Iowa parents defend bullying of autistic teen

[Namehere]

Before anyone asks; no I'm not sayin' this to be offensive. I'm saying it because it looks like fact from the proposition put forward by this principle and the education system in which he works. He stated that he leaves it to the students to manage and handle bullies. So what? In other words; the inmates run the asylum? Does that sound like a nurturing protective environment, or like feeding wolves to wolves, or maybe even rats to rats?

If you establish a set of rules that is 'supposed' to be universally binding, then do not enforce those rules on a marginal group within said society ? aka the bullies ? others will take matters into their own hands. Maybe a bully gets a cracked skull in a fight, maybe the bully harms someone to such an extent as law enforcement is called in. Maybe... just maybe... maybe the bully frightens someone enough that they go on a shooting spree, because the teachers who are authority figures don't actually want to have to exorcise that authority and keep a safe and educational environment for their students... Frightening thought really.

Sounds to me like sending a kid to that school is tantamount to dooming it.

 

[blackrave]

You'd be surprised. Positive parenting [http://www.positive-parents.org/] generates much better results than you might expect.

You jumped to conclusions rather fast.
Let me clarify
I don't think we should beat up kids for every minuscule thing we don't like
I just think we should allow bad things to happen with kids (nothing lethal or permanent though)
Because it is nearly impossible to learn to deal with pain or overcome the trouble if you never have experienced pain or trouble.
So let them do mistakes and learn from them
In current example, getting bullied can serve said kid a lesson
Unless autism prevents logical thinking, beating up should motivate to analyze the situation and come up with possible solutions.

I got beaten up. Why? I said something prior to that. What? Maybe I should avoid using such language in future.
That is the thought process bullying should have started.
If bullying is repeated then reevaluation of situation should take place
For me repeated bullying for non-related reasons brought idea of retaliation (and it solved the issue- later on we became good friends)

Bad analogy. The kid wasn't assaulting anyone; he was, if we take the other kid's parents' word for it, "calling someone a nasty name". There's an old saying about sticks and stones that springs to mind in this situation.

I admit analogy was bad, or rather imprecise
But I wasn't trying to relate it to current situation, I related it to concept of being sensitive to everyone at all times.
There is too little of information to make good analogy in this case
We don't know the context of calling someone the nasty name (was there actually reason or it was totally unprovoked reaction)
We don't know the nasty word (he might have called someone a little *****, or maybe it was comparison to caveman, we don't know)

 

[Robert Marrs]

I find it hard to believe so many people would come out AGAINST a bully victim unless there was some reason for it. Seems like this is a case of a kid being a total d-bag and when the consequences of his actions bite him in the ass they use a medical condition as a scapegoat. I'm not sure where you went to school but when I was in high school messing with a genuinely disable student was grounds for a serious ass kicking. Of course we will never know the whole story but something fishy is going on here. I have known a few people with aspergers and while some of them were a little off key in regards to social settings they were still normal enough to be held to the same standards as everyone else.

 

[TheIceQueen]

I come from a very rural Midwestern setting that's quite similar to where this incident took place (despite having moved around a lot, my parents always settled in a rural area, blaaagghhh), and can tell you that the cultural context in which we live in is so very traditional that anything different from the traditional, conservative role simply baffles these rural citizens, such as women wanting to have a career. And that's no joke, believe you me.

As someone with Aspergers growing up in rural Kansas, your description is in no way, shape, or form how it happens here. Everyone knows that I am not the same, but they help me and if I do something wrong they tell me. In fact, the only grief I have ever gotten was at the school I went to, which was in a town of 50,000 (by no means "rural"). That "Traditional, Conservative" small town that was my home away from home? Treated 1,000,000X better there than I was in the city of 50,000 that I actually lived in. To this day, I hate the city and will ONLY live in the Rural Midwest, and you couldn't PAY me live in cities.

OT: Absolutely disgusting. I remember my own instance, though it ended better. Just like this one, the principal said that I was just faking my bullying to get attention. But when my mom found out about that, SHE FLIPPED SHIT! Went and ranted straight to the principal, who tried to feed some bullshit line about how the bullies were excused because they came from bad homes, whereas I obviously didn't if my mom was there trying to sort things out. To which my mom responded that she was going to take me home and beat me so that this principal would get off her ass and do something. While she obviously didn't do that, she did go to the school board and, using her authority as a teacher in the same school district and with help from the Special Ed department, she got said principal fired, and mandatory anti-bullying programs in all schools. Now that she is a principal herself, whoo to anyone who commits bullying in her school.

Perhaps I should have even further clarified with Upper Midwest. Kansas might be a Midwestern state, but it's a lot different from Minnesota, Wisconsin, Iowa, and South Dakota. I know that because I have a -bunch- of family in Kansas and I have to visit them regularly. It's a lot different for a lot of reasons, but I like to put it partially to the highly Mennonite culture in the Kansas area. Mennonites, you be crazy, but you're lovely people as well.

 

[Single Shot]

What I want to comment on is the number of people on this forum who have Aspergers, or some form of Autism. It's something I've noticed in other threads, and it's occured to me again in this thread.

It's a very, very high number of people.

I find that interesting.

Well, it could be that such people are more likely to click on a thread that has "autistic" (and "bullying, I guess) in the title. But yeah, the escapist demographics often seem a little unusual.

It could also be that people with social disabilities who don't fully understand the real world are more likely to turn to fictional worlds where set rules are easier to understand.

 

[Amir Kondori]

No one here really knows what was going on but applauding a child for physically harming another for calling him a bad name is waaay out there in the "not ok" category. Justifying physical violence against a child unable to physically defend himself is also waaay out there in the "not ok" category as well.

This sounds like typical small town bullshit to me.

 

[Someone Depressing]

God bless America, the immigrant country that attacked a Mexican kid for singing America's national anthem that was written, recited and published by an immigrant!

Bullying is wrong. It leaves scars deeper than any child could bear; even if that kid is a complete and utter little unsufferable fuck, nobody deserves to be bullied.

Also, this man is proud of his nephew cocking someone's mouth. I know it's sic, but that doesn't make it any better. I'm also autistic, and I come out with things I don't really think about; I don't even know I'm being insulting, or offensive; I've even been heavily misogynistic once, and I had no idea what was going on; someone had to tell me what I'd said, and what was wrong with it. The kid may be an evil little twat, but then again, it might have been an accident.

Besides, the fact that adults are defending bullying is disgusting.

 

[Flutterguy]

Small town mentality. Parents seem to be patting kids on the back for physically addressing an insult... a true sign of intelligence and proper etiquette.

Im curious why he has not been home-schooled or given other options. Laziness and lack of empathy probably.

Then always the off chance he is an exceptonal asshole, but I seriously doubt that.

 

[Genocidicles]

He's either an asshole (and he deserved it), or he should be in a specialized class or school better equipped to help him.

 

[balladbird]

I admit, I'm torn on the issue. On one hand, bullying is bullying, and responding to verbal irritation with physical violence is never the answer. autism is very real, and it does carry with it social awkwardness, which can easily be misconstrued as legitimate mean spiritedness...

but at the same time, it's become quite popular, even to the point of being a fad, for people to use autism, asperger's in particular, as some kind of handy "get out of personal responsibility for being an asshole free" card. People aren't obligated to smile while being subjected to verbal abuse or rude behavior, whether such tactlessness is born from legitimate disability or being a dick. I would never advocate physical violence, and I believe tolerance is important, but if I'm being honest with myself, if I knew a guy who suffered from aspergers, and even if I knew beyond the shadow of a doubt that his rudeness was born from this disorder, I can't guarantee I'm a strong enough person to hang around with him as he insulted me. I would distance myself from him, if not ignore him outright, so I'm not sure how tolerant I am of the issue.

 

[008Zulu_v1legacy]

I have gone to school with people who have used their disability as a reason to be total jerkhats, and they did get away with it. I have no sympathy for those with these kinds of conditions in circumstances like this.

It is not impossible to teach disabled people how to behave properly, the fault lies with the parents.

 

[Riot3000]

I think there are a lot of details left out of this to make a clear cut case. Did the kid call people names just out of no where or was his naming calling a retaliation to the bully. I think the school is off on this they are the authority figures and should act accordingly. That compounded by the parents who realistically defend and be on their kids side just makes this into a bigger mess. But thats just my analysis with the info given so I can't say much.

You'd be surprised. Positive parenting [http://www.positive-parents.org/] generates much better results than you might expect.

You jumped to conclusions rather fast.
Let me clarify
I don't think we should beat up kids for every minuscule thing we don't like
I just think we should allow bad things to happen with kids (nothing lethal or permanent though)
Because it is nearly impossible to learn to deal with pain or overcome the trouble if you never have experienced pain or trouble.
So let them do mistakes and learn from them
In current example, getting bullied can serve said kid a lesson
Unless autism prevents logical thinking, beating up should motivate to analyze the situation and come up with possible solutions.

I got beaten up. Why? I said something prior to that. What? Maybe I should avoid using such language in future.
That is the thought process bullying should have started.
If bullying is repeated then reevaluation of situation should take place
For me repeated bullying for non-related reasons brought idea of retaliation (and it solved the issue- later on we became good friends)

I never understood the allow bad things to happen I mean whenever a parent is not around their child stuff will happen good or bad. I think your romanticizing this a bit never experiencing some sort of pain and trouble is kind of impossible. That is why the whole parents should let their kids make mistakes is kind of a oxymoron.


My repeated bullying just taught that my bullies were bigger than me so apparently that gave them right to bully me because reasons. Not saying your bullying was a learning experience but sometimes it is just dicks being dicks and that should not be tolerated.

 

[2012 Wont Happen]

There's not enough information to really get into this. I know people with aspergers who I consider close friends. I knew someone in high school who had a bit more severe an autism spectrum disorder who intentionally assaulted a friend I had at the time on the football field so cameras couldn't see it. If I had been there, a lot worse than mean words would've happened to him as a result.

So it really depends on the situation. People should be tolerant of mental disabiliy, but one should not and often can not allow legitimately destructive behavior to go without some form of response.

I hope this kid was just an asshole who happened to have aspergers though, because the alternate possible version of the story, that the entire community endorses bullying the autistic, is atrocious.

 

[ThreeName]

He sounds like a prick who's hiding behind a condition. I, and most people I know, have met plenty of people like this.

I think there's a difference between "Bullying because he has Asperger's" and "Punching a dickhead because he insulted you".

 

[Vivi22]

Besides, the article notes that he called someone "a nasty name".

I'm not sure how other people were raised, but I was always aware that being called a name wasn't grounds to punch someone. And that's ignoring the fact that we only have the word of one of the bullies parents to go on there, and "nasty name" is pretty non-specific.

Maybe I just don't understand Asperger's, but I'm assuming that you're aware enough of bad language, difficult situations and the like to avoid calling someone something vile enough that they immediately punch you in the face.

You don't understand Asperger's. I'm not saying that to be rude, I'm saying you really don't seem to know much about it. The brother of my sister's husband has Asperger's, and a relatively more severe case than most for lack of a better term. He can function just fine living on his own, but he says insulting things to people with some frequency because he just doesn't get that it's insulting. He literally does not get that telling someone they look fat or things of that nature are wrong. As far as he's concerned he's just telling the truth and doesn't get why it might hurt someone's feelings.

It's more than a little hard for someone to understand they're being insulting when they don't actually understand the concept to begin with. Mind you, he can be taught when some things are inappropriate, and he does pretty well since he's in his 20's and has had years of practice and people correcting him, even if he still slips up now and then. But a 13 year old kid? They don't have nearly as much time spent learning what's appropriate and not, or learning how to interact with people socially. I would honestly be surprised if this kid was any good at it at that age.

but the pure amount of blowback of the incident implies something more malevolent.

Actually I think it implies something I've known about most parents for a very long time, and that's that most of them are ignorant ass hats.

 

[Sansha]

As someone with mild Aspergers, I learned in high school not to provoke people, because I would start shit and be reacted to thusly. It took me a few years to learn to think before I speak, and not victimize myself.

So this is really a non-issue. Someone talked shit, it escalated for a moment, apologies happened. Everyone goes home wiser.

 

[scorptatious]

As someone with a mild form of autism, I'm not sure if there's enough context in this article for me to properly make a proper judgement. Perhaps Null was calling people rude names on purpose, or maybe because of his condition, he actually does have social problems. Either way, it probably didn't warrant a video of him being bullied.

I also don't agree with the school's policy on bullying. If the staff isn't going to intervene whenever bullying occurs, what makes you think the students will? Children learn through example and discipline. By depending on the kids to watch out for one another, you're essentially leaving those unable to defend themselves to the mercy of the bullies. That system just won't work.

 

[Bluestorm83]

I'd have to place a lot of blame on the society we exist in where if a teacher tries to discipline a student they lose their job. When I was a kid, if you bullied a kid, the teacher would handle it. These days you can't stand up for the victims without being punished.

Also, I can't say that the bullies are justified, but if the kid really can't control a lot of what is a trigger for these bullies, maybe it would be in his best interest to find a special ed teacher or something. I'm not saying it's his fault, but, I mean...

Okay, if you take a fish and put it in the desert, it's going to suffocate. That's not the fish's fault, that's the nature of gills and a dry environment. But for God's sake, you don't try and change the desert, you put the fish into a suitable body of water. Nobody goes into a Synagogue and complains there's not enough Jesus, nobody goes to the Vatican and complains that there are no statues of Ganesha, nobody goes to the British Parliament and complains that they aren't working with the President of the U.S. Not everyone or everything needs to be everywhere.

 

[CpT_x_Killsteal]

"But ultimately, it's got to come down to the kids to take ownership for this and to stand up for the kids who can't stand up for themselves."

Um... You sure about that?

OT: Evidence unclear, need moar! And who the hell is proud that someone punched another person?

That Principle needs to be shot. You're meant to take care of the kids and provide them a SAFE learning environment. Stupid prick has probably never done anything besides paperwork and attend functions.