Jimquisition: The Poison of Pre-Order Culture

[hermes]

And I can't even remotely agree with Jim here:
Alien Isolation is about Amanda Ripley. Selling a DLC with the original Nostromo Crew (which are all but one, at the time Isolation takes place, are kinda, sorta... you know... dead?) telling a story we already know, then that's fine by me. It's a bonus in every way.
Now if the game would advertise itself as playable version of the original movie or a parallel story where you may run into the original cast, it would be a whole different case. But as it stands, it's not. And if you don't want to pre-order or get the DLC later but still want to know about it... Alien is over 25 years old - get it and freaking watch it!

To be fair, I am totally fine with this AFTER they said the DLC would be available for people to buy after release. In fact, it gives me some hope for the game, since it won't be another sequel where you have to redo many setpieces of the movie because: "nostalgia!!" (see Colonial Marines or Ghostbusters)
The problem was that for some time (and probably at the time Jim made this video), it looked like the ONLY way to get the DLC would be via preorders in gamestop, which was just stupid...

 

[MonkeyPunch]

At this point, the only time I preorder games is for Pokemon. You ALWAYS know what your gonna get.

Actually I would say that preordering Nintendo games is the safest thing you can do. You hardly if ever get scammed.

No and no.

How do you know? You quite simply don't. Nowadays developers rarely keep exactly the same staff for long periods of time like they used to in the 80's and 90's so you can't even base it on knowing the developer.

There's no way of telling in advance if game development has been fraught with peril. You could for example argue that the Battlefield series was always good and you roughly knew what to expect. I bought most games. Battlefield 4 says "hello".
BF4 being a game I didn't buy because of the technical flaws and am really happy I didn't now.

I know of games in established franchises suffering because entire dev teams were swapped out - or having the game completed by another studio owned by the same publisher. There are almost infinite ways that a game can turn out shit because of how it was developed and just because the game prior to it was good - has absolutely no bearing on how the next title will end up.
Funds can be pulled, release dates shifted, directors changed - all of which can quite easily result in a games quality being substandard.

And it has nothing to do with being scammed either. The developers themselves can have the best intentions.

These are "only" games. They aren't made of rare metals and you and you can reproduce them infinitely. Why act as if they were?

 

[Demonchaser27]

Yeah, there is just nothing to say. Even indies have left a sour taste in my mouth. I might just quit gaming or just keep playing classics for a long time (Funny how that's going to be hard to do in 10 years when they can just take your game from you). Its becoming almost unbearable to continue this hobby in it's current state. Thanks devs/pubs/big corporate interests. Thanks for slowly killing the one thing I've loved since childhood. I was getting into other hobbies anyway. You know, ones that people can't claim artificial scarcity to and can't take away from you because they don't feel like "patching it to work without servers". Yeah those hobbies, ones that last.

 

[Imp_Emissary]

That was a lot of aptly used profanity and flailing about. Good job.

Indeed. Jims abillity to use words and physical comedy to do very dirty things to his viewers imaginations is top notch. xD

The ending was particularly funny while also being horrifying.

At this point, the only time I preorder games is for Pokemon. You ALWAYS know what your gonna get.

Actually I would say that preordering Nintendo games is the safest thing you can do. You hardly if ever get scammed.

Hmmm....You have a point, but it also brings a question to mind. Do Nintendo often give incentive for pre-orders?
The only one I can think of is they gave a pokemon or two to pre-orderers. Though, that could have just been for people who were early adopters, not just those who pre-ordered.

Not that that's necessarily a bad thing. In fact it leads them to still do things like having alternate costumes still be things you unlock in-game, rather than buy as DLC.

OT: As much fun as that was Jim, :/ I'm afraid to say I don't really agree with you.

Not that pre-orders can and have been used very poorly to drive up sales, or be used as meat for the hype-machine grinder.
I just don't think this pre-order deal is as bad as you say. Though, I understand why it would anger you in this way.

That said this is an good example of pretty bad "day one DLC". Having the original cast missions be DLC doesn't seem so bad to me, but having the DLC made before the game is even out isn't right. After all, if it's done, the only reason they don't add it to the rest for all copies is to keep it separate to make extra money.

I can understand why they would want to do that, but I also think they should have had something else as pre-order DLC and made this one later to be sold just as normal DLC. Heck, they could make it like Far Cry: Blood Dragon, or Dragon Age: Awakening and sell it as something that can even be played without the regular game. People probably would have bought just the DLC if it was priced right.

Thank God for you, Jim.

 

[Kmadden2004]

Trying to get us to pre-order a game before any actual gameplay has been seen reeks of desperation, and to think that I was looking forward to this game. Now I have a seeking suspicion that The Creative Assembly and Sega are working together to deliver us another turgid turd like Rome 2. Seriously these guys couldn't deliver on their flagship franchise, what makes people think that they give even the slightest fuck about Alien?

Actually, in all fairness, they have released gameplay footage, and it does at least look like it could be pretty solid on that front.

Doesn't mean you shouldn't wait for a couple of reviews before buying it, of course.

 

[LoneWolf83]

I was hyped for Alien: Isolation. Now I just feel the sad. I thought the developers cared more about the franchise and its fans than they did, but no, they just dressed up their greed in a little cosplay show. Come suck my xenomorph lollipop, it's right here in my pants. Mmm, suck it good. You want it, don't you? Yeees.

Except a few Alien vs Predator games and maybe a few Alien comics the Alien franchise hasn't had anything good in it sense Aliens, you Alien fans keep getting hyped up and then end up disappointed. At this point the you should just assume anything in the Alien franchise will be shit unless proven otherwise.

On topic: I don't pre-ordering a game. I don't even understand buying a game at launch. Why do people feel they need to get it right away? Why can't you people wait a few months or at least a week? Why do you have to have it now?

 

[Silentpony_v1legacy]

I don't fully remember, when did pre-orders become a thing? Was it Steam? I don't think I was able to pre-order Ocarina of Time or Star Wars: Podracer. Or Starcraft 1 or Diablo 2 or any game from the PS2/Xbox1 era.
And for that matter, how is pre-order still a thing? I'll admit I've pre-ordered two games in my time: Space Marine(collectors set) and Mass Effect 3(again, Collectors) and that's because I love both those franchises.
But I've never pre-ordered on Steam or another digital store.
And with digital stores never selling out - by definition they can't - the idea of pre-order should be dead. I can and will wait months and months to buy a game, usually at 50% off the launching price and with the confidence its been reviewed, patched, repaired and Let's Played.

 

[Iceklimber]

Diablo 3 was holding the equippable Wings from the FAKING COVER hostage for preorder and "Deluxe Edition" so I havent bought it. And good thing too since it turned out to be just a glorified DLC with the sole purpose of shoving a cliffhanger Ending down your throat that is supposed to make you get hyped for the next expansion.
http://blogs-images.forbes.com/erikkain/files/2014/03/reaper-main.jpg

 

[Rabbitboy]

I have never understood why people pre order to begin with. Why not wait until the reviews are out. And your right you should only pre order when there is a chance that the game will sell out quikly.
And the only game I have ever had that with is GTA V. And even then I only had to wait until the next week when they had restocked.

Also I don't give a shit about most pre order "bonuses" but that gamestop Thing is going to far. There isn't even a gameflop in this country (or at least any that I know of).

 

[gamegod25]

Had a feeling Jim would at least mention that when I first saw the article about the dlc.

As always the game industry takes something good (or at least harmless) and exploits the fuck out of it like an abusive pimp, destroying any pride or dignity for all those involved.

 

[The White Hunter]

At this point, the only time I preorder games is for Pokemon. You ALWAYS know what your gonna get.

Actually I would say that preordering Nintendo games is the safest thing you can do. You hardly if ever get scammed.

In the UK Nintendo first party stuff jumps up in price considerably after launch at times to, particularly if it's a bit more niche than the latest 3D mario.

Also any Nintendo limited edition thing is almost always actually limited and will require ebay trips to get later.

 

[Roofstone]

Eh, I pre order if I really like the collector's editions and so on. I always pre order WoW expansions for example.

 

[LTK_70]

Truth on a stick right here.

I pretty much agree with you here 99.99% if it wasn't for the fact that I pre odder Witcher 3.

This is because CD Project Red and GOG have Earned, My, Trust

On top of that it was a great deal with a lower price and discounts on GOG games. Now that's how you do a pre order.

Yeah, the metric fuckton of pre-order bonuses and loyalty discounts is a great incentive. If you pre-order something, the seller needs to give you an incentive to mitigate the risk of the game being, well, shit. And let's be honest, that risk is always substantial, even for the Witcher 3. An extra gun, an extra mission, or a special hat means jack shit to me if the game that it's in doesn't meet my expectations. A whole extra game, maybe even two or three, now that's risk mitigation.

I plan on pre-ordering from GOG as well, and the only other time I pre-ordered something was Bioshock Infinite, and they also gave me three extra games for it.

 

[Something Amyss]

I'm pretty sure the last game I pre-ordered was Burnout 3: Takedown. That was back when not every game to come out would have 80 copies on the shelves of Gamestop, and in fact there were no extra copies of Burnout 3 for over two weeks in my area (a friend who tried to get it to play with the rest of us couldn't).

In fact, one of the complaints used to be that Gamestop wouldn't hold your copy of the game and would sell those because they didn't have sufficient stock.

I suppose I might be persuaded to pre-order a game in a series I like if there's some cool limited edition swag or something. Part of the problem is that it's more and more just DLC. Stuff that would have been part of the game a generation ago, too. Used to be, you'd get statues and soundtracks and steelbook editions (oh my!). Now you get parts of the game sold back to you.

Do you really want to see AAA gaming exist in its current form or continue to play games that have their development and overall gameplay/gameflow sabotaged by day one DLC, Preorder Content, and Microtransactions?

Ecept what's been the takeaway so far? So far it's been "this game didn't sell, so it's used games and piracy's fault. Let's install online passes, pre-order "bonuses" cut from the game, Day 1 DLC, and as many other ways to sell the game twice as we can."

Game doesn't sell in that environment? They just push more pre-orders and bonuses and DLCs.

The problem then becomes that "not buying" is not a practical message sent. You can claim moral high ground, but you can't demonstrate an impact.

Hmmm....You have a point, but it also brings a question to mind. Do Nintendo often give incentive for pre-orders?
The only one I can think of is they gave a pokemon or two to pre-orderers. Though, that could have just been for people who were early adopters, not just those who pre-ordered.

Most of the Pokémon games I've seen have had some sort of minor bonus.

However, Pokémon are among the few games I've seen end up in short supply in this modern world of bogus pre-orders. That in itself might be incentive to do so. I mean, I don't think I've ever wanted a Pokémon game bad enough to try for a day one purchase, but If you've got to have it, a pre-order seems a decent way to assure you do.

Plus, as most of the games are handheld titles, you aren't likely to see a depreciated price in a couple of months like console games. There seems to be a lot fewer drawbacks and potentially more benefits to simply pre-ordering.

Of course, if you don't mind going digital, you can just buy Pokémon games that way now. So even they're not truly limited anymore. But then, Gamestop doesn't get their cut.

 

[Andy Shandy]

Yeah, I only pre-order if I'm getting a decent discount on the game beforehand, which coincidentally is becoming much rarer these days thanks to these fucking pre-order bonuses.

So yeah, I'm with you Jim, fuck pre-orders.

 

[Xman490]

And I can't even remotely agree with Jim here:
Alien Isolation is about Amanda Ripley. Selling a DLC with the original Nostromo Crew (which are all but one, at the time Isolation takes place, are kinda, sorta... you know... dead?) telling a story we already know, then that's fine by me. It's a bonus in every way.

Yes, and pre-ordering is basically the same as buying a game on its launch period without the benefit of reviews to question its quality - and even then, some games are reviewed just before they're launched.

Is pre-ordering a game a faulty maneuver in this age of months-later discounts? Yes, but it is better than buying on launch when extra content exists and one is fully aware that the game itself is going to be good, such as if the game is in an established series. Sure, there are games like Duke Nukem Forever, Colonial Marines, and even Watch Dogs that do not reach expectations, but when a game's trailers are many months apart and/or don't show much, one can doubt the quality of the finished product.

Also, a reviewer might as well pre-order games since he/she is practically required to review them.

 

[DarkhoIlow]

I agree that preordering is bad, but I want to support my favorite developers so I made the decision of preordering Witcher 3 Collector's Edition because they are limited so I got in the queue of getting one.

 

[SilverUchiha]

Jim, I agree with you to a point. After seeing Aliens Colonial Marines or Watch_Dogs and how they either lied to us through pre-orders or just had so many different pre-orider deals that it wasn't worth it at all, I can see that Pre-order culture has gotten carried away with out it works and needs to dial back.

However, I am on the side that still believes that pre-ordering games isn't inherently bad. There are SOME companies that still make pre-ordering games worthwhile. When Grasshopper released Killer is Dead, they were giving out artbooks and soundtracks to pre-orders at no extra charge. There are stores (like gamestop, sadly) that won't have certain games in stock if you don't pre-order them, especially true lately (from what one of their employees told me) in regards to Nintendo games. Saying that they won't get as much (or any) of a Nintendo game sent to them if they don't pre-order because Nintendo is pushing for more focus on their digital distribution. And I don't always want to do digital Nintendo games due to limited storage space on 3DS and WiiU (even with external memory or SD cards plugged in).

I think the thing to consider when pre-ordering is whether or not the dev/publisher is known for actively screwing with customers and whether or not pre-ordering the game guarantees you'll be able to get it versus not getting it at all. I refuse to say that pre-ordering is 100% good or 100% bad. It's just something people need to think about before actually going through with it. The last game I pre-ordered was Bayonetta 2 because it looked great, Platinum has never been an asshole company to me, it's going to be a Nintendo exclusive, and given how popular Bayonetta is, I'm not sure how well stocked my usual stores will be. It's not like Smash Bros where we already know it'll sell well, so I'm not worried about them running out of copies anytime soon.

 

[babinro]

And I can't even remotely agree with Jim here:
Alien Isolation is about Amanda Ripley. Selling a DLC with the original Nostromo Crew (which are all but one, at the time Isolation takes place, are kinda, sorta... you know... dead?) telling a story we already know, then that's fine by me. It's a bonus in every way.
Now if the game would advertise itself as playable version of the original movie or a parallel story where you may run into the original cast, it would be a whole different case. But as it stands, it's not. And if you don't want to pre-order or get the DLC later but still want to know about it... Alien is over 25 years old - get it and freaking watch it!

This DLC seems no worse on paper than Mass Effect 3 giving you a playable Prothean character or Arkham City letting you play as Catwoman for a couple hours. On paper, these things felt like they were genuinely denying the gamer a good experience if you choose not to buy them. In reality, they were neat additions but ultimately felt like DLC content.

I can absolutely understand why people would be upset about this but it just may be a case of people blowing this out of proportion as well. I guess we'll know more when the game comes out.

 

[ObsidianJones_v1legacy]

And I can't even remotely agree with Jim here:
Alien Isolation is about Amanda Ripley. Selling a DLC with the original Nostromo Crew (which are all but one, at the time Isolation takes place, are kinda, sorta... you know... dead?) telling a story we already know, then that's fine by me. It's a bonus in every way.
Now if the game would advertise itself as playable version of the original movie or a parallel story where you may run into the original cast, it would be a whole different case. But as it stands, it's not. And if you don't want to pre-order or get the DLC later but still want to know about it... Alien is over 25 years old - get it and freaking watch it!

Im with this guy here. I kind of think that the dlc is both justified and makes a full purchase of the new game worth it. The only thing stingy here is that sega doesnt have my trust like cd project but perhaps this is there way of being sincere. Time will tell.


Plus someone pointed out how they are trying to "force it down your throat before gameplay is revealed. Well youl still be able to preorder right up until near the game comes out and we have a whole slew of gameplay videos to watch. So if someone wants to preorder now and risk getting dashconned in the process(OH! OH!!!!!! ) lmao Well thats on them.

I'm half on the train that you guys are on. It does seem like only a few of us remember that this was supposed to be Amanda's story. I haven't played the game yet, but if this was created as purely Amanda's story and the developers thought it would be cool (AKA: A desperate lure that few people would pass over) to add content to the game, I can get behind that.

And more over... it's free content. I keep looking to see where you have to pay extra because I never pre-ordered before. Looking up the process, it seems like you put 5 dollars down to pre-order, and that five dollars is taken off of the final purchase? So, in a sense it would be like getting '400 Days' bundled with the Walking Dead Season 1 for really no extra money.

I know I've been screwed over with having to buy extra content to get the 'full experience of the game', but I don't count other's people's journeys the 'full experience of the game' if the game is about Amanda. And double that if you're not really paying extra. But my point is summed up in essence... Will being Ellen somehow change the main story of Amanda? Like, if flushing out the Alien as Ellen changes plot and development and gives you extra levels in Amanda's main story line? If so, then we are being robbed. If Amanda's story will be just as full and good (or bad) no matter if you get to play as Ellen... I really don't care. I haven't lost or gained any thing is I'm here just for Amanda's story.

I personally hate the idea of pre-order bonuses, to be fair. Like for a skin for a gun that really doesn't mean anything to me. I won't buy this game for the pre-order, because I really don't see the need to. I only set foot in Gamestop twice in the last five years to get Xbox 360 controllers for my gaming laptop. I haven't... ever bought a game from Gamestop I think and I have no reason to start now that I game on pc. Brick and Mortars mean nothing to me.

However, I get if someone sees what Alien Isolation does, realize they are getting an add-on for the same price as the full product (if my research is correct) and says "Good deal, I'm on board."