Game Dev Claims Demos Hurt Game Sales

[Squilookle]

This is a load of bias horse crap, you can't just put out a 60 dollar game and expect people to buy it on blind freaking faith, especially when putting it out on PC where some devs don't give a rats ass and just drop an un-optimized pile of garbage out that you CAN'T RETURN.

Here's a thought, make a good game and don't worry about that demo scaring away potential customers. Or don't be scumbags and lie in your demo how the game will play. I was pretty set on buying Brutal Legend figuring it as a beat-em-up only to find out it was a RTS sort of game in disguise. Well that sorta made me not want to buy the game just out of anger of basically being LIED to.

Drop demos and you'll probably see rentals skyrocket and then these 4-5 hour games that cost $60 bucks be beat in one shot and returned to redbox or gamefly or whatever, or you know everyone will just pirate the game they don't feel like chancing.

Exactly. the article doesn't prove shit. Sure it may hurt sales, in the same way a lousy trailer may hurt sales of a movie. But it doesn't matter. You do it. Everyone used to do it and you're just lowering the standards of the whole industry if you don't. All these models just focus on individual games, but in my experience gaining customer trust proves to have far better long term effects on sales than trying to 'trick' the customers with every new game.

Long story short- Cut the crap and release demos. If you do them properly for a game that's done properly, then it can only be a good thing.

If a demo is enough to sate your curiosity enough that you don't want to play it more, it's not the demo that's the problem.

If the only people you can convince to buy your game are the ones who haven't experienced how it plays firsthand, your game may not be very good.

Pretty much, yeah.

 

[Epona]

Bad Demo to a good game = hurts sales
Any kind of demo for a bad game = hurts sales
Good demo to a good game = helps sales

I guess the idea is that they want to get you to part with your money BEFORE you know if the game sucks. That's what pre-orders are for too.

 

[Blachman201_v1legacy]

It just comes across as "Giving the people a sample of what our games are like? What are you, crazy?! Don't you know that will make it much harder to trick them into buying our substandard products?!!"

 

[Adam Jensen_v1legacy]

That depends on the game and the ability of the demo to show what the game is about. More often than not, a demo convinced me to buy the game. I know I couldn't wait to buy Just Cause 2 after I played the demo. Same thing with Mafia 2. Also, didn't that leaked demo of Deus Ex: HR boost sales? I think I read about that. These days I find myself refusing to buy the game if I don't know what I'm buying. And since I don't trust the reviewers, and everyone seem to be making mediocre shit and demanding more and more money for that shit, I'd say you're gonna have to start making a lot more demos to attract me as a potential buyer.

 

[Shjade]

I don't know where I'd fall on the statistical playing field of "average consumer," but I'll still say this: I've been sold by game demos far more often than I've been turned away by them. I could probably count games I decided not to buy because of their demo on one hand. More often I decide not to buy games because they don't have a demo and I'm borderline about the game's description (trailers mean nothing to me unless they're featuring gameplay heavily enough to really get a feel for what PLAYING the game is like as opposed to watching pretty cutscenes).

Heck, I often just want a demo of a PC game to check how well it runs on my rig before I risk buying something I can't actually play with higher than 5 FPS.

But again, I dunno if my relationship with demos is anything like the norm, so meh.

 

[WanderingFool]

I find that very interesting. I'm sure many of the comments here will be 'Well, then those games sucked anyway', but I think Schell has made an important point, especially with the EEDAR numbers on his side.

Games that focus on gameplay could very well be hurt by demos because...gameplay is gameplay. You play it, you've already experienced what it has to offer, and then that's it.

Games that focus on narrative don't lend themselves very well to demos because while a demo might peak your interest in the story, they'd likely be giving you information that is wholly out of context and therefore is non-sensible, or a spoiler- in which case, that would also hurt the game because it's ruining it's own focus.

It makes Purfect sense, but it doesnt really seem to matter. If a demo is able to make a person decide to not buy a game, than the game wasnt that much of a game anyways. Hell, thats the point of a demo, IMO. The demo is suppose to show you what the game has to offer, and to intice you to actually try the game. If you release a demo and people decide they dont want to play the game, its not becuase you released a demo, its because you made a baD demo.

Hell, you want to make money on you game? Make it worth the money. I mostly rent games because save for a few, most dont offer enough for me to spend a full $60 on.

 

[Canadamus Prime]

Or maybe by playing the demo gamers find out that your game is shit and then don't want to bother with the full version. Ever think of that? Of course not 'cause how could it ever be your fault. ¬_¬

 

[weirdee]

I remember hearing something about this, that out of 9 possible scenarios (made up with 3 levels of demo quality ad 3 levels of game quality) that only 2 out of those 9 possibilities will actually lead into increased sales (a terrible game with an amazing demo, and an okay game with an amazing demo) Every other combination either results in no noticeable increase or, in other cases, a decrease in sales.

And to be fair, I can't think of the last time that the demo alone made me want to buy a game. I either was going to get it anyways, in which case the demo just sates my appetite, or it actually turns me off wanting to get the game.

Well, these are both interesting arguments, but I'd bet that, at the very least, an amazing game with an amazing demo would also increase sales (by giving more people the opportunity to get hooked on it). I also suspect that an okay demo would increase sales for a terrible game. I don't know if an okay demo for an okay game would help or hurt; on the one hand, more possible exposure, but on the other hand, less hype. I'm not the sort of person that buys into hype, so for me I know which scenario is more probable, but I can't speak for the majority of my fellow citizens.

Still, upon reflection, both arguments seem to boil down to the advice "don't release a demo that's worse than your game".

the question is with "awesome game awesome demo" is that is it worth it to do the extra work for a demo compared to how many less sales a game will get if that game is good enough to become popular on its own? the only game i can come up with that worked like that is minecraft, and i'm still not really sure why it continues to sell even though you would think that by now it would have reached some sort of saturation point, even before the game became "officially a complete game".

 

[lacktheknack]

Sure, the numbers are on his side, but what were the numbers used?

(Maybe it's in the video but I don't have the time to check.)

All I know is that one of the best games this generation, Just Cause 2, was bought by me entirely because of its excellent demo.

I don't see why "trying the gameplay" would stop people from buying unless the game is awful. If it's gameplay-driven, the gameplay should justify the purchase. If it's story-driven, the hook you leave should justify the purchase.

 

[Kotaro]

In my personal experience, I actually find that I'm more likely to purchase a game if it has a good demo. Two examples immediately spring to mind:
I saw Sleeping Dogs discounted on Steam, and remembered that a friend of mine had recommended it. So I played the demo, which got me to buy the game. If I hadn't been able to play the demo, I probably wouldn't have bought it.
When I first read about Bayonetta, I wasn't too interested. Yeah, I'm a big fan of the genre, but the whole "over-the-top sex appeal" rather turned me off of the game. Until I played a demo of the game at a convention, which I had so much fun with that I immediately preordered the game as soon as I got home.

 

[Happiness Assassin]

I have never been convinced by a demo to buy a game, but I have been convinced by a demo to not buy a game. If it fails to impress me in what is essentially a highlight, then it really can only go downhill from that point on. But there really isn't a way to gauge if a game that has a great demo can hold up across a whole playthrough, so I turn to other more reliable sources. Just my two cents.

Also Extra Credits did an episode on this a while back: http://www.penny-arcade.com/patv/episode/demo-daze [http://www.penny-arcade.com/patv/episode/demo-daze]

 

[EHKOS]

I've bought a few indie games just because of the demos. Dungeon Defenders is the only one I can think of where the demo made me not want to buy it. Well, and Heavy Rain, but Heavy Rain already looked like crap and I just played the demo to make sure it was crap.

Yeah, I remember I used to buy Playstation Magazine for the PSUnderground discs. And I bought some games because of the demos. Once even a rare Japanese import. I miss Jampaks.

OT: It's prolly because the game sucks, or wasn't what the player was expecting. I know I've had both experiences, both good and bad. For instance, I could finally decide whether I should buy Ni No Kuni if I had a demo for it :/

I really miss PS Underground.

 

[The Rogue Wolf]

Well, I do have to grant him his point- I would never have preordered Brink if there had been a demo for it.

Though I'll never, ever buy another Splash Damage title again, because Brink was dog shit on ice. So he's right, they got that sale from me thanks to not having a demo- they just won't ever get another.

 

[RandV80]

I don't know where I'd fall on the statistical playing field of "average consumer," but I'll still say this: I've been sold by game demos far more often than I've been turned away by them. I could probably count games I decided not to buy because of their demo on one hand. More often I decide not to buy games because they don't have a demo and I'm borderline about the game's description (trailers mean nothing to me unless they're featuring gameplay heavily enough to really get a feel for what PLAYING the game is like as opposed to watching pretty cutscenes).

Heck, I often just want a demo of a PC game to check how well it runs on my rig before I risk buying something I can't actually play with higher than 5 FPS.

But again, I dunno if my relationship with demos is anything like the norm, so meh.

Pretty much the same here, though my taste in gaming tends to be a little more obscure as I usually like turn based strategies or RPG's with a more old school flavour. If it falls under one of these category I'm perfectly fine playing a 7/10 game, but they never come with the same amount of hype or press a more mainstream game does so it's good to have a demo to try out. One concept that's completely foreign to me here is that the demo could give me enough of a fill that I wouldn't care to buy the main game.

But at the same time while I may buy a game after playing the demo I don't necessarily always use a demo before buying the game. While I appreciate when a developer gives me one I can't honestly say from my perspective if it's really that beneficial to them or not. In some cases yes, but others not really.

 

[Bad Jim]

I'm pretty certain that adding a demo only hurts your game if your game sucks.

Two points

1) They've got empirical data. You can spout theory all you like, but the real world data says otherwise.

2) Whether a game or demo is good or not is highly subjective. No matter how good a demo is, some people will decide the game is not for them.

 

[Vegosiux]

1) They've got empirical data. You can spout theory all you like, but the real world data says otherwise.

2) Whether a game or demo is good or not is highly subjective. No matter how good a demo is, some people will decide the game is not for them.

Well, not that I care, let people waste their money on substandard products if they want to, but the moment I get blamed for not buying a game because the demo relayed it was not a good purchase is the moment I say "Hey you devs, why the fuck are you feeling so entitled to my money? SCREW YOU!"

Empirical data only suggests that people are idiots who will buy anything without thinking.

 

[Epona]

I'm pretty certain that adding a demo only hurts your game if your game sucks.

Two points

1) They've got empirical data. You can spout theory all you like, but the real world data says otherwise.

2) Whether a game or demo is good or not is highly subjective. No matter how good a demo is, some people will decide the game is not for them.

Who's to say their data isn't cherry picked? Like AAA games that don't need demos and sell out of pre-orders compared to lesser known games that do need to demos to raise awareness.

As for me, it was the demo that convinced me to buy Fire Emblem Awakening. I had a FE game on the DS but didn't like it. If there hadn't been a demo for this one, I wouldn't have even considered it.

 

[Nazulu]

I use demo's so I can find out what the game play will be roughly like. If it's terrible, then you don't deserve to make money. However, I believe you should research before you buy. Even if I didn't like the demo, I still wait for more info, and I'm sure many others do as well, and then spread the popularity.

Does he really have the numbers? Starcraft had a 4 level demo and I fell in love with it. We all know that one sold a lot. What's the difference with new demo's?

 

[Bad Jim]

Who's to say their data isn't cherry picked?

This is data that AAA companies are basing business decisions on. So they probably hired a few statisticians to double check it and make sure it wasn't BS before they started acting on it.

Like AAA games that don't need demos and sell out of pre-orders compared to lesser known games that do need to demos to raise awareness.

Well that's what the guy said. A demo is better than nothing, but it hurts sales if you have a big marketing campaign. But he is of course discussing AAA games, which need the marketing campaign.

 

[Vykrel]

...maybe if the demo was actually fun, people would buy the game.

there are plenty of demos that convinced me to buy the games. a good example would be the demo for Red Faction: Guerrilla. they chose the perfect part to put in the demo, and i think it is safe to say that a lot of people bought the game because of how fun the demo was. i know i did.

other demos that convinced me to buy a game: Bulletstorm, Rayman Origins, FEAR 2, Splinter Cell: Conviction, Just Cause 2, Split/Second, Dante's Inferno, and some others.

demos are a big factor in convincing people to buy games. its up to the developers to not release a shitty demo that will turn them off of the game.