Extra Punctuation: Action Is Not Finisher Porn

[Swifteye]

I'd like to think the kingdom hearts series does a good job with flow with the exception of kingdom hearts two that gets really caught up in quick time event kills. Also I think dynasty warriors has a fair amount of flow for those willing to actually play with the controls (I'm the only one who ever seems to combine charges swift attacks and mousous)

So mk9's xray moves are bad and arkham asylum's fighting is alright.
Cannot honestly tell if trolling or genuinely emitting dreadful opinions.

You should know better than that Jim is the guy who uses troll tactics yathzee genuinely means it and while we are in the neighborhood you mind explaining why yathzee's opinion is dreadful? Cause it seems like the point of his article was that X-ray moves stop the flow of combat while in arkam you didn't have those things and you just punched and kicked never stopping thus maintaining flow(I'm honestly surprised he didn't mention prince of persia or maybe that last prince of persia game killed the romance they had)

 

[Shjade]

Arkham Asylum really did have a nasty combat-flow system. Very delicious for the most part, my only gripe with it being that, playing on PC at least, sometimes it was hard to aim at precisely the fellow you wanted to hit next to keep your chain going. Not really a problem in the main game, but when you're doing challenge mode arenas and trying for the use-every-move-in-an-unbroken-combo score bonus, swinging at the guy who's getting up off the ground instead of the one right next to him who's about to pull a gun out of a gun box can make or break the attempt. x.x

Other than that it was lovely.

I'm honestly surprised he didn't mention prince of persia or maybe that last prince of persia game killed the romance they had

Of the many things he praised about Prince of Persia, I don't think the combat was one. Passable, but not "play this game for the awesome combat mechanics."

Maybe I'm misremembering.

 

[Yokai]

I think the Assassin's Creed games had the perfect balance of flow and spectacle. The animations flowed together incredibly well--your sword would never stop moving in the time it took to kill several different enemies, seamlessly switching from a slash to the throat to a thrust in the chest. The finishers, too, were pretty much all quick and nasty and never lasted more than a couple seconds, and there were enough of them that it was uncommon to see the same one more than once in a fight. I want more third-person combat like that, because it was an immensely satisfying experience.

 

[PunkRex]

3 second rule, if it takes longer then 3 seconds chances are its going to get annoying. As for Spiderman, after watching my brother complete Web of Shadows for the second time... GO VENOM, GOGOGO!!!

 

[AlohaJo]

This is why the Blazblue series are my favourite fighting games. The animations flow very smoothly, the controls are easy to learn, but they're still tough games to master. And there's no finisher porn in them. They are, in my opinion, what fighting games should be.

EDIT: I forgot to mention, they also have some really sweet soundtracks.

 

[crimson sickle2]

What if the finishing moves were only for the last attack in a group of enemies? Similar to how Arkham Asylum slowed down the last hit on the final thug of the room.

 

[Optimystic]

I disagree with him totally about Bayonetta. The only mandatory finishers were the boss finishers, and she had a unique finish for every single boss. You can accuse Bayonetta of many things, but monotony and laziness are definitely not among them.

 

[Phoenixmgs_v1legacy]

Bayonetta didn't have finishers outside of the summon finishers in the boss fights, which were all awesome, and you only saw them once in the game. The torture attacks weren't finishers, they were special moves.

Edit:

I disagree with him totally about Bayonetta. The only mandatory finishers were the boss finishers, and she had a unique finish for every single boss. You can accuse Bayonetta of many things, but monotony and laziness are definitely not among them.

Lol, you posted this as I was typing my post.

 

[Phoenixmgs_v1legacy]

Sorry, double post, I edited my post above.

 

[Saelune]

Should point out Street Fighter does X-Ray moves even worse with their super and ultra "combos".
And I like the X-ray moves. They are not too long, and they are as repetitive as any other thing in a fighting game. When I use Smoke, I do the same things. Even worse I often have to fight Scorpion anyways.

This is one of the few times Yahtzee has acually kinda annoyed me. But he is not a fighting game person anyways, so maybe thats why.

 

[The Random One]

I completely agree, Yahtzee, that was your best metaphor so far.

I also agree with the other stuff. Finishers should be a cool thing that takes some effort to do and are not required, so the short animation feels like what it's supposed to be: a reward. If it's actually required to defeat an enemy it's in the way.

 

[applefleas]

I think Batman:AA and Ninja Gaiden 2 are really the superior examples to be referenced. Both of them don't require you to use the finishing moves, but if you do, not only are you treated to a nice little animation but you also make proper use of the game's efficient techniques. It rewards you in more ways than one.

...between the two games, though, Batman probably serves as a better example because as soon as you're done with your execution move in NG2, you get gang banged the moment the last animation frame ends. It doesn't flow as well as Batman's finishers/combat, but it's still an appropriate example of quick and cool finishing moves.

 

[TinmanX]

I feel something that should be mentioned here is how these over-the-top powerful moves/combos tie into the competitive fighting game scene, and how infrequently they are actually used. Besides MvC3, attempting to get off these sort of moves is incredibly risky and are not of great priority. Most of the time they are blocked or whiff (miss) as competitive players are so very used to avoiding them or anticipating them in the first place.

From a casual point of view (I am a casual myself), fighting games may seem like they are entirely about these super/hyper/ultra/X-ray moves. You see them in all the trailers and there is so much emphasis on them in the media. Really though, these moves form a very small part of a fighting game's actual mechanics and should be seen as merely a catchup option if someone is getting owned. A competitive player is more likely to burn their super/xray bar through enhanced attacks then leaving the whole thing for said move, mainly because it is more advantageous for them to do so. The sparring or 'footsies' of a fighting game is what a competitive player is focusing on 90% of the time. Should said 'footsies' allow them a small window of opportunity to properly place one of these special moves, then great! If you watch enough tournament videos you will know that it is THIS that entertains and awes the crowd, not the special move itself. This is because at the competitive level, successfully getting off one of these moves is not easy. It is incredibly hard.

I guess what I am trying to say is that people are probably looking at these moves the wrong way and thinking of them in the wrong light. Yes, for the casual beating up his friend who doesn't know how to block these moves can get boring and probably pull the action away for both of them. But for two people who are actually fighting competitively, getting these moves off are significant, difficult and highly entertaining.

Example: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cDnaTmGHb1g&t=10m10s

Also, fatalities are nothing more than glorified finishing moves. You don't have to do them. Anyone complaining about how they are forcing unnecessary gore porn down your throat is just silly.

 

[spaceman_jan]

i dont either
i think that games are amazing

 

[subfield]

I want to agree with you but this argument is kind of flimsy. A repeatable mechanic or animation is OK so long as it doesn't overshadow the gameplay, even if is very long. Example: Knights of the round in FFVII. You acquire it late in the game, it is used repeatably, but it doesn't take over the game, because it is isn't forced on the player.

If the game is varied enough, this issue is basically moot. For a fighter, or a platformer, where the gameplay is very one-dimensional, it becomes much more important.

 

[havass]

As with almost everyone here, I have to admit the Arkham Asylum fighting engine is the best I've seen. The things they let you do with a two button system really made you felt like Batman. In most games having more than 10 enemies should make you wary, but not in AA. The combat really flows.
In fact at the last bit where you walk through a corridor filled with goons who weren't gonna attack you, I punched one in the face just because there were like over 20 in the room and I wanted to rack up a combo. THIS is how a fighting engine should feel like, not breaking up the action with unskippable cutscenes. Assassin's Creed Brotherhood had a pretty good one down too. It had execution scenes which could be stopped if someone else was attacking.

 

[jakefongloo]

I'd say Ninja Gaiden II also has a very good fast paced combat, sure it's hard as hell but the system is very fast paced because the finishing moves happen in a flash, nice and quick, you know, like a ninja should be... I guess it gets its porn aspects in in other ways though

Damnit Ninja'd....oh i get it

But seriously, when you quickly look for the guy missing an arm and hit Y (or triangle i would assume). The animation is somewhere between 2-5 seconds long it gives a nice break considering your invulnerable while you do it and it out right kills the guy but the action never breaks because the exact second it is over all the guys waiting will jump your ass so you have to be ready to dodge, jump, slash, kick, and generally be a bamf until its over. Especially when on the harder difficulties you're begging for them because you need a breather.

 

[tzimize]

Or look at Batman: Arkham Asylum, it's got one of the best fighting engines I've ever seen in a game and it doesn't really do elaborate finishers at all, it just flows incredibly well. Punch flows to kick flows to counter flows back to punch.

Fuck..Yeah. That game truly had flow, and all it required was "Tilt analogue-stick in direction of asskickery, press X to kick ass, press Y to wtfpwn, then X to kick ass again".
Never seen a game that let you do so many different things with just two buttons, and never, ever broke flow. God how I loved to jump into a fight with ten different thugs and just see how long I could keep my combos up. You really felt like Batman when you managed to take them all down, no hits taken.

Agreed. And it never got old either, probably because large enemy groups were few and far between. I still remember the big grin crawling into my face whenever I spotted such a group

Ah man. I cant wait for Arkham City.

 

[zeldagirl]

I enjoyed the broth metaphor as much as Yahtzee. Nicely done. Hell, the whole thing was spot on and hilarious, with salient points, as well. Arkham Asylum had amazing flow. Never have been a huge fan of MK, for the gore reason, but this review has me even less inclined to even try it (as I have in the past).

 

[ChupathingyX]

But...they're optional.

You don't have to use x-ray attacks, you can still win without them. They also provide an opportunity to take a quick breather and think of your next attack.

Also fatalities are also optional finishers, if you don't want to use them then don't, just smack your opponent and you're done.