp humour at best and I don't have a problem if someone enjoys it (though I won't think terribly highly of them) but that doesn't mean I'm not allowed to demand better.

If you find it offensive, shut the hell up and don't play it.

I don't. And by the same token, if you don't like people criticizing a game you like, shut up and don't respond to threads.

I'm sick of whiny irks moaning about this kind of stuff. Some people need to grow up and discover the difference between real life, and an over the top game that intentionally tries to piss you off.

There is a considerable difference between criticizing a game and having a disassociation with reality. And honestly, I can't imagine any developer looking to make a game that's designed to intentionally piss of it's target demographic. It's bad business.

 

[Zaik]

He's still trolling you guys and he isn't even making videos here anymore.

That's pretty bad.

 

[Pedro The Hutt]

Well...they are being raped by the aliens
But its not new. The series had it in Duke Nukem 3D, and the Alien series had alien rape in a similar way with similar results.

Except, y'know, the rape wasn't used as a setup for a ~joke~.

 

[DonMartin]

I think I recall reading a review of the demo that Jim did, in which he said it was fun an enjoyable. He sometimes, to me, seems like the kind of guy who changes opinion to make it a bit more controversial. When the demo came out, he thought he'd defend it and say that it's fun, and that's what videogames are about, that the artsy fartsy crowd have ridiculous standards. (in a similar way we saw in the Call of Duty video he made) Now, he's turned on those who liked it or thought they'd like it, and his opinion is that it's not fun, simply vulgar and boring. Those who like it now are immature, or it's simply not a good game at all. I think he said the mechanics are dated, or something similar. The same mechanics were in the demo, right?

I realize the demo part was the most polished part of the entire game, or so Ive heard, but this is the impression Ive gotten of Jim. Sorry if Ive got him all wrong. The man's entitled to his opinion, but he could rethink the way he's presenting it. Saying new things or being original, stating opinions that are uncommon is great, by all means, but then marketing yourself with that? "Has a tendence to make the internet angry at him"? That's not being thoughtprovoking, that's just being a dick. No offense, though.

 

[Sudenak]

Meh.

More proof that DNF was just a tasteless, awful, piece of shit game imho. The people wildly defending it as hilarious are the sort of people DNF was made for. They can keep it. Point being that all other video games have found ways to make humor without directly involving a rape joke.

And while I defend the right of a game to do whatever the fuck it wants (a la free speech), I don't like it one bit.

Hell, this game should buddy up with EA on throwing gamers back into that "immature, piece of shit punks" spotlight that we've been trying to break out of. It's very hard for me, as a girl gamer, to stand up and defend the industry as growing into a beautiful and artistic thing when shit like this is thrown out there.

I mean, if you like it, fine. But don't pretend for a single second that it isn't appallingly tasteless. Even for the Duke.

>_> It's not even funny, either.