Gena Davis institute on Gender in media tries to link violent games to mass shootings and police violence

Silvanus

Elite Member
Legacy
Apr 26, 2020
6,258
1,890
118
Country
United Kingdom
Well they didn't tell any stories even inspired by them. Unless it's the same way "Armed and Dangerous" on Xbox was "Based on a true story" lol
This is a value judgement on your part. Things don't need to even be closely related in order to be "inspired by" them. The Last of Us is "inspired by" Night of the Living Dead. The Will Smith version of I Am Legend is "inspired by" Matheson's novel.


Why not people have happily taken everything other have said absolutely literally online for their own ends. What was the phrase "Context doesn't matter it's still offensive and should be changed." Where the only way it said things were coming off badly was without context? Sorry but Moviebobs side doesn't get to play that kind of card then pretend when they say stuff context matters without it looking hugely hypocritical
So... you want to simultaneously complain about thus behaviour but also indulge in it yourself? So, hypocrisy then.


What if I'm doing it to show how bad doing it is to people who were doing it because they don't seem to learn any other way?
...but you're in this thread using it against people who never did it themselves. You're justifying it by pointing at people on other sites who have nothing to do with anyone here.

Which serious allegation was that?
Sorry you accuse me of so much I tend to forget what villainy I'm supposed to have done this week
Endlessly accused me and others of condoning harassment and abuse, which was a lie.
 

Dwarvenhobble

Is on the Gin
May 26, 2020
4,369
483
88
This is a value judgement on your part. Things don't need to even be closely related in order to be "inspired by" them. The Last of Us is "inspired by" Night of the Living Dead. The Will Smith version of I Am Legend is "inspired by" Matheson's novel.
Well as there's only 1 mission with women in it in BFV's campaign and it's a mother and daughter one that has nothing people can say it was inspired by in terms of the characters but the mission was inspired by an all male commando unit's actions it does come off as exceptionally hollow.

Where's some mission as some of the female middle eastern fighters?
Where's the mission about a Russian woman sniper?
How about one about a Female bomber crew?
Or Women spies?
How about French Resistance fighter?
Or the Women who bought a Tank to go avenge her husband.

Nope none of such stories apparently inspired anything.


So... you want to simultaneously complain about thus behaviour but also indulge in it yourself? So, hypocrisy then.
I acknowledge it's bad and use it to prove to others why it's bad and hopefully cause some introspection. Because plenty of people on about how it's not bad aren't willing to listen as to why it's bad and have to learn other ways.


...but you're in this thread using it against people who never did it themselves. You're justifying it by pointing at people on other sites who have nothing to do with anyone here.
Then maybe they can have words with people on their side and clean up a bit because I got thrown in the proverbial pit for standing against the stuff when it was coming.

Endlessly accused me and others of condoning harassment and abuse, which was a lie.
And yet people were far more busy yelling about how outraged they were than to do the simple thing of saying said stuff was bad and actually clarifying their positions....... funny how that goes.
 

Silvanus

Elite Member
Legacy
Apr 26, 2020
6,258
1,890
118
Country
United Kingdom
Well as there's only 1 mission with women in it in BFV's campaign and it's a mother and daughter one that has nothing people can say it was inspired by in terms of the characters but the mission was inspired by an all male commando unit's actions it does come off as exceptionally hollow.

Where's some mission as some of the female middle eastern fighters?
Where's the mission about a Russian woman sniper?
How about one about a Female bomber crew?
Or Women spies?
How about French Resistance fighter?
Or the Women who bought a Tank to go avenge her husband.

Nope none of such stories apparently inspired anything.
To be frank, I don't give a toss why you think it wasn't inspired by XYZ. "Inspired by" is a vague term you find in promotional material for countless films and games with very little direct connection to their supposed inspiration. Hell, this criticism equally applies to the male characters in the same COD game. The only reason you're moaning about it is that it's a woman.


I acknowledge it's bad and use it to prove to others why it's bad and hopefully cause some introspection. Because plenty of people on about how it's not bad aren't willing to listen as to why it's bad and have to learn other ways.
But you use it against people who never did it.

This is a bullshit justification, and you're just as bad as the people you're decrying.


Then maybe they can have words with people on their side and clean up a bit because I got thrown in the proverbial pit for standing against the stuff when it was coming.
"Have words with"...? Do you genuinely think all online left-wingers all know each other, even on different sites? That we all talk to each other? Utter craziness.

Shall I ask you to "have words with" the right wingers who moan about gay marriage on Yahoo Answers? You all know each other, right?
 

Revnak

We must imagine Sisyphus horny
Legacy
May 25, 2020
2,944
3,097
118
Country
USA
You are grown adults who still think the government is coming for your video games and that it would even fucking matter if they did. You all have rent to pay and think this matters.
 

Dwarvenhobble

Is on the Gin
May 26, 2020
4,369
483
88
To be frank, I don't give a toss why you think it wasn't inspired by XYZ. "Inspired by" is a vague term you find in promotional material for countless films and games with very little direct connection to their supposed inspiration. Hell, this criticism equally applies to the male characters in the same COD game. The only reason you're moaning about it is that it's a woman.
...... and because they specifically claimed that and because the male war stories can be more easily connected pretty directly to events that happened. Also because part of the argument being pushed round BFV was how people clearly failed history and it would show them by showing real stories of real women who fought in WWII



But you use it against people who never did it.

This is a bullshit justification, and you're just as bad as the people you're decrying.
That's you opinion. Also as I already explained the difference is in knowing it's not a nice move to pull. Also not having gone through every post everyone has ever made they may have happily done it


"Have words with"...? Do you genuinely think all online left-wingers all know each other, even on different sites? That we all talk to each other? Utter craziness.
No, though you can happily try can't you?

Shall I ask you to "have words with" the right wingers who moan about gay marriage on Yahoo Answers? You all know each other, right?
As I've said before I'm not right wing so don't think it would do much lol.
 

Dwarvenhobble

Is on the Gin
May 26, 2020
4,369
483
88
You are grown adults who still think the government is coming for your video games and that it would even fucking matter if they did. You all have rent to pay and think this matters.
So do I file you in the camp of "Art doesn't matter" Revank?
 

Dreiko

Elite Member
Legacy
May 1, 2020
1,800
575
118
CT
Country
usa
Gender
male, pronouns: your majesty/my lord/daddy
You are grown adults who still think the government is coming for your video games and that it would even fucking matter if they did. You all have rent to pay and think this matters.
The government is more than eager to blame all sorts of things to video games as opposed to the real cause, things like gun violence. While it won't "take the videogames away", it still scapegoats them and also doesn't even fix the problem it purports to be concerned about.


If you're really concerned about sexism in all of its facets, and base your concern on a degree of severity, thereby devoting your resources on the things most in need of salvation, to focus on videogames is patently absurd and can only be interpreted as an effort to scapegoat them. It's both inaccurate and it also doesn't solve the problem people pretend to want solved.


There's this weird thing where if videogames are not being literally illegalized it is somehow spoken of as though it is illegitimate for fans of them to be dismayed that they're being unfairly maligned. As if it's normal for that to happen and we as their fans should just accept it. This is why a lot of people question folks' credentials, cause they act like they don't actually care about games at all, only caring about the things that games are negatively impacting on any given day.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Dwarvenhobble

Revnak

We must imagine Sisyphus horny
Legacy
May 25, 2020
2,944
3,097
118
Country
USA
The government is more than eager to blame all sorts of things to video games as opposed to the real cause, things like gun violence. While it won't "take the videogames away", it still scapegoats them and also doesn't even fix the problem it purports to be concerned about.


If you're really concerned about sexism in all of its facets, and base your concern on a degree of severity, thereby devoting your resources on the things most in need of salvation, to focus on videogames is patently absurd and can only be interpreted as an effort to scapegoat them. It's both inaccurate and it also doesn't solve the problem people pretend to want solved.


There's this weird thing where if videogames are not being literally illegalized it is somehow spoken of as though it is illegitimate for fans of them to be dismayed that they're being unfairly maligned. As if it's normal for that to happen and we as their fans should just accept it. This is why a lot of people question folks' credentials, cause they act like they don't actually care about games at all, only caring about the things that games are negatively impacting on any given day.
We have been having this exact argument since before either of us were born. There still is zero US government oversight of video game sales, and of those countries where there is oversight it’s more of an arbitrary occasional frustration of less concern than poor internet service and bullfrogs.
 
  • Like
Reactions: MrCalavera

Dreiko

Elite Member
Legacy
May 1, 2020
1,800
575
118
CT
Country
usa
Gender
male, pronouns: your majesty/my lord/daddy
We have been having this exact argument since before either of us were born. There still is zero US government oversight of video game sales, and of those countries where there is oversight it’s more of an arbitrary occasional frustration of less concern than poor internet service and bullfrogs.
Yeah so like I said, that needn't be the barometer for whether one is being absurd and blaming things on videogames unjustly and in so doing smearing the fans of those games. We have a right to defend our hobby from unfair smears. Even if they are purported to be done for the sake of feminism or what have you.
 

Revnak

We must imagine Sisyphus horny
Legacy
May 25, 2020
2,944
3,097
118
Country
USA
Yeah so like I said, that needn't be the barometer for whether one is being absurd and blaming things on videogames unjustly and in so doing smearing the fans of those games. We have a right to defend our hobby from unfair smears. Even if they are purported to be done for the sake of feminism or what have you.
Why spend so much time on a subject that matters so little when you can just not? And nothing different will happen? What has all this over-defensiveness and unjust blaming accomplished aside from wasting everyone’s fucking time? Literally just play your damn games.
So do I file you in the camp of "Art doesn't matter" Revank?
Arguing about art censorship doesn’t matter because the only censoring that will ever matter will always occur without you even thinking it’s happening.

Edit: I also generally don’t care about continuing this second line of argument because it’s going to be a bunch of dumb “here’s why my shit’s ok actually and I’m not a hypocrite” from both sides until we’re both too bored so I’ll skip that. Please go do something more valuable with your life than getting upset about what some grad student said about anything, nobody listens to grad students anywhere.
 
Last edited:

Dwarvenhobble

Is on the Gin
May 26, 2020
4,369
483
88
Why spend so much time on a subject that matters so little when you can just not? And nothing different will happen? What has all this over-defensiveness and unjust blaming accomplished aside from wasting everyone’s fucking time? Literally just play your damn games.

Arguing about art censorship doesn’t matter because the only censoring that will ever matter will always occur without you even thinking it’s happening.

Edit: I also generally don’t care about continuing this second line of argument because it’s going to be a bunch of dumb “here’s why my shit’s ok actually and I’m not a hypocrite” from both sides until we’re both too bored so I’ll skip that. Please go do something more valuable with your life than getting upset about what some grad student said about anything, nobody listens to grad students anywhere.
*Looks at China*

You sure it's not going to matter and people won't notice?
 

Dreiko

Elite Member
Legacy
May 1, 2020
1,800
575
118
CT
Country
usa
Gender
male, pronouns: your majesty/my lord/daddy
Why spend so much time on a subject that matters so little when you can just not? And nothing different will happen? What has all this over-defensiveness and unjust blaming accomplished aside from wasting everyone’s fucking time? Literally just play your damn games.

I don't spend much time at all, when I posted that comment yesterday I had already done about 12 hours of baldurs gate, cooked dinner and listened to a full album of Galneryus (Under the force of Courage) while reading stuff about the fighting game I'm most competitive at for this time. It was a tiny part of my very productive day. I also type pretty fast too, and these arguments are very easy to refute so if anything not doing so is more of an annoyance because it'd smear something I literally spent most of my day enthralled and totally satisfied by.
 

Cicada 5

Elite Member
May 1, 2020
1,262
183
68
Country
Nigeria
It goes to show how fully stupid and idiotic these people truly are. Just because they're stupid does not stopping for me terrible people. They're a whole bunch of one of these smart guys that think they know everything, but they don't know crap as you said. While I do love Ghost of Tsushima, they're only using that game just to rally behind something. The moment it becomes useful no longer, those parasitic leeches or latch on us something else. I I do dislike TLOUS2. If only because it's just another grim and gritty, revenge story that thinks it's saying something, but it's not saying anything. It's a game stuck in the seventh generation of gaming where everything has to be dark and gritty for the sake of it and mean spirited. Ironic, because Ghost has revenge as a theme for some of the subplots and the actual main story that's woven into the narrows. That game does it better there than TLOUS2. Otherwise, neither of the games should be compared to each other.

Then there's getting into the fact, that somebody's saying butt-holes complain about the politics in Miles Morales and claim that such "dangerous politics" or even mentioning of Black Lives Matter should not exist in video gaming. I find it funny that it's all sudden dangerous when it involves black people, women, or any people of color, or someone of a non-Christian religion. Thankfully, those people were called out on, and most people had no problem with the politics. It in the previous Spider-Man game have plenty of politics; especially the latest game.
I'm reminded of how Wonder Woman got the usual accusations of misandry (despite having no less than three heroic and sympathetic male characters) only to suddenly become "representation done right" in the eyes of people who hated Captain Marvel because of Bree Larson.
 
  • Like
Reactions: BrawlMan

BrawlMan

Lover of beat'em ups.
Legacy
Apr 3, 2020
10,972
3,668
118
Detroit, Michigan
Country
United States of America
Gender
Male
I'm reminded of how Wonder Woman got the usual accusations of misandry (despite having no less than three heroic and sympathetic male characters) only to suddenly become "representation done right" in the eyes of people who hated Captain Marvel because of Bree Larson.
The cycle repeats. The same thing happened with Battle Angel, where all these yahoo's and jackasses were praising it only just to bring down the Captain Marvel movie. CM did fine, but all these drama queens on Twitter and YouTube try to act as a crap the Marvel was a failure. Even though Alita didn't do all the box office, they tried to make it seem like it was Captain Marvel's fault that the movie didn't do well despite the fact that there wasn't a lot of marketing for it. Now that Disney bought Fox, they want nothing to do with it and just have to sit there. For the record, I'm a big Alita fan, and while I didn't care for captain marvel, I didn't want to see two movies competing against or destroy each other like that. Because no one was asking for it, except for the sexist dick wads themselves.
 

CriticalGaming

Elite Member
Legacy
Apr 3, 2020
6,217
1,653
118
The cycle repeats. The same thing happened with Battle Angel, where all these yahoo's and jackasses were praising it only just to bring down the Captain Marvel movie. CM did fine, but all these drama queens on Twitter and YouTube try to act as a crap the Marvel was a failure. Even though Alita didn't do all the box office, they tried to make it seem like it was Captain Marvel's fault that the movie didn't do well despite the fact that there wasn't a lot of marketing for it. Now that Disney bought Fox, they want nothing to do with it and just have to sit there. For the record, I'm a big Alita fan, and while I didn't care for captain marvel, I didn't want to see two movies competing against or destroy each other like that. Because no one was asking for it, except for the sexist dick wads themselves.
Man I loved Alita.

Frankly though, I think the reason Captain Marvel got so much hate was exclusively base off Bree Larson thinking her shit didn't stink and acting like now that Marvel had finally hired a woman she would be the thing that saved the MCU. And you could tell that even the MCU cast couldn't take her trash.

As far as a film goes, Captain Marvel was fine. Kind of a mid to low tier film in the overall MCU tbh. And it was certainly better than most of DC's movies.

This was funny. Do not take it seriously.
 

Trunkage

Nascent Orca
Legacy
Apr 3, 2020
6,291
1,494
118
Brisbane
Gender
Cyborg
The cycle repeats. The same thing happened with Battle Angel, where all these yahoo's and jackasses were praising it only just to bring down the Captain Marvel movie. CM did fine, but all these drama queens on Twitter and YouTube try to act as a crap the Marvel was a failure. Even though Alita didn't do all the box office, they tried to make it seem like it was Captain Marvel's fault that the movie didn't do well despite the fact that there wasn't a lot of marketing for it. Now that Disney bought Fox, they want nothing to do with it and just have to sit there. For the record, I'm a big Alita fan, and while I didn't care for captain marvel, I didn't want to see two movies competing against or destroy each other like that. Because no one was asking for it, except for the sexist dick wads themselves.
Yeah, I don't understand the idea that a movie being successful means that social justice is winning/losing

Reactionaries have weird priorities
 
  • Like
Reactions: BrawlMan

Dwarvenhobble

Is on the Gin
May 26, 2020
4,369
483
88
Yeah, I don't understand the idea that a movie being successful means that social justice is winning/losing

Reactionaries have weird priorities
I hope this doesn't come off as too condescending but..... well........ money talks. Money can very much dictate the way companies choose to go unless they're very very activist companies and then they normally collapse by spending 30% on actual product and 50% on funnelling revenue to activist causes rather than making anything and eventually a competitor surpasses them and they collapse unable to keep up the demands to fund activists without the product sales.
 

BrawlMan

Lover of beat'em ups.
Legacy
Apr 3, 2020
10,972
3,668
118
Detroit, Michigan
Country
United States of America
Gender
Male
Reactionaries have weird priorities.
Because they know they have nothing better to do with their lives, but they just don't want to admit it or they're only catering to a subset of gullible idiots to listen to them. Either way, the moment they realize that their life is a meaningless, uneventful, miserable waste of space, they'll have no one to blame with themselves. They could have done really anything else with their life, but they chose just to be whiny jackasses. That's if they realize it.
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: Dansen

Cicada 5

Elite Member
May 1, 2020
1,262
183
68
Country
Nigeria
See the problem with the modern view on media that Feminist tend to take, is that nothing bad can ever happen to the female character. She must always be in complete control of any situation, she must be dominant or at bare minimum equal power level to all the male characters around her, she must never have anything bad happen to her in any way, and effectively she has to be playing the game on God-Mode. Which might be very empowering fantasy, but it also means it is a stupid and boring story because there is never any danger.

Buffy The Vampire Slayer was a great example of how to do the powerful women characters correctly. Buffy was the strongest person on the show, but there were several times which she got her ass kicked, her friends needed saving (including girl friends so it's okay to be the damsel if the hero is also a woman apparently), and was never above every creature she faced. There were several times where even she was saved by a male character, and that's FINE. There is nothing wrong with your character having vulnerabilities, and needing saving too. In fact a vulnerable hero is ultimately a more interesting and better hero because they continue to be the hero despite being vulnerable. It's one of the reason why Superman sucks.
The Last of Us 2 has been defended by feminists and has all manner of horrible crap happen to the two main female leads. Jessica Jones and Supergirl are also beloved by modern feminists and went through all kinds of crap in their shows. There are loads of stories feminists love that deal with women going through abuse or something terrible in general.
 

Cicada 5

Elite Member
May 1, 2020
1,262
183
68
Country
Nigeria
See the problem with the modern view on media that Feminist tend to take, is that nothing bad can ever happen to the female character. She must always be in complete control of any situation, she must be dominant or at bare minimum equal power level to all the male characters around her, she must never have anything bad happen to her in any way, and effectively she has to be playing the game on God-Mode. Which might be very empowering fantasy, but it also means it is a stupid and boring story because there is never any danger.

Buffy The Vampire Slayer was a great example of how to do the powerful women characters correctly. Buffy was the strongest person on the show, but there were several times which she got her ass kicked, her friends needed saving (including girl friends so it's okay to be the damsel if the hero is also a woman apparently), and was never above every creature she faced. There were several times where even she was saved by a male character, and that's FINE. There is nothing wrong with your character having vulnerabilities, and needing saving too. In fact a vulnerable hero is ultimately a more interesting and better hero because they continue to be the hero despite being vulnerable. It's one of the reason why Superman sucks.
The Last of Us 2 has been defended by feminists and has all manner of horrible crap happen to the two main female leads. Jessica Jones and Supergirl are also beloved by modern feminists and went through all kinds of crap in their shows. There are loads of stories feminists love that deal with women going through abuse or something terrible in general.