Jimquisition: BOYCOTT!

[Plazmatic]

Im sorry, but Jim was wrong on the Left 4 Dead protest, the problem wasn't simply that it was released one year after, it was that it was practically the same game, and that anything else that was added could have been added as an update, and things that weren't fixed in the origional left 4 dead still have not been fixed to this day, were added when left 4 dead 2 came out. and that's just the tip of the iceberg, and if you look, it actually worked, the studio that made the game got kicked out AND they didn't make another game for valve afterwards.

I like your arguement, except the parts where you're wrong.

Left 4 Dead 2 wasn't the same as L4D. Saying so is like complaining about any sequel being the same as the game its based off of. Thats kinda the point of sequels. A lot of the changes done to L4D2 were under the hood. They changed how the Director worked, modified the engine to allow for different features (branching pathes, new melee system, modifiers and deviations from the standard L4D weapon/health system, enhanced matchmaking features), etc. You could argue they could do that in a single update, but I'd then have to ask you why you're being so self entitled. They made a lot of updates in L4D2, people are just bitching because it used the same engine. Its literally the same arguement ignorant people use to complain about Pokemon. "They're all the same" - if you don't know what you're talking about. "They don't add any significant features with each iteration" - if you've never bothered to pick up a copy of the game.

Last time I checked, the Studio that made L4D is STILL creating content, and tweaking content for both games. The original doesn't see as much traffic anymore - its how Halo 3 is to Halo Reach.

Also, the point of the boycott was to tell Valve this would not pass as a fully priced retail game. If you look at the facts and the sales chart, it sold well. And even the creator of the biggest boycott against Valve visited their HQ, played the game, and said "this was actually pretty good". The L4D boycott was an embarassment.

Im not going to read your response since this was not directed at you for you, or other wise anything to do with you. All I said was the reasons for the boycott which were legitimate. this was not an argument as this was not a matter of opinion.

 

[Ovoon]

THANK YOU! All these "im boycotting this game" posts lately have been absurd. that being said, i did boycott fallout 3 (and have stuck to it, i have no desire to ever play it). not because it looked different but because the gameplay had been fundamentally changed. i wanted a turn based rpg, not an fpsrpg

But that isn't a boycott. A boycott is not buying something to prove a point, you didn't buy it because you didn't like the looks of it. That is exactly what jim is talking about. "Boycotting" things for silly reasons.

 

[ZZoMBiE13]

Could not agree more. I just had this conversation with a friend yesterday. How we as gamers have given up any and all hope of making positive change by showing the developers that while we're good at pissing and moaning, we're horrible at sticking to our guns.

And to be fair, I'm just as guilty as anyone of doing this. Although I never cried out or tried to rally troops, I was not intending to buy the last CoD game because of the poor treatment of the Infinity Ward founders then ended up getting it anyway because I wanted to be Richard Nixon shooting zombies in the face. I am properly ashamed of myself, but I still got to spill galons of zombie ichor while saying "I am NOT A CROOK!" and waving my fat jowels Futurama style.

I hope we can follow Jim's advice on this one and maybe be a bit less quick to sound the rally cry in the future unless it's truly neccesary.

 

[-Dragmire-]

If boycotting ever actually works and publishers see a significant dip in profits, they'll probably blame pirating anyway.

 

[lord.jeff]

Every week half the forum for Jim seems to be "Good thing I gave the show one last shot, you managed to do a good episode."

As for the boycotts there stupid, half the time people boycott a game because it's to similar to the first the other half is because the game is to different from the first. Also I think I'm gonna see this episode make a few rounds when the next Call of Duty game gets announced.

 

[Yopaz]

My god. I haven't watched Jim since the first two episodes and dismissed his show as shit. Something about this one caught my eye and I actually decided to watch it. I'm surprised. This episode actually seems sincere, and I actually agree with him. I may have to give you another chance Jim.

The 2 first episodes were pretty bad. I've been watching it and enjoying it since episode 4 or 5, he's simply improved a lot since he first appeared. You should see if you enjoy some of the videos after the 2 first too.

OT: Great stuff. He really managed to front the stupidity we usually see with gamers boycotting and still not dismiss boycotting as all bad.

 

[jklinders]

OK this was a good one. Finally deserving of the praise Jim's fans give him.

This needed to be said very badly. Too many prats out there spouting histrionic nonsense every time everything isn't absolutely perfect. And by that I mean not exactly the way they want it to be.

No one in the gaming press really wants to take consumer action as seriously as it should be. They either blow crap out of proportion and jump on the boycott everything express or they completely minimize consumer rights.

Moderation is called for here. I find it highly disturbing that Jim Sterling of all people was the first I've seen top actually call for it.

 

[Callate]

I agree with everything Sterling said, but I'm kind of a terrible person to turn to.

The last "Battlefield" game I played was Battlefield 1942. The last "Call of Duty" game I played was just called "Call of Duty". Oh, wait- I played one of the DS versions of Modern Warfare. But I don't recall any hue and cry over that.

I haven't played Starcraft 2, and I'm not likely to get Diablo III. I've barely gotten into Left For Dead, so I guess I kind of unwittingly boycotted LFD2.

I'll probably get Saints Row 3, Mass Effect 3, and Torchlight 2 (the last for my spouse), and I'm considering Skyrim and Arkham City. Let me know if any controversies arise over those. But as usual, I'm about five games behind right now, so most calls for boycotts that reach me are probably going to get a response that amounts to "Um, I wasn't going to buy that anyway, so, count me in, I guess...?"

Crikey, I haven't even caught up with everything I got at the last Steam Holiday sale...

 

[00slash00]

THANK YOU! All these "im boycotting this game" posts lately have been absurd. that being said, i did boycott fallout 3 (and have stuck to it, i have no desire to ever play it). not because it looked different but because the gameplay had been fundamentally changed. i wanted a turn based rpg, not an fpsrpg

But that isn't a boycott. A boycott is not buying something to prove a point, you didn't buy it because you didn't like the looks of it. That is exactly what jim is talking about. "Boycotting" things for silly reasons.

um...no, not buying wind waker because its cell shaded is not buying it for the looks, not buying a game because it was an fps when you had been waiting for a turn based rpg, is not buying it because you dont like the gameplay. back when interplay was still developing fallout 3, it looked quite a bit different from fallout 1 and 2, but i was still excited to buy it. i felt betrayed when i read in interview by fallout 3 developers, saying they used halo as an influence. its the same as fans of xcom being mad that the sequel is being turned into an fps

 

[Skizle]

My boycott of Valve until they release HL2 ep3 is still going strong thank you very much.

You sir I give props to for boycotting Valve, but your missing half the point. Yes they have said that Episode 3 is coming out and with nothing as much as a screen shot it is kind of irritating that they keep "making games" instead of focusing on their core game. What you be mad about is their business practices. Instead of building the game from the ground up they will buy the rights to a mod, recode itand put in new character models, and then sell it as their own game and people will defend it until the end because it has the Valve logo on it. And all these little side projects take up all their time instead of making the one game that they have actually made. Whats worse is that Valve refuses to say anything if the HL3 delay is cause by lack of funding, lack of man hours, Gabe has writers block, or even if they plan to release the game once the new Source engine comes out.

 

[Epona]

My god. I haven't watched Jim since the first two episodes and dismissed his show as shit. Something about this one caught my eye and I actually decided to watch it. I'm surprised. This episode actually seems sincere, and I actually agree with him. I may have to give you another chance Jim.

My thoughts exactly, perhaps in the past I've been put off by the intro portion that got paraphrased in this episode.


I have to admit that I'm somewhat in the Apathy camp here, but I think that's because of the nature of the entertainment industry versus, say, the retail industry. It's very easy to boycott, say, Walmart when you can go to a different store to do all the shopping you would have done there, but each video game is unique, and even if other games are in the same genre you can't call them the same. If I want to boycott a video game (or a video game company), it means that I definitively cannot obtain the game they're making, I can't just shop for it somewhere else.

So someone would have to make a damn good argument if I were to boycott the release of a game I wanted.

You could buy used for console games and that would effectively be a boycott for the publisher. Don't buy DLC though.

 

[ManupBatman]

I'm pretty sure the hate for Jim is tied to his intro segment. >.>

 

[GonzoGamer]

community's growing tendency to boycott, the tendency of others to dismiss consumer action

Here's the thing, I may boycott a game because of a business practice that I find abusive towards consumers ("Pass" schemes, Day 1 DLC, their games always launch broken only to be patched much later...if ever) but I may still rent the game. Does that still count as a boycott?

Or I might buy a game used: I plan on buying Mortal Kombat used because I don't like the idea of them taking out online play for those who (probably for financial reasons: that's why I used to usually) buy used, and when I want to play multiplayer for a game like that, I prefer it to be on the couch.

BTW - I also think that people have to stop over-using the word "entitlement."
I think that paying $60 for a game actually does "entitle" you to a complete (full length) game that works.

 

[geier]

Muhahahah..... "Would only bought by neckbeards"

Thank you Jim, give it to the Fallout 1+2 Fanboys !!

 

[James Crook]

Jim wins again!
Thanks for mentioning the Modern Warfare 2 boycott. I bought the game, thinking it'd fix the problems from World at War and the first Modern Warfare, only to be ultimately disappointed by a broken fucking game, and spineless bastards who have been "boycotting" it finding themselves all playing the damn game, and then went on to "boycott" Left 4 Dead 2.

 

[vivster]

the word and thing of boycott is in itself nonsensical
no one needs to "call out" a boycott
a boycott is only that a person won't do a thing
why would one have to rally people for that?
if people don't like a thing they don't do it... period
your boycott would reach people who weren't going to do it anyway...and people who don't care about your opinion will still not care

the only thing such a thing will do is to sway idiotic people with no own opinion or understanding of how to inform oneself
if i want to rally idiots for my cause i'd become a politician

 

[Epona]

1: I like the arrogant persona, but it's also nice to see things taken a little more seriously and personally, like in the NoA episode.

2: I thought the L4D2 outrage was justified, but the call for a boycott wasn't. Mostly becasue I knew it wouldn't work. The Church of Freeman would never defy their Almighty God-King Valve. They'd talk shit, but all the while they had that game pre-ordered and were counting down the days, and would go singing their Lord's praises once the game came out. Plus, the game was good and they actually kept their promise to update it this time.

3: Agreed. Just because YOU don't like something doesn't mean you should go to everyone "Stop being excited! Stop having fun! Have my opinion or I will YELL LOUDER UNTIL YOU DO!"

4: This all comes about because of 3 things: A: Gamers a whiny, entitled lot who think the Dev should cater to them and only them, and anyone who goes against their wishes should be scorned. B: The internet lets them find a couple like-minded individuals that they can rage together with anonymously with and C: Some people really think that people will give a damn that they are saying "Dante looks emo, so let's boycott!". Entitlement, Anonymity and Delusions of Grandeur are what often lead to these 'boycotts' in the first place.

I think calling gamers self entitled should get an episode because that is also overused. There's nothing wrong with people having opinions about a game and even more so if they just spent $60 on it.

So maybe I should alter your 3rd point. "Just because YOU don't like something someone says doesn't mean you should go to everyone "Stop being self entitled! Have my opinion or I will YELL LOUDER UNTIL YOU DO!".

Quite frankly I got tired of people on the internet calling everyone else on the internet stupid or entitled or whiny, etc... around 1996.

 

[Excludos]

Checking...yepp, still good this show.
Couldn't agree more about the theme in this episode. I'm not planning on buying MW3, but mainly because of their subscription model. But I wouldn't call it boycotting, as I feel I should be entitled to change my mind if the game just happens to be that damn good (Which, lets be honest, it wont).

 

[Fiz_The_Toaster]

Great episode Jim, and this is one of the very few times where I've fully agreed with you.

I will say that I'm in the apathy crowd since I'm so tired of hearing that word since I know that some of the people that cry for one hardly ever stick by it and the whole boycott thing will collapse. Jaded is probably closer to what I am to it.

The word 'boycott' should be a powerful word and one that should be taken seriously, but as of late it's being used like the word 'the' and is slowly loosing it's meaning. I'm beginning to wonder if companies just think, 'Oh how cute, look at them. Shouting boycott and not even really meaning it. In a few years I'm sure they're gonna really mean it, and boy are we gonna look foolish!' One day perhaps.