Extra Punctuation: Roleplaying Homosexual in Dragon Age 2

[Jonabob87]

Interesting read!

It's lovely to know that you "pity" those who think differently from you...

"Those" being homophobes or any individual who sees homosexual romance as disgusting or unnerving.

To be a homophobe is to fear gayness, or being gay yourself. I'm not afraid of either of these things.

If you're meaning disliking gay people? Wrong again, gay people are as the term indicated "People who are gay". Still people and still worthy of every consideration you or me is worthy of of.

To be opposed to homosexual conduct or lovemaking makes me neither unpleasant nor insecure. It means I see something and don't like it.

If I saw something I didn't like and disliked the person for doing it that would be a whole 'nother story.

What, exactly, is wrong about homosexual conduct in video games aside from earning a bit of your ire? Too used to traditional hetero romance dominating the medium that this comes off as a bit of a culture clash? We're the twenty first century, values are updating, we should open new venues in all forms of pop culture.

Maybe it's because as a member of the LGBT community I see nothing inherently wrong with two fictional characters enjoying love and devotion on the screen, just as I see nothing inherently wrong in men and women pairing up for similar purposes. What's your reason?

I never said a single thing about homoeroticism in gaming, I'm utterly without comment and couldn't care less.

 

[Bara_no_Hime]

Damn, I've lost my "serious man slow clapping" picture again.

Best Extra Punctuation ever. Beautiful, truly beautiful.

 

[monnes]

My issue with the love interests in Dragon Age 2 wasn't that there were too many gays, it was that all of them were bisexual. They are clear-written characters you're not supposed to make decisions for, but still all of them are bisexuall. I find this a bit odd.

Also, there's actually only 2 female love interests, and counting day 1 dlc, there's 3 male ones.

Although this is a bit besides the point, I felt the characters were pretty badly written, with the exception of Varric, and possibly Aveline (who is not a love interest).

Also, I might have been imagining things, but I felt Anders and Fenris were both pretty sexually aggressive, which didn't really seem to fit with their personalities.

I believe that the backstory changes according to your character's gender: they aren't all bisexual.

I'm almost certain this is not the case, but I'd love to be proven wrong, in this case. Got source?

 

[ramboondiea]

just whats to be expected of a proper British gentleman haha, good read yahtzee

 

[Iron Lightning]

Well, to be fair, a lot of the criticism comes from the fact that all the romancible characters in Dragon Age 2 are bisexual, which is frankly a bit odd. Not that I have a problem with that design decision myself. It does make it so that people playing homosexuals have the option of romancing any character they fancy which is an improvement over the more realistic romancing options in Dragon Age: Origins.

I have also played some characters of unusual sexuality. For instance, in DA:O my only love... was Shale. Unfortunately it didn't have anywhere to stick it in and rock handjobs just leave one sore.

 

[TwistedEllipses]

My issue with the love interests in Dragon Age 2 wasn't that there were too many gays, it was that all of them were bisexual. They are clear-written characters you're not supposed to make decisions for, but still all of them are bisexuall. I find this a bit odd.

Also, there's actually only 2 female love interests, and counting day 1 dlc, there's 3 male ones.

Sebastian doesn't have the homosexual relationship option, though I'm not sure if that was a design choice or just cutting corners...

 

[Jonabob87]

Interesting read!

It's lovely to know that you "pity" those who think differently from you...

I think the pity is directed at the people who want to get guys fired for writing something that didn't appeal to them, especially when that content was not a dominant part of the experience. Or even a part at all, for the most part, if you didn't want it to be.

That's not how I read into it but that would make far more sense.

 

[SergeantAnt]

haha this was great . i couldnt agree with him more, then he went on ranting about his "man crush" with Anders and i just thought it was so funny. See yahtzee has a soft side :3

 

[aegix drakan_v1legacy]

but I wonder how much of it was intended by the developers and how many blanks were filled in within my crazed mind alone

Ahhh...That's the secret. Whether or not it was intended that way by the developers, being able to fill in the blanks is great for game narrative.

Hell, in Mass Effect, I mentally filled in what I thought would fit Shepard's actions on Torfan, and how that turned him away from "total-renegade-bent-on-revenge" to a "renegade who grew a heart and is willing to break the rules if it means saving a life".

None of this is reflected in game, obviously, but it puts me in the right mindset for my paragon-renegade mix.

 

[FieryTrainwreck]

To be completely honest, I've shied away from gay characters in Bioware games. In Origins, I didn't use Zevran even once. In DA2, I used Anders right up until he started coming on to me. Then I swapped him for Merrill and changed my mage into a healer. I haven't used Fenris even once. Granted, that's at least half his own fault for being a completely tone-shattering anime reject, but I don't think a simple model-swap would stamp his ticket into my party.

I don't see anything wrong with homosexuality. I support it, and gay marriage, via total apathy; let people do what they want to do so long as no one is harmed (mostly). But do I want to hang out with a guy when I know he fantasizes about kissing me? No. It's sorta like how I don't want to hang out with a gal if I fantasize about kissing her when I know it will never happen. It's awkward and uncomfortable for me.

I think a big part of the problem is Bioware's approach to romance. Seems I'm always one sentence away from banging everyone. If the game allowed me to develop meaningful relationships with these characters over the course of time, allowing them to actually learn about my fictional character and his personality/sexuality/etc., it would make more sense when someone starts throwing him/herself at me. As is, you can stumble into a come-on, gay or otherwise, by simply choosing the most benign or reasonable conversation options.

Thank god for idiot-proof convo-wheel icons, huh?

 

[Mirrored Jigsaw]

My interpretation of role-playing is suddenly a lot greater. I've always been one of those people that plays a character close to home, but you make an amazing point.

 

[monnes]

My issue with the love interests in Dragon Age 2 wasn't that there were too many gays, it was that all of them were bisexual. They are clear-written characters you're not supposed to make decisions for, but still all of them are bisexuall. I find this a bit odd.

Also, there's actually only 2 female love interests, and counting day 1 dlc, there's 3 male ones.

Sebastian doesn't have the homosexual relationship option, though I'm not sure if that was a design choice or just cutting corners...

Considering he's a DLC character, I'd guess it's cutting corner, but I'd still consider it a good thing. I'd even consider it a good thing if he was exclusively gay. As long as they get a sexual identity.

 

[Veldel]

"Are there men so insecure that they're offended by fictional gay men coming onto their fictional avatars?"

Not me. But then again, I tend to play as a woman...

I always play games with both genders if possible XD

 

[rembrandtqeinstein]

I was sad Shepard didn't get to get his gay on with Jacob in ME2, because it would make the rest of the mission hilariously awkward.

Awesome writeup Y, made me actually want to play DA2 despite the reviews.

 

[Theotherguy]

"the person you are in a game is not the person you are in reality"

Of course not, but for some people playing a character that does have that behaves partly like the player would in a imaginable situation makes it more enjoyable for them. Like for me male non-gay Hawk that was all about being a ok dude was my choice.

Thats also the reason why I just hated Anders with his pick up lines andbeing all friendly to the point where butterflies flew out of his ass along with a gigant rainbow.

I say yes for gay romance options in rpgs but not for characters that make you feel unconfortable with their harrasing gay text lines.

And one more thing Yahtzee there are 2 women to shag as a male and 3 dudes, so that leaves the non gay people in a disadvantage.

 

[TwistedEllipses]

To be completely honest, I've shied away from gay characters in Bioware games...I haven't used Fenris even once. Granted, that's at least half his own fault for being a completely tone-shattering anime reject, but I don't think a simple model-swap would stamp his ticket into my party.

If it helps you to use Fenris (who admittedly is an anime reject), if you don't romance him, it's implied he's in a reltionship with the pirate-wench Isabella (as long as you're not in a relationship with her either). It's fun to bring him along with Merril on a mission, side with the mages and watch him get really worked up...

 

[EmpressZombiKitty]

Really good read, Yahtzee!

 

[zerobudgetgamer]

lol, bravo Yahtzee, you irrepressible stud you.

Honestly, I have to say that I've never seen a problem with homosexual pairings in games and TV. Hell, before he passed, my Uncle was gay, and he was an awesome guy. Quite frankly, and maybe this is a bit of my Uncle's influence, I've never been afraid to admit a man is handsome or find a homosexual pairing in my games to be adorable or romantic. I'm 100% sure I'm into chicks, and although I've wondered before, I'm fairly certain I wouldn't enjoy another man's company in bed, regardless if I was pitching or catching.

I guess you could say I follow the Bill Engvall take on homosexuality. If not for the taking-it-up-the-butt part, I could totally see myself being gay. Being around other dudes is just so much easier than trying to deal with even a single woman. I'm not saying the rewards for dealing with the woman aren't worth it, but sometimes, and all men have been there, when the rewards are too few and far apart for the effort put into it, y'know?

 

[drisky]

I was going to ask how he handled the end game, but I see he covered that. I wasn't interested in Anders, and man was I angry at the end. I can only imagine someone pursuing a romance with him would be even more upset.
On a personal note, I don't think I like Anders being gay. (Throws in quick self-defense speech here), but because in Awakening, there was no hint of it. He seemed to be solely focused on the the ladies, so much so that it got to the point where I wanted to tell him to shut up. Him suddenly being gay was a bit of a jerking turn for me, breaking his character a bit. If it had been any other character I wouldn't have even noticed, but Anders I went, "Wait. Since when are you gay?"

I'm going to quote Torchwood for this one, when Yanto's sister confronted him over over his relationship with Jack Harkness.
"How long (have you known you were gay?)"
"That's not it. Its not guys, it's just him."

I thought this was a great romantic line and it can work the same way for Anders. Just because he didn't hint that he liked guys in Awakining, doesn't mean there isn't a man out there for him. Hawke can just have something special about him that gravitates him more than any other character previously seen. Just because he didn't hint it before, doesn't mean it can't be there with out being forced.

GMTA. Aka "Gay only for you."

I was saying it might be the case, or it might be that he just didn't show intreats in any man in the game previously. I actually haven't played awaking or origins so really I don't know how bad the transition is, but I know that some people won't realize there bisexual until the right person of the same gender comes along. It happens that way sometimes.

 

[jpoon]

Wow, you really "overanalized" it there, didn't you ZP?