Extra Punctuation: Hating Warhammer 40k and Space Marine

[Frankster]

But I do have to agree about the ridiculousness of the balking at a woman in charge. But thank god those walking tank-men showed up to save her before she fainted from all the pressure of being in command!

Except that's not what happens. Find my previous posts buried around here somewhere on the topic....

 

[Necromancer1991]

I like WH40K, tell me "it's shit" all you want, I like the universe (and how over the top it is). I will admit that the universe isn't perfect (But than again what is), but I like it just the same.

 

[Erttheking]

This coupled together with Gears 3...I'm really starting to get the impression that Yahtzee is rather biased towards these types of games. He deflected acusations that he was a troll in the SSBB mailroom showdown and I agreed with him then but these viewpoints are starting to sound rather unfounded and frankly I wonder if he's just trying to get the goat of fans.

Also as someone who has limited exposure to 40K, here's what I got from it. The future is a hell hole, aliens are besigning it from every side, Hyperspace is quite literally Hell filled with immortal demons and four (five) asshole gods who take joy in causing pain and miser. The Imperium is a husk of what it used to be, falling apart over 10,000 around the corpse of it's founder, who had such a different vision for humanity, after he was mortally wounded by his own son. The Inquisition will gladly sacarafice millions to save billions, and billions to save trillions. You are expendable, you will be used as cannon fodder if you show no other use, and worse of all, THERE IS NO WAY OUT.

 

[Erttheking]

The Imperium is a husk of what it used to be, falling apart over 10,000 around the corpse of it's founder, who had such a different vision for humanity, after he was mortally wounded by his own son.

He wanted to create a way of space travel without using the warp. The Chaos powers did not like this and lied to many of the Primarchs (including Horus) that he was trying to become a god(the Imperial Truth is that there are no gods, though the Emperor knew about chaos and simply hoped that his sons would destroy any trace so quickly that they would not be tainted), who either turned to Chaos or became renegades.

Yeah, half of the Primarchs and Space Marines turned on the Emperor and practically all of them, Loyalist and Traitors, died in the end with the Emperor being stuck on the throne. What really makes me crap my pants is that somewhere I read that there were other methods of FTL that the Imperium looked at, and the Warp was considered the safest. I really don't want to think about that too much, that the Warp is viewed as a preferably alternative to something. Unless you're the Tau, if you use the Warp to travel things could very easily end badly.

 

[MrPeanut]

What really makes me crap my pants is that somewhere I read that there were other methods of FTL that the Imperium looked at, and the Warp was considered the safest. I really don't want to think about that too much, that the Warp is viewed as a preferably alternative to something. Unless you're the Tau, if you use the Warp to travel things could very easily end badly.

The Necron ships travel with near instant non-warp FTL drives across the galaxy but I doubt they would be eager to share.

 

[The_root_of_all_evil]

Pah, Advanced Dungeons and Dragons.

You weren't a proper D&D player unless you were using Red Box special edition.

 

[Erttheking]

What really makes me crap my pants is that somewhere I read that there were other methods of FTL that the Imperium looked at, and the Warp was considered the safest. I really don't want to think about that too much, that the Warp is viewed as a preferably alternative to something. Unless you're the Tau, if you use the Warp to travel things could very easily end badly.

The Necron ships travel with near instant non-warp FTL drives across the galaxy but I doubt they would be eager to share.

I recall the Adectus Mechanicus trying to get into a tomb world once, but I think it was one of those, "get a billon people killed" days and I doubt it worked. Not to mention with the "Kill all organics" thing that they've got going on along with them completly disapearing after every, fight, that is pretty unlikely. Not to mention they're all being controled by a C'tan, which is kind of cheating.

 

[Sordak]

dont get trolled by yahtzee

 

[Malkavian]

Military/paramilitary/intelligence and associated services then. The interesting bit is the Adeptus Administratum who seem to control planets and military. and in the back-ground even they sound like inhuman monks.

Supposedly this system of governance has been going controlling the entire human galaxy for 10,000 years; which sounds like a situation where you'd have sections of the administratum fall under the control of local princes al la europe after the Roman Empire. But no, the empire is stable despite constant war.

Hence I think it would be more interesting for the empire to fragment. Hence my previous Catholic/Protestant/Orthodox analogy.

The Administratum is also everything civil matters. Infrastructure, civil services, health care that sort of thing. It's a really broad umbrella, and another reason why your chart isn't that good at describing how the society functions.

For an example, the military branch of the administratum is a section in itself, called the munitorium. While I concede war and a militaristic mindset is weaved closely into the societys structure, it is a necessity born out of constant conflict. On any number of fronts.

The empire can't fragment. If it were ever to cease functioning as it does now, humanity would perish. Which would not make it very interesting at all, since it would mean the end of the setting.


Yes. There is only war. Not as in every planet is constantly engulfed in strife, but humanity as a whole is at constant conflict, and it is barely holding. If it were to become divisioned, if the warmachine was not fed, it would falter in its defense. And if the public was not constantly scrutinized for signs of heresy, it would crumble from within. Not because not being a fervant churchgoer is a bad thing, but because chaos must be held at bay at all costs.

Who say's that humanity would perish? The Imperium's propaganda?

If you defy the Imperium you will fall to Chaos (Ie. go to hell.): Theocratic
If we don't work together for the Imperium the imperium will fall: Fascism

It's all propaganda to support these two systems. Two types of government that I and I imagine people in the future would buck against or would be corrupt enough that people would carve out domains of their own. And I said fragment. Not fall apart. Did Europe stop working just because the Roman Empire fell? No. They became a system of feudal nationstates that paid homage to the former imperial power the papacy.You cannot tell me that a galaxywide inefficient theocratic empire wouldn't fracture.

The setting would be more interesting and dynamic if these problems or the tensions that lead to these problems were highlighted but most of the back story focuses on how space-marine chapters were formed and how they behave. And I'm with Yahtzee. Sapce Marines are boring sexless monks devoid of humanity. Interesting as part of a setting but so over emphasized that the everything else falls into the background.

Edit: I don't hate the setting just thing that the actual humanity could be a dynamic and colorful as the superhumans that inhabit it.

No, that's pretty much fact. The thing is, if chaos is not kept properly in check, it will swallow up the whole galaxy. Humanity is barely holding as it is now, and that' thanks to the system.

For one thing: How does a fractured Imperium maintain the Imperial Guard? How can the Inquisition operate, and with what authority? Where does the Mechanicum ship its manufactured arms, and what does it do with the titan legions?

Of course, measures can be taken to maintain these forces, The Guard can be something akin to the UN or Nato forces, the Inquisition a kind of Interpol, the Mechanicum can be independant manufacturers selling their weapons. The problem is that it would make everything function much less smoothly. Politics would interfere with the protection of the imperium, noone would be able to do their job properly. Humanity would be destroyed, as noone would be able to properly organize, for an example, the defense against Hive Fleet Leviathan, by Inquisitor Kryptman. Imagine the UN trying to solve that situation, and having to take those hard decisions, for an example, virus bombing an entire imperial planet out of necessity. I can see where you are coming from, but it is not possible in the setting. If you would prefer such a setting, fair enough, but its not possible to change the W40k to one such, without making major changes to EVERYTHING, all factions, and the underlying lore. You would have something very much not 40k.

As for humanity not being varied and colourful... it IS. While the government that connects systems may be a strict, unchanging, dystopian fascist oppressor, individual planets have individual cultures. Reading the books will show that. Hell, you can even see it in the Wargame itself. Tallarns differ vastly from Cadians differ vastly from Valhallans.

EDIT: I just reread your post to add something: Chaos and the threat it poses is not imperial propaganda. It's very, very real. Same goes for the xenos. It's not propaganda that the Necrons are awakening, that we've only yet seen scouting parties of the real Tyranid Hivefleet, that the Tau have advanced past humanity in terms of tech, that the Orks are an unstoppable destructive force that could slaughter everything if they worked together, etc. In fact, it is not used for propaganda at all, mostly being kept a secret as much as possible. While the imperium utilizes propaganda, the threats that beset them are very much real.

 

[ACman]

Military/paramilitary/intelligence and associated services then. The interesting bit is the Adeptus Administratum who seem to control planets and military. and in the back-ground even they sound like inhuman monks.

Supposedly this system of governance has been going controlling the entire human galaxy for 10,000 years; which sounds like a situation where you'd have sections of the administratum fall under the control of local princes al la europe after the Roman Empire. But no, the empire is stable despite constant war.

Hence I think it would be more interesting for the empire to fragment. Hence my previous Catholic/Protestant/Orthodox analogy.

The Administratum is also everything civil matters. Infrastructure, civil services, health care that sort of thing. It's a really broad umbrella, and another reason why your chart isn't that good at describing how the society functions.

For an example, the military branch of the administratum is a section in itself, called the munitorium. While I concede war and a militaristic mindset is weaved closely into the societys structure, it is a necessity born out of constant conflict. On any number of fronts.

The empire can't fragment. If it were ever to cease functioning as it does now, humanity would perish. Which would not make it very interesting at all, since it would mean the end of the setting.


Yes. There is only war. Not as in every planet is constantly engulfed in strife, but humanity as a whole is at constant conflict, and it is barely holding. If it were to become divisioned, if the warmachine was not fed, it would falter in its defense. And if the public was not constantly scrutinized for signs of heresy, it would crumble from within. Not because not being a fervant churchgoer is a bad thing, but because chaos must be held at bay at all costs.

Who say's that humanity would perish? The Imperium's propaganda?

If you defy the Imperium you will fall to Chaos (Ie. go to hell.): Theocratic
If we don't work together for the Imperium the imperium will fall: Fascism

It's all propaganda to support these two systems. Two types of government that I and I imagine people in the future would buck against or would be corrupt enough that people would carve out domains of their own. And I said fragment. Not fall apart. Did Europe stop working just because the Roman Empire fell? No. They became a system of feudal nationstates that paid homage to the former imperial power the papacy.You cannot tell me that a galaxywide inefficient theocratic empire wouldn't fracture.

The setting would be more interesting and dynamic if these problems or the tensions that lead to these problems were highlighted but most of the back story focuses on how space-marine chapters were formed and how they behave. And I'm with Yahtzee. Sapce Marines are boring sexless monks devoid of humanity. Interesting as part of a setting but so over emphasized that the everything else falls into the background.

Edit: I don't hate the setting just thing that the actual humanity could be a dynamic and colorful as the superhumans that inhabit it.

No, that's pretty much fact. The thing is, if chaos is not kept properly in check, it will swallow up the whole galaxy. Humanity is barely holding as it is now, and that' thanks to the system.

For one thing: How does a fractured Imperium maintain the Imperial Guard? How can the Inquisition operate, and with what authority? Where does the Mechanicum ship its manufactured arms, and what does it do with the titan legions?

Of course, measures can be taken to maintain these forces, The Guard can be something akin to the UN or Nato forces, the Inquisition a kind of Interpol, the Mechanicum can be independant manufacturers selling their weapons. The problem is that it would make everything function much less smoothly. Politics would interfere with the protection of the imperium, noone would be able to do their job properly. Humanity would be destroyed, as noone would be able to properly organize, for an example, the defense against Hive Fleet Leviathan, by Inquisitor Kryptman. Imagine the UN trying to solve that situation, and having to take those hard decisions, for an example, virus bombing an entire imperial planet out of necessity. I can see where you are coming from, but it is not possible in the setting. If you would prefer such a setting, fair enough, but its not possible to change the W40k to one such, without making major changes to EVERYTHING, all factions, and the underlying lore. You would have something very much not 40k.

As for humanity not being varied and colourful... it IS. While the government that connects systems may be a strict, unchanging, dystopian fascist oppressor, individual planets have individual cultures. Reading the books will show that. Hell, you can even see it in the Wargame itself. Tallarns differ vastly from Cadians differ vastly from Valhallans.

EDIT: I just reread your post to add something: Chaos and the threat it poses is not imperial propaganda. It's very, very real. Same goes for the xenos. It's not propaganda that the Necrons are awakening, that we've only yet seen scouting parties of the real Tyranid Hivefleet, that the Tau have advanced past humanity in terms of tech, that the Orks are an unstoppable destructive force that could slaughter everything if they worked together, etc. In fact, it is not used for propaganda at all, mostly being kept a secret as much as possible. While the imperium utilizes propaganda, the threats that beset them are very much real.

But none of these societies interact with each other.

Except through war.

Or through nasty totalitarian government.

 

[ACman]

Military/paramilitary/intelligence and associated services then. The interesting bit is the Adeptus Administratum who seem to control planets and military. and in the back-ground even they sound like inhuman monks.

Supposedly this system of governance has been going controlling the entire human galaxy for 10,000 years; which sounds like a situation where you'd have sections of the administratum fall under the control of local princes al la europe after the Roman Empire. But no, the empire is stable despite constant war.

Hence I think it would be more interesting for the empire to fragment. Hence my previous Catholic/Protestant/Orthodox analogy.

The Administratum is also everything civil matters. Infrastructure, civil services, health care that sort of thing. It's a really broad umbrella, and another reason why your chart isn't that good at describing how the society functions.

For an example, the military branch of the administratum is a section in itself, called the munitorium. While I concede war and a militaristic mindset is weaved closely into the societys structure, it is a necessity born out of constant conflict. On any number of fronts.

The empire can't fragment. If it were ever to cease functioning as it does now, humanity would perish. Which would not make it very interesting at all, since it would mean the end of the setting.


Yes. There is only war. Not as in every planet is constantly engulfed in strife, but humanity as a whole is at constant conflict, and it is barely holding. If it were to become divisioned, if the warmachine was not fed, it would falter in its defense. And if the public was not constantly scrutinized for signs of heresy, it would crumble from within. Not because not being a fervant churchgoer is a bad thing, but because chaos must be held at bay at all costs.

Who say's that humanity would perish? The Imperium's propaganda?

If you defy the Imperium you will fall to Chaos (Ie. go to hell.): Theocratic
If we don't work together for the Imperium the imperium will fall: Fascism

It's all propaganda to support these two systems. Two types of government that I and I imagine people in the future would buck against or would be corrupt enough that people would carve out domains of their own. And I said fragment. Not fall apart. Did Europe stop working just because the Roman Empire fell? No. They became a system of feudal nationstates that paid homage to the former imperial power the papacy.You cannot tell me that a galaxywide inefficient theocratic empire wouldn't fracture.

The setting would be more interesting and dynamic if these problems or the tensions that lead to these problems were highlighted but most of the back story focuses on how space-marine chapters were formed and how they behave. And I'm with Yahtzee. Sapce Marines are boring sexless monks devoid of humanity. Interesting as part of a setting but so over emphasized that the everything else falls into the background.

Edit: I don't hate the setting just thing that the actual humanity could be a dynamic and colorful as the superhumans that inhabit it.

No, that's pretty much fact. The thing is, if chaos is not kept properly in check, it will swallow up the whole galaxy. Humanity is barely holding as it is now, and that' thanks to the system.

For one thing: How does a fractured Imperium maintain the Imperial Guard? How can the Inquisition operate, and with what authority? Where does the Mechanicum ship its manufactured arms, and what does it do with the titan legions?

Of course, measures can be taken to maintain these forces, The Guard can be something akin to the UN or Nato forces, the Inquisition a kind of Interpol, the Mechanicum can be independant manufacturers selling their weapons. The problem is that it would make everything function much less smoothly. Politics would interfere with the protection of the imperium, noone would be able to do their job properly. Humanity would be destroyed, as noone would be able to properly organize, for an example, the defense against Hive Fleet Leviathan, by Inquisitor Kryptman. Imagine the UN trying to solve that situation, and having to take those hard decisions, for an example, virus bombing an entire imperial planet out of necessity. I can see where you are coming from, but it is not possible in the setting. If you would prefer such a setting, fair enough, but its not possible to change the W40k to one such, without making major changes to EVERYTHING, all factions, and the underlying lore. You would have something very much not 40k.

As for humanity not being varied and colourful... it IS. While the government that connects systems may be a strict, unchanging, dystopian fascist oppressor, individual planets have individual cultures. Reading the books will show that. Hell, you can even see it in the Wargame itself. Tallarns differ vastly from Cadians differ vastly from Valhallans.

EDIT: I just reread your post to add something: Chaos and the threat it poses is not imperial propaganda. It's very, very real. Same goes for the xenos. It's not propaganda that the Necrons are awakening, that we've only yet seen scouting parties of the real Tyranid Hivefleet, that the Tau have advanced past humanity in terms of tech, that the Orks are an unstoppable destructive force that could slaughter everything if they worked together, etc. In fact, it is not used for propaganda at all, mostly being kept a secret as much as possible. While the imperium utilizes propaganda, the threats that beset them are very much real.

But none of these societies interact with each other.

Except through war.

Or through nasty totalitarian government.

I don't really give a toss what types of hat the populace wears. The political class is what interests me an they seem to be horrible religious types.

I'm not saying that horrible religious types shouldn't be present but some alternatives are nice.


And as for the Chaos stuff. Most of that information come from heavily redacted imperium documents. Who's to say they not making that shit up?

 

[Neocavo]

TBH IMO i am a W40K fanboy to the point i all but boycott SC2 but i dont think yahtzee so much as did an injustice towards the backstory he just said what he saw in the game and has already in a few reviews mentioned he is not a fan of the 40k universe if it wasnt for the fact that Dawn of war 2 and personal interest in the grim dark future i wouldnt have a damn clue based on space marine alone, it is a little silly that hes gone to highlight chainswords and raging roids and battle armour as a bad thing since hes a clear advocate of the old school shooter but then again space marine does kinda come across as warhammer 40k: gears of war....in the sense of limited weapons and the whole melee weapons are over exaggerated to do more fan service than make the game legitimately fun. If THQ make a sequel which they proberly will because W40k is guaranteed money for them, they should take out the limited amount of hardware you can carry and the needing to execute for health and keep the melee just polish it off abit more, they could be on to a real melee/shooter winner......and of course no regenerating health -.-

 

[Malkavian]

But none of these societies interact with each other.

Except through war.

Or through nasty totalitarian government.

I don't really give a toss what types of hat the populace wears. The political class is what interests me an they seem to be horrible religious types.

I'm not saying that horrible religious types shouldn't be present but some alternatives are nice.


And as for the Chaos stuff. Most of that information come from heavily redacted imperium documents. Who's to say they not making that shit up?

They interact plenty. Trade, vacationing, etc.

Not at all. Sure, some of them are religious, but you should compare it to american politicians. They have to show piety outwards, but they are not zealots. Are the figureheads of the ecclesiarchy highly religious? Yes. Are the administrative workers and the ruling politicians? No.

PLanetary Governors are not typically fervent believers. I mean, they can be, but no different from how normal people can be christians, but mostly in upbringing.

The lore? It's not like all of W40k are seen from the perspective of humans, you know... There is really nothing to discuss here. You might as well argue that the emperor didn't build the death star, and everything we saw in the Star Wars movies were just propaganda. I don't know where you are going with this, but there's really no doubt here. Chaos is real, and it's hella dangerous.

 

[ACman]

But none of these societies interact with each other.

Except through war.

Or through nasty totalitarian government.

I don't really give a toss what types of hat the populace wears. The political class is what interests me an they seem to be horrible religious types.

I'm not saying that horrible religious types shouldn't be present but some alternatives are nice.


And as for the Chaos stuff. Most of that information come from heavily redacted imperium documents. Who's to say they not making that shit up?

They interact plenty. Trade, vacationing, etc.

Not at all. Sure, some of them are religious, but you should compare it to american politicians. They have to show piety outwards, but they are not zealots. Are the figureheads of the ecclesiarchy highly religious? Yes. Are the administrative workers and the ruling politicians? No.

PLanetary Governors are not typically fervent believers. I mean, they can be, but no different from how normal people can be christians, but mostly in upbringing.

The lore? It's not like all of W40k are seen from the perspective of humans, you know... There is really nothing to discuss here. You might as well argue that the emperor didn't build the death star, and everything we saw in the Star Wars movies were just propaganda. I don't know where you are going with this, but there's really no doubt here. Chaos is real, and it's hella dangerous.

Maybe for people in Sementum Obscurus.

For us in Segmentum Solar the government is just using a vague threat somewhere far far away to distract from domestic issues.

 

[poleboy]

Now that I know 40K is a satire, taking blows at just about every major religious and political insitution, I actually like it a lot more.

captcha: tembroac sorcery. - the chaos demons are upon us! :O

 

[ACman]

Do you know what I really want in this setting?

Pirates.

And Venician/Florentine merchant ships. The setting could do with a good renaissance.

And a reformation.

Not to mention an enlightenment.

Edit: But mostly space pirates.

Edit: Edit: Yarr!

 

[dubious_wolf]

If it was a Tau FPS it would have been better.
...Oh wait.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Warhammer_40,000:_Fire_Warrior

Never mind.

Maybe if it was space wolves?
...http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Elder_Scrolls_V:_Skyrim

Yeah maybe not.

It's sad but in reality there isn't any good way to bring the Warhammer universe into a video game form because every thing has been done before. And the guys over at GW have decided they aren't going to push the envelope any time soon.

 

[Trillovinum]

I tend to feel that 40K derivative works don't capitalize on the setting's DOOM reserves.

I always feel that people boasting about the Imperial Guard's superior firepower are missing the point of the Imperial Guard flavor, which is to die horribly to phenomena from every branch of particle physics. And once in a while they manage, against all odds (though not really because of game balance of course), to eke out a victory amidst terrible sacrifices while their officers oppress the shit out of the poor assholes. Their heroism is without meaning if the setting is not only out to get them but actually usually does.

I liked it when the Tau were purely idealistic animu people with tons of hope and tolerance and a forward-thinking attitude towards technology, before all that grimderp mind control and sterilization stuff got written in. Because they were tiny, and if a Waaagh or a Black Crusade or a Hive Fleet so much as farted at them they would be utterly wiped out. They were actual good guys, a speck of hope to contrast the backwards oppressive juggernaut of the Imperium, in a setting that would eat them alive as soon as any major player decided to give them the time of day.

What people get right all the time is how over-the-top everything is. Bolters are standard-issue weapons that basically shoot RPGs on full auto. That's great, it's a funny little factoid. It's a funny factoid, because it's absurd and moronically juvenile. And meanwhile, the Space Marines carrying them are all grim and super serious and For The Emperor, and they look totally ridiculous. You say that it's awesome, or AWESOME, in the same way that Fist of the North Star is "AWESOME", which is to say that it's hilarious. What people keep overlooking is that 40K isn't grimdark because of how AWESOME it is, how tough Orks are, how dangerous Necrons can be - it's grimdark because everyone is stupid. And their weapons are stupid. And everything they think of is a bad idea.

I totally agree with you. especially that bit about the Tau... I formed my opinion about them after I played as them in the dawn of war games. they sounded like a tolerant people that actually wanted to make friends and for alliances, that allowed humans to join them in a caste of their own...

and then the writers took a turn up genocide avenue...

And that doesn't even make any sense. Why on earth would they do that, they're too small as it is. and why wouldn't they want to allow humans in their system, they have four different allied species already and since humans are so divided and culturally different, this wouldn't be a practical issue.

I've read something about them killing and sterilizing humans so they wouldn't interbreed with Tau. But that whole idea is ludicrous. The chance of humans being genetically compatible with an alien species is just too small. (Eldar would be better matches anyway.)

 

[Gildan Bladeborn]

Danke for the knowledge boost, but i was referring to the human weaponry, merely considering the technological avenues that we are currently pursuing led me to believe that, logically, weaponry that relied on ammunition would have become defunct for the human race by the year 40,000. I assumed that we'd have something like the Mass Effect games later showed; ergonomically similar to modern rifles (Due simply to human anatomy being what it is.) but using a more advanced method of projectiles or even energy weaponry that doesn't require mass manufacture of raw materials that the trillions of bullets fired would nessecitate.

Don't mean to troll if it seems that way, just explaining what i mean.

You... really don't get how technology works in 40K. The height of human technological advancement occurred thousands of years prior to the setting's "current day", and is now referred to as "The Dark Age of Technology". The keepers of technology venerate machines as facets of the Omnissiah, and believe that rituals to appease the "machine spirits" are required for them to operate - in short, scientists have largely been replaced by a religious mystery cult that for the most part considers innovation to be heretical; the technological rate of advancement since the 31st Millennium has slowed to a crawl, and most of that prior to the Horus Heresy was simply recovering schematics and designs that humanity had already created in its distant past.

The Imperium as a whole is collectively losing knowledge, and the production of new technology is as much ritual as it is manufacturing in many cases; superstition reigns and reverse engineering is an affront to the sanctity of the machine, so you have examples where the Mechanicus knows perfectly well how to produce grav-plates for their warships but cannot then replicate the technology on a smaller scale to produce a grav-bike, even though they have vehicles that work on basically the same principle now.

Mass Effect is your standard Science Fiction vision of a bright shiny optimistic future, 40K is what happened after mankind already had one of those and it all went to hell in a hand basket - you are talking about a society that produces maxims like "An open mind is like a fortress with its gates unbarred and unguarded". The rare few brilliant technical minds or innovators are exceptions to the hidebound stagnation that sees extremely advanced technology operated alongside stuff less advanced than what we commonly use now; loading the cannons on an Imperial ship of the line is done by hand, by entire teams of men.

But with that said the Imperium uses a whole bunch of energy weapons, lasguns are standard issue equipment to the Imperial Guard.

 

[daftalchemist]

But I do have to agree about the ridiculousness of the balking at a woman in charge. But thank god those walking tank-men showed up to save her before she fainted from all the pressure of being in command!

Except that's not what happens. Find my previous posts buried around here somewhere on the topic....

I wouldn't know because I'm not about to sift through 10 pages of fanboyism to find it, and because I didn't get much farther than that point before I got bored and went to do something else.