Funny events in anti-woke world

Trunkage

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No, I didn't. The idea is that the 1619 project is not (mostly) an explicit attack on Trump, it's an attack on all of America. Some of the staffers wanted the Times to explicitly call him racist all the time, and the head honcho said that it's better to say the whole country is racist. If your country is founded purely in racism, then patriotism is racism, which is worse for a nationalist candidate like Trump than just simply calling him specifically racist. That's the idea.

It's not "an attack on Trump is an attack on America". Not at all. It's "an attack on America is bad for Trump, so let's do that instead."
You're conflating racism with hatred

Just need to find out where you stand here: Do you hate your racist grandpa/uncle (or whatever relative)?
 
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Hades

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It's funny how when Trump says some immigrants are good people, that somehow really means all immigrants are rapists,
That's not what Trump said though. He did not say some immigrants were good people. What Trump said is that the vast majority of immigrants are the worst people imaginable and that some might theoretically be good people but that he's not sure about it.

''They’re bringing drugs. They’re bringing crime. They’re rapists. And some, I assume, are good people”

All the negative descriptions are stated as certainties but that some of them might be good thinking is stated as a hypothetical, not a fact.

The key word in that imitation is "reporter". The news media suck, and they all deserve far worse mocking than even what Trump gave them. He mocked and insulted reporters, and why wouldn't he, when they were doing everything in their power to make him out as Hitler.
Hitler is as Hitler does. Ultimately Trump chose to run for office as an anti democratic, racist and completely out of control demagogue. That's not the media's fault. Trump chose to run on that platform for political gain. Trump could have styled himself after other breeds of politicians but he deliberately chose a style that has Hitler as its most famous practitioner.

Trump certainly is not like Hitler in the sense that he wants to commit genocide for fun or take over Europe. However Trump is simply not dissimilar to the Hitler that popped up during the waning days of the Weimar Republic.
 

tstorm823

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You're conflating racism with hatred

Just need to find out where you stand here: Do you hate your racist grandpa/uncle (or whatever relative)?
I don't have any particularly racist relatives to speak of. Your question does not follow from the preceding sentence in any way.
All the negative descriptions are stated as certainties but that some of them might be good thinking is stated as a hypothetical, not a fact.
That is how negative things work. Sort of the same but opposite of the squeaky wheel gets the grease, the criminal immigrant gets noticed. People don't tend to take notice when things work smoothly and without incident. On top of that, you can't prove someone isn't a criminal. If you witness a rape, you can say with absolute assurance the perpetrator is a rapist, but the inverse doesn't quite work. You can only assume non-criminal people exist unnoticed, not committing crimes. That's certainly a likely and reasonable assumption, but it is an assumption nonetheless.
 

Trunkage

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I don't have any particularly racist relatives to speak of. Your question does not follow from the preceding sentence in any way.
I'm specifically asking if you call someone racist, do you hate them?

Take a random plantation over before the civil war. You can call them racist. Does this make you hate them?

Anyway, while you are doing that, was this event the one you were talking about? It's the first thing I thought of when you were going on about the media hating America and whatnot



I just wanted to make sure, because we wouldn't want to mischaracterise or misinterpret a person or situation now.

Would we?
 

The Rogue Wolf

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From the "batshit crazy" files: Senator Chuck Grassley believes that the budget increase for the IRS will be spent on armed agents sent out to shoot small-business owners.


"Are they going to have a strike force that goes in with AK-15s already loaded, ready to shoot some small-business person in Iowa with these, because I think they're going after middle-class and small-business people, because basically they think that anyone who has passed-through income is a crook who isn't paying their fair share."

Yep. A Republican in high standing is declaring that the IRS is going to start shooting people. And he has this video prominently displayed on his website.

(And the AK-15 is a real rifle, Russia's newest military-issue assault rifle, though I sincerely doubt Grassley knew that and was instead simply confusing the AK-47 and the AR-15 together in his mind.)
 

TheMysteriousGX

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From the "batshit crazy" files: Senator Chuck Grassley believes that the budget increase for the IRS will be spent on armed agents sent out to shoot small-business owners.


"Are they going to have a strike force that goes in with AK-15s already loaded, ready to shoot some small-business person in Iowa with these, because I think they're going after middle-class and small-business people, because basically they think that anyone who has passed-through income is a crook who isn't paying their fair share."

Yep. A Republican in high standing is declaring that the IRS is going to start shooting people. And he has this video prominently displayed on his website.

(And the AK-15 is a real rifle, Russia's newest military-issue assault rifle, though I sincerely doubt Grassley knew that and was instead simply confusing the AK-47 and the AR-15 together in his mind.)
Anytime I hear right wing pundit whining about how the left wants everybody to live in fear I have to laugh.
 
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tstorm823

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Trunkage

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Gonna point at anything specific?
The NYT calls people and thing murderers, rapist, terrorist etc. all the time

But during this even calling what someone does racist, well... that's not on. We have to have a big meeting over it. You cant be mean... after just calling people murderers and terrorist

What utter stupidity. I cant imagine a better way to describe censorship to people than this. It would be like Charlie Hebo refusing to draw Mohammed just because Muslims got offended.

But you personally, pretending that calling someone racist is attack on America.

I just wanted to be sure the NYT didnt make another stupid mistake like this. They are prone to them
 

tstorm823

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The NYT calls people and thing murderers, rapist, terrorist etc. all the time

But during this even calling what someone does racist, well... that's not on. We have to have a big meeting over it. You cant be mean... after just calling people murderers and terrorist

What utter stupidity. I cant imagine a better way to describe censorship to people than this. It would be like Charlie Hebo refusing to draw Mohammed just because Muslims got offended.

But you personally, pretending that calling someone racist is attack on America.

I just wanted to be sure the NYT didnt make another stupid mistake like this. They are prone to them
You are reading that situation backwards. Nobody in that meeting was upset about calling Donald Trump racist. They were all upset that he wasn't called racist enough. They were trying to get the higher ups to put more accusations of racism in against Trump, and the guy running the meeting agreed about getting people to see Trump as racist, but tactically believed it more effective to get people to see racism in literally everything.

"Everything is racist... one reason we all signed off on the 1619 Project and made it so ambitious and expansive was to teach our readers to think a little bit more like that. Race in the next year—and I think this is, to be frank, what I would hope you come away from this discussion with—race in the next year is going to be a huge part of the American story."

One year after he said that, race riots were tearing apart most of America's major cities. I'm not saying the NYT are secret puppet masters pulling people's strings, those riots happened the way they did 95% because of covid. But Democrats were actively encouraging the riots, bailing out rioters and supporting them in public statements, because their strategy was "racial unrest beats Donald Trump at the ballot box". In a country were everyone sees everything as racist, Donald Trump loses the election, so that's the America they set out to make.
 

XsjadoBlayde

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When the FBI executed their search warrant on Mar-A-Lago on August 8th, QAnon was all over the news. Their first reaction was to declare the raid a final desperate act of a flailing and doomed ‘Deep State’ that is doing anything it can to prevent Donald Trump and the mythical ‘QTeam’ from being able to secure their victory in the battle between these two forces. One of the many contractions of QAnon is the belief that Trump, aided by Q, is always several steps ahead of his enemies and counters all of their efforts to defeat him with ease (Fig. 1). While regular people (insultingly called ‘normies’ by QAnon) would see the COVID pandemic followed by Trump losing the election and being unable to convince the courts of his claims of election fraud as signs that Trump’s enemies actually have the upper hand, QAnon remains convicted of their inevitable victory in a moment known as ‘The Great Awakening’.



Once it was clear that the raid signified the possibility that Trump could be in some legal jeopardy, QAnon quickly fell back to one of their favourite talking points – that Trump had successfully set a trap for his bungling enemies to fall into. If anything that looks like it benefits Trump’s enemies has happened, then their reality is that Trump allowed them to achieve this supposed victory only to turn the tables on them in the near future. For example, the 2018 mid-term elections which saw the Democrats win back control of the House of Representatives were a trap that would expose their election fraud; the COVID vaccine would backfire on the Deep State and the damage it would do to society would make people see that QAnon and Trump were right about everything; the trials of Flynn, Bannon, and countless others were merely traps the Deep State had unwittingly stepped into and soon they would find their schemes thwarted and turned against them. Q repeatedly employs the terms ‘year of the boomerang’ and ‘boomerang suicide’ to describe the Deep State’s attempts to defeat Trump backfiring on them and resulting in their destruction.


How this trap is sprung is another one of QAnon’s strange beliefs about how the world works. When Michael Flynn was under indictment for obstruction of justice charges, one of the things Q would repeatedly explain to his followers was a convoluted plan in which Flynn’s guilty plea and cooperation with the Mueller probe were going to lead to the undoing of the Deep State (Fig. 2). The theory as QAnon believes involves Flynn tricking Mueller into allowing him to testify on the record and bringing up all the crimes that the Deep State committed while under oath. This, in turn, would bring about the fall of the Deep State. The reality is that you can’t bring up unrelated crimes during testimony; any competent lawyer would object to such claims being made and the witness could end up being held in contempt of court if they refused to stay on topic. Here, QAnon believes the documents raided by the FBI contain evidence damaging to the Deep State and now that this evidence is officially in the government’s hands, it must be made public. When that happens, the Deep State’s corruption will be exposed for the world to see.



The next narrative QAnon fell back on was attacking the FBI. While this was something that mainstream Republicans were also promoting, QAnon took it to another level after the attack on an FBI field office in Cincinnati. While everyone else was condemning the attack by Ricky Shiffer, QAnon saw the attack in a different light. Throughout QAnon’s long history of violence, the movement has refused to come to terms with the fact that its extremist rhetoric and promises of brutal justice against its supposed enemies could ever lead to any real-world incidents. After the Cincinnati attack, QAnon promoters worked diligently to claim that the attack was a supposed ‘False Flag’ that the Deep State had set into motion to discredit their movement. They claim it was not the work of an honest anti-government radical who decided it was time to take matters into his own hands, but instead an act committed by anti-Trump forces seeking to paint Trump supporters as terrorists who need to be rounded up. The “glows” comment below (Fig. 3) is QAnon slang to insinuate that somebody works for the Feds.



The final QAnon talking point about the raid on Mar-A-Lago paints the idea of Trump being indicted for mishandling classified documents in a positive light. QAnon has an endless supply of portents that are supposed to herald when their victory arrives. While many of these events have names like ‘The Storm’ or ‘The Great Awakening’. This one is simply known as ‘The First Arrest’. Q decreed that the first major arrest made by QTeam would send shockwaves through the world and lead to a revolution as the masses learned the dark truth. QAnon spent years debating exactly who the person arrested would be; they speculated that it would be Hillary Clinton, or Barack Obama. Other options included former FBI Director James Comey or Dr Fauci. Now with this raid on Trump’s home, QAnon’s theories have done a U-turn – what if the first arrest wasn’t one of Trump’s enemies, but Trump himself (Fig. 4)?



This theory is based on the following chain of events: by arresting Trump, the Deep State will have overplayed their hand, therefore exposing its corruption to the public. The prosecution will then be condemned as unjust, leading to a large Republican turnout in the 2022 midterm elections in which they win back the House and the Senate. Once that’s achieved, Trump’s trap will spring into action during his trial, and the already-discredited FBI will be forced to admit they had fabricated the case against Trump and he will walk free. Trump will then win a landslide victory in the 2024 Presidential election, return to power and crush his enemies once and for all.

If you were hoping that the prospect of Trump facing criminal charges would dampen QAnon’s support for Trump, it’s clear that it has only further solidified their faith in the former President. It is unlikely that indictment, imprisonment, or even the death of Trump would break his grip on the movement. This is a movement that has splinter factions which believe JFK Jr. is still alive and will declare himself Trump’s 2024 Vice President. No matter what Trump’s fate may be, it is clear that QAnon will remain a part of American politics for years to come.
 
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The Rogue Wolf

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XsjadoBlayde

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I wasn't. Insanity is very resistant to reality, and every last member of this idiot movement is out of their minds and should be institutionalized.
Yeah, these kinda beliefs and grifty communities are going to carry on long after he's buggered off this mortal coil. Naturally starting to seriously wonder just how much the modern idea of Jesus actually matches with the real person if he did exist at all now.

-


Say it ain't so.
 
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Trunkage

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You are reading that situation backwards. Nobody in that meeting was upset about calling Donald Trump racist. They were all upset that he wasn't called racist enough. They were trying to get the higher ups to put more accusations of racism in against Trump, and the guy running the meeting agreed about getting people to see Trump as racist, but tactically believed it more effective to get people to see racism in literally everything.

"Everything is racist... one reason we all signed off on the 1619 Project and made it so ambitious and expansive was to teach our readers to think a little bit more like that. Race in the next year—and I think this is, to be frank, what I would hope you come away from this discussion with—race in the next year is going to be a huge part of the American story."

One year after he said that, race riots were tearing apart most of America's major cities. I'm not saying the NYT are secret puppet masters pulling people's strings, those riots happened the way they did 95% because of covid. But Democrats were actively encouraging the riots, bailing out rioters and supporting them in public statements, because their strategy was "racial unrest beats Donald Trump at the ballot box". In a country were everyone sees everything as racist, Donald Trump loses the election, so that's the America they set out to make.
You know that Trump using the term 'Wuhan/China virus' caused race based violence right? People heard what Trump said and just found random Asians to beat up. So as a newspaper how do you handle this?

Note: if you at all criticize what Trump said, that's race baiting. You don't have to use the word racist, just point out that Asian people are being attacked

It's why Bush spent an inordinate amount of time trying to not blame all Muslims for 911. Bush knew that speaking like this would just cause race based violence. Trump didn't have to call it Wuhan virus. Maybe he didn't intend for people to be attacked but at a certain stage he knew people were being attacked because he used that term. He did it anyway

But apparently, point this out this causing race riots....

It was already there. All NYT is doing is deciding how to report on it. (Note: this is me after I just criticize how poorly they dealt with the situation). Pretending racism is caused by the people using the term racist is HOW you get racism.

You aren't solving the problem. You're causing it
 

tstorm823

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You know that Trump using the term 'Wuhan/China virus' caused race based violence right?
No, I don't know that. The idea that naming a virus after the region or population that got hit the first or hardest incites violence against them doesn't make sense. "Those people got hit first by a once in a generation epidemic... let's beat 'em up" is not a thing. People like you introduce the idea of inciting violence. You aren't solving the problems, you are causing the problems.