Female Game Characters Photoshopped to Average American Proportions

[Karadalis]

"Lets take female characters that do alot of physical straining activities like fighting for their lives every other day and make them look fat.. instead of say trained and athletic"

Yeaaaah... im sorry but just because there are alot of out of shape women out there that feel unsecure about their bodies but dont want to change anything about it doesnt mean that video game characters should suit their tastes.

Not only that but what the fuck has this to do with bad imaginings of women?

Women do not look at Tifa from FF7 and decide to become bulemic.

They look at super models.. REAL people and decide they want to be like them.

In the history of Barbie there have been only a handfull of nutjobs in history that wanted to look like her. Yet there are hundrets and thousands of girls that want to become super models.

Completly barking up the wrong tree and completly cringeworthy shopping of images. The girls could use a bit more muscle but certainly not more fat

 

[llubtoille]

It's worth remembering that many of these characters are designed in Japan, a county that has one of the lowest female average BMI in the world (21.7) vs America which has one of the highest (29).
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/health/article-2301172/Fattest-countries-world-revealed-Extraordinary-graphic-charts-average-body-mass-index-men-women-country-surprising-results.html

 

[mad825]

Okay we get. The media has an unrealistic idea of what a human body looks like hence why I don't look like Beef cake G.I Joe.

And yes ffs, females are the only ones effect by this shock shock horror.

 

[Mister K]

Snip

Thank you.

I'm not sure that's how it works. And frankly I don't see how criticizing body types in media or feeling pressured to convert to the norm because of overwhelming pressure (Which is a big problem world wide). And I don't really see what "Always feel the need to be loved" has to do with this. It's more like "Not being judged for not falling in line." Hell, sometimes I'm pressured to play basketball just because I'm call. Society has a lot of uncreative and narrow minded twits who want everything to be nice and static.

I doubt most other countries have concern over the internet being slower, but when that came around in this one just about everyone else jumped on the government for it. And plenty of these things seem stupid, depression seems stupid to people who haven't gone though it. Human beings are a very un-elegant race. (That and I'm pretty sure Belemia exists in other first world countries)

Where is the shaming? All it says about developers is that "They say that they portray everything as hyper-realistic yet seem to struggle with the female body" and they say nothing about players. It's criticizing trends, don't take it so freaking personally.

That's the point me and so many others are trying to get across. When having average weight, a woman can look gorgeous. Standards of unrealistic thinness aren't needed. (Ok fair enough, the photoshops kinda fucked it up. I still think Christie was a massive step towards being realistic though. Not to mention they're chubby at worst, and I consider the way people are calling them much worse to be very telling)

Actually apparently 700,000 people in England suffer from eating disorders.

http://www.b-eat.co.uk/about-beat/media-centre/information-and-statistics-about-eating-disorders

Like I said, we are not a graceful species at all.

Well, from what I understand, in US people are brought up thinking that US is the best, numero uno and, by extension, it also makes its citizens the best no matter who they are. This creates a psychological profile for people, according to which, since they are the best, they can never be wrong and them eating fat-rich food and living a (as someone said before me) white-collar exercise-less life is also correct way to live.

And when someone doesn't want to have a physical relationship with them they don't think that they are at fault. Oh no, it is society that is at fault.
Yes, there are people with, well, let's just call it big constitution, yes there are people who simply can't lose their fat belly no matter how much they run, diet and exersise (It's me we are talking aboot), but from what I gather vast majority of people are basically that: people who don't/can't eat what is actually good for their body and don't/can't exersise.

I agree, what I said about letting them die wasn't the best thing to say. At the time I was pissed about something that has nothing to do with the topic (not an excuse, but statement of a fact). But that doesn't change my opinion about people wishing for the world and society to change to suit their needs, not the other way around.

Internet in our modern world is essential (just like phones and high-quality public transportation are). The essenciality(?) is not limited to this one country. Fat people demanding to be considered as attractive as fit and healthy ones is a thing that exists in US and UK. I am not talking about bullying ("Ha, look at this ugly fat fuck"). I am talking about, to be blunt, demand to be arroused whether person likes it or not.

The quote presented to us claims that industry can make wonders with hyper-realistic visuals but fails to show "accurately portray the female body". First off, as said by others, it is a fantasy, it is something that does not exist in real life. Getting upset over how a 3D doll looks like is ridiculous. What is next? Should classic works of art that depict beautiful people be blocked for public viewing and be replaced by their copies that suddenly gaind 20 kilos?

What I CAN understand is when people get upset when they see portrail of real life people (celebrities and such). However: first of all, every image that you see was at the very least slightly altered in Photoshop. But even if those alterations were to be removed I bet most of the time you'd see a body that those people literally worked for: they dieted, they exercised.

Basically, the quote says that devs (at least) should be ashamed for not making female characters look like average american woman, who spends most of her time at work sitting by the desk, eating whatever whenever and hardly doing anything to get in shape. Slimmer one, or the one you've posted, any healthy shape.

I agree that many female characters (and male ones, to be perfectly honest) are not realistic. But those damn people want me to believe that Riku, a girl that always on the move, most of the game actively fighting monsters and runs around the world should look exactly like "average" woman, whose only physical activity during the day is getting from her bed, riding a car to work and riding it back. Ridiculous. She should have a bit of leg muscle though, I agree. But that is not what I see on those pictures.

As for England: US and UK are basically son/father or daughter/mother states. Hell, they belong to one legal family. I am not at all surprised that they have similar problems.

 

[The Almighty Aardvark]

Usually I'm pro these kind of things, but I feel like the point is seriously missed on a lot of these characters.

A large number of these characters are supposed to be very physically active. Lara Croft, Sonya Blade, what the hell, most of them. They've gone in and edited out the muscle on these characters. If you want to make these characters realistic, make them realistic for what they're supposed to be. For characters like Lara Croft, look at what's realistic for hikers and climbers. Lara Croft has an abnormally small waist, so if you need to fix something, fix that.

These might be more in line with the average American woman, but it's far from suiting from the average American athlete, which is the level of fitness that these characters are portraying. If you want to do this, you're better off choosing a character like Yuna than Rikku

EDIT:

Spoiler

Worth coming to this thread just for this post. This design is just badass

 

[Gethsemani_v1legacy]

Right. Let's cater to every fuckin' little group that doesn't want to take responsibility for themselves. "Eating disorder" my ass. Stop eating like pigs. I hate fat acceptance and other shit like that. Being fat is not healthy and I don't have to accept it.

Being obese is not the same as having an eating disorder, please don't confuse the two. Bulimia is a serious eating disorder that takes a great toll on the body and can, potentially if left untreated, be fatal due to the stress it puts on the body.

This guy gets it.

I agree. These edited pictures are of women who most certainly qualify to be above 25 Body Mass Index from fat. From a health (and Swedish) perspective, they are clearly overweight and would do well from changing their diet and exercise habits. You are entirely right that for most people the problem is not that movies, video games and what have you are showing us women and men who are physically fit, have healthy BMIs and are often beautiful. The problem is that they lack the self-control to do anything about their own health risks and health problems (which obesity very much is). That being said, there are legit eating disorders (I know, I work with treating them) and it is kind of said that Bulimia.com is using one of them as a cover for what basically amounts to fat acceptance.

As an aside, most eating disorders aren't caused just by "skewed body ideals", there are often other psychological problems behind them such as anxiety issues, depressions or social problems like broken homes or bullying.

 

[vagabondwillsmile]

Lets also hope that they adopt the average to their lifestyle and profession, so that people can play Lara Croft the average american archaeologist or Jade the average american martial artist. Sounds great!

Exactly. I don't watch the olympics and think, "Why don't they look more like the average person?" Who has arms these guys? OLYMPIANS DO! These characters ARE NOT AVERAGE! The pro fighter is going to be built like a pro fighter. All that running, lifting, jumping, climbing, and fighting will naturally lead to a body that is well-designed for running, lifting, jumping, climbing and fighting. I'm sorry, but that's how excercise works. Constant sitting, eating garbage, and drinking soda or god damn ENERGY DRINKS will invariably produce different results. If that is life-style that someone choses, MALE OR FEMALE, fine. But that lifestyle has consequences. And those that live it shouldn't expect a high energy, fit, athletic character not to look the part. It makes no sense.

Well, that's kind of related to the concern that the group has, that the ever presence of this kind of body image represents an unattainable ideal for the average person, the pursuit of which could result in the development of the eating disorders they provide information about.

The unrealistic expectations put on girls is horrible. I truly hate it. And the damage it does is real. I'VE SEEN IT HAPPEN TO SOMEONE CLOSE, and it can get so, so bad. People that haven't seen it have no idea. But the paradigm and the body image/eating disorders/depression aren't coming from video games and cartoons (the elements of style and fantasy nature of the mediums are enough of a disconnect that the character design isn't *presented* as an *expectation*). Rather, they are coming from children (like 14-16) modeling clothes for adult women. They are coming from the routine Photoshopping of models in magazines and on billboards. They are coming from manequins in the department stores that are never larger than a size 2 (unless you go to the plus size section). They are coming from bullies - and even garbage teachers - in school, and shit parents at home. They are coming from our titillation, sexualisation culture that is more about fetishizing the body than accepting it. And it's all constantly thrown in a girl's face pretty much from middle school on, with every magazine and program showing "live" examples of what girls are supposed to do, what they are expected to be, how they are expected to eat, how they ought to behave, and how they are expected to look, in order to fit into that ideal box of attractiveness as determined by American society. I can understand and even sympathise with the reasoning behind these redesigns. But honestly, the group is looking in the LEAST influential place possible with respect to females and body image.

 

[Akjosch]

If you think current body trends are acceptable, that these photoshops represent some sort of "normal" weight range in anything other than the statistical sense, you're so fucking wrong.

Even in the statistical sense, the "normal" weight range is at the median, not at the average. And the median in this case is quite a bit lower than the average, too.

Why the fuck is everyone talking about "average" in this thread anyway? What your mind registers as "typical" is the median. For the USA (data from 2003-2006), and the female 20-29 age range (which most of those women fall in, aside of Cortana which could look like a T-Rex if she wanted to, and Rikku who's 15), that would be 65.3 kg / 144.0 lb weight, 163 cm / 64.2 inches height, 24.4 BMI. For the US counterpart of Rikku, that would be 57.6 kg / 126.9 lb weight, 162 cm /63.8 inches height, 22.1 BMI.

Source: http://www.cdc.gov/nchs/data/nhsr/nhsr010.pdf

 

[Strazdas]

Maybe people should be encouraged to lose weight rather than making their fictional characters fatter.

Well, that's kind of related to the concern that the group has, that the ever presence of this kind of body image represents an unattainable ideal for the average person, the pursuit of which could result in the development of the eating disorders they provide information about.

Except that the image is attainable as proven by live action actor alternatives looking like that.

The whole comparison here is absolutely stupid. If you want to compare a mountain climber to average body image, compare it to average mountain climber, not someone that sits in office whole day and eats chocolate. The image presented is attainable and actually exists in people with same professions as depicted in the games (fighter, soldier, climber, ect). This charity would be much more useful if it actually taught people about how to loose weight without these eating disorders instead.

Some people say that that they look that way because they leave healthy lifestyles. If that were the case, they would have muscles instead of being built like toothpicks with a pair of grapes.

Do you watch olympics? Go, look at the female athletes there. do you see bulging muscles on them? no, you dont. because muscle strenght is not the same as muscle bulging. Openly visible muscles are for body builders. it does not represent actual strenght of the muscle. Also muscle tones are much less visible on females due to sexual dimorphism. Surely you dont suggest that videogame characters be steroid junkies?

 

[Zacharious-khan]

Here's an interesting thought. Are women "on average" are more likely to develop psychological disorders because of their depictions in video games. And does this make men superior because you never see them complaining about unrealistic body type depictions in video games.

Yes/No?

 

[Luminous_Umbra]

You know, we can talk day in and day out about what's an acceptable appearance, acceptable weight, etc, etc.

Or, instead of combating symptoms, we tackle the actual problem:

Get people to stop comparing themselves and others constantly to "ideal forms."

People want to lose weight? Fine. Gain weight? Fine. But there is such a thing as a healthy weight range and it's not going to be exactly the same for every last individual. Stop comparing yourself to others who most likely don't have the same healthy weight range as you.

 

[Maphysto]

Man yall sure got mad that some people photoshopped your waifus

 

[Smoketrail]

First and foremost its worth pointing out that this is reporting on something from "Bulemia.com" so of course the images have an "Axe to Grind" on the issue of body image and the media, that's literally the point of the organisation.

And frankly the fact that a lot of posters responses are instantly about obesity, thunder-thighs and the like seem to indicate that they have a point.

finally the claims that they are realistic deceptions of women who lead active lifestyles with physical jobs? yeah that's probably going to make them pretty muscular rather than bikini model thin.

 

[beastro]

This is why we can't have nice things

She's still hot.

 

[Erttheking]

Snip

Uh, I would like to point out that the main argument given in the article was "for an industry that prides itself on realism, they don't seem to have many realistic female characters" and "it's not a realistic standard to set". I'm not really sure where everyone in this thread is getting all this "eating like pigs" and "catering to every little fucking group" comes from. There's a middle ground between unrealistically skinny and fat for the love of god. "Want everyone to change except themselves" all right, point out in the article where that's even vaguely implied. They even flat said they don't condem the developers. Christ, re-reading the article it's the most lukewarm and inoffensive criticism I've seen on the subject mater. (Not sure why they bothered, people are still losing their shit over it.) You're not ranting. You're lashing out. Without any real provocation.

Oh, and creative design in mainstream gaming sucks a big fat one right now. Rant about fat acceptance all you want, that's not going away. As a rather chubby person who is trying to loose weight, the lack of variety in gaming is just booooooooooooriiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiing.

Oh...whining. That creative little word designed to dismiss anything you don't want to hear. Dismissing someone who has an eating disorder as whining is simply saying "I don't experience your plight, therefore I dismiss it". Same thing that people say about depression or autism. You're dismissing something because you haven't experienced it. "whining."

...I despise that word. It's a word designed specifically to shut people up.

 

[beastro]

Women do not look at Tifa from FF7 and decide to become bulemic.

They look at super models.. REAL people and decide they want to be like them.

In my experience with women from, pre-teens to the elderly, any societal view of weight has little to do with it and it more or less comes down to their own self-perception than anything. They're unhappy with themselves and their weight is something they focus on.

Along with cutting, starving themselves was a way most women I know found an outlet of control over their lives when they felt none only looking to an ideal when friends ad family asked for reasons why they wanted to so thin and they wanted to avoid bringing up how they were feeling deep down (Either out of lack of trust, fear that bad things would happen, not wanting to be an object of pity, or they had deep self-loathing and didn't feel they deserved help).

Two friends I know who were 120 and 106 (5'6'' and 4'10'' respectively) both wanted to get down to 90 and it didn't matter what anyone said, they wanted to do so because they felt at that weight they'd feel better about themselves, not because of some societal ideal.

In the latter case, as soon as she faced her depressive tendencies and got her OCD under control her concern about her weight vanished.

In minor cases this is "I feel/look fat" comes from and is just female for "I'm unhappy right now" and nothing you'll say will make them feel better, indeed, they're not looking for you to say anything and boost their mood, they're just stating how they feel, but it's the nucleus and the longer they feel down the more they'll focus on weight.

I'd wager it's the way the female mind generally turns to when down while the male mind generally starts dwelling on lack of accomplishments, only focusing on physique when a romantic prospect enters their life.

 

[NPC009]

Wait, what, Christie is anorexic because her ribs are somewhat visible when she bends backwards? Oh, good lord... depending on your fat distribution that may be perfectly normal. I weigh more then her (BMI of 21 in a country that considers a BMI of less than 18.5 problematic) and you can see mine if I pose like that. It's a bit like that 'thigh gap' thing, some people have the bone structure for it, others do not.

If there's anything wrong with half the original designs, it's that the girls don't have enough muscle and/or their boobs are unrealistically big.

 

[kasperbbs]

Average American might look like this, but these characters are not average people, and a lot of them are not even Americans. The only thing thats not right about them is that they don't enough muscle.

 

[CrimsonBlaze]

So I've read a few comments here and there, both from the article and this forum, and I will say that I initially agreed with what seems to be the consensus: female characters should be proportioned accordingly to fit their lifestyles, especially more acrobatic, agile, and fighting-fit characters.

However, as I finished this thought, I came to a realization: why exactly should their physical appearance reflect their prowess and capabilities?

Ladies and gentlemen, I present Exhibit A:

Spoiler: Mario from the Super Mario Bros. franchise

We all know Mario as an iconic video character. His design has been relatively consistent over the years, with minor changes here and there. But shouldn't Mario's appearance reflect his capabilities? After all, with Mario's height, weight, and built, he should not be capable to break bricks with his fists, effortlessly wield and swing a large sledgehammer, run fast enough to be aerodynamic, jump high in the air, and have amazing acrobatic capabilities.

If Mario were to be more 'accurately portrayed,' he would be taller, leaner, and have a great deal of muscle mass (specifically in his arms and legs).

As for those who feel that female fighters should have a physic that mirrors that of UFC fighters, I present Exhibit B:

Spoiler: Rufus from the Street Fighter franchise

While initially speculated to become another joke character like Dan, Rufus has come into his own as a credible and worthy addition to the Street Fighter roster. Granted, he's not the most agile fighter in the bunch, but it has been seen that he is no joke; especially since someone of his extremely exaggerated physic shouldn't be able to last two seconds in ring with other physically superior characters.

Take Dan, for example; speaking on his physic, he should be on a similar caliber as any of the other fighters with a background in martial arts. However, in the hands of unseasoned player, unfamiliar in Dan's fighting style, he quite literally is a joke.

So while I agree that the option exists to create characters in which their physic promptly reflects their capabilities and life style, it should not be the norm (especially when it comes to gender).

 

[Bat Vader]

Right. Let's cater to every fuckin' little group that doesn't want to take responsibility for themselves. "Eating disorder" my ass. Stop eating like pigs. I hate fat acceptance and other shit like that. Being fat is not healthy and I don't have to accept it. On top of that every culture has a certain beauty standard. And being fat simply isn't a beauty standard in the western world. Your precious hurt feelings are not gonna make that go away. You know what will? Physical fuckin' exercise and healthy eating habits. Why should the rest of the world have to change so that your fat ass can feel better? Get off the sofa and throw away that McDonald's for fuck sake. I'd really love to see a fat Lara Croft try to do what Lara does in the video games. What a fuckin' truckload of fat morons.

Sorry for the rant. But I've really had it with all of these idiotic groups that are too weak to take responsibility for themselves and want everybody else to change except them.

I'm fat. I know what fat looks like. Those revisions? They're fat. America, you're average is fat. You should count your calories and start doing some cardio.

Sincerely, a fat schlub trying to lose weight.

This guy gets it. He acknowledges the problem and he's working on solving it. I did so as well. I used to be an obese fuck in high school. Guess what? Now I look like Captain America. It's entirely possible. So quit whining about eating disorders. You can't use that excuse when the majority of the population look like walruses.

There are people out there who like being fat and gaining weight. Personally I find women that have some meat on their bones much more attractive than skinny women. Groups like that are going to continue to exist and getting mad about them won't solve anything. I just ignore them and go on my merry way.