Funny events in anti-woke world

Phoenixmgs

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I still don't see the alleged lie. Because even the most ''neutral'' reading can't get around the fact that the last two Republican presidents were Bush who started two disastrous wars, and Trump who's Donald Trump with both of them dangling around the bottom of presidential rankings. Nor can they get around the fact that Nixon had to resign in scandal.

Bad track record even with a most favorable of readings.
Trump didn't get us into any wars (how about that Biden and wars?). And, it's not like Obama reversed much of Bush's war on terror practices. Also, it's funny how you guys repeat "good people on both sides" but never repeat the sentence he said directly after that. Not that I like Trump in any way, nor do I like Biden in any way either, but tell the truth and be objective of their positives and negatives. Nixon was interesting in the sense that Watergate happened due to how paranoid he was (not really an inherent republican or democrat trait), there was no reason to have done it in the 1st place.
 

Hades

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Trump didn't get us into any wars (how about that Biden and wars?). And, it's not like Obama reversed much of Bush's war on terror practices. Also, it's funny how you guys repeat "good people on both sides" but never repeat the sentence he said directly after that. Not that I like Trump in any way, nor do I like Biden in any way either, but tell the truth and be objective of their positives and negatives. Nixon was interesting in the sense that Watergate happened due to how paranoid he was (not really an inherent republican or democrat trait), there was no reason to have done it in the 1st place.
Not starting a new war is not the only metric to judge a president. Especially if said president wasn't exactly doing much to make the world any safer. Even if we praise Trump for not starting new wars he still didn't end the old ones, he still stoked civil divisions well beyond the breaking point, still mishandled a pandemic, still routinely attacked democratic institutions, still got impeached for trying to blackmail his allies into intruding in the election and still tried doing a coup against his own country.

Now as for what Trump said directly after the whole both sides debacle ''You had people in that group. Excuse me, excuse me. I saw the same pictures as you did. You had people in that group that were there to protest the taking down of, to them, a very, very important statue and the renaming of a park from Robert E. Lee to another name."

That sentence after both sides changes very little. Firstly because protesting the removal of a statue honoring a literal traitor who fought to preserve slavery is already a little sus and secondly because the protest was called ''unite the right''. Not everyone there might have been a wacky facsist but the wacky fascist were the people the rest was coming to unite with. Being fine with their presence and coming to unite with them to honor a literal traitor is a little sus. Very little about it gives me an image of fine people.

Lastly as head of state you're a symbol of the nation. If someone on one side murders someone on the other then the head of state going ''uh but there were fine people on both side'' is simply not what the nation needs to hear at that point.

''The sentence after that'' simply doesn't change any of this.

As for Obama. He's not recognized as having been a bad president. I'm sure hardcore Republicans beg to differ but traditionally its simply not how he is seen. Most presidential rankings have him hover above mediocre unlike his direct predecessor and successor who both are around the bottom.
 
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Phoenixmgs

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Not starting a new war is not the only metric to judge a president. Especially if said president wasn't exactly doing much to make the world any safer. Even if we praise Trump for not starting new wars he still didn't end the old ones, he still stoked civil divisions well beyond the breaking point, still mishandled a pandemic, still routinely attacked democratic institutions, still got impeached for trying to blackmail his allies into intruding in the election and still tried doing a coup against his own country.

Now as for what Trump said directly after the whole both sides debacle ''You had people in that group. Excuse me, excuse me. I saw the same pictures as you did. You had people in that group that were there to protest the taking down of, to them, a very, very important statue and the renaming of a park from Robert E. Lee to another name."

That sentence after both sides changes very little. Firstly because protesting the removal of a statue honoring a literal traitor who fought to preserve slavery is already a little sus and secondly because the protest was called ''unite the right''. Not everyone there might have been a wacky facsist but the wacky fascist were the people the rest was coming to unite with. Being fine with their presence and coming to unite with them to honor a literal traitor is a little sus. Very little about it gives me an image of fine people.

Lastly as head of state you're a symbol of the nation. If someone on one side murders someone on the other then the head of state going ''uh but there were fine people on both side'' is simply not what the nation needs to hear at that point.

''The sentence after that'' simply doesn't change any of this.

As for Obama. He's not recognized as having been a bad president. I'm sure hardcore Republicans beg to differ but traditionally its simply not how he is seen. Most presidential rankings have him hover above mediocre unlike his direct predecessor and successor who both are around the bottom.
I didn't say Trump not starting a war made him a good president (I actively hate Trump). I'm saying you can't say republicans are pro-war and ignore how pro-war democrats are as well. How did Trump stoke civil divisions, that was the media. Literally people were crying when Trump got elected before he even did anything as President, how did Trump stoke civil divisions before he even did anything? Biden mishandled the pandemic more than Trump; Biden at least on 2 different occasions gave orders he knew were unconstitutional (as later got reversed because they were unconstitutional and he was told they were), the top 2 FDA directors resigned because of pressure from the Biden administration (if that happened under Trump, we wouldn't hear the end of it), mandating the vaccine (with literally no data supporting community benefit) didn't stoke civil divisions? And the Clinton campaign lying to the FBI about Russian collusion was democratic?

REPORTER: The neo-Nazis started this thing. They showed up in Charlottesville.

TRUMP: Excuse me, they didn’t put themselves down as neo-Nazis, and you had some very bad people in that group. But you also had people that were very fine people on both sides. You had people in that group – excuse me, excuse me. I saw the same pictures as you did. You had people in that group that were there to protest the taking down, of to them, a very, very important statue and the renaming of a park from Robert E. Lee to another name.

Reporter: "George Washington and Robert E. Lee are not the same."

Trump: "George Washington was a slave owner. Was George Washington a slave owner? So will George Washington now lose his status? Are we going to take down -- excuse me, are we going to take down statues to George Washington? How about Thomas Jefferson? What do you think of Thomas Jefferson? You like him?"

Reporter: "I do love Thomas Jefferson."

Trump: "Okay, good. Are we going to take down the statue? Because he was a major slave owner. Now, are we going to take down his statue?

"So you know what, it’s fine. You’re changing history. You’re changing culture. And you had people -- and I’m not talking about the neo-Nazis and the white nationalists -- because they should be condemned totally. But you had many people in that group other than neo-Nazis and white nationalists. Okay? And the press has treated them absolutely unfairly.
Trump said Nazis were very bad people (my bad, the sentence prior and a few sentences later). The "both sides" thing was Trump saying some people that want the statue to stay are good people along with people that want the statue gone. That, to you, is stoking civil divisions? You want it to be that and you made it that.
 

Hades

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I didn't say Trump not starting a war made him a good president (I actively hate Trump). I'm saying you can't say republicans are pro-war and ignore how pro-war democrats are as well. How did Trump stoke civil divisions, that was the media. Literally people were crying when Trump got elected before he even did anything as President, how did Trump stoke civil divisions before he even did anything? Biden mishandled the pandemic more than Trump; Biden at least on 2 different occasions gave orders he knew were unconstitutional (as later got reversed because they were unconstitutional and he was told they were), the top 2 FDA directors resigned because of pressure from the Biden administration (if that happened under Trump, we wouldn't hear the end of it), mandating the vaccine (with literally no data supporting community benefit) didn't stoke civil divisions? And the Clinton campaign lying to the FBI about Russian collusion was democratic?
Trump didn't magically pop into existence upon his first day as president. There was a campaign before he became president. And in that he behaved as the typical rogue demagogue. Putting groups against each other, completely demonizing opponents and made numerous implications, ''jokes'' or statements that he wasn't in any way going to honor democracy and that he'd go out to hurt those he didn't like. The media didn't force him to campaign that way, and they certainly didn't force him to govern that way. Trump is a willfully divisive politician and that cannot be argued with. Its his business model. Demagogues are not goofy politicians who are just bad at expressing themselves. They use fear and division as marketing tools.

People were downright on their knees praying in fright when Trump lost for far less reason and far less justification for any fear. Biden is after all infamously milktoast. One can at least sympathize with those that fear a man who's an objective threat to democracy coming to power even if you consider the action themselves overly dramatic. The people who feared Trump so much? They were completely correct. Everything they feared came to pass up to and including an attempt to take down American democracy.

Given Biden didn't underestimate covid and didn't try to convince people it was just the flue we can safely dismiss any statement that somehow it was Biden who screwed up with Covid. Doing your best to protect citizen during a pandemic doesn't stoke divisions and much as grifters who pretend it does, or president who go out of their way underestimating it because they just don't feel like dealing with it.
 
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Hades

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Because the posters above and below you also aren't responsible for starting any wars recently? So it's not really a metric to compare by?
As far as we know anyway. Vladimir could be lurking among us even now....
 

Terminal Blue

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Trump said Nazis were very bad people (my bad, the sentence prior and a few sentences later). The "both sides" thing was Trump saying some people that want the statue to stay are good people along with people that want the statue gone. That, to you, is stoking civil divisions? You want it to be that and you made it that.
I mean, if someone is at an event where people are openly chanting "gas the [slur], race war now" and isn't thinking to themselves "okay, I should leave and maybe rethink how I ended up here" I would say they are either not a good person, or an extremely, extremely stupid person, and it functionally doesn't matter which they are at that point.

Unite the Right was a massive failure for the far right. It was a huge mask off moment, and people really weren't ready for it. Ironically, it both divided the far right internally with various groups blaming each other for not being covert enough and pushed a lot of people who had assumed the neo-Nazi shit was just an edgy joke away from the far right.

Sure, they probably would have preferred it if Trump had stood up and said "hell yeah, white supremacy is tight" because they honestly seem to have thought that was going to happen, but what he did was still the next best thing for them, which is to play along with their cover story that this was just an innocent little grass roots local-led protest about statues and some mean old LARP Nazis showed up even though noone invited them. It wasn't. It was an explicitly neo-Nazi event organized by neo-Nazis to capitalize on a real political disagreement noone else wanted them involved in.

Basically, he did the absolute bare minimum he needed to do while leaving enough room for copium-huffing white supremacists to rationalize that he was actually on their side and protecting them. Many people justifiably felt that, given the context, it wasn't good enough.
 
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Phoenixmgs

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Trump didn't magically pop into existence upon his first day as president. There was a campaign before he became president. And in that he behaved as the typical rogue demagogue. Putting groups against each other, completely demonizing opponents and made numerous implications, ''jokes'' or statements that he wasn't in any way going to honor democracy and that he'd go out to hurt those he didn't like. The media didn't force him to campaign that way, and they certainly didn't force him to govern that way. Trump is a willfully divisive politician and that cannot be argued with. Its his business model. Demagogues are not goofy politicians who are just bad at expressing themselves. They use fear and division as marketing tools.

People were downright on their knees praying in fright when Trump lost for far less reason and far less justification for any fear. Biden is after all infamously milktoast. One can at least sympathize with those that fear a man who's an objective threat to democracy coming to power even if you consider the action themselves overly dramatic. The people who feared Trump so much? They were completely correct. Everything they feared came to pass up to and including an attempt to take down American democracy.

Given Biden didn't underestimate covid and didn't try to convince people it was just the flue we can safely dismiss any statement that somehow it was Biden who screwed up with Covid. Doing your best to protect citizen during a pandemic doesn't stoke divisions and much as grifters who pretend it does, or president who go out of their way underestimating it because they just don't feel like dealing with it.
Hilary didn't honor democracy either and said Trump was an illegitimate president after the election. And what about all the promises that democrats make during the election and never do? Again, Trump did not do anything (as he couldn't) and people were crying on election day. And what happened during Trumps presidency? Not much. Is the US now fascist or a dictatorship or are we back to before civil rights as far as racism goes? Nope. So what were people crying about then? They were riled up by the media in how horrible it would be if Trump became president. Both sides of the media do this, they act like every election everything will far apart if the other guy gets in, and the fact that US elections/campaigns last fucking forever, and just makes that division/hate even stronger.

Really, you actually think Jan 6th was a legit attempt to take down American democracy?

Trump did the project warp speed on the vaccine, and the vaccine is the only thing that significantly helps mitigate covid. But, Trump did nothing.

Trump wasn't the only one downplaying covid, the liberal media was as well. Here about the 3:00 mark, Rachel Maddow completely downplays covid while literally saying it has about a 2% fatality rate, does she not understand how devastating a 2% fatality rate would be? Same thing with Dr. Peter Hotez (not some media talking head but actual serious doctor that invents vaccines), famous for being super strick on people following the dumbest covid restrictions (yelling at people just this year for seeing Barbie and Oppenheimer), and was on The Daily Show around the same time as Maddow here saying you can see friends and family and stuff.

If you wanna criticize Trump for not following covid science, you also gotta criticize Biden who also has a horrible track record on following covid science. Why did he force vaccine mandates with no science supporting it? Why did he force boosters through with no science supporting them (for all people)? Why wasn't Biden for opening schools? Keeping kids home for 18 months straight was a massive tragedy that no other country did because the science was clear it was a massively stupid idea. I can tell you why, because Trump said to open schools and Trump can't possibly be right and the opposite must be done no matter what. Neither party is my team so I keep receipts on both of them. Lastly, closing schools massively hurt minority students disproportionately because private schools were open and all the kids of well-off families were still going to school the whole time. Hence, it was democratic covid policy that was very much against minorities, not republican policy, but the narrative is that republicans are the racist ones trying to keep minorities down.

I mean, if someone is at an event where people are openly chanting "gas the [slur], race war now" and isn't thinking to themselves "okay, I should leave and maybe rethink how I ended up here" I would say they are either not a good person, or an extremely, extremely stupid person, and it functionally doesn't matter which they are at that point.

Unite the Right was a massive failure for the far right. It was a huge mask off moment, and people really weren't ready for it. Ironically, it both divided the far right internally with various groups blaming each other for not being covert enough and pushed a lot of people who had assumed the neo-Nazi shit was just an edgy joke away from the far right.

Sure, they probably would have preferred it if Trump had stood up and said "hell yeah, white supremacy is tight" because they honestly seem to have thought that was going to happen, but what he did was still the next best thing for them, which is to play along with their cover story that this was just an innocent little grass roots local-led protest about statues and some mean old LARP Nazis showed up even though noone invited them. It wasn't. It was an explicitly neo-Nazi event organized by neo-Nazis to capitalize on a real political disagreement noone else wanted them involved in.

Basically, he did the absolute bare minimum he needed to do while leaving enough room for copium-huffing white supremacists to rationalize that he was actually on their side and protecting them. Many people justifiably felt that, given the context, it wasn't good enough.
Why is the far right so much worse than the far left? And this far right that's made of Nazis is actually a big enough percentage of the right to make actual Nazi shit happen? It's like being worried about the far left communists are gonna make America communist, it's not gonna happen. Why are you so worried about stuff that has no chance of happening?
 

Gergar12

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I was on the sub. it stopped being an alt-history sub, and every other post was black people suck, black people suck because of this statistic. The Youtuber is in the alt-right, but some of his content was good. Some. He did have left-wingers and centrists watching his videos; we watched them because it was a new perspective. But the sources were cherry-picked from before 1980, and a few people he agreed with.
 

Casual Shinji

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Why is the far right so much worse than the far left? And this far right that's made of Nazis is actually a big enough percentage of the right to make actual Nazi shit happen? It's like being worried about the far left communists are gonna make America communist, it's not gonna happen. Why are you so worried about stuff that has no chance of happening?
Well you know... books are being banned, being gay and trans is being banned, that whole reproductive rights being rolled back. I'm not expecting anything other than deflection in response to this and how 'actually the democrates', but yeah, thinking the far left and the far right are at all on equal footing in America is laughable.
 

Phoenixmgs

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Well you know... books are being banned, being gay and trans is being banned, that whole reproductive rights being rolled back. I'm not expecting anything other than deflection in response to this and how 'actually the democrates', but yeah, thinking the far left and the far right are at all on equal footing in America is laughable.
This is all lies; books aren't banned, gay/trans isn't banned, Roe v Wade was about right to privacy not reproductive rights (and that ruling was pretty dumb, which is why it was overturned). Why didn't the left actually codify reproductive rights? So they can continuously run on that platform. The left (and by left, I just mean democrats) was better for the last few decades. Recently I do find the left's blatant attacks on free speech to be more dangerous than Roe v Wade being overturned for example. I'm for reproductive rights but Roe v Wade was a shit ruling that didn't make legal sense. I think the right is slightly better right now as far as being beneficial for the average and minority American (again, SLIGHTLY) but both parties are shit and I don't understand why anyone votes for either party and defends either party. People completely don't understand how much power they actually have whether in politics or at work or anywhere. You guys be defending democrats like a kid defended Nintendo or PlayStation or Microsoft in the console wars, neither company cares about you, why are you so emotionally tied to any of them?

I don't know why anyone is bothering to engage with Phoenixmgs. He will just keep throwing arguments around until he gets what he wants: An apology from the rest of us for valuing our lives over his comfort.
What I want is everyone to realize how much actual power they have and to actually use it.
 

Casual Shinji

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This is all lies; books aren't banned, gay/trans isn't banned, Roe v Wade was about right to privacy not reproductive rights (and that ruling was pretty dumb, which is why it was overturned). Why didn't the left actually codify reproductive rights? So they can continuously run on that platform. The left (and by left, I just mean democrats) was better for the last few decades. Recently I do find the left's blatant attacks on free speech to be more dangerous than Roe v Wade being overturned for example. I'm for reproductive rights but Roe v Wade was a shit ruling that didn't make legal sense. I think the right is slightly better right now as far as being beneficial for the average and minority American (again, SLIGHTLY) but both parties are shit and I don't understand why anyone votes for either party and defends either party. People completely don't understand how much power they actually have whether in politics or at work or anywhere. You guys be defending democrats like a kid defended Nintendo or PlayStation or Microsoft in the console wars, neither company cares about you, why are you so emotionally tied to any of them?
And yet you can't help yourself but defend the republican party at every turn, Mr. Centrist.

Anyway, you're full of shit. Nothing else to say regarding anything you have to say.
 

Casual Shinji

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If you defend Roe v. Wade being overturned you can seriously go fuck yourself. Not aimed at anyone specific ofcourse, just casually mentioning it into the aether. Fuck you!
 
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tstorm823

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If you defend Roe v. Wade being overturned you can seriously go fuck yourself. Not aimed at anyone specific ofcourse, just casually mentioning it into the aether. Fuck you!
Roe v. Wade was insane regressive trash that grossly impeded societal progress for decades
 

TheMysteriousGX

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Due to the company who's simultaneously translating The Ancient Magnus Bride announcing they're going to use Machine Translation, the ol' "idiots getting mad at localization" topic has been flaring up and I had some thoughts beyond "most of these are slight rewordings, please find some actual problems to be mad at"

 
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Casual Shinji

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Due to the company who's simultaneously translating The Ancient Magnus Bride announcing they're going to use Machine Translation, the ol' "idiots getting mad at localization" topic has been flaring up and I had some thoughts beyond "most of these are slight rewordings, please find some actual problems to be mad at"

*plugs ears* 'La la la, I'm not listening. Japan is the anti-woke Promised Land, la la la.'
 
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