I kind of agree. I love multiplayer shooters and I've met some truly awesome people online whom I call my friends. But, devs gotta realize there is only room for 1 or 2 multiplayer shooters in the market for extended periods of time. Right now, it's Call of Duty and a variable from quarter to quarter.
Hating Multiplayer Creep
- Thread starter Yahtzee Croshaw
- Start date
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I haven't played a game regularily online basically since the original starcraft, and that didn't last long either. FFXI is the only MMORPG I've ever tried, and I found it incredibly boring, not the game in and of itself but to play online, with others, having my game-experience hampered by the whims of strangers. I remember the only lan-party I ever went to. After getting bored with playing cs over and over again (despite the fact that I am a pretty decent fps-player), I spent the rest of the time playing single-player games. Multiplayer is not for everybody, although the industry seem to think so.
I dont of course mind that there are multiplayer-games, but like Yahtzee I do get upset when games like Diablo 3 suddenly becomes an online-game where you are more or less forced to play with others. I know some think playing Diablo 1 or 2 by yourself is "playing it wrong" (as if there were such a thing), but I WANT to play them alone. I had great great fun playing them alone. Is that truly such a bad thing?
Strange thing though, when at social functions I am extremely outgoing. I wonder why that doesn't translate to liking multiplayer-gaming as well...
I dont of course mind that there are multiplayer-games, but like Yahtzee I do get upset when games like Diablo 3 suddenly becomes an online-game where you are more or less forced to play with others. I know some think playing Diablo 1 or 2 by yourself is "playing it wrong" (as if there were such a thing), but I WANT to play them alone. I had great great fun playing them alone. Is that truly such a bad thing?
Strange thing though, when at social functions I am extremely outgoing. I wonder why that doesn't translate to liking multiplayer-gaming as well...
Very well put.
It's this perspective specifically that makes me treat Yahtzee's reviews as reviews rather than simply amusement. It's so utterly rare to find another reviewer who can see the beauty in a self-contained, anti-social-media-linked, strictly single-player game.
It's this perspective specifically that makes me treat Yahtzee's reviews as reviews rather than simply amusement. It's so utterly rare to find another reviewer who can see the beauty in a self-contained, anti-social-media-linked, strictly single-player game.
I'd like to point out that multiplayer actually makes it easier to interact with other people. If they turn out to be dicks or the conversation doesn't flow well you just shoot them. You can't do that at a party when someone talks to you about things you don't care about.
Now, I'd like to say more, but the thought of Strongbow dry clouds the mind. And I don't even know what Strongbow really is.
Now, I'd like to say more, but the thought of Strongbow dry clouds the mind. And I don't even know what Strongbow really is.
Actually, I find the current style of advertising for alcoholic beverages far more offensive than they could possibly be if they depicted people drinking alone. You know the ones I mean, the adverts that are set in entirely fictional worlds full of impossibly cool attractive people who live lives of fun, non-stop partying. It didn't do any good for Slurms Makenzie, did it? I mean, I saw the most recent Budweiser advert (in the UK) recently, and I actually felt insulted. I mean, I'm probably more introverted than I care to admit - well, probably not introverted, but I'm far more misanthropic than I let on - and I don't have that many friends in real life - particularly ones that I see regularly - but this kind of advertising does vilify that. It sorta says 'hey! Look at us! You're not cool and popular like us, so you don't get to have fun!' which, ironically, would probably push moe people towards drinking, to numb the pa...
Oh shit! Thats genius!
Anyway, back OT. I too loathe multiplayer crammed into everything. One of my (few) friends has been excited about Borderlands 2 for months, so much so that the day before release, he was barely able to sleep. I'm far more reserved in this area, maybe because I'm so used to waiting for stuff (like this exciting fun life that I'm waiting to come along) and I said to him that I'd play co-op, as long as we could play it my way (I'm an RPG person, he's more of an FPS guy), because I like to take things slow, explore, look around and admire the scenery and so fourth. He agreed, saying, and I quote 'yeah, I appreciate that too, probably more so than you.' which I was kinda offended by.
But as soon as we start playing, he goes rushing off to kill everything, while I'm exploring. What I disliked more is that he's grabbing quests, completing them, and turning them in, and so I'm missing content, all because I've got a different playstyle.
Though thats kind of an issue I have with Borderlands in general, when some of the quests involve picking up ECHO devices, and a lot of the time, the dialogue is going to be drowned out by the fact you're in combat at the time, and you have no way to relisten to them.
Oh shit! Thats genius!
Anyway, back OT. I too loathe multiplayer crammed into everything. One of my (few) friends has been excited about Borderlands 2 for months, so much so that the day before release, he was barely able to sleep. I'm far more reserved in this area, maybe because I'm so used to waiting for stuff (like this exciting fun life that I'm waiting to come along) and I said to him that I'd play co-op, as long as we could play it my way (I'm an RPG person, he's more of an FPS guy), because I like to take things slow, explore, look around and admire the scenery and so fourth. He agreed, saying, and I quote 'yeah, I appreciate that too, probably more so than you.' which I was kinda offended by.
But as soon as we start playing, he goes rushing off to kill everything, while I'm exploring. What I disliked more is that he's grabbing quests, completing them, and turning them in, and so I'm missing content, all because I've got a different playstyle.
Though thats kind of an issue I have with Borderlands in general, when some of the quests involve picking up ECHO devices, and a lot of the time, the dialogue is going to be drowned out by the fact you're in combat at the time, and you have no way to relisten to them.
There is a strong pull to prevent introverts from being left alone to their own devices.
Agree a fair bit with yahtzee, I'd agree wholeheartedly, but I've had some brilliant multiplayer experiences and got into the mp really strongly of a few games. There sure is a sp and mp divide, and sometimes I'll leave mp off for whole weeks. Which explains why yahtzee didn't like dark souls. That can get very intrusive.
A story.
The Wind and the Whiskey.
Once I was in a second story bar, with plenty open to the night air, almost a 360 balcony. Some friends were around, and acquaintances, but I was not interested in talking to people. I only cared about my whiskey and enjoying the night air, that cool breeze that tickles across your face on a slightly windy night. Over and over, this small labourer guy kept hassling me to join his crew. To drink with them. At first it was friendly, then it was pitying me, then it was insistent, then it led to anger. The guy was furious I wouldn't drink with him. I had no idea who he was or his name, but an introvert just enjoying the wind and the whiskey was wrong. We almost got into a fight over this, for not drinking with a random stranger. If I had been smaller, less assertive, yep, it would have gone that way. The extrovert was a smaller man, a more needy man, a more desperate man. Not someone I was interested in drinking with.
Random fucking strangers can fuck off.
Agree a fair bit with yahtzee, I'd agree wholeheartedly, but I've had some brilliant multiplayer experiences and got into the mp really strongly of a few games. There sure is a sp and mp divide, and sometimes I'll leave mp off for whole weeks. Which explains why yahtzee didn't like dark souls. That can get very intrusive.
A story.
The Wind and the Whiskey.
Once I was in a second story bar, with plenty open to the night air, almost a 360 balcony. Some friends were around, and acquaintances, but I was not interested in talking to people. I only cared about my whiskey and enjoying the night air, that cool breeze that tickles across your face on a slightly windy night. Over and over, this small labourer guy kept hassling me to join his crew. To drink with them. At first it was friendly, then it was pitying me, then it was insistent, then it led to anger. The guy was furious I wouldn't drink with him. I had no idea who he was or his name, but an introvert just enjoying the wind and the whiskey was wrong. We almost got into a fight over this, for not drinking with a random stranger. If I had been smaller, less assertive, yep, it would have gone that way. The extrovert was a smaller man, a more needy man, a more desperate man. Not someone I was interested in drinking with.
Random fucking strangers can fuck off.
Hmm. Drinking alone, perhaps wallowing in your depression, perhaps just relaxing. Versus drinking in pubs in a social group, becoming loud and obnoxious watching some athletes run/skate back and forth across a field/court/rink of some kind, eating fatty starchy pub food, foisting unwelcome attention on the opposite sex, getting into a fight, vomiting on a bar floor, a taxi cab seat, or someone else, getting behind the wheel of a car and hurting someone. Yeah, I can see how drinking alone is completely unhealthy behaviour.Yahtzee Croshaw said:
On the other hand, I'd only drink Strongbow at the bar. It only tastes decent on draft.
I hit this point alot some days and just want to be left alone. In fact, I have several games that encourage play with other users, even through the main campaign, whom I don't want to play with. I think the only game I play with strangers are MMOs. I find it rather intrusive to have someone else mucking up how I want to enjoy the game.
My thoughts exactly.Mike Fang said:
Just to add a few more, I like hanging out with people, but usually only in situations where we have something to Do. For example having a lan-party, or drinking... Or both (tabletop rpg's are also a pleasurable pastime). On the other hand, in cases where I've been invited to have a cup of coffee at a friends house in the middle of the day, I usually haven't gone to visit them. I just can't sit there doing nothing except talk about stuff, it is awkward when you don't have anything to talk about, and if you do, you have to make an effort to keep the conversation flowing. So, hanging out with friends all well and good, but that's stuff for the weekends, when being hungover is sanctioned. On weekdays, it's me-time. I might drink few beers (etc.) here and there while playing or something, I don't need friends around for that, and I doubt they'd come over to drink with me when they have work the next day or something. I might play MMO's while having that me-time, but I always choose when I wish to play with others. As someone mentioned earlier, I hate those people who seem to not have anything else to do except bite your ear off in TS or Skype "Hey, you're online let's do dungeons and raids and...!!?!" everytime you log in. Just one of the reasons I like GW2 is that you don't have to group up to tackle a hard boss rumbling around in the PvE-area, you just go up that boss without having to socialize with anyone if you don't want to.
Let's just say that I appreciate my personal space. That sums it up quite well in my opinion ^^
I agree with this for the most part except for Driving games and Demon's Souls. Demons Souls had fun multiplayer because you didn't have to play with anyone and if you did you had the option of being a complete &%*$ and screwing them over.
I agree on all counts.
It's only been recently that I learned (from my dad, also an introvert) that introversion is unduly demonized by our culture, and I'm not a broken person for preferring solitary activities over social ones. I have tried to be the outgoing social butterfly, but the problem there was that it felt dishonest, and social interaction is really tiring to me. It's why I don't have a Facebook.
Also tiring: playing browser games and getting pestered to link my account to my Twitter or Facebook so I can let my friends know what I'm doing. Dammit, even if I had friends I wouldn't be so cruel as to spam their feeds with bullshit I'm doing on my own time. But it's free advertising, so I guess the Facebook connectivity thing will just never die.
It's only been recently that I learned (from my dad, also an introvert) that introversion is unduly demonized by our culture, and I'm not a broken person for preferring solitary activities over social ones. I have tried to be the outgoing social butterfly, but the problem there was that it felt dishonest, and social interaction is really tiring to me. It's why I don't have a Facebook.
Also tiring: playing browser games and getting pestered to link my account to my Twitter or Facebook so I can let my friends know what I'm doing. Dammit, even if I had friends I wouldn't be so cruel as to spam their feeds with bullshit I'm doing on my own time. But it's free advertising, so I guess the Facebook connectivity thing will just never die.
I do find myself agreeing with you for the most part. I take exception to sitting with Strongbow, however, stuff's horrid. Although apparently Strongbow is owned by a different company in Australia, so your stuff may taste better.
I am okay with playing coop with a couple of friends.
It's good fun once in a while.
But, developers strop trying to cram multiplayer down my throat.
No I don't want Sim City to be some kind of always online connected experience. I just want to build my city peacefully, on my own.
And then burn it to the ground.
I don't want some wanker from wherever to be the city next to me and fuck up my game.
Also seriously what's with the multiplayer in Dark Souls? The game is made to have you struggle and suffer and die and struggle and die again forever.
Then a red asshole pop in your game with his over optimized build and backstab you while your fighting against two armoured giants. What the fuck game.
Anyway, enough ranting, Just let me play solo when I play solo, There is enough MP oriented game already I would be playing them if I wanted to have a shitty social impaired time.
It's good fun once in a while.
But, developers strop trying to cram multiplayer down my throat.
No I don't want Sim City to be some kind of always online connected experience. I just want to build my city peacefully, on my own.
And then burn it to the ground.
I don't want some wanker from wherever to be the city next to me and fuck up my game.
Also seriously what's with the multiplayer in Dark Souls? The game is made to have you struggle and suffer and die and struggle and die again forever.
Then a red asshole pop in your game with his over optimized build and backstab you while your fighting against two armoured giants. What the fuck game.
Anyway, enough ranting, Just let me play solo when I play solo, There is enough MP oriented game already I would be playing them if I wanted to have a shitty social impaired time.
I always thought Yahtzee had good taste, but it's good to know it extends to alchohol. The only point of contention is that he appears to prefer normal Strongbow to sweet.
Also, it's depressing when multiplayer gets crammed into a game that doesn't need or benefit from it "just because". A lot of (extremely thick) reviewers gave Spec Ops: The Line reduced review scores because of its mediocre multiplayer (lower than they might have given it if it had NO multiplayer), completely missing the point that it's a spectacular single-player game.
Also, I find Borderlands to not be great in multiplayer. Oh sure, the actual fighting is better, but in-between quests you have everyone running ahead racing through things, heading off in their own direction when you'd rather sit back, take your time and do some more sidequests.
Also, it's depressing when multiplayer gets crammed into a game that doesn't need or benefit from it "just because". A lot of (extremely thick) reviewers gave Spec Ops: The Line reduced review scores because of its mediocre multiplayer (lower than they might have given it if it had NO multiplayer), completely missing the point that it's a spectacular single-player game.
Also, I find Borderlands to not be great in multiplayer. Oh sure, the actual fighting is better, but in-between quests you have everyone running ahead racing through things, heading off in their own direction when you'd rather sit back, take your time and do some more sidequests.
Yahtzee Croshaw said:
There's also the possibility you're confusing things -- you're partly right, it's about money.MichaelMaverick said:
Multiplayer, in its current incarnation, is a huuuuuuge moneymaker. Gone are the days of going over to a friend's house and enjoying hours of fun sitting in front of the same screen and [gasp] using a single copy of the game.
Now, by including a multiplayer component, you encourage groups of friends to all buy the game together. Don't think so? Consider that shampoo companies increased sales by simply telling customers to "Lather. Rinse. Repeat."
Multiplayer also provides 'hours of content' to tout on the box, and can indeed keep players around just a bit longer... so you can snag them with your various monetization schemes. That's how the entire free-to-play market lives.
The problem, as I see it, isn't that they're trying to push multiplayer on people. It's that they're pushing a manipulative form of multiplayer on everyone. And, as you rightly noted, it's about money.
I appreciate you speaking out for us introverts, Mr. Croshaw, even though I'm not entirely adverse to playing online with my friends. I'll never touch a random lobby, though.
I will say there's nothing like having a couple of beers while enjoying your favorite single player game. And while playing online with some friends is a lot of fun, I refuse to play along side strangers. I've had my fill of my worth as a human questioned because my reaction time isn't that of a mongoose. Thanks, Counter Strike.