How should the next Elder Scrolls Game be handled?

[AnotherAvatar]

... Set it in the distant future?

Make your character a cyborg?

You know what, fuck it, just give me another Deus Ex.

 

[AnotherAvatar]

snip

How does anything you replied to contradict the fact that Skyrim is dumbed down as opposed to earlier games. That's right, none of it does.

Next time, respond with something valid. Until then, my statements stand - Skyrim is dumbed down.

I actually found Skyrim to have a lot of features I felt were lacking from what I could stand to play of Oblivion.

Mind you, I make no comments on the older games as I've heard Morrowind was epic and deep, and what I played of Daggerfall seemed absurdly massive, so you're probably right on those, but I would argue it was a step up from Oblivion in more than just it's graphics.

 

[AnotherAvatar]

Well, in the words of Todd Howard (holy be thy name), each Elder Scrolls game is made in mind as a completely seperate piece from its predecessors.

Also, Skyrim was sort of hinted as the last Elder Scrolls game. At least for this generation.
Next-gen??

I don't know but if it doesn't rhyme with "lack-of-ear" I'm not sure of an alternative route to expand beyond where the series is now.

Well, according to several people at Bethesda, mind you this comes way back from Morrowind days, Bethesda has had the entire story-arc planned out until Elder scrolls 6 or 7, so we got another game or two before they are done with their planned story.

And they will never go to Akavir, Akavir is like the Dwemer, its cool because you never actually see it, putting it in the game would ruin it because it removes the one thing it has going for it.... the mystery, and yes I do know there was one Dwemer in Morrowind, he doesn't count.

Also the slithering of a snake is a ***** to animate, that's why Bethesda made all the Akaviri in Oblivion's Pale Pass humans, because its a royal pain to get snake slithering working right and not look like shit.

Ah my old enemy

Have you noticed the size of scale throughout the Elder Scrolls?? They've gotten bigger and bigger. From control of an empire (Arena), to control of a region (Daggerfall), to saving a whole province (well for the most part; Morrowind), to saving the continent of Tamriel (Oblivion), to the entirety of Nirn (Skyrim)??

I can only imagine what would go beyond Mundus being swallowed whole.

EDIT: I was saying it was the last ES game of this generation (ESO doesn't count) not the last Elder Scrolls entirely... hopefully.

Wasn't Daggerfall much bigger than the modern ones? I thought it was the biggest encompassing several provinces, and the majority of Tamriel?

Edit: Seems to me like you mean the scope of the quest, not the size of the world. Right?

 

[SajuukKhar]

Also, bring back levitation! Make the world more exotic and interesting like Morrowind was. Basically bring back the soul of the game.

You are aware Morrowind is the only game in the ENTIERE series to be exotic like that?

I find it funny people mention Morrowind so constantly when talking about the "soul" of the game when Morrowind is and was the antithesis to the games before and after it.

Wasn't Daggerfall much bigger than the modern ones? I thought it was the biggest encompassing several provinces, and the majority of Tamriel?

Edit: Seems to me like you mean the scope of the quest, not the size of the world. Right?

Arena had the entire continent of Tamriel.

Daggerfall only covered a small part of Hammerfell, and High Rock, though the game was the largest in terms of how large the section of the world presented in-game was, but that's only because 99.99% of it was randomly generated.

Also, where the fuck did attributes go?

Attributes were removed because they killed character diversity.

When leveling up your Major/Minor skills In Morrowind and Oblivion you would eventually reach a point were the bonuses to attributes would cause you to reach 100 in all attributes that mattered to your character.

This forced you to have to level up attributes that didn't matter to you. that in turn caused you to eventually have max, or nearly maxed attribue stats in all attributes by the time you go to a high level.

The problem with that is that it killed character diversity because when you have attributes, and you have them control things like your health, all character end up being exactly the same near the end.

in removing attributes Skyrim caused the exact opposite effect.

while in Morrowind and Oblivion one could describe the leveling system as "start off unique but become the same", Skyrim changed the leveling system to "start off the same but become unique"

Attributes, along with major/minor skills, were removed because they did nothing but constrain character diversity and cause all character to end up being the same.

 

[chozo_hybrid]

I would like to see some more Orc based stuff, just in general. Take Skyrims system for the game and just add what was missing from previous titles: Making spells, acrobatic abilities etc, I'm sure others can think of more, but I would like to see a story about the green skins.

One thing I would like to say, is that some see Skyrim as dumbed down, fine you can think that. I don't consider it so, I would say the way Skyrim works for me is more convenient then dumbed down.

 

[poxyrom]

You don't need to be a Dragonborn to learn shouts, you just need a lot of practice.
They could make it so that you can learn shouts from master(s) of the voice. They start off being weak, then as you "learn" how to do them, they gradually become better and better.

 

[SajuukKhar]

You don't need to be a Dragonborn to learn shouts, you just need a lot of practice.
They could make it so that you can learn shouts from master(s) of the voice. They start off being weak, then as you "learn" how to do them, they gradually become better and better.

The only masters of the voice left are the Greybeards, so unless the next game is also set in Skyrim, we wont be seeing them again.

It would be better for us to learn Redguard sword-singing, it is much like the Thu'um except instead of learning words of power from massive word walls, the Redguards put their power inside stone cubes.

The Redguards were basically Jedi, they had energy swords, and stored their knowledge in cubes, similar to the star war holocrons.

Hell the greatest sword-singers could split atoms with their swords, with normal, everyday, swords.

 

[Manji187]

Complicate it back up. Skyrim was dumbed down too much.

I want to create spells.
I want races to have meaning beyond a palette swap.
I want a more interesting level mechanic than vanilla levels/ perk.

Not gonna happen. After all those copies they sold, Beth is fully entrenched in the casual market now. The days when they were making a more complex style RPG like Daggerfall are LONG gone.


Said it before and I'll say it again, at this point they should just fully concentrate on the combat system, completely ditch that shit engine and drop their terrible/meaningless RPG elements. Make more of an open-world action-adventure type game with actual good combat and some magic.

So, according to you, TES should become something like a way bigger, but less challenging Dark Souls?

What is it with RPG's (and RPG elements) these days? Do they offend the masses so much? Do they stand in the way of making greater profits?

How much more can a game be dumbed down? Press A to do everything? How much dumber can the actual gameplay get than "Go to place X, kill everything there and loot everything that can be looted"?

What a sad, sad state the triple A industry is in. Increasingly succesful in making and selling utter shite. Latest example (not an RPG but still); Resident Evil 6.

 

[Manji187]

But yea, as far as the ES games goes, they've casualized the rpg elements so much in their games, all their stats and rpg mechanics are pretty much meaningless, their story elements and choices and consequences are dogshit/non-existent, quests are boring... At least make the gameplay (combat) fun and satisfying. It needs to be more reactive, have a sense of weight & momentum applied to movement/blows, have different animations for different weapon types. Also be more visually appealing. If I'm slashing at something with a sword I want to see some damage being done, some dismemberment. And I'm not talking about some shitty cinematic finisher I have no control over. First thing would be to ditch that shitty gamebryo/creation engine, or what ever they want to call it.

When it comes to combat, they need to take some hints from games like Dark Souls, Dark Messiah, Gothic 2, Mount and Blade, and Blade of Darkness.

Yeah, it would be nice to experience realistic weight & momentum based combat in contemporary games. It would probably require a specialized enigine to calculate and render the results.

A troll swinging a massive mace at a characters head should have vastly different outcomes depending on whether it was blocked, how it was blocked (straight on or at an angle), with what it was blocked (tower shield made out of iron or a silver shortsword) and who did the blocking (a huge barbarian or a big orc have more mass and strength than some frail wood elf). So in one scenario it would be stopped (almost) completely, while in another it would stagger the blocker, hit the shield/ sword out of his hands, send him flying 30 feet or taking his head off.

Also, combat strain and injury should be better represented. The longer a fight lasts the greater the risk: the character deals less damage, and becomes increasingly slower in all of his movements and won't have such a sturdy grip on his weapon and or shield. Arrow to the (unprotected) knee? Game over, because crippling pain and no mobility = sitting duck/ arrow sponge.

If you choose to play a sneaky thief with light armor and daggers in such a world, you better plan ahead and play dirty, for it can be over in a flash.

Probably too much work for developers, though.

 

[el derpenburgo]

In Oblivion there was an ingame book that vividly described the Aldmer home island. It was apparently a desolate wasteland torn asunder by magic, last seen a few hundred years ago, or something like that. I always thought it would be interesting to set an Elder Scrolls game there, maybe the Dominion send an expedition and find out that the island's been repopulated by the Aldmeri who are desperately trying to rebuild. There would be a lot of cool magic going on and some really crazy fantasy stuff could come in, since the island is basically like an alien planet. I think the main plot would write itself.

edit: There seems to be a lot of people who want realistic medieval settings and action... but I don't think TES has ever been that kind of game. I'm not having a go, but is this because we've all been living too long in the world of dark fantasy? I love GRRM and Dark Souls but TES has always been rooted in High Fantasy and I hope it stays there.

 

[Cyrus Hanley]

It should be handled by beta testers.

*ba-dum tish*

 

[Mikejames]

Oh, and more interesting quests which more branching story arcs.

Skyrim's quests are SOOOO BORING.

Agreed. For all the flaws Oblivion had there was at least more of a sense of creativity in what you were doing besides-
Go to dungeon,
Kill all bandits/draugr,
Try to find shopkeeper with enough money to buy your loot,
Repeat.

 

[tangoprime]

Well, in the words of Todd Howard (holy be thy name), each Elder Scrolls game is made in mind as a completely seperate piece from its predecessors.

Also, Skyrim was sort of hinted as the last Elder Scrolls game. At least for this generation.
Next-gen??

I don't know but if it doesn't rhyme with "lack-of-ear" I'm not sure of an alternative route to expand beyond where the series is now.

Haha, completely agreed, I REALLY want to see what's happening over on that continent, all we have is some lore about an imperial invasion force getting curb stomped.

 

[RustlessPotato]

I'd like a more alien environment like Morrowind had. I was quite pleased with Skyrim's, but I know they can do more.

More diverse quests, or silly quests. For example, the Quest of Sheogorath in Skyrim I found underwhelming, considering he's the Mad God.

Lastly, I have a problem with guilds. I don't like the fact that I'm able to be Arch Mage and sucking in magic for example. That's personal opinion and I know that I'm not forced to join the guild.

(Also, maybe, I shouldn't have been able to do the end boss thing so easily, while playing on Master difficulty without using uber armor that you can exploit)

 

[RobfromtheGulag]

Not online.
Seriously, am I the only one that finds the prospect of the idiocy of MMOs not a good mesh with an immersive world like Elder Scrolls? Games like Wow are fun, look nice, but the immersion was gone about 5 minutes after I entered Ironforge (and this was back in 2004).


I would prefer (though by no means necessary)
-A more lush/tropical setting.
-A more humdrum protagonist. Even if they did have the budget* to make you feel as epic as you should, it gets tiresome being Mr Uberpants all the time. You can't very well blend in if everyone supposedly reveres you.

[*With the repetitive sayings and limited script of people, it doesn't seem too impressive when I go talk to some Jarl of a hole in the wall burb and he asks me to get him a beer and then rewards me with an Iron Axe of Freezing. I'll keep the Akaviri, thank you very much. And the guards shouldn't be mistaking me for the common rabble in the first place, I'm the saviour of the whole damned world!]

 

[KingsGambit_v1legacy]

... You mean the

Spoiler

Falmer??

Yes, and you're right I mean the you-know you meet after the you-know-what in the Forgotten you-know-where with you-know-who. It's a pretty big deal considering and I think it would be a shame not to explore it in the future.

 

[SajuukKhar]

Not online.
Seriously, am I the only one that finds the prospect of the idiocy of MMOs not a good mesh with an immersive world like Elder Scrolls? Games like Wow are fun, look nice, but the immersion was gone about 5 minutes after I entered Ironforge (and this was back in 2004).


I would prefer (though by no means necessary)
-A more lush/tropical setting.
-A more humdrum protagonist. Even if they did have the budget* to make you feel as epic as you should, it gets tiresome being Mr Uberpants all the time. You can't very well blend in if everyone supposedly reveres you.

[*With the repetitive sayings and limited script of people, it doesn't seem too impressive when I go talk to some Jarl of a hole in the wall burb and he asks me to get him a beer and then rewards me with an Iron Axe of Freezing. I'll keep the Akaviri, thank you very much. And the guards shouldn't be mistaking me for the common rabble in the first place, I'm the saviour of the whole damned world!]

The next Elder Scrolls isn't online.

ESO is a side game being developed by an entirely different company.

In Oblivion there was an ingame book that vividly described the Aldmer home island. It was apparently a desolate wasteland torn asunder by magic, last seen a few hundred years ago, or something like that. I always thought it would be interesting to set an Elder Scrolls game there, maybe the Dominion send an expedition and find out that the island's been repopulated by the Aldmeri who are desperately trying to rebuild. There would be a lot of cool magic going on and some really crazy fantasy stuff could come in, since the island is basically like an alien planet. I think the main plot would write itself.

The Aldmer homeland is Alinor, also known as the Summerset isles, and it is perfectly fine.

Aldmeris, the place the elves believe they came from, is a fictional place, it is a collection of dreams and memories from back when the elves were one race, before the spirit wars splintered them into the various races we see today, Aldmeris never actually existed.
http://www.imperial-library.info/content/nu-mantia-intercept

As they were the most powerful of lesser spirits in the ages after the Convention and eager to emulate what they saw, the Aldmer began construction of their own towers. That they built more than one shows you that they were not of one mind.

The Aldmer began to split along cultural lines, on how best to spread creation and their parts in it. Each Tower that was built exemplified a separate accordance.

This sundering of purpose is the myth of the "destruction of Aldmeris." Outside of the Dawn, and even then only in the dreamtime of its landscape, there was never a terrestrial homeland of the Elves. "Old Ehlnofey" is a magical ideal of mixed memories of the Dawn.

 

[monnes]

Jyggalag most likely doesn't exist anymore, he was reabsorbed into Sheogorath after Shivering Isles.

Wasn't the whole point of the shivering isles DLC that you, the player, the hero of kvatch, stopped the greymarch and therefore Jyggalag managed to break free from his curse of existing as Sheogorath? And then you take sheogoraths place as the new prince of madness. Incidentally, the Sheogorath you see in Skyrim is strongly hinted to be the playable character from Oblivion.

 

[Mortons4ck]

With the backdrop being a war between Aldmeri Dominion (Valenwood) and Elsweyr.

 

[SajuukKhar]

Wasn't the whole point of the shivering isles DLC that you, the player, the hero of kvatch, stopped the greymarch and therefore Jyggalag managed to break free from his curse of existing as Sheogorath? And then you take sheogoraths place as the new prince of madness. Incidentally, the Sheogorath you see in Skyrim is strongly hinted to be the playable character from Oblivion.

To the average person yes, but for those who know the lore no. The whole point of the Shivering Isles DLC was in fact to show the futility of fighting against the king/rebel.

I augguest you read the following docunent, it explains in detail how Jyggalyg wasnt really freed
Arden Sul - http://www.imperial-library.info/content/arden-sul

In short Jyggalyg and Sheo are tied in the same way Akatosh and Lorkhan are, in that they are the same person, a rebel who is also a king, and like Akatosh and Lorkhan they are eternally doomed to kill each other, which is to say themselves, time and time again.

You can never free Jyggalyg because Jyggalag IS Sheogorath and vice-versa, by becoming Sheo you also became his other, his antithesis, Jyggalayg, who is now inside you, just as Sheogorath is.

the article explains it in far better detail though.