Jimquisition: Integrity, Journalism, and Free PS4s

Aardvaarkman

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Jul 14, 2011
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Therumancer said:
. Right now the argument that a game reviewer can't afford all the games or hardware he needs to review and thus shouldn't be criticized for being "gifted" them only makes sense unless you consider that if this was like any other job he'd punch into an office, go to some soulless cubicle, rev up a console owned by his publisher, and play a game purchased by the publisher that it wants reviewed.
It's hilarious that you think all jobs other than game reviewing are like that. When does a construction worker see the inside of a cubicle, unless he's doing the maintenance on it? When does a teacher or academic work in a cubicle? So on, and so forth.

Plenty of people work from home, whether they are highly paid or not. In fact, many companies are decreasing on-site work, because of the cost of providing facilities. A game console for the reviewer to use at home costs a hell of a lot less than providing a work space in an office building. You know, we do have this thing called "the internet" that allows many types of work to be conducted from outside of an office.

It's amusing that you think that "cubicle work" is the standard form of work, and other forms of employment are some how invalidated by it.
 

MatsVS

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Nov 9, 2009
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Callate said:
Sadly, this is not the case.

I'm not saying, based on the above, that it's common practice; I genuinely hope it's not.

But few things are as likely to get you proved wrong as "always" and "never".
Eh, the only one of these that are remotely worrying is the third one, and even that was quickly brought to light. If anything, that proved how untenable such a practice would be as a long-term business model, or strategy if you will.
 

thewatergamer

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*sigh* I can't believe how stupid some people can be, thank god that jim sterling is here to explain to those poor morons
 

Techno Squidgy

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I was going to say I'd bring a taser if I ever met you, just to be safe, but then I realised you'd probably enjoy it, wouldn't ya Jim? You sick puppy.

Can't wait to pick up a PS4 in about half a year to a years time, when Sony's got their shit together, there's a decent number of titles to play and the price has dropped a bit.
 

UltraPic

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I suppose the funny thing is that sony have always done this, they also used to give out yellow playstations to run alpha/beta/not yet in print copies of games.
 

Therumancer

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Nov 28, 2007
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Aardvaarkman said:
Therumancer said:
. Right now the argument that a game reviewer can't afford all the games or hardware he needs to review and thus shouldn't be criticized for being "gifted" them only makes sense unless you consider that if this was like any other job he'd punch into an office, go to some soulless cubicle, rev up a console owned by his publisher, and play a game purchased by the publisher that it wants reviewed.
It's hilarious that you think all jobs other than game reviewing are like that. When does a construction worker see the inside of a cubicle, unless he's doing the maintenance on it? When does a teacher or academic work in a cubicle? So on, and so forth.

Plenty of people work from home, whether they are highly paid or not. In fact, many companies are decreasing on-site work, because of the cost of providing facilities. A game console for the reviewer to use at home costs a hell of a lot less than providing a work space in an office building. You know, we do have this thing called "the internet" that allows many types of work to be conducted from outside of an office.

It's amusing that you think that "cubicle work" is the standard form of work, and other forms of employment are some how invalidated by it.
I probably wrote it badly in my haste. Cubicle work is the most applicable standard for this kind of work however, where someone is to use a computer or similar device for a long period of time. Remember the subject here is game reviewing, and the most practical way of doing it as a "regular job" would be to have the reviewer sit in a cubicle where the console and monitor are set up and play the game there.

That said, you might want to re-read my post since you seem to be picking at it devoid of the overall context, which has to do with institutional corruption, and is addressing the point that "we reviewers have to be given these things by the industry, or else the overhead would kill us" the point is that they do not. Game reviewing is a cushy job, and predictably they want to keep it cushy. There is nothing intrinsically wrong with that desire of course, but the point is that things do not HAVE to be that way.

As I pointed out, right now half the problem with reviews is that the system is fundamentally corrupt, and very few reviewers rise above that. The industry ultimately supports the media producers behind reviewers (websites, etc...) with advertising for the most part, and ultimately directly provides the tools (which are also a huge perk) to the people doing the reviews of which it approves or thinks are a big enough deal to matter. Ideally a reviewer, and his sponsor, should be entirely detached from the industry producing whatever they are doing reviews of. Hence why I mentioned that game sites hiring reviewers should ideally only accept advertising from sources outside of the gaming industry itself, say from hardware manufacturers (gamepads, headphones, mice, keyboards, etc...) or snack food companies or whatever, and the reviewers themselves should have no direct contact with or accepts gifts from the industry, rather their producer/publisher should be the one to provide such things... which the reality of costs being what it is, especially if they go with secondary advertising options as opposed to those motivated to pay the most money, means that the company itself would be the one to buy and own the PS-4 and would provide it in a work space much like how another
kind of company would provide it's workers with a computer.

The point here again (for the third time pretty much, even if you disagree with it, which I imagine you do), is that while the guys showing off their gifted PS-4s were being douches, the backlash is because this goes beyond that. What your looking at is a situation where there is already a lot of focus on the gaming media for having sold out to the gaming industry, with reviewers being invited to events not open to the public, and publishers largely making their money by selling ad space to the same groups they are supposed to be watchdogging. Seeing a bunch of guys handed consoles that most people can't get by the same people they are supposed to be critical of, brought a lot of things to
a head.

Now yeah, it's great to be able to work from your own home, get to travel to conventions and such where your treated as a minor celebrity due to your "E-fame", and be handed expensive toys constantly as "part of your job". Sure I acknowledge grappling with a deadline is stressful, and gaming is less fun when you HAVE to do it, but overall the whole situation is a joke compared to most people. If you read my examples I mentioned guys getting their heads potentially kicked in during alcohol shut offs (I did casino security), or being made to work on unsafe machinery (my brother, who I haven't seen face to face in many years, works in metal factories which keep getting shut down due to the death of industry where he is). A REAL job is one where you get up early, drive at your own expense (gas is not cheap, especially nowadays) to a place you hate (if it was nice they wouldn't need to pay someone) and even if you do very little you have to deal with mind killing boredom in repetitive tasks, and sore feet, maybe depending on your job you might have to worry about whether your the guy the machine is going to break on and hurt, or if your going to be the one who gets called to tell a drunk "bar closed... for you" and not be able to control the situation (I controlled it every time I was there, but I knew people who had it go very wrong, and knew something like that was always in the cards). Now fine, those who have gotten professional video game reviewing jobs have got it good, and overall there aren't many people who live off of that alone to be fair, but at the same time I don't think we quite need a "woe is us" routine to justify why they "need" the perk of being given free consoles and games. Most people have trouble making ends meet, and part of it because a portion of whatever they make goes towards things like gas, professional cleaning on uniforms (if your not lucky), and similar things. I suppose $400 at once is a big work expense, but it happens (say if you need to get the tires on your care replaced from all the driving) and honestly the cost of a game is probably what someone spends on gas each week depending on their commute.... not many jobs cover the overhead involving in doing those jobs. Some do,
most do not. Where I worked I was lucky that they had an employee cafeteria and laundered the uniforms, but of course they didn't do most of that out of the goodness of their hearts either even if it didn't cost us anything (long story/tangent). Most people aren't that fortunate.

The point here is pretty much to say that I don't think the people getting upset about this were out of line. Mostly though it's largely because it illustrates how close the gaming industry is to the people who are supposed to be keeping an eye on it. Even if one defends the game reviewers NEEDING these handouts, it still shows the industry more or less picking who is allegedly going to be their balancing force.
 

grumpymooselion

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Would having to buy systems and games yourself really ruin you?

Let's take a step back and look at some of the independent reviewers out there. They don't get free systems. They don't get free games. They barely get to get in and talk to the developers, and publishers, if they get to get in and talk to them at all. Yet they still review these things. They buy these things all themselves. They pay for trips up to the major conventions themselves. They pay for everything. And they get by.

They don't ruin themselves doing this.

Some of them get by all on the money made off their web shows. Some of them have to work a job or two in the background, in addition to reviewing and previewing games.

I'm not really against Jim on this. I'm actually with him on the idea that getting review/preview copies of games and systems is not automatically bad. But it can be. And we've seen how it can go bad on both sides of the coin. I won't say it always will, because it won't, but some publishers and console makers really do have less moral substance than others, and that's a fact. The same goes for the people reviewing games, just look at the gamespot fiasco some years back, bribery heavily involved.

So, while I agree with Jim on this, I do so warily, because Human nature is . . . what Human nature, unfortunately, is.
 

Colt47

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I licked one of my gaming consoles once exactly because I saw someone do what Jim did. It was a dreamcast, and it tasted of plastic.

Rest in peace noble gaming console: May the memories of Sonic Adventure, Grandia II, Crazy Taxi, and other great titles keep you company in the great beyond. =(
 

Baresark

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Great episode. Jim is absolutely right. These people have a job that they earn their green with, and it would be ridiculous for them to have to pay and then spend all their other time writing reviews for free. And don't forget the absolute shit they would have to pay for out of pocket. I love the accusation of them being "bought". Last time I checked, bad games still get shitty reviews, and those reviews are not from something that was paid for by the reviewer.
 

Eve Charm

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Really you don't need your name branded on the god damn console to "Track the console" They have SERIAL NUMBERS! They can remotely brick your damn console by checking your console id online if it so happened to fall into evil hands and what not if they gave a damn.

I get it's for their job but doing anything more then giving ps4 and games and goes into the bribe territory. Holding a big galla ball event to hand out customized ps4s along with a party might not be as bad as that halo where people got a new halo themed 360 and a swag bag worth a few hundred dollars to just "review the new halo game" and we may not have known about it till the few whistle blowers called them out on the bribe. Hell jim you even routinely wield the dildo bat. Now why you may be above the bribe, how many people won't be to try and get more free crap.
 

Aardvaarkman

I am the one who eats ants!
Jul 14, 2011
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Therumancer said:
I probably wrote it badly in my haste. Cubicle work is the most applicable standard for this kind of work however, where someone is to use a computer or similar device for a long period of time. Remember the subject here is game reviewing, and the most practical way of doing it as a "regular job" would be to have the reviewer sit in a cubicle where the console and monitor are set up and play the game there.
How is that the most applicable environment for the job? If the job is to review games, the household is a much more appropriate one, because that's where most people play games. they are typically not played in office cubicles. And they are not typically played on a 9-5 office work schedule.

That said, you might want to re-read my post since you seem to be picking at it devoid of the overall context, which has to do with institutional corruption, and is addressing the point that "we reviewers have to be given these things by the industry, or else the overhead would kill us" the point is that they do not. Game reviewing is a cushy job, and predictably they want to keep it cushy. There is nothing intrinsically wrong with that desire of course, but the point is that things do not HAVE to be that way.
I'd hardly call game reviewing a "cushy job" - most game reviewers are not making a lot of money, for many hours of work. And it's also a job where one is constantly subject to online scrutiny and even harassment. I'd call a "cushy job" being on the board of executives of some company where you get little scrutiny, get paid millions, and have the power to control other people's lives and finances, without having to do much work.

As I pointed out, right now half the problem with reviews is that the system is fundamentally corrupt, and very few reviewers rise above that.
Well, Jim certainly does. He regularly attacks the industry. Do you think him getting a PS4 is going to change that? Do you think him working in a cubicle is going to change that?

The industry ultimately supports the media producers behind reviewers (websites, etc...) with advertising for the most part,
Well, here we get to the actual aspects that influence the industry and reviewers. And they have nothing to do with getting free games, not working in cubicles, or having "cushy" jobs. They are entirely the result of reviewers being too ethically weak to stand up against advertisers, or employees of media sites being pressured by their employers.

Hence why I mentioned that game sites hiring reviewers should ideally only accept advertising from sources outside of the gaming industry itself, say from hardware manufacturers (gamepads, headphones, mice, keyboards, etc...) or snack food companies or whatever,
That's absolutely absurd. It would be like a car magazine not having ads for cars. The other side of it is that wouldn't those game peripherals influence the reviews just like the game company advertising does? e.g:

"This game does not play well with the Logitech SuperMaestro 2000 Extreme gamepad, so I can't recommend it."

"What a fantastic game to play while slamming down a can of PWNED+++ Energy Drink?"

"Play longer with Ms. Pacgirl brand feminine hygiene products!"

Gamers come to gaming sites to see stuff about gaming. Frankly, I would find advertising other unrelated stuff somewhat insulting. I'd prefer to see ads for games, as long as the advertising doesn't influence the review. But I haven't seen any evidence of that on the Escapist. Corrupt and bought-off media is going to be corrupt and bought-off no matter who the advertiser is.

... which the reality of costs being what it is, especially if they go with secondary advertising options as opposed to those motivated to pay the most money, means that the company itself would be the one to buy and own the PS-4 and would provide it in a work space much like how another
kind of company would provide it's workers with a computer.
But that would shut out many smaller and independent voices. Only the larger media companies are going to be able to afford such work spaces - and the larger media companies tend to be the ones who are most influenced by advertising deals. Smaller sites aren't going to get huge feature advertising deals from game publishers. It's the big ones who do.

And directness of contact between industry and reviewers doesn't seem that relevant. What seems more relevant is contact with editorial staff. There are plenty of reviewers who can remain un-influenced by industry swag - but if their editor tells them to take a certain line, they might be out of a job. So, arbitrarily limiting reviewer's contact doesn't seem like a foolproof plan if the managers and editors are already corrupted.

The point here again (for the third time pretty much, even if you disagree with it, which I imagine you do), is that while the guys showing off their gifted PS-4s were being douches, the backlash is because this goes beyond that. What your looking at is a situation where there is already a lot of focus on the gaming media for having sold out to the gaming industry, with reviewers being invited to events not open to the public, and publishers largely making their money by selling ad space to the same groups they are supposed to be watchdogging. Seeing a bunch of guys handed consoles that most people can't get by the same people they are supposed to be critical of, brought a lot of things to
a head.
So, people are just looking at one small symptom that isn't really a big issue, rather than the actual problems. Pretty typical. What you're really seeing is jealousy, and it's stupid. "Oh, why does he get to play with the shiny new toys, and I don't"? It's just as asinine as people complaining that a car reviewer gets to drive the new Ferrari, and they don't - while ignoring real problems endemic to the car industry.

...but overall the whole situation is a joke compared to most people. If you read my examples I mentioned guys getting their heads potentially kicked in during alcohol shut offs (I did casino security), or being made to work on unsafe machinery (my brother, who I haven't seen face to face in many years, works in metal factories which keep getting shut down due to the death of industry where he is). A REAL job is one where you get up early, drive at your own expense (gas is not cheap, especially nowadays) to a place you hate (if it was nice they wouldn't need to pay someone)
This is a strawman. Any job, you can find one that's better or worse. Those "real workers" that you cite have it easy compared to somebody working in a sweatshop. So why don't they do a "real job" and work in a sweatshop? Likewise, there are plenty of better paid and more interesting jobs than being a game reviewer. Like being George Clooney, for example.

I also find your idea of "real work" rather pathetic. Why should a job have to be dangerous and difficult? And this is why we have things like Unions and safety regulations. Your friend shouldn't have to be working with unsafe equipment. What do you propose - that we randomly equip game consoles with dangerous spinning blades, just to even things up with the "real workers"?


Where I worked I was lucky that they had an employee cafeteria and laundered the uniforms, but of course they didn't do most of that out of the goodness of their hearts either even if it didn't cost us anything (long story/tangent). Most people aren't that fortunate.
How is any of this relevant to the subject at hand?
 

Aardvaarkman

I am the one who eats ants!
Jul 14, 2011
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Elias Islas Rodriguez said:
Also why do i have to go premium to watch in HQ?? I wont pay to watch Jim licking his PS4 in glorious 720p XD
It wouldn't matter if you did have a premium account. The visual quality of Jim's video is anything but glorious, no matter what resolution you play it at. I'm actually impressed that Jim managed to get such a terrible camera. He must have found it at a goodwill store, or be using an original Playstation Eye, as I didn't think it was possible to get such bad picture quality in 2013.
 

Aardvaarkman

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Jul 14, 2011
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Eve Charm said:
Really you don't need your name branded on the god damn console to "Track the console" They have SERIAL NUMBERS! They can remotely brick your damn console by checking your console id online if it so happened to fall into evil hands and what not if they gave a damn.
But how would they know it fell into "evil hands" and it wasn't the reviewer using it themselves? Serial numbers are typically hidden on the back or the bottom, so it would be easy to sell it to somebody else and it would be visually indistinguishable from a stock unit. Having the name emblazoned on it makes it much easier for onlookers to know the origin of the device.

Now why you may be above the bribe, how many people won't be to try and get more free crap.
But there will always be unscrupulous people. If it doesn't happen out in the open like this, it will happen behind closed doors and be much more insidious. At least this way, it's public knowledge.
 

Eve Charm

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Aardvaarkman said:
Eve Charm said:
Really you don't need your name branded on the god damn console to "Track the console" They have SERIAL NUMBERS! They can remotely brick your damn console by checking your console id online if it so happened to fall into evil hands and what not if they gave a damn.
But how would they know it fell into "evil hands" and it wasn't the reviewer using it themselves? Serial numbers are typically hidden on the back or the bottom, so it would be easy to sell it to somebody else and it would be visually indistinguishable from a stock unit. Having the name emblazoned on it makes it much easier for onlookers to know the origin of the device.

Now why you may be above the bribe, how many people won't be to try and get more free crap.
But there will always be unscrupulous people. If it doesn't happen out in the open like this, it will happen behind closed doors and be much more insidious. At least this way, it's public knowledge.
What do you mean they can take a picture of the rest of the 95% of the ps4 that doesn't have their name of it if they wanted to you know sell it. Or not take a hammer and chisel and destroy where their name is if they gave that much of a crap. How about if weird user names with real names and credit cards show up online to a system with a serial number registered to someone else, that'd be 100 times easier to find bs then what knocking on peoples doors looking for someones name written on a ps4?

Lastly it depends on the thing if public knowledge makes something better or worse, BS is still BS public or not and it's not like this was public knowledge, people just leaked out the info and made themselves look like shills.
 

Therumancer

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Aardvaarkman said:
Therumancer said:
I probably wrote it badly in my haste. Cubicle work is the most applicable standard for this kind of work however, where someone is to use a computer or similar device for a long period of time. Remember the subject here is game reviewing, and the most practical way of doing it as a "regular job" would be to have the reviewer sit in a cubicle where the console and monitor are set up and play the game there.
How is that the most applicable environment for the job? If the job is to review games, the household is a much more appropriate one, because that's where most people play games. they are typically not played in office cubicles. And they are not typically played on a 9-5 office work schedule.

.

As I pointed out, right now half the problem with reviews is that the system is fundamentally corrupt, and very few reviewers rise above that.
Well, Jim certainly does. He regularly attacks the industry. Do you think him getting a PS4 is going to change that? Do you think him working in a cubicle is going to change that?

?
Much snipped for brevity.

For starters this isn't about Jim or anyone else specifically for that matter, as I mentioned exceptions exist. I've been very politic to not turn it into that. I did mention in my first post that you can drawn your own conclusions about the fact that I frequent The Escapist. This is more about the issue than him or any other specific individual involved.

The majority of what was snipped generally comes down to the basic point of industry corruption and the idea that reviewers should be separated from what they criticize. You disagree, I do not. However the point remains that someone could very well do reviews in a cubicle (which does not require a huge office and a farm, it could just be separated off to the side of a small office area). One does not NEED to get into bed with the gaming industry in order to criticize the gaming industry. Doing the job this way is a lot more comfortable and pleasant, but it's hardly necessary, and it's going to rightfully call into question the integrity of the reviewers and the entire system, like we've seen happen. You might try and strawman the other point about advertising on the production end of thing until your blue in the face, but the bottom line we've already had the whole Gerstmann "Kane and Lynch" fiasco which pretty much brought that one to the forefront, and helped pave the way for the latest outbreak of rage against the gaming media and it's members. Like it or not a review source that is beholden to the people it watchdogs, is always going to have it's integrity questioned, especially after scandals like that. I do not follow car magazines enough to talk about any similar incidents that might have taken place or how they influenced things, but then again cars are a big purchase and not something that gets reviewed for a quick, fairly frequent, pick up like a video game. Your typical "review" there is more of an opinion for an enthusiast who is curious, not so much a "hey, buy one of these right now" because really, the readership of a gearhead magazine isn't going to do that.

At the end of the day we'll have to agree to disagree, in short I think the criticisms of reviewers being gifted these new Playstation systems are appropriate. It also shouldn't surprise anyone, because the relationship between the gaming media and gamers has been under increasing stress for a while now. To be honest I think you'd see more trust for the gaming media without the industry hosted gala press events, and the giveaways.... and honestly after Gerstmann unless the media separates itself from the gaming industry advertising dollars, there is always going to be a layer of suspicion there, that case brought it to the top of people's minds and left it there, and that means anything else that happens is going to be compounded by it. You might not like what was thrown back at the reviewers over this, but it's understandable, and I think Jim is wrong about it being unfair or undeserved. Right now the gaming media is in a position where it needs to earn trust from it's followers in order to avoid these kinds of things, fair or not. As I've said before, there are only a handful of people in the gaming media I put any real trust in (even when I don't always agree with them), and a huge number of people are the same way or even more paranoid about the gaming media, as you can see by the backlash.
 

Redd the Sock

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A large part of the problem is how little most of us know about the ins and outs of being a paid reviewer, especially for your chosen hobby. How much time is spent both overall and writing, not playing? Do you play differently for review than you do leisurely? How often are you slammed by your editor that this is unacceptable? Stuff like that. Without that, it's hard to see the job as anything but being paid to do what a lot of us do anyway, and not even doing that well as it seems that game killing bugs never seem to hit reviewers (no Pokemon reviewer got a corrupt save, or Skyrim reviewer had severe slowdown?)

Of course, if you post or tweet anything that can be summed up as "I got something and you don't HA HA." you're just being a dick and deserve the hate mail you get.
 

option1soul

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Just my 2 cents:

In my state, Michigan, it's actually ILLEGAL to make your employees pay for work related expenses incurred while on the job. For example, if I dropped and broke a tray full of dishes at a serving job- by law they couldn't make me pay for the damages.

Making game reviewers pay for their games and systems would be like making a server pay for all the food they served. Or making construction workers pay for their own hard hats and building materials. I agree with Jim, most people should know this stuff.

Honestly, it shows integrity and belief in their products when game/publishing companies give out copies of their game for review. It says: "We made a game and we believe in it enough that we're willing to let you speak your influential mind about it in well read public spaces." You should be more wary of companies that DON'T give their games/systems out for review, as they would more likely have something to hide.
 

leviadragon99

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Well... yeah.

This is yet another issue where I can't believe the immediate response to the obvious sane position isn't a resounding duh.

Seriously guys? We have to be told this stuff?

Having said that, an excellent point on the tackiness of the hashtag photo-tweets that send entirely the wrong message.