Hayao Miyazaki: Anime Suffers Because the Industry is Full of "Otaku"

[makano]

Thing is he is way too much up his own backside. His films are overrated and he has resorted to taking other authors story's (see the borrowers for what i mean).

You know the only reason Otaku are a problem in japan? They "shame" the older generation of japan. If they could they would blame the radiation leak on a otaku if they could.(bit like American politics in that regard)

Anime brings in money something the older ones love, Anime Blu Rays cost a lot of money there so in there tanking economy i think they would be a little bit more respectful. They did the same with TV/D and D/comic books/video games here in the west(remember when being a nerd was the worst thing in the world?).

I have even known some to go without food just to buy and support the shows they love.

I also love the fact you all think you have the right to judge as well as you who only see "west popular" shit such as that crap known as Naruto/SAO/AoT.

 

[Atmos Duality]

I also love the fact you all think you have the right to judge as well as you who only see "west popular" shit such as that crap known as Naruto/SAO/AoT.

*chuckles*
...Says the person judging everyone else in the thread with an unprovable assumption.
Unless you're claiming you have the psychic powers necessary to know exactly what everyone you're condemning has watched.

 

[makano]

I also love the fact you all think you have the right to judge as well as you who only see "west popular" shit such as that crap known as Naruto/SAO/AoT.

*chuckles*
...Says the person judging everyone else in the thread with an unprovable assumption.
Unless you're claiming you have the psychic powers necessary to know exactly what everyone you're condemning has watched.

unprovable? Most people in this thread only talk about shit like what i mentioned(i have lurked here a long time pal), also i like the fact you tried discredit my argument by focusing on 1 point in my post(what's the matter afraid to take on the challenge?). Face it Miyazaki is a old hack and his relevance in the anime industry is to pander to normal people so of course he is going to attack the otaku because they are the only ones who point out his bullshit.

*welcomes the Miyazaki internet defence force*

 

[Dragonbums]

Face it Miyazaki is a old hack

Someone seems a bit touchy. It's one thing to not like his movies. It's quite another to accuse him of being a hack.

and his relevance in the anime industry is to pander to normal people

You say that like that's a small nice group. At least this "pandering" as you call it has landed him an Oscar, and worldwide respect inside and outside of the anime industry by many animators across the world.

Honestly this quote sounds like it came straight from Wizardchan.

so of course he is going to attack the otaku because they are the only ones who point out his bullshit.

Well the thing is is that what Miyazaki is pointing out is indeed toxic to the industry. I don't think you'll be surprised to see a lot more olden day animators have the same opinion outside of Miyazaki and the creator of Evangelion. I'm also thinking that you don't really understand what the term Otaku means in Japan. It is not simply an anime fan.

Otaku are basically people who live at home by themselves or with their parents, who don't work, don't contribute, don't communicate with others, don't do ANYTHING but talk to others like them, harass female actresses (and in some cases ruin their careers) if they dare to have actual relationships, and are a general drain in society that somehow have the cash store to by hundreds of anime girl figurines and body pillows. They are basically the saddest people on the planet.

THAT'S the kind of people Miyazaki is talking about. And when you have a whole new generation of animators who are only interested in unnatural moe fantasies appealing to an equally secluded demographic of dudes into moe fantasies, you are going to see an industry that's spiraling to a crash.



*welcomes the Miyazaki internet defence force*[/quote]

 

[Atmos Duality]

unprovable? Most people in this thread only talk about shit like what i mentioned, also i like the fact you tried discredit my argument by focusing on 1 point in my post

I focused on one point because its the only part I took issue with, obviously.
Lets rewind to that bit.

I also love the fact you all think you have the right to judge as well as you who only see "west popular" shit such as that crap known as Naruto/SAO/AoT.

The bolded part is a Gross generalization, and it's not a valid argument.
So either you're unaware of how your own phrasing works, or you are and were just trying to piss people off.

Either way: Stop projecting.

(i have lurked here a long time pal)

...And?
Am I supposed to be intimidated by this...?

(what's the matter afraid to take on the challenge?)

...I guess I was. How adorable.

Face it Miyazaki is a old hack and his relevance in the anime industry is to pander to normal people so of course he is going to attack the otaku because they are the only ones who point out his bullshit.

*welcomes the Miyazaki internet defence force*

I'm not defending Miyazaki. He doesn't need my defense, anyway, given his success.
Quite frankly, I don't really care much about his work.

Out of the films of his I've seen, I've only really enjoyed one entirely.
Though if you're anything representative of the Otaku he's speaking out against, sorry to say, but I'm starting to see his point more clearly.

 

[WouldYouKindly]

Get in line Miyazaki, Hideki Anno has been shitting on the Otaku subculture through Evangelion for years now.

And yet Gainax makes a living through pandering to that very subculture. At least Miyazaki sticks to his guns.

Lol, true, but I don't think Anno has much input in that honestly, although I'm pretty sure I'm wrong about that. All I'm saying is that news about a creative individual in the anime industry bashing on the otaku subculture is nothing new, and I feel that Miyazaki is making a statement that's at least 10 years old.

Well, that's what I enjoy about Gainax. We're going to relentlessly insult you and you're still going to give us money because you can't see through the veneer of crap that appeals to people like you.

 

[Riot3000]

Face it Miyazaki is a old hack

Someone seems a bit touchy. It's one thing to not like his movies. It's quite another to accuse him of being a hack.

and his relevance in the anime industry is to pander to normal people

You say that like that's a small nice group. At least this "pandering" as you call it has landed him an Oscar, and worldwide respect inside and outside of the anime industry by many animators across the world.

Honestly this quote sounds like it came straight from Wizardchan.

so of course he is going to attack the otaku because they are the only ones who point out his bullshit.

Well the thing is is that what Miyazaki is pointing out is indeed toxic to the industry. I don't think you'll be surprised to see a lot more olden day animators have the same opinion outside of Miyazaki and the creator of Evangelion. I'm also thinking that you don't really understand what the term Otaku means in Japan. It is not simply an anime fan.

Otaku are basically people who live at home by themselves or with their parents, who don't work, don't contribute, don't communicate with others, don't do ANYTHING but talk to others like them, harass female actresses (and in some cases ruin their careers) if they dare to have actual relationships, and are a general drain in society that somehow have the cash store to by hundreds of anime girl figurines and body pillows. They are basically the saddest people on the planet.

THAT'S the kind of people Miyazaki is talking about. And when you have a whole new generation of animators who are only interested in unnatural moe fantasies appealing to an equally secluded demographic of dudes into moe fantasies, you are going to see an industry that's spiraling to a crash.



*welcomes the Miyazaki internet defence force*

[/quote]

You see I find the whole otaku thing to be very big cop out. Honestly it is just one big ass stereotype sure you can find someone that fits that criteria but I am pretty sure that is few and far between. Besides like they manage to get money to buy things so not working or doing nothing yet can buy things when a stereotype starts to contradict itself it fails as a frame of reference. That description is just a conflated caricature you see people pull all the time for platitude sake. I mean I said before they have to get out their basements make this stuff if you think about it a little more critically.

http://www.news.com.au/entertainment/music/japan-akb48-pop-idol-minami-minegishi-shaves-head-in-penance-for-spending-night-with-man/story-e6frfn09-1226567125292

I read this article and unless I read it wrong this sound like more of the work of dumbass sexist big business company than otaku. I mean I read it and these apparent "scourges" of society were defend a women for having a normal life. This sounds like the work of screwed up business practice than the rage of shut ins who actually came to her defence.

 

[sageoftruth]

Miyazaki makes a very valid point but i'd like to point out two things:

1)A lot of animes are set in fantasy universes or with supernatural and magical elements. Whilst there isn't anything wrong in writing realistic characters to fill unrealistic universes there isn't anything wrong in writing unrealistic characters for them either as they tend to blend more into the unreal setting they find themselves in. Whilst this isn't an anime i'll use it because it's a good example: Game of Thrones is a universe of Machiavellian medieval real-politik, but as a universe it is reliant on it's characters behaving like scheming evil assholes to each other. Fill Game of Thrones with perfectly ordinary and normal characters and it simply doesn't work. For some fantasy universes to "work" you need fanciful characters.


2)Related to the above point- Often unrealistic characters are more interesting than normal ones. One of my favourite characters of all time is Revy from Black Lagoon, a female gun wielding psychopath with anger issues. I don't expect to ever meet someone vaguely like her in real life, nor would I particularly want to, but such characters certainly grab your attention. In addition, abnormal characters are more likely to make decisions and take risks that a normal character would not do, and hence make the storyline more dramatic.

And finally, like gaming, a lot of people also watch anime as a form of escapism from the real world. Certain audiences are more inclined to escapism than others, and few are more inclined than anime otakus.


However, I agree there's something of a gap in the market for anime's being set in more realistic scenario's with realistic characters. Not where your highschool is overun by zombies, but you have magical powers, a gundam and a harem of adoring female fangirls. If anime increasingly goes in the narrowing direction of fanciful situations with fanciful characters then in the end the genre's going to slowly stagnate into obscurity. You need diversity to flourish as a genre.

So I can certainly get behind a call for anime to become more diverse as a genre and encompass normal characters acting in situations we can all relate to.

Personally, I don't think he was criticizing them for making characters who aren't "normal". Instead, I think it's about making characters who don't act like robots that were programmed with a collection of tropes. It's been awhile since I read "Black Lagoon" so my recollection of Revy is pretty rusty, but I believe she could still be the abnormal, abrasive, gut-toting Revy everyone loves even if a writer with more social history fleshed her out a bit. Characters are often better written if the writer creating them draws from his or her personal experiences.

 

[Kittyhawk]

@frozen

Yes, I have the Art of Game Design book. Worth getting for those that haven't, as it puts your mind in that creative space for games and other creative efforts.

Whatever Miyazaki means, the impact its having on anime is gradually hurting, that a revolutionary change has to come to change things. The current path the anime industry is taking is untenable. With their low birth rate, fans will age and dwindle. I think they need more small studios like Trigger, who make what they want and sell to their own audience. Crowd-funding can also help in breaking the chains that bind anime to mass mediocrity and pandering mess.

For the last decade, navigating anime every season is a minefield of wet hay with a few needles hidden. Its become so bad that I can usually tell 80-90% of the bad stuff to avoid, just by looking at the art and reading the synopsis, which is usually lame cookie cutter stuff. Exceptions made for those who try.

As for the otaku of Japan, I'm aware how terrible they can be out there, with studios hanging staff out to dry if they break icky otaku fan hearts. Many bad stories of their treatment of actors etc is frankly scary warped stuff, so I can understand why many might avoid anime work altogether and seek to work in the games industry instead, as its become more globally focused, than just Japan.

 

[deadish]

@frozen

Yes, I have the Art of Game Design book. Worth getting for those that haven't, as it puts your mind in that creative space for games and other creative efforts.

Whatever Miyazaki means, the impact its having on anime is gradually hurting, that a revolutionary change has to come to change things. The current path the anime industry is taking is untenable. With their low birth rate, fans will age and dwindle. I think they need more small studios like Trigger, who make what they want and sell to their own audience. Crowd-funding can also help in breaking the chains that bind anime to mass mediocrity and pandering mess.

For the last decade, navigating anime every season is a minefield of wet hay with a few needles hidden. Its become so bad that I can usually tell 80-90% of the bad stuff to avoid, just by looking at the art and reading the synopsis, which is usually lame cookie cutter stuff. Exceptions made for those who try.

As for the otaku of Japan, I'm aware how terrible they can be out there, with studios hanging staff out to dry if they break icky otaku fan hearts. Many bad stories of their treatment of actors etc is frankly scary warped stuff, so I can understand why many might avoid anime work altogether and seek to work in the games industry instead, as its become more globally focused, than just Japan.

How about you stop blaming an entire industry for providing the exact goods that society is asking for?

Welcome to Capitalism. Nothing gets made unless there is demand for it.

Yes, the vast majority of Anime is niche stuff. Some of it is targeted at "weird" people. Problem?

We should be celebrating the diversity. That it's not all "mainstream" watered down junk design to be as unoffending as possible, appealing to the lowest common denominator.

 

[Pedro The Hutt]

You could consider it a problem when it validates and encourages unhealthy attitudes (like lusting for your under-age sister).