Smilomaniac said:
NoeL said:
pre-emptively judging a movie based on that alone does make you an asshole.
Even if it turns out they were right?
Yes. Being lucky doesn't make you not an asshole. By all means
predict that the movie will be crap based on precedent, but hating on it outright with a closed mind doesn't reflect well on you. Give it a chance, even if the odds seem stacked against it. For all we know the movie will be ok but just has an awful, awful trailer.
Smilomaniac said:
I personally believe this was doomed from the beginning, it has "bad" written all over it.
It's a reboot variant on a classic (another one...) and it has a full cast of women as the protagonists in a time where this is "controversial" and can almost exclusively be seen as forced.
Why is that "bad"? Even if you consider it "a trope or token political correctness", why is that inherently bad? Why is the response "HOW DARE FEMINAZIS TAKE MAH MANZ!!!" rather than "Ghostbuster chicks? Sure, let's see how it goes."? Does it really matter
why they're being "progressive"? You claim it leads to "flat and uninteresting characters" but I can't say I've noticed that myself. Besides, flat and uninteresting characters are typically the mark of bad writers, not soc-jus insertions. A good writer can force in a black transgender lesbian eskimo and still make it work.
Not sure what your beef is with Star Wars though. Are you claiming Rey and Fin would've been more interesting characters if they were white dudes?
Smilomaniac said:
I get where you're coming from, but it's also hard to see your own opinion as anything else but another kind of prejudice. People don't just go "it's ruined because women are leading this", they just shorthand what I just explained or they rage because they believe what they like or love is being shit on. You can disagree and call it what you want, sure, but don't just chalk people up as being assholes because of it.
I think it's fair to call people doing assholey things "assholes" regardless of their intentions, but yes I'll agree it's not likely to win me any friends and is largely counterproductive to do so. And that's just, like, my opinion, man - people are free to disagree and we can discuss whether or not they actually ARE doing assholey things.
Smilomaniac said:
See, people don't particularly like it when you change their favourite characters and then have them outright shame you with political rhetoric, or when existing characters like Wonder Woman uses the word "mansplaining". Even if some get a chuckle out of it, how can it be seen as anything but antagonizing and childish? In what fucking universe is this a good thing?
In this universe - a universe where the cultural status quo needs to be shifted a bit. You can directly compare it to pre- and post- 9/11 America. "Typical" Americans used to be patriotic to the point of absurdity, as their country's prosperity had given them a sense of invincibility. They believed America was the greatest place on Earth and no one could ever touch them in their ivory tower, and it made them a laughing stock to every other country. 9/11 was a massive wake-up call for them, and American media shifted to be more humble, even parodying those previous attitudes with things like
Team America: World Police and the like. And I would argue Americans are better off (or at least much more tolerable) because of this shift. No doubt there were (and are) die-hard nationalists that don't like being "shamed" for their out-dated beliefs, but that's what happens if you maintain shameful beliefs. Same with comic books - if you don't like being shamed for holding politically incorrect beliefs, change those beliefs. At the very least question WHY you're being shamed rather than simply retaliating because the writer hurt your fee-fees.
Smilomaniac said:
Feig is just another accuser in a long line of content makers/directors/developers and journalists that treat us like scum.
By rebooting
Ghostbusters with a female cast? Cry me a river! Look, I get the frustration with content makers/directors/developers that have no passion for the source material and are only chasing a paycheck. You usually get a sub-par product and it can be a huge let down. But really, who are they harming? It doesn't destroy the source material - you still have that to love - and if it's a crap adaptation it'll usually bomb. Even if it doesn't, why does it matter to you that the "mainstream" likes a version of something you're a fan of, even if you despise it? I guess I can see the argument for serialised media like comics where the mainstream success can influence future issues, but when it's a reboot of an 80's movie... who gives a shit? I love
Ghostbusters, I think it's a great movie, and Feig getting his Melissa McCarthy all over it isn't going to change that. So I feel no impetus to rage about it and don't understand why anyone else would.
Smilomaniac said:
It's practically expected, so we might as well hit them fast and hard when we see things we don't like.
If anything is to change, it'll have to be the way they treat us. Sure, you can rely on the mainstream for the bulk of the cash, but it's the geek community that will always initially back and support original and awesome content, it's practically what we live for.
Could you elaborate on how they "treat [you] like scum", please?
Smilomaniac said:
I am a massive anti-feminist
Don't be. Feminism is a worthwhile philosophy despite the loonies it can attract, and really deserves consideration. Don't throw the baby out with the bath water.