"For privacy, Origin is the same as Steam" WRONG!!! -Updated

[Wicky_42]

...
Imagine I was looking through your window. I'm not gonna tell anyone else what you do, hell i'll just use it to get to know you better. Is it still ok with me looking through your window?

eh i see what your getting at but i still think it's different, i wouldn't give a fuck if someone wanted to see what kind of shit is in my car or room, but to physically COME to my house and look at it through the window? that's a bit creepy, but if it was just your average "show your rig/room!" stuff, which is comparable to the origin "peeking around", then i don't see what the problem is.

honestly i don't see what the information can be used badly for. hell maybe they find out that shit tons of people use "such and such companies video card!" so they make a deal next time with that company to sell upgraded versions of those cards (such as radeon 6770 to a 6790 or 6850) with a 5 dollar off coupon for EA's next big game. that's a score for me personally.

I don't understand - you wouldn't mind someone going through the stuff in your room, but you do mind if they look through the window? That's a little strange. Also, the "show your rig/desktop" thing? The point that OP was making is that even that is a voluntary thing - it's not as if you read a thread title and the forum steals your system info or screenshots your desktop and posts it online, you decide if you want to post such information, and you choose when and where. Choice is phenomenally important, and Origin holds your freedom to choose hostage with its restrictive games distribution.

On top of that, why the fuck does any corporation think it has the right to casually browse the contents of your computer? I'm not that happy with Steam doing it, but as far as I know they grab steam game useage info and the optional hardware survey. Origin's is wonderfully open - I believe they want to be able to help themselves to your browsing history, at least at one point. Fuck that.

 

[Wicky_42]

My Escapist profile is blank because I only made one out of necessity in order to post the very rare reply and whatnot.

United States
Miroku2235 for both Steam and Facebook, seeing a pattern?
Same as well for Aim, MSN, Yahoo, Trillian.

I got nothing to hide.

So what are your logins for those accounts? I mean, if you've got nothing to hide, you don't mind if random strangers browse through your emails or have a look at your messages on facebook, right? Don't worry, we won't sell the information to anyone [agreement liable to change at any time with 24 hours notice], and what could possibly go wrong with giving complete strangers with unknown and unknowable motives access to systems you use as part of your everyday life?

 

[Iron Criterion]

Personally I think that if someone goes through all the effort to run No-scripts, ad-blocks, javablocks, cookie untrackers, etc etc...then they do have something to hide, even if they claim the opposite. However that is just my opinion so take with a grain of salt.

What kind of stupid is this?

I run ad-blocks because... wait for it.. dramatic pause... I DON'T LIKE ADS! I've never bought anything from any internet ad, I've never found them in any way useful, and they often contain viruses. No scripts, same reason, a lot of dodgy pages contain scripts which try and jack your browser, cookies? Security, so websites can't keep me logged in etc, in case, y'know, my computer got stolen or something? Then anyone would have access to every single one of my accounts, e-mail, bank. Javablocking, same reason as adblock + anti-scripts.

You might want to drastically alter that sentence before The Moderators descend down with the ban-hammer. They don't like ad-blocks.

 

[Iron Criterion]

You might want to drastically alter that sentence before The Moderators descend down with the ban-hammer. They don't like ad-blocks.

To bad? My browser, if they want to ban my account because I don't want crappy ads with extra loading time, then I guess I'll just stop visiting The Escapist, I won't have what plugins I can and cannot have dictated to me.

Okay. I was just giving you some advice is all.

 

[ph0b0s123]

You might want to drastically alter that sentence before The Moderators descend down with the ban-hammer. They don't like ad-blocks.

To bad? My browser, if they want to ban my account because I don't want crappy ads with extra loading time, then I guess I'll just stop visiting The Escapist, I won't have what plugins I can and cannot have dictated to me.

Since I got a warning for this, it's not about having the Adblockers that's a problem it's disclosing it and advocating it. Obviously anyone here who uses them has Escapist in their white-list to help pay for the site. I did not know until the warning, but it's in the forum rules....

 

[Sandytimeman]

I like how fast people will sell out their own rights for something they don't really need. I agree with the OP this is setting a dangerous precedent. Just like the Patriot act set a dangerous one. Sure I don't have anything to hide, but does that mean I want some listening in on my phone? Or do I want someone rooting around in my computer without my permission.

Shit, personally I do have some details on my computer that would fuck me socially if they got out. For instance, I am openly gay on this forum and among a few select online friends. But IRL if it was ever discovered that I was gay I would lose my family, my job, my friends...I don't want a program digging up that kind of dirt even if they agree to not sell it.

So just because you can benefit in the short term doesn't mean you should give everyone in the future the opportunity to do so. Or whats that quote everyone is using "Those that would give up freedom for security deserve neither?" something to the effect of "Those that give up there freedom for momentary temporary pleasure deserve none?"

Idk, but I'm a firm believer of voting with my wallet when it comes to corporate policies. For instance I don't buy Dominios pizza because they funnel money into anti-gay organizations, so I go to their competitors like papa johns or pizza hut. I don't like Ubisoft's DRM so I don't buy Ubisoft. I don't like EA's Origin so I don't buy from it.

TL;DR Don't give up your long term rights for short term gains. And voting with your wallet is the responsible consumer thing to do.

 

[hermes]

You do know everyone is collecting the same data Origin does, don't you? The browser you are using? Collects and send all the hardware data you have to MS, Google or Apple. Google.com collects and sends all the hardware and navigation data it needs. Facebook? They collect all sorts of interesting data about you, your tastes, your relatives and your pet...

So, stop demonizing EA for collecting statistical and aggregation data about your GeForce or your version of Windows. If you are so concern about your privacy, I advice you to cut the Internet cable right now. Otherwise, I would advice you to live with the idea that you and your PC has little privacy and the best you can hope for is that companies will limit themselves to statistics and won't sell that info to telemarketing channels.

 

[kasperbbs]

EA has my system specs? Who the fuck cares? Seriously?

 

[ph0b0s123]

You do know everyone is collecting the same data Origin does, don't you? The browser you are using? Collects and send all the hardware data you have to MS, Google or Apple. Google.com collects and sends all the hardware and navigation data it needs. Facebook? They collect all sorts of interesting data about you, your tastes, your relatives and your pet...

So, stop demonizing EA for collecting statistical and aggregation data about your GeForce or your version of Windows. If you are so concern about your privacy, I advice you to cut the Internet cable right now. Otherwise, I would advice you to live with the idea that you and your PC has little privacy and the best you can hope for is that companies will limit themselves to statistics and won't sell that info to telemarketing channels.

You want to back up your accusations about browsers being the same as Origin in sending your software details to MS without your permission? As I think you are factually wrong. Also I use Firefox where they give you the option of whether you want to share those details or not.

And again with the Facebook, etc, false equivalently. No, Facebook does not root around your system to find out what software you are using. Everything you make public or share with Facebook is optional, you control it.

What Origin does with collecting software data and transmitting it to EA is new.

 

[Something Amyss]

one asks whether you want to share your hardware and software data, the other doesn't.

False, false, FALSE. Both collect data anyway, regardless. Only certain elements are optional, which I JUST SAID.

One asks you and does it anyway, one doesn't ask you and does it anyway. I think the pretense of the former is worse. But hey, paraphrase Aldous Huxley and sound the alarms. Maybe you could violate Godwin's Law, while you're at it. That way we can hit all the major "false alarm" buttons at the same time.

I agree with the OP this is setting a dangerous precedent. Just like the Patriot act set a dangerous one.

I'm sorry, that precedent has already been set. Not just by Valve corporation, which has a similar policy, but by dozens and dozens of other commonly used EULAs. If that's what you're worried about, that ship has sailed. That genie is out of the bottle. That gun has been fired.

Hell, courts have upheld the "you can't sue us" style of EULA. That's already been forgotten.

 

[Sandytimeman]

I agree with the OP this is setting a dangerous precedent. Just like the Patriot act set a dangerous one.

I'm sorry, that precedent has already been set. Not just by Valve corporation, which has a similar policy, but by dozens and dozens of other commonly used EULAs. If that's what you're worried about, that ship has sailed. That genie is out of the bottle. That gun has been fired.

Hell, courts have upheld the "you can't sue us" style of EULA. That's already been forgotten.

Last I checked I opted to not share my info with steam and was still enjoying its service. Try that with Origin...oh wait...

 

[ph0b0s123]

EA has my system specs? Who the fuck cares? Seriously?

No, they have what software you use, versions, modifications, no-CD patches, how often you use it, anything else they can potentially gather by rooting around. If it was just hardware details it may have not been such a big issue.

You will see people saying that the rooting around seems harmless at the moment, but now the precedent has been set there is nothing to stop them increasing how invasive the rooting around is. That no-CD patch, or game mod your are using on a EA game, EA don't like that, so ban, no more access to your paid for EA games anymore...

 

[ph0b0s123]

one asks whether you want to share your hardware and software data, the other doesn't.

False, false, FALSE. Both collect data anyway, regardless. Only certain elements are optional, which I JUST SAID.

One asks you and does it anyway, one doesn't ask you and does it anyway. I think the pretense of the former is worse.
-snip-

Prove it, or it's not true.

 

[Something Amyss]

Also I use Firefox where they give you the option of whether you want to share those details or not.

They do, however, collect personally identifiable information regardless of whether you opt-out. Funny, that.

Hell, Origin's EULA is geared towards non-personally identifiable identification. Where is the end of the world panic at Firefox? Oh, right, Origin is only a big deal because ponies.

 

[gmaverick019_v1legacy]

...
Imagine I was looking through your window. I'm not gonna tell anyone else what you do, hell i'll just use it to get to know you better. Is it still ok with me looking through your window?

eh i see what your getting at but i still think it's different, i wouldn't give a fuck if someone wanted to see what kind of shit is in my car or room, but to physically COME to my house and look at it through the window? that's a bit creepy, but if it was just your average "show your rig/room!" stuff, which is comparable to the origin "peeking around", then i don't see what the problem is.

honestly i don't see what the information can be used badly for. hell maybe they find out that shit tons of people use "such and such companies video card!" so they make a deal next time with that company to sell upgraded versions of those cards (such as radeon 6770 to a 6790 or 6850) with a 5 dollar off coupon for EA's next big game. that's a score for me personally.

I don't understand - you wouldn't mind someone going through the stuff in your room, but you do mind if they look through the window? That's a little strange. Also, the "show your rig/desktop" thing? The point that OP was making is that even that is a voluntary thing - it's not as if you read a thread title and the forum steals your system info or screenshots your desktop and posts it online, you decide if you want to post such information, and you choose when and where. Choice is phenomenally important, and Origin holds your freedom to choose hostage with its restrictive games distribution.

On top of that, why the fuck does any corporation think it has the right to casually browse the contents of your computer? I'm not that happy with Steam doing it, but as far as I know they grab steam game useage info and the optional hardware survey. Origin's is wonderfully open - I believe they want to be able to help themselves to your browsing history, at least at one point. Fuck that.

there is a difference between physically rummaging through my stuff and me taking a picture and saying "here you go, this is what my room looks like!", physical and digital comparisons are not going to be on par so that was as close as i could get with that type of argument. if it was mandatory on your computer i would definitely agree, but it is all right there as clear as day in the EULA, not to mention there are plenty of ways to disable/inhibit what origin does, hell it wouldn't surprise me if there are specific chrome/firefox extensions available that do just that. what are you looking up that you are SO WORRIED that origin would see? this is the internet after all, i am pretty sure they wouldn't be that shocked if they even DID look at that info.

 

[ph0b0s123]

Also I use Firefox where they give you the option of whether you want to share those details or not.

They do, however, collect personally identifiable information regardless of whether you opt-out. Funny, that.

Hell, Origin's EULA is geared towards non-personally identifiable identification. Where is the end of the world panic at Firefox? Oh, right, Origin is only a big deal because ponies.

Still waiting for some corroboration on that point. What is this personally identifiable information? And unless is all the software details of your system it is nowhere near as bad a Origin...

 

[Elate]

Since I got a warning for this, it's not about having the Adblockers that's a problem it's disclosing it and advocating it. Obviously anyone here who uses them has Escapist in their white-list to help pay for the site. I did not know until the warning, but it's in the forum rules....

Hmm that makes sense, still not changing my original post though since it was more a general statement on it, and ad-blockers aren't illegal or in anyway a criminal offense, so frankly I don't see why it is listed in the rules an example of one.

Okay. I was just giving you some advice is all.

Aye sorry, I hadn't eaten and was a bit snappish.

 

[Something Amyss]

Last I checked I opted to not share my info with steam and was still enjoying its service. Try that with Origin...oh wait...

Problem is, you can't ever completely opt-out. Read the privacy policy.

Prove it, or it's not true.

It's in the privacy policy. The one I doubt you've ever read. Also:

No, they have what software you use, versions, modifications, no-CD patches, how often you use it, anything else they can potentially gather by rooting around. If it was just hardware details it may have not been such a big issue.

Prove it or it's not true. The current EULA does not specify those things.

 

[Canadish]

I don't have the screenshot on this computer

It's funny, this is always case whenever someone has irrefutable proof of something. They just can't prove it right now.

I've noticed that happens alot as well.

Thankfully, this isn't one of those times where it was a load of BS.

 

[Sandytimeman]

Last I checked I opted to not share my info with steam and was still enjoying its service. Try that with Origin...oh wait...

Problem is, you can't ever completely opt-out. Read the privacy policy.

Prove it, or it's not true.

It's in the privacy policy. The one I doubt you've ever read. Also:

No, they have what software you use, versions, modifications, no-CD patches, how often you use it, anything else they can potentially gather by rooting around. If it was just hardware details it may have not been such a big issue.

Prove it or it's not true. The current EULA does not specify those things.

Taken from
http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2011/08/24/eas-origin-eula-proves-even-more-sinister/

The full clause reads,

2. Consent to Collection and Use of Data.

You agree that EA may collect, use, store and transmit technical and related information that identifies your computer (including the Internet Protocol Address), operating system, Application usage (including but not limited to successful installation and/or removal), software, software usage and peripheral hardware, that may be gathered periodically to facilitate the provision of software updates, dynamically served content, product support and other services to you, including online services. EA may also use this information combined with personal information for marketing purposes and to improve our products and services. We may also share that data with our third party service providers in a form that does not personally identify you. IF YOU DO NOT WANT EA TO COLLECT, USE, STORE, TRANSMIT OR DISPLAY THE DATA DESCRIBED IN THIS SECTION, PLEASE DO NOT INSTALL OR USE THE APPLICATION. This and all other data provided to EA and/or collected by EA in connection with your installation and use of this Application is collected, used, stored and transmitted in accordance with EA?s Privacy Policy located at www.ea.com. To the extent that anything in this section conflicts with the terms of EA?s Privacy Policy, the terms of the Privacy Policy shall control.

It?s not unusual for such software to collect information from your computer relating to itself, and it?s not unknown that using that software means you agree to this information being distributed anonymously to third parties. Steam, for instance, warns that it will,

?store information on a user?s hard drive that is used in conjunction with online play of Valve products. This includes a unique authorization key or CD-Key that is either entered by the user or downloaded automatically during product registration. This authorization key is used to identify a user as valid and allow access to Valve?s products. Information regarding Steam billing, your Steam account, your Internet connection and the Valve software installed on your computer are uploaded to the server in connection with your use of Steam and Valve software.?

But there?s a significant difference. Valve?s policy is self-restricted to anything on your PC directly relating to its own products. EA?s is so broad that it gives the publisher permission to scan your entire hard drive, and report back absolutely anything you may have installed, and indeed when you may use it, and then pass that information on the third parties.