EDIT: No Russian

[bl4ckh4wk64]

I just realized. When the US finally debts themselves into oblivion, guess who will be the new global superpower?

Spoiler: FUCK YEAH!

You guys don't have the military or the economic stability to do this.

Have you ever heard of a joke? and look at America and its glorious economic stability with its huge-arse debt.

I can understand that it's a joke and I wasn't meaning it as a serious answer... And even now, America has a much better economy that much of Europe, minus Germany, and our military is still the most prominent, best trained in the world. I'm not saying that because of my American bias, I'm saying that based on the operations they've completed. Special Forces units? Navy SEALs, Army Rangers, Marine Expeditionary Units, Marine Force Recon, Deltas, etc. They have all completed missions with extraordinary success. Russian Special Forces? Spetsnaz. Beslan Massacre? Tragedy. Definitely not befitting of a special forces unit. Yes, Spetsnaz have some badass training programs and they're taught to fight with a shovel (which is pretty fuckin awesome if I do say so myself) but that's all for naught if you can't manage to covertly storm a building.

America does not have a better economy than Europe... and the only reason America has the biggest military is because they spend 99% of taxes on it.

You can believe that if you want, but a large majority of taxes go towards fixing infrastructure, paying of government people, and I believe Welfare. It's definitely not 99% of the budget. And right now, America does actually have a more stable economy than a large portion of Europe. And I actually mistyped when I wrote prominent. America has the most widespread military. I believe it's China that has the largest military as of this moment. However, numbers all equate to jack when you're better trained. I know of operations in Afghanistan where we insert about 12 Rangers on the top of a mountain and they take potshots at insurgent forces 10 times larger than them. It normally ends with a sunset exfiltration and a bunch of dead terrorists. This whittling away can easily be done on a larger scale, but it depends on the training they're given.

 

[urilukin]

I just realized. When the US finally debts themselves into oblivion, guess who will be the new global superpower?

Spoiler: FUCK YEAH!

You guys don't have the military or the economic stability to do this.

Have you ever heard of a joke? and look at America and its glorious economic stability with its huge-arse debt.

I can understand that it's a joke and I wasn't meaning it as a serious answer... And even now, America has a much better economy that much of Europe, minus Germany, and our military is still the most prominent, best trained in the world. I'm not saying that because of my American bias, I'm saying that based on the operations they've completed. Special Forces units? Navy SEALs, Army Rangers, Marine Expeditionary Units, Marine Force Recon, Deltas, etc. They have all completed missions with extraordinary success. Russian Special Forces? Spetsnaz. Beslan Massacre? Tragedy. Definitely not befitting of a special forces unit. Yes, Spetsnaz have some badass training programs and they're taught to fight with a shovel (which is pretty fuckin awesome if I do say so myself) but that's all for naught if you can't manage to covertly storm a building.

America does not have a better economy than Europe... and the only reason America has the biggest military is because they spend 99% of taxes on it.

You can believe that if you want, but a large majority of taxes go towards fixing infrastructure, paying of government people, and I believe Welfare. It's definitely not 99% of the budget. And right now, America does actually have a more stable economy than a large portion of Europe. And I actually mistyped when I wrote prominent. America has the most widespread military. I believe it's China that has the largest military as of this moment. However, numbers all equate to jack when you're better trained. I know of operations in Afghanistan where we insert about 12 Rangers on the top of a mountain and they take potshots at insurgent forces 10 times larger than them. It normally ends with a sunset exfiltration and a bunch of dead terrorists. This whittling away can easily be done on a larger scale, but it depends on the training they're given.

Sure, buddy whatever you say.
http://www.usdebtclock.org/
whatever you say...

 

[Smokej]

Large parts of this thread remind me on all those youtube comments from 15 year old keyboard warriors debating who has the most badass army, special forces or whatever. Seriously if you haven't served just a single day in a modern army, all those statements make you look ridiculous...

Another thing Russia was beaten militarily pretty clearly in modern history in WWI by the Central Powers... (nonetheless a great country with rich history)

Concerning stereotyping the enemy; the chinese gave the US a taste of their own medicine recently

http://www.wired.com/dangerroom/2011/05/gamers-target-u-s-troops-in-chinese-military-shooter/

 

[urilukin]

Large parts of this thread remind me on all those youtube comments from 15 year old keyboard warriors debating who has the most badass army, special forces or whatever. Seriously if you haven't served just a single day in a modern army, all those statements make you look ridiculous...

Another thing Russia was beaten militarily pretty clearly in modern history in WWI by the Central Powers... (nonetheless a great country with rich history)

Concerning stereotyping the enemy; the chinese gave the US a taste of their own medicine recently

http://www.wired.com/dangerroom/2011/05/gamers-target-u-s-troops-in-chinese-military-shooter/

If you look at my posts you will see that I never said even once that Russia has the best military because we don't, in our military you will probably be beaten to death before your first war experience.

 

[Dark Knifer]

Large parts of this thread remind me on all those youtube comments from 15 year old keyboard warriors debating who has the most badass army, special forces or whatever. Seriously if you haven't served just a single day in a modern army, all those statements make you look ridiculous...

Another thing Russia was beaten militarily pretty clearly in modern history in WWI by the Central Powers... (nonetheless a great country with rich history)

I'd say it was more to do with the social events of the Russian revolution then being beaten by the Central powers, as the factory workers went on strike, protests, leadership being overthrown etc but it certainly was a contributing factor to them pulling out of the war and the later events of the russian revolution. I would post more OT but this is the only thing that seemed safe to post on without fear of a shit storm brewing...

 

[Smokej]

If you look at my posts you will see that I never said even once that Russia has the best military because we don't, in our military you will probably be beaten to death before your first war experience.

I wasn't referring to single posts, this was just my general impression of this thread.

Your last statement matches with what i heard from acquaintances and relatives who served in the National People's Army (GDR)and were deployed together with russian troops on the hottest spot during europe's coldest times... It's a sad thing if your allies are pitying you because of those degrading conditions in your army...

 

[Smokej]

I'd say it was more to do with the social events of the Russian revolution then being beaten by the Central powers, as the factory workers went on strike, protests, leadership being overthrown etc but it certainly was a contributing factor to them pulling out of the war and the later events of the russian revolution. I would post more OT but this is the only thing that seemed safe to post on without fear of a shit storm brewing...

this is of course true but the impetus behind the revolutions was the economic breakdown, inflation and the poor logistics for the distribution of food supplies caused by a war in which they had not a real chance to win in a timely manner...

 

[urilukin]

If you look at my posts you will see that I never said even once that Russia has the best military because we don't, in our military you will probably be beaten to death before your first war experience.

I wasn't referring to single posts, this was just my general impression of this thread.

Your last statement matches with what i heard from acquaintances and relatives who served in the National People's Army (GDR)and were deployed together with russian troops on the hottest spot during europe's coldest times... It's a sad thing if your allies are pitying you because of those degrading conditions in your army...

Talk about 15 year old keyboard warriors, you are the one who just basically said GDR had better conditions then Russia's army and probably gonna' start a shitstorm about who has a better army.

 

[Dark Knifer]

I'd say it was more to do with the social events of the Russian revolution then being beaten by the Central powers, as the factory workers went on strike, protests, leadership being overthrown etc but it certainly was a contributing factor to them pulling out of the war and the later events of the russian revolution. I would post more OT but this is the only thing that seemed safe to post on without fear of a shit storm brewing...

this is of course true but the impetus behind the revolutions was the economic breakdown, inflation and the poor logistics for the distribution of food supplies caused by a war in which they had not a real chance to win in a timely manner...

Plus the war they had just before WWI with japan. Really not a good moment for a war but considering the circumstances, Russia did rather well holding them off for a while but obviously, they shouldn't have tried in the situation they were in... If it wasn't for that treaty with serbia, but the germans were forced into the stalemate due to having forces spread too thin in fighting on the eastern and western front so Russia's part was extremely vital.

 

[Jewrean]

heh, I was just thinking about this. I rented MW3 (not gonna buy it), and it's just kind of wierd how the drone enemies are Russian soldiers. Not Russian terrorists, or extremists, or even commies, but regular Russian infantry men. Games do this a lot, using Russians as cannon fodder. I agree that the "no russian" level was a particularly egregious example. You know if it was set in the US there would have been a media tidal wave condemning the game, but since it was just Russians it was not really anything out of the ordinary.

EXACTLY! if a game was released with Russians soldiers shooting American soldiers it would get slaughtered in the media and it does not matter if there are a few good Russian guys in your team at the end of the day you are an American soldier shooting Russians.

Personally I would love to play a Call of Duty game from the Nazis perspective.

 

[Smokej]

Talk about 15 year old keyboard warriors, you are the one who just basically said GDR had better conditions then Russia's army and probably gonna' start a shitstorm about who has a better army.

hm i didn't make my point clear, so it seems... those statements were based on the experiences of people (and we are talking here from enlisted personel up to commissioned officers) who had insight into the working und living conditions of the russians deployed on the border... I myself have no personal experiences with the russian army (i do however with the us and french army during my army service) so i can only echo what is the consens between those ex military during the cold war. And i have to add those statements weren't based off resentments against the russians just on how people have perceived the russians soldiers during that time...

 

[Therumancer]

So a long time ago I posted this : (http://www.escapistmagazine.com/forums/read/9.304300-No-Russian?page=1)
fell free to comment on that post.

Anyway, I want to bring the subject back into the spotlight because almost all of the comments were about the No "Russian mission" and maybe that was a bad example what I wanted to say is that there is a VERY anti-Russian attitude in modern FPS's and we shouldn't make up excuses like "Oh,you know there was one good Russian dude the the game wasn't anti-Russian" for their shitty storytelling.

You have to remember that despite a brief period of reform following the collapse of the soviet union, Russia has more or less remained opposed to the US and western interests. It wasn't that long ago that we had that whole incident with Georgia, which involved more than just the invasion of Georgia, spilling over into Russia trying to bully the EU, and threatening Poland over having missle interception bases (US ones) which inconveinently prevented Russia from firing missles further into, or accross the EU, even threatening to nuke them at one point before stomping off.

This is to say nothing of the massive Russian crime syndicates that hit the western world in greater numbers than ever before when the USSR collapsed, many of these syndicates dealing in Russian military hardware, and being run and organized by former soviet authorities (intel agents, soldiers, etc...). Many have argued that the collapse of the USSR brought about an invasion, albiet an underworld invasion rather than over attempt at military conquest.

You can say "yeah but" and argue all those points to your own satisfaction I'm sure, but that's the way things are, and most importantly they have influanced perceptions. Like it or not despite some attempts to reform, most people in the Western World, the US in paticular, still see Russians largely causing, or being the cause of problems. Even beyond things like Georgia, understand that the connection to crime has had a major influance as well, similar to how Italians became so heavily associated with the mafia (and it's not entirely undeserved given that the mob comes along with large groups of Italians, even if not all Italians are mobsters). When you go from The Cold War, to A Crime War, it doesn't matter how you attempt to justify it, people aren't going to take a positive view of the group involved.

 

[urilukin]

This is to say nothing of the massive Russian crime syndicates that hit the western world in greater numbers than ever before when the USSR collapsed, many of these syndicates dealing in Russian military hardware, and being run and organized by former soviet authorities (intel agents, soldiers, etc...). Many have argued that the collapse of the USSR brought about an invasion, albiet an underworld invasion rather than over attempt at military conquest.

Same thing could be said about Cuba but they aren't the target of current FPS'S.

 

[bl4ckh4wk64]

I just realized. When the US finally debts themselves into oblivion, guess who will be the new global superpower?

Spoiler: FUCK YEAH!

You guys don't have the military or the economic stability to do this.

Have you ever heard of a joke? and look at America and its glorious economic stability with its huge-arse debt.

I can understand that it's a joke and I wasn't meaning it as a serious answer... And even now, America has a much better economy that much of Europe, minus Germany, and our military is still the most prominent, best trained in the world. I'm not saying that because of my American bias, I'm saying that based on the operations they've completed. Special Forces units? Navy SEALs, Army Rangers, Marine Expeditionary Units, Marine Force Recon, Deltas, etc. They have all completed missions with extraordinary success. Russian Special Forces? Spetsnaz. Beslan Massacre? Tragedy. Definitely not befitting of a special forces unit. Yes, Spetsnaz have some badass training programs and they're taught to fight with a shovel (which is pretty fuckin awesome if I do say so myself) but that's all for naught if you can't manage to covertly storm a building.

America does not have a better economy than Europe... and the only reason America has the biggest military is because they spend 99% of taxes on it.

You can believe that if you want, but a large majority of taxes go towards fixing infrastructure, paying of government people, and I believe Welfare. It's definitely not 99% of the budget. And right now, America does actually have a more stable economy than a large portion of Europe. And I actually mistyped when I wrote prominent. America has the most widespread military. I believe it's China that has the largest military as of this moment. However, numbers all equate to jack when you're better trained. I know of operations in Afghanistan where we insert about 12 Rangers on the top of a mountain and they take potshots at insurgent forces 10 times larger than them. It normally ends with a sunset exfiltration and a bunch of dead terrorists. This whittling away can easily be done on a larger scale, but it depends on the training they're given.

Sure, buddy whatever you say.
http://www.usdebtclock.org/
whatever you say...

Oh yes, trust a non-government website about how much spending Americans do. Obviously civilians are told exactly how much money goes where and to whom.

 

[urilukin]

I just realized. When the US finally debts themselves into oblivion, guess who will be the new global superpower?

Spoiler: FUCK YEAH!

You guys don't have the military or the economic stability to do this.

Have you ever heard of a joke? and look at America and its glorious economic stability with its huge-arse debt.

I can understand that it's a joke and I wasn't meaning it as a serious answer... And even now, America has a much better economy that much of Europe, minus Germany, and our military is still the most prominent, best trained in the world. I'm not saying that because of my American bias, I'm saying that based on the operations they've completed. Special Forces units? Navy SEALs, Army Rangers, Marine Expeditionary Units, Marine Force Recon, Deltas, etc. They have all completed missions with extraordinary success. Russian Special Forces? Spetsnaz. Beslan Massacre? Tragedy. Definitely not befitting of a special forces unit. Yes, Spetsnaz have some badass training programs and they're taught to fight with a shovel (which is pretty fuckin awesome if I do say so myself) but that's all for naught if you can't manage to covertly storm a building.

America does not have a better economy than Europe... and the only reason America has the biggest military is because they spend 99% of taxes on it.

You can believe that if you want, but a large majority of taxes go towards fixing infrastructure, paying of government people, and I believe Welfare. It's definitely not 99% of the budget. And right now, America does actually have a more stable economy than a large portion of Europe. And I actually mistyped when I wrote prominent. America has the most widespread military. I believe it's China that has the largest military as of this moment. However, numbers all equate to jack when you're better trained. I know of operations in Afghanistan where we insert about 12 Rangers on the top of a mountain and they take potshots at insurgent forces 10 times larger than them. It normally ends with a sunset exfiltration and a bunch of dead terrorists. This whittling away can easily be done on a larger scale, but it depends on the training they're given.

Sure, buddy whatever you say.
http://www.usdebtclock.org/
whatever you say...

Oh yes, trust a non-government website about how much spending Americans do. Obviously civilians are told exactly how much money goes where and to whom.

Dude, other way around. don't trust the GOVERNMENT about their spendings. And compare http://www.usdebtclock.org/ to any other debt clock it checks out.

 

[bl4ckh4wk64]

I just realized. When the US finally debts themselves into oblivion, guess who will be the new global superpower?

Spoiler: FUCK YEAH!

You guys don't have the military or the economic stability to do this.

Have you ever heard of a joke? and look at America and its glorious economic stability with its huge-arse debt.

I can understand that it's a joke and I wasn't meaning it as a serious answer... And even now, America has a much better economy that much of Europe, minus Germany, and our military is still the most prominent, best trained in the world. I'm not saying that because of my American bias, I'm saying that based on the operations they've completed. Special Forces units? Navy SEALs, Army Rangers, Marine Expeditionary Units, Marine Force Recon, Deltas, etc. They have all completed missions with extraordinary success. Russian Special Forces? Spetsnaz. Beslan Massacre? Tragedy. Definitely not befitting of a special forces unit. Yes, Spetsnaz have some badass training programs and they're taught to fight with a shovel (which is pretty fuckin awesome if I do say so myself) but that's all for naught if you can't manage to covertly storm a building.

America does not have a better economy than Europe... and the only reason America has the biggest military is because they spend 99% of taxes on it.

You can believe that if you want, but a large majority of taxes go towards fixing infrastructure, paying of government people, and I believe Welfare. It's definitely not 99% of the budget. And right now, America does actually have a more stable economy than a large portion of Europe. And I actually mistyped when I wrote prominent. America has the most widespread military. I believe it's China that has the largest military as of this moment. However, numbers all equate to jack when you're better trained. I know of operations in Afghanistan where we insert about 12 Rangers on the top of a mountain and they take potshots at insurgent forces 10 times larger than them. It normally ends with a sunset exfiltration and a bunch of dead terrorists. This whittling away can easily be done on a larger scale, but it depends on the training they're given.

Sure, buddy whatever you say.
http://www.usdebtclock.org/
whatever you say...

Oh yes, trust a non-government website about how much spending Americans do. Obviously civilians are told exactly how much money goes where and to whom.

Dude, other way around. don't trust the GOVERNMENT about their spendings. And compare http://www.usdebtclock.org/ to any other debt clock it checks out.

I'm sorry, but I trust the Government to know what they're spending money on over the speculation of arrogant civilians any day. While I do take most things the government says with a grain of salt, I find that they're usually more correct that some random person on the internet.

 

[JoesshittyOs]

I'm with everyone who says that it's bullshit.

I liked what they were going with in Call of Duty 4. The Russians were having a civil war between themselves and the Ultra Nationalists were winning. It led me to believe that they were fucking crazy over-patriotic fanatics, and I had no qualms about them being the bad guys.

They completely abandoned that in MW2.

 

[urilukin]

I just realized. When the US finally debts themselves into oblivion, guess who will be the new global superpower?

Spoiler: FUCK YEAH!

You guys don't have the military or the economic stability to do this.

Have you ever heard of a joke? and look at America and its glorious economic stability with its huge-arse debt.

I can understand that it's a joke and I wasn't meaning it as a serious answer... And even now, America has a much better economy that much of Europe, minus Germany, and our military is still the most prominent, best trained in the world. I'm not saying that because of my American bias, I'm saying that based on the operations they've completed. Special Forces units? Navy SEALs, Army Rangers, Marine Expeditionary Units, Marine Force Recon, Deltas, etc. They have all completed missions with extraordinary success. Russian Special Forces? Spetsnaz. Beslan Massacre? Tragedy. Definitely not befitting of a special forces unit. Yes, Spetsnaz have some badass training programs and they're taught to fight with a shovel (which is pretty fuckin awesome if I do say so myself) but that's all for naught if you can't manage to covertly storm a building.

America does not have a better economy than Europe... and the only reason America has the biggest military is because they spend 99% of taxes on it.

You can believe that if you want, but a large majority of taxes go towards fixing infrastructure, paying of government people, and I believe Welfare. It's definitely not 99% of the budget. And right now, America does actually have a more stable economy than a large portion of Europe. And I actually mistyped when I wrote prominent. America has the most widespread military. I believe it's China that has the largest military as of this moment. However, numbers all equate to jack when you're better trained. I know of operations in Afghanistan where we insert about 12 Rangers on the top of a mountain and they take potshots at insurgent forces 10 times larger than them. It normally ends with a sunset exfiltration and a bunch of dead terrorists. This whittling away can easily be done on a larger scale, but it depends on the training they're given.

Sure, buddy whatever you say.
http://www.usdebtclock.org/
whatever you say...

Oh yes, trust a non-government website about how much spending Americans do. Obviously civilians are told exactly how much money goes where and to whom.

Dude, other way around. don't trust the GOVERNMENT about their spendings. And compare http://www.usdebtclock.org/ to any other debt clock it checks out.

I'm sorry, but I trust the Government to know what they're spending money on over the speculation of arrogant civilians any day. While I do take most things the government says with a grain of salt, I find that they're usually more correct that some random person on the internet.

Fact is that this debt checks out, you want something official? Fine.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/business/8296079.stm
http://content.usatoday.com/communities/theoval/post/2009/10/620000005/1
http://usdebt.kleptocracy.us/
http://www.brillig.com/debt_clock/
There, the BBC,USA today and all other debt clocks display the same debt.
Do you believe me now?

 

[bl4ckh4wk64]

I just realized. When the US finally debts themselves into oblivion, guess who will be the new global superpower?

Spoiler: FUCK YEAH!

You guys don't have the military or the economic stability to do this.

Have you ever heard of a joke? and look at America and its glorious economic stability with its huge-arse debt.

I can understand that it's a joke and I wasn't meaning it as a serious answer... And even now, America has a much better economy that much of Europe, minus Germany, and our military is still the most prominent, best trained in the world. I'm not saying that because of my American bias, I'm saying that based on the operations they've completed. Special Forces units? Navy SEALs, Army Rangers, Marine Expeditionary Units, Marine Force Recon, Deltas, etc. They have all completed missions with extraordinary success. Russian Special Forces? Spetsnaz. Beslan Massacre? Tragedy. Definitely not befitting of a special forces unit. Yes, Spetsnaz have some badass training programs and they're taught to fight with a shovel (which is pretty fuckin awesome if I do say so myself) but that's all for naught if you can't manage to covertly storm a building.

America does not have a better economy than Europe... and the only reason America has the biggest military is because they spend 99% of taxes on it.

You can believe that if you want, but a large majority of taxes go towards fixing infrastructure, paying of government people, and I believe Welfare. It's definitely not 99% of the budget. And right now, America does actually have a more stable economy than a large portion of Europe. And I actually mistyped when I wrote prominent. America has the most widespread military. I believe it's China that has the largest military as of this moment. However, numbers all equate to jack when you're better trained. I know of operations in Afghanistan where we insert about 12 Rangers on the top of a mountain and they take potshots at insurgent forces 10 times larger than them. It normally ends with a sunset exfiltration and a bunch of dead terrorists. This whittling away can easily be done on a larger scale, but it depends on the training they're given.

Sure, buddy whatever you say.
http://www.usdebtclock.org/
whatever you say...

Oh yes, trust a non-government website about how much spending Americans do. Obviously civilians are told exactly how much money goes where and to whom.

Dude, other way around. don't trust the GOVERNMENT about their spendings. And compare http://www.usdebtclock.org/ to any other debt clock it checks out.

I'm sorry, but I trust the Government to know what they're spending money on over the speculation of arrogant civilians any day. While I do take most things the government says with a grain of salt, I find that they're usually more correct that some random person on the internet.

Fact is that this debt checks out, you want something official? Fine.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/business/8296079.stm
http://content.usatoday.com/communities/theoval/post/2009/10/620000005/1
http://usdebt.kleptocracy.us/
http://www.brillig.com/debt_clock/
There, the BBC,USA today and all other debt clocks display the same debt.
Do you believe me now?

Just to make it clear with you, I'm not doubting the debt. I'm doubting your "proof" that the Government spends 99% of taxes on military research and spending. I know America's in debt, by quite a lot.