Gabe Newell thinks Windows 8 will be a catastrophe?

[oplinger]

I'm still using XP. And I'm still waiting for a valid reason to use anything else. Will there be any point to 8? Like does do anything XP doesn't that would justify the massive system hogging that would accompany it?

I'm wishing that I had stuck with XP like you have. At the time, I lambasted it for its failings... how little did I realize the horror that was to come. I dare anyone to try and get kotor 2 to work on windows 7.

...All I had to do was check some boxes, and it worked fine. Many things work on windows 7 with a little tweaking.

Also, XP won't be a supported OS in 2014, that's when I would suggest an upgrade from it. Right now all I can say is it's not getting any new features, and technology will march forever onward without it.

Also when this console generation is over, DX10/11 will be the norm. There won't be any need for DX9 anymore.

I like 7 though, once you know how to use it, it's nice.

I've been blissfully ignoring the hell out of 8 though, so I know nothing about it but the touchscreen UI that felt really silly. It doesn't seem to really....add anything.

 

[Nazulu]

Everyone is following Apple's suit: be as closed as possible.

Basically Apple is ruining / has ruined the PC industry, just like COD is ruining / has ruined the gaming industry.

Nah, I don't think COD is ruining the gaming industry when the game itself has a "hatebase" (like a negative fanbase), kinda like Rebecca Black.

CoD has a popular fanbase. The hate people are actually a rather small VOCAL MINORITY, fyi.

No, they're everywhere. I have no doubt more probably hate it now than like it. At least I see it everywhere.

Well, DX10+. Eventually, more games will require it.

That's my fear; at some point I'll be forced to switch :/

It might just be all the years I spent with shitty systems like 98 and ME (spit), but I'm reluctant to give up XP because I've used it for ages and it's always... worked, y'know?

Captcha: higgs boson. Maybe. In fact, quite probably.

Exactly the same here. XP just works with everything and has given me the least grief out of all the operating systems. I've used nearly all the others (including Mac and Linux) and for some reason I keep finding stupid designs and new problems that need to be quickly fixed.

 

[Vault101]

what did he say about the PS3?

 

[Signa]

Well, DX10+. Eventually, more games will require it.

That's my fear; at some point I'll be forced to switch :/

It might just be all the years I spent with shitty systems like 98 and ME (spit), but I'm reluctant to give up XP because I've used it for ages and it's always... worked, y'know?

Captcha: higgs boson. Maybe. In fact, quite probably.

As someone who didn't want to leave XP, let me tell you, make the jump to 7 while you can. I don't know how difficult it is to get older OSs (never tried), but I'm going to assume that Windows 8 is going to try very hard to replace their current iteration of perfection[footnote]yes, 7 does have flaws that still bug me, but it's good enough that I don't see myself leaving anytime soon. Not for 8 anyway, and not back to XP for sure.[/footnote].

EDIT: I should add that it does depend on your hardware. My PC is 3 years old, but installing XP on its newer hardware felt like installing 95-98 on my old machine. It might work, but it probably would be shooting myself in the foot in the long-run. Things like 64-bit are catching on big now, so since I had 6 gigs of ram installed, 32-bit XP wasn't an option.

 

[008Zulu_v1legacy]

7 is good enough for me, for now. But if 8 does come with an X360 emulator built in, then I could see swapping over.

 

[Idocreating]

From some quick googling, I get the impression Newell is simply afraid of competition from Microsoft.

Ho ho ho! Good one, love a good joke.

Microsoft couldn't compete with Steam even if Valve somehow managed to piss off every one of it's userbase. They've proven time and again that they're completely incompetant with the Games for Windows Live service.

GFWL has effectively killed any chance of Microsoft getting a leg up over Steam. Even if there was some kind of integrated Windows 8 marketplace, even with the Xbox Live integration, even if they actually understood pricing and sold games cheaply (Unlike EA's attempt) they still would not be able to get past the years of negative publicity of how they've handled PC gaming that no-one will want to switch from Steam.

Hell, even if they offered you your entire Steam library on the new service, you'd still have most sticking with Steam.

 

[evilneko]

Psst. There's a 64 bit version of XP too.

Oh right, it does. x.x

It's pretty terrible from what I've heard, though. The 64 bit version was less a fully supported operating system and more like a 64 bit experiment using XP as a platform.

As a user of XP64, I don't really see that as the case. There is some security software that supports 64 bit Vista and 7, but not XP64 (firewalls, mainly--your choices are limited to Outpost Free and Comodo, which is a no-brainer given how shitty a company Comodo is), however this kind of incompatibility is the minority case. Pretty much everything else is fine.

 

[FalloutJack]

Well it fits the pattern.

Windows releases go like this: Good (3.11), shit (95), good (98), shit (Me), good (XP), shit (Vista), good (7)...

What he said, really. Dunno why, but that's the case. The only people who ever managed to have a good and working ME system are people like Yours Truly, who are truly blessed.

 

[Denamic]

I dare anyone to try and get kotor 2 to work on windows 7.

Challenge accepted.
Challenge completed.
I played through it a few weeks ago on 7, had no problems.
Well, except the ye olde swoop racing bug, but that's not exclusive to 7.

 

[evilneko]

Well it fits the pattern.

Windows releases go like this: Good (3.11), shit (95), good (98), shit (Me), good (XP), shit (Vista), good (7)...

What he said, really. Dunno why, but that's the case. The only people who ever managed to have a good and working ME system are people like Yours Truly, who are truly blessed.

Except that it's not entirely accurate, and leaves out a few things. A more accurate descriptor would be first-release Windows operating systems tend to suck and generally get significant improvements later.

XP was a steaming turd that many, many people despised when it was released (I was one of them), but made significant gains with each service pack.
2000 was possibly the most stable Windows OS Microsoft ever made, particularly 2k Server. It was also never intended as a consumer OS, so of course anyone listing "Good" vs "Bad" Windows versions might leave it out.
ME never got a chance, it was superseded by XP fairly quickly.
98 sucked, 98SE not so much.
95 had a fair amount of problems, most fixed in OSR2.
3.x line was another exception. 3.x was pretty much shit all the way through. No, really, it was.

Somewhere in there are the NT OSes, but like 2000, these were never marketed for consumers.

 

[Epona]

So, link first, then my two cents:

http://arstechnica.com/gaming/2012/...8-catastrophe-driving-valve-to-embrace-linux/

The TL;DR version:

Basically Newell is saying that the way Microsoft is closing off the operating system will be disastrous for many OEMs, as well as for services like Steam. Also, this is a main reason why Valve has started embracing Linux.

Anyways, while Newell's remarks sound much like his ignorant words regarding the PS3 a few years ago, and I think he is exaggerating regarding what the OS's effect on the industry will be, I think he does have somewhat of a point. Microsoft has demonstrated that they have no fucking clue how to effectively compete in the digital distribution market. Their incompetence with XBLA, Games on Demand, and GFWL serve as proof of this. I don't think its beneath Microsoft to just close off the system completely and force everyone to use some sort of integrated GFWL in their next operating system. And before anyone accuses me of hating on Microsoft, I'm not saying it will definitely happen, I'm saying that it isn't an impossibility. Microsoft has fully demonstrated in the past (multiple times I might add) just how anti-consumer it can be, and once you get stung by those practices, it hard to forget it.

Well, I am running Steam and Origin on Windows 8.

 

[Zaik]

lol, they couldn't make GFWL work for shit, so they decided they'd prevent anyone else from competing?

That's cool, it's not like at least half of us didn't skip straight over the disaster that was vista, or just stick with xp to begin with.

By all means, pour more money down the toilet.

 

[Nazulu]

Sorry, but you're just wrong on this one. That doesn't mean any of your feelings are off or misplaced, it just means that the numbers speak decibels louder than your opinions. AKA the opinions of the masses mean more than the opinions of the minorities.

It's fine that you select few hate a game, it won't stop the rest of us from loving it.

I don't know what you think my stance is one the games but it's besides the point.

I'm literally talking about that everywhere I go, every single forum and where ever else, I see more put it down. In other words, I think the masses are against it, so I don't agree with you one bit.

 

[lacktheknack]

Still using XP here.

That being said, why should I care what Gabe (valve drone) has to say about anything?

Well, if you're not a Valve fan, then you shouldn't, and I'm not sure why you entered the thread.

OT:

Features such as Xbox LIVE integration could make the Windows Store and Windows 8 a more appealing platform for gamers and developers alike than Steam.

Because nothing is more appealing than more Live support!

Wait...

 

[Not G. Ivingname]

Well, that would make sense.

It also more likely he would have more information and more hands on experience than any of us. As a game developer, they more than likely sent valve some prototype so they can start making/porting games to the system. That's what they do with consoles, in any case.

 

[lacktheknack]

Everyone is following Apple's suit: be as closed as possible.

Basically Apple is ruining / has ruined the PC industry, just like COD is ruining / has ruined the gaming industry.

Nah, I don't think COD is ruining the gaming industry when the game itself has a "hatebase" (like a negative fanbase), kinda like Rebecca Black.

CoD has a popular fanbase. The hate people are actually a rather small VOCAL MINORITY, fyi.

No, they're everywhere. I have no doubt more probably hate it now than like it. At least I see it everywhere.

You hideously underestimate the amount of passing fans that just don't go around praising it.

Of my friends who play games, there's sixteen CoD fans and two dedicated haters (plus myself). I only know this because I actually asked them if they play CoD.

 

[viranimus]

Well after using the Dev preview.. I really do not see it. Its really hard for it to be a catastrophe when its basically just Windows 7 with gadgets removed and replaced with touch tiles that can easily be turned off and never seen again. Its hard to be a catastrophe when the hook of the OS will just become abandoned.. just like gadgets.


I mean I do get it. Microsoft is not consumer friendly. Neither is Apple, Neither is Sony, Neither is Valve or any large scale corporation. They do what they do to make money and protect what they have invested for better or worse. So in a consumerist society they are simply playing the game by its design. They only and should only be worried about what the customer thinks up till the point that they A: obtain a sale, and B: ensure a future sale.

If their practices become unacceptable, people will either force them to change with their wallet or move to satisfactory alternatives.

I REALLY hate having to put it so poorly, but dont hate the player, hate the game. Dont like the game, do something to change it.

 

[lacktheknack]

Still using XP here.

That being said, why should I care what Gabe (valve drone) has to say about anything?

Well, if you're not a Valve fan, then you shouldn't, and I'm not sure why you entered the thread.

Didn't you get the memo? Gabe is nothing but another goon for the company. There is no system of responsibility here. It's a fucking free for all with no one steering the boat. That's why they haven't made a real game for so many years. They can only try to update dated fps multiplayers trying to catch up with CoD. It's all they know, cuz they have no center.

I long for the days when Valve gave a shit about me.

I take it that you weren't a fan of Portal 2, Alien Swarm, or the new filmmaker.

 

[SnowyGamester]

I've already installed the Windows 8 release preview and from what I can tell it's nothing like that. It has optional integration with your live account that can save your Windows settings in the cloud, and there was an Xbox Live app in the new start menu but since I don't have an Xbox I right click->uninstall and it's completely gone. Other than that it is basically Windows 7 with a new start menu (which is basically like the homescreen on an android phone right down to the possibility of live gadgets and a shortcut to the full list of programs) and everything else still works the same as before, though there are a few additional features (mounting images natively is the bomb, closing off things my ass) and a different looking lock screen. Gaben needs to try it for himself before passing judgement.

 

[imagremlin]

I'm still using XP. And I'm still waiting for a valid reason to use anything else. Will there be any point to 8? Like does do anything XP doesn't that would justify the massive system hogging that would accompany it?

Not living in a security Swiss cheese perhaps?