George R.R. Martin Wants A Song of Ice and Fire to End With Him

[Tanis]

I feel the same way when I think of the manga 'Berserk'.

Kentaro Miura is 47, and he plans on making Berserk like 100-200 volumes.
It's now in its 30s, and barely gets a volume or two a year.

XD

 

[Teoes]

As others are saying: that's fine George, but if we could actually get those last two books before you shuffle off that would be just magic.

Now, back to slowly working my way through A Feast for Crows so I can get back to the interesting people in Dance With Dragons...

Stick with it. I found AFFC a complete slog, especially at the beginning with the chapters wandering around the Riverlands (although the King's Landing chapters were a highlight); ADWD was much more interesting for me.

 

[Kungfu_Teddybear]

I completely agree, there's a very large chance that someone else taking over the reins could ruin the franchise completely. If he were to pass away before finishing the book, I'd rather it ended with him than be ruined by someone else.

 

[1337mokro]

Imagine if we still had to pay money to build airplanes and could only build biplanes just because the original inventor didn't want his "vision of biplanes sullied by single winged planes" (yes powered flight, all flight with engines, WAS patented at one time).

In fairness, patents and copyrights are different things. Nothing is stopping you from picking up a pen and writing a Low Fantasy epic about the onset of snow - accompanied by snow-spirits - involving occasional character deaths the way a patent actually prevents innovation for a time.

And besides, we don't want there to be an incentive to off authors, do we?

We already have an incentive to not off anyone. It's called 20 to life.

Also whilst we are hitting on dead authors. Why would copyright ever extend beyond a natural lifespan? I can see an author who died at 30 getting copyright for 30-40 more years mainly because of any family left behind and the fact you can't predict when people die.

But how is copyright, something intended to motivate people to keep creating new stuff by offering TEMPORARY financial security for their work.

Now of course I could just skirt the copy right and have a King Boffrey is stead of Joffrey, but why should I have to after the author passed away? There will be no more stories from that person. Why then not allow anyone who so wants to take up the pen and attempt telling a story?

 

[Zeckt]

Knowing how much of a troll Martin is, he'll finish the last book and then torch himself and the book while laughing like a maniac as we all shit out pants.

My guess as to how it all ends:

Spoiler

John Snow is actually a Targaryen, Daenerys finally comes across the sea, her dragons wipe out the others, the wartorn and tired Westeros unite under her and John's marriage.

I doubt it, more like winter will come and bring complete desolation from the others rampaging all over westeros with their unstoppable zombie army that Daenerys, Snow and whoever will be in charge of kings landing will have to unite to combat.

I have no doubt that the ending will be as grey as possible, with many villains having no choice but to ally to combat the greater evil of the otheers and will live to the end of the series.

 

[lokicdn]

I understand his wanting the series to always remain in his artistic control but the whole "would fall into money hungry hands" thing is the height of irony. Seeing that his licensing of the franchise has likely put him into the Scrooge McDuck stratosphere.

 

[rob_simple]

.....No.

I don't agree. Sure it would be a sad thing but in the end you are dead. Your idea now belongs to humanity rather than just one person. Now thanks to Disney though we still have to wait 60 years after you croak before we can start desecrating your work but it will and should happen.

Such is the nature of ideas. They can't be yours forever.

Imagine if we still had to pay money to build airplanes and could only build biplanes just because the original inventor didn't want his "vision of biplanes sullied by single winged planes" (yes powered flight, all flight with engines, WAS patented at one time).

You can have the original books be the only thing that is actually canon but you can't section of a part of our culture as private territory forever.

Then why not go make up your own stories in a completely different world, instead of desecrating the work of others with fanfic nonsense? If you concede that anything that does get done after his death is not going to be canon, anyway, then it's still abiding by the guy's wishes.

This is why the world is full of over-saturated bullshit nowadays, because people never know when to leave well enough alone.

Also, your plane analogy doesn't work at all, since air travel is actually hugely beneficial to international trade and hindering it would have a catastrophic effect on the global economy.

The only reason to bastardise a classic work of fiction is to line the pockets of the greedy and serve as a masturbatory aid for fanboys who don't know what's good for them.

 

[hazabaza1]

I thought I remembered someone saying that he's written a rough draft of what will happen in case he dies so it can be finished elsewhere?

Either way though, I agree with the man. Once something is done and finished it should stay that way, and adding more and more to a completed series has rarely given us a good product.

 

[MorganL4]

So has he given any clue as to how many books it will take to close out the series? I mean LotR was always intended to be a trilogy, Harry Potter always had 7 books planned, but Song of Ice and Fire... We are on book 5 going on 6 and have no clue. I can't see him doing more than 7. He won't be alive to do an 8th.

 

[Eldritch Warlord]

So has he given any clue as to how many books it will take to close out the series? I mean LotR was always intended to be a trilogy, Harry Potter always had 7 books planned, but Song of Ice and Fire... We are on book 5 going on 6 and have no clue. I can't see him doing more than 7. He won't be alive to do an 8th.

The Lord of the Rings was meant to be published as a single massive tome. The publisher however didn't want to print a 1600 page book.

Anyway, Martin says he plans two more books: The Winds of Winter and A Dream of Spring.

 

[DugMachine]

This is something I've worried about too. I REALLY hope he lives long enough to finish but seeing as he's still got 2 books to do I'm doubtful. I think it would be best for no one to continue his work though, let the show continue with the ending he's already told them but nobody should try and finish the books if he can't complete them.

I would put good money on HBO working with the publishers to release novelizations of the last few series if Martin does die.

I'd be okay with that as long as they put a disclaimer showing it's from the TV show adaption and not what Martin actually wrote. I'd still read them but leave an artists work alone once they pass in my opinion, especially literature.

 

[saxman234]

Hopefully he finishes all of them and finishes the hbo show. Maybe we can convince him to make a deal with the devil or something.

Anyways there is only one person who I would trust to carry on R.R Martins writing, http://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLo1nDt_-WWnWF3E6Pq_shP4hA61LB8PrX, Robbaz! His tale of House Corgi's rise to power equals the drama that R.R. Martin created with his books. I am still hoping Martin sees the brilliance of House Corgi and incorporates them into the next season or the next book.

 

[XMark]

I'm kind of hoping that, when Martin finishes the novels, he reveals (with maniacal laughter) that the ending he told HBO was completely the opposite of what actually happens. So, like, Daenerys wins in the TV show but the Others kill everyone in the book series (or the other way around). That would be a pretty epic troll.

 

[1337mokro]

.....No.

I don't agree. Sure it would be a sad thing but in the end you are dead. Your idea now belongs to humanity rather than just one person. Now thanks to Disney though we still have to wait 60 years after you croak before we can start desecrating your work but it will and should happen.

Such is the nature of ideas. They can't be yours forever.

Imagine if we still had to pay money to build airplanes and could only build biplanes just because the original inventor didn't want his "vision of biplanes sullied by single winged planes" (yes powered flight, all flight with engines, WAS patented at one time).

You can have the original books be the only thing that is actually canon but you can't section of a part of our culture as private territory forever.

Then why not go make up your own stories in a completely different world, instead of desecrating the work of others with fanfic nonsense? If you concede that anything that does get done after his death is not going to be canon, anyway, then it's still abiding by the guy's wishes.

This is why the world is full of over-saturated bullshit nowadays, because people never know when to leave well enough alone.

Also, your plane analogy doesn't work at all, since air travel is actually hugely beneficial to international trade and hindering it would have a catastrophic effect on the global economy.

The only reason to bastardise a classic work of fiction is to line the pockets of the greedy and serve as a masturbatory aid for fanboys who don't know what's good for them.

Why is there a right to not have shit floating around? Why not be allowed to use something as inspiration several decades after it was first made?

Seriously imagine if George Lucas did not have copyright till fucking 2070? The time around which I fucking retire from the job I don't even have yet and I was born after the movies were made! Imagine what you could do to salvage that universe with someone who actually can make movies at the helm?

You see you focus on the bad parts. I can ignore the bad parts. What I can't do is ignore the possible gems I might never get to enjoy because of restrictive copyright and auteur mentality.

Though please do explain to me how bastardizing a work of classic fiction worked out for Disney. Are they not some of your favourite movies from your childhood? What BASTARDS!!! It's a good thing they lobbied long and hard to make sure no one else could build an empire on public domain work... not even small time fans who just enjoy to write short stories or make small fan movies or fan mods for games. What horrible greedy people those are.

Like the Middle Earth Skyrim mod that was slapped in the face righteously so because these horrible disgusting scummy people were bastardizing the Tolkien works by making a mod for a game for it...

Narrow views. They are abundant.

 

[Eleuthera]

Martin's 65, people are talking like he's 80+

Statistically speaking he's got 15-20 years left to live/write (possibly even 30). Assuming he does manage to finish up his story in two more books I have good faith he'll live long enough to do so.

 

[GundamSentinel]

Martin's 65, people are talking like he's 80+

Statistically speaking he's got 15-20 years left to live/write (possibly even 30). Assuming he does manage to finish up his story in two more books I have good faith he'll live long enough to do so.

Most people don't know he's 65 and assume he's ancient because he looks like Santa Claus. My father is almost 65 and he sure doesn't look as old as GRRM.

Personally, I fully expect him to finish the books, no problem. But I perfectly understand his wishes about it ending with him and I somewhat agree. If I'd made a successful work I was proud of I wouldn't want people fucking around with it either. But then again, I think he as an author has some obligations to his readers. People bought his books assuming they would end in a satisfactory way one day. If GRRM happened to die before that, he should at least let someone else finish it.

 

[Delock]

Considering what happened to the Dune series, I'm totally with him on that one...

I made the mistake of going into Dune without reading up on the series.

In short, I didn't know Dune was a single book instead of a trilogy (everyone just assumed I'd know this), and I picked up THAT series and soon began wondering what the hell people liked about this.

People complain about Martin killing characters, but that series literally destroyed storyarcs it brought up, and soon I stopped caring at all since everything interesting would be shut down before it had anywhere to grow. When I learned that series was done by the son, I felt cheated, as it took advantage of me knowing nothing about Dune.

However... we've also seen a lot of good stories made from series that were made by fans these days, like the new Ninja Turtles, Transformers Prime, Batman, etc. (there's also been bad failures, but we've already addressed that can happen).

I believe there are people out there that would finish it how it should be written if Martin were to go, just as much as I agree there would be people looking to cash in on an established name.

Honestly though if I were to decide, I'd rather not have another series I love cliffhanger. While this doesn't mean I'd like a bad ending, I can say that with the amount of time invested here, it wouldn't feel right to walk away without some sort of conclusion, even if it meant opening up the avenue to a new tale beginning (Tolkien himself did this with the way his stories in Middle Earth ended). Doesn't mean this has to be exploited, just that I'd like the "end of an era" sort of thing in case the worst should happen and we don't get a "The End."

 

[Therumancer]

I have mixed opinions, I can see not wanting a bunch of cash hungry people to ruin things by writing for the lowest common denominator, but at the same time I have to admit that few things crush me more than a really good series never being finished because of the demise of the author.

To be honest I'm not the biggest fan in the world of "A Song Of Ice And Fire" but I appreciate it enough where I want to see him finish it.

I do not want it to become another Amber (which I am a huge fan of) which will never see a proper conclusion due to the passing of Roger Zelazny, who is quite probably my favorite author.