Jimquisition: The Poison of Pre-Order Culture

[Triaed]

... not to mention that you are paying upfront for a product/service you have not received and will not receive for a long while. Besides making your mom cringe for doing that, the AAA company is getting money for free which can bolster its financials and encourage this behaviour. Interest alone is significant, just by having millions of dollars sitting pretty in the bank.

Nice salad toss, Jimbo

 

[LaoJim]

I've never really understood the whole pre-order thing. Perhaps it comes with growing up in a village in the 1980's. Even if there was something I really wanted, I'd still have to wait weeks for my parents to decide it was time for trip to our local city to get it, (assuming that I already had cash saved for it). And my friends were all in the same position, so there was no "shame" if you didn't have the latest thing immediately. Come to think of it, games weren't hyped for years in advance, so the first I'd know of a game was typically when it was reviewed in a monthly magazine, by which time it had already probably been out for quite a while anyway.

These days, it seems like you're not a real fan of something even if you merely buy it on the first day of release.

Anyway, I'm feeling old now.

With regards to Isolation, Sony had done a lot to make people genuinely excited about this game even after the Colonial Marines debacle. Instead of saying "Hey we know we screwed up with the last game, but this one is better and when the reviews (and word of mouth) is out, everyone will see it", they are pushing pre-order bonuses harder than ever.

Incidently, I asked this on another thread and didn't get an answer. Is the audio for this game completely new and recorded by basically the whole of the cast? Has this been confirmed or are they just going to plunder the original audio from the movie?

 

[themilo504]

I?ve stopped pre ordering after Rome 2 was released unfinished, nowadays all that pre order bonuses do is convince me to wait for steam sales and game of the year editions.

 

[Luminos564]

Last time I pre-ordered was for Blazblue Chronophantasma Limited Edition. Did it out of respect for the developer (Arc System Works) and very happily shelled out nearly $100 for it even though I personally did not really care for most of the bonuses (only the artbook). Turns out the game's localization was poor at best, the music files are not formatted properly (or something like that) so they don't work as intended and just to put the cherry on top, it turns out they cut the Library (a glossary of terms explaining fighting game terms and the Blazblue lore) from the NA version for a very dubious reason.

I am DONE with pre-orders. I'll gladly buy the games at launch if need be like with the upcoming Persona 4 Arena Ultimax or the to be released 2015 localized version of Under Night In-Birth EXE: Late. But I am never going to pre-order for expensive LEs again. I and by extension, my wallet, have had enough. It just is not worth it.

 

[MonkeyPunch]

Totally. I've hated (and never actually understood) pre-ordering. I have to this very day, never pre-ordered a game.
I never saw the point and the risk always seemed too high.

Nowaydays companies sometimes make the game ever so slightly cheaper on pre-order or add in some bullshit content which they cut from the original game.

Pre-orders and 95% of DLC can fudge itself.
These are things in the game industry that make me like gaming less and less.

Another thing that hits me are the gaming consumers. They so readily do things which are only for the Publishers good and then on top of things go off and defend them...

 

[Chuppi]

I´m totally not a fan, of these pre-order extras, but saying, that the original cast should have been included, in Isolation is like buying an Aliens-DVD and then being disapointed, that it doesn´t include the first movie.

 

[zerabp]

There is one good reason to preorder games that you know you are going to purchase Jim at least from Amazon and that reason is same day delivery. Other than that I fully agree with you. Preorder bonuses, especially store exclusive ones are almost as annoying as a poorly made game.

 

[EiMitch]

And I can't even remotely agree with Jim here:
Alien Isolation is about Amanda Ripley. Selling a DLC with the original Nostromo Crew (which are all but one, at the time Isolation takes place, are kinda, sorta... you know... dead?) telling a story we already know, then that's fine by me. It's a bonus in every way.

And why is it that way? Oh, thats right: because the developers and publishers chose to make it that way. And while I do agree that the original cast of Alien is a bonus, that doesn't mean it has to be sold separately. Bonus content can be part of the main package. And such things were part of the main game package before DLC and Pre-Order culture sank their fangs into the industry. This is like selling us cheat codes and alternate costumes separately, only to a much worse degree.

This isn't something created after the fact like Bioshock Infinite's Burial at Sea. Its available as a pre-order bonus. And it'll very likely be on-disc. There is no reason for this to be separate from the main game except to milk extra money from customers and/or Gamestop.

But if you're going to accept and defend this, then you might as well defend Nintendo if they decide tomorrow to lock Captain Falcon behind a pre-order/DLC paywall in Smash Bros U.

 

[Szadek]

I only pre-order CE,because that usually the only way to get them.
I don't even care about the DLC's,most of the time I give them away anyway.
For me,there is no reason to pre-order the normal version,they are not running out anytime soon.

 

[Luminos564]

Totally. I've hated (and never actually understood) pre-ordering. I have to this very day, never pre-ordered a game.
I never saw the point and the risk always seemed too high.

It didn't used to be like this. In the PS2 era, Limited Edition pre-orders were done very well. I still have the Persona 4 artbook I got from it, long after the disc broke and my PS2 damaged beyond repair. I'm thinking Jim alluded to the reason in this video and before: digital market took over. Now you can add more content to your game very easily whereas before you'd have had to shell out more money for a whole new edition. Unfortunately, a good number of companies see this as a means of "producing less for the same profit". Or rather "more profit" considering how much they try to nickle and dime everyone.

 

[youji itami]

I was hyped for Alien: Isolation. Now I just feel the sad. I thought the developers cared more about the franchise and its fans than they did, but no, they just dressed up their greed in a little cosplay show. Come suck my xenomorph lollipop, it's right here in my pants. Mmm, suck it good. You want it, don't you? Yeees.

The developers do care it's the publisher's who are c**t's,

 

[Soulrender95]

I'd really like Alien Isolation to be THE definitive alien game, and was if'ing and ahh'ing over whether or not to preorder it but the classic cast 'bonus' put me right off, I love the franchise and the game looks like it's going to be great (operative word: looks like) and I've been looking for a good horror game, but this looks like essentially an expansion pack's worth of content and frankly if I'm dropping £50+ on a disc I want all the content to be on the disc, not have a giant portion hacked off to get me to reaffirm my commitment to buying the game or having to pay another £10 later to access that content.

Sega by removing this level of content you might have guaranteed yourself thousands of pre-orders, but you've also cost yourself a sale as well, I will now be waiting and buying either second hand, in a sale or a complete edition if there is one.

moving on to the subject of high street games retailers and preorders, anyone who works there, I know it's probably mandated that you have to ask but please, take it from me if someone tells you no they don't want to preorder a game don't ask again and add in all the fancy "preorder bonuses" stuff, if the customer doesn't want to buy the game the extra content isn't going to get them to change their mind, I had to say no three times last week because the cashier wanted to know if I wanted to preorder 'destiny', once should be enough.

 

[josh4president]

6:49

"Jews games are killing the industry!"

Well I can honestly say I wasn't expecting to hear that.

(And yes I know he didn't actually say that it just sounded like it)

 

[senordesol]

I'm calling BS on that 'impersonation', Jim! That was an obvious dub-over of actual dialog.

You're better than that Sterling!

 

[Demonchaser27]

So, uh, what do we do about it?

I've tried setting my heels and standing on principle before, and I've noticed two primary reactions:
#1. The people who make these decisions interpret me not playing their game as a lack of interest and murder the game/genre in its crib
#2. The tide of people who don't care how much they're exploited makes my stance irrelevant.

I realize that this idiomatically similar to negotiating with terrorists, but I'm not convinced that this industry wouldn't be murdered fucking dead if we resist the shenanigans. If we video game fans get a reputation with investors as being balky and unpredictable, that means fewer investors and even less risks than the already paltry amount currently being taken.

Steam looks pretty fucking bleak to me, speaking as someone who just joined the glorious PC gaming master race. While I would accept a world where the only games made were indie games, I'd much rather have some AAA still on the menu.

How should defeat preorders without defeating the existence of AAA gaming?

Well, I guess a question to answer your question would be:

Do you really want to see AAA gaming exist in its current form or continue to play games that have their development and overall gameplay/gameflow sabotaged by day one DLC, Preorder Content, and Microtransactions?

I know you kind of answered that, but i don't know, think really hard, lol.

 

[ddrkreature]

The only time I pre-order anything is when I know for a fact that I'm going to get the game day 1 and there is a worthwhile incentive for doing so. Character skins don't count. I'll admit I pre-ordered Destiny but that's because I was able to get into the Alpha and I liked what I played of it. If I play the Beta and find it bland or unappealing, I'll cancel.I do agree that Pre-order stuff is getting ridiculous. It went from being a convenience to a hindrance.

FINE - "Pre-order *title* to upgrade to the limited edition for free, which includes a map, artbook, and soundtrack download"

NOT FINE - "Pre-order *title* today to get 30 minutes of extra content and a free map for Multiplayer. Preorder the super mega pre-order gamestop edition for access to the first DLC and a free hat for your avatar!"

I'm actually a little scared that the movie industry will do the same thing now that you can pre-order a movie while it's still in theaters.

 

[hermes]

And I can't even remotely agree with Jim here:
Alien Isolation is about Amanda Ripley. Selling a DLC with the original Nostromo Crew (which are all but one, at the time Isolation takes place, are kinda, sorta... you know... dead?) telling a story we already know, then that's fine by me. It's a bonus in every way.
Now if the game would advertise itself as playable version of the original movie or a parallel story where you may run into the original cast, it would be a whole different case. But as it stands, it's not. And if you don't want to pre-order or get the DLC later but still want to know about it... Alien is over 25 years old - get it and freaking watch it!

To be fair, I am totally fine with this AFTER they said the DLC would be available for people to buy after release. In fact, it gives me some hope for the game, since it won't be another sequel where you have to redo many setpieces of the movie because: "nostalgia!!" (see Colonial Marines or Ghostbusters)
The problem was that for some time (and probably at the time Jim made this video), it looked like the ONLY way to get the DLC would be via preorders in gamestop, which was just stupid...

 

[MonkeyPunch]

At this point, the only time I preorder games is for Pokemon. You ALWAYS know what your gonna get.

Actually I would say that preordering Nintendo games is the safest thing you can do. You hardly if ever get scammed.

No and no.

How do you know? You quite simply don't. Nowadays developers rarely keep exactly the same staff for long periods of time like they used to in the 80's and 90's so you can't even base it on knowing the developer.

There's no way of telling in advance if game development has been fraught with peril. You could for example argue that the Battlefield series was always good and you roughly knew what to expect. I bought most games. Battlefield 4 says "hello".
BF4 being a game I didn't buy because of the technical flaws and am really happy I didn't now.

I know of games in established franchises suffering because entire dev teams were swapped out - or having the game completed by another studio owned by the same publisher. There are almost infinite ways that a game can turn out shit because of how it was developed and just because the game prior to it was good - has absolutely no bearing on how the next title will end up.
Funds can be pulled, release dates shifted, directors changed - all of which can quite easily result in a games quality being substandard.

And it has nothing to do with being scammed either. The developers themselves can have the best intentions.

These are "only" games. They aren't made of rare metals and you and you can reproduce them infinitely. Why act as if they were?

 

[Demonchaser27]

Yeah, there is just nothing to say. Even indies have left a sour taste in my mouth. I might just quit gaming or just keep playing classics for a long time (Funny how that's going to be hard to do in 10 years when they can just take your game from you). Its becoming almost unbearable to continue this hobby in it's current state. Thanks devs/pubs/big corporate interests. Thanks for slowly killing the one thing I've loved since childhood. I was getting into other hobbies anyway. You know, ones that people can't claim artificial scarcity to and can't take away from you because they don't feel like "patching it to work without servers". Yeah those hobbies, ones that last.

 

[Imp_Emissary]

That was a lot of aptly used profanity and flailing about. Good job.

Indeed. Jims abillity to use words and physical comedy to do very dirty things to his viewers imaginations is top notch. xD

The ending was particularly funny while also being horrifying.

At this point, the only time I preorder games is for Pokemon. You ALWAYS know what your gonna get.

Actually I would say that preordering Nintendo games is the safest thing you can do. You hardly if ever get scammed.

Hmmm....You have a point, but it also brings a question to mind. Do Nintendo often give incentive for pre-orders?
The only one I can think of is they gave a pokemon or two to pre-orderers. Though, that could have just been for people who were early adopters, not just those who pre-ordered.

Not that that's necessarily a bad thing. In fact it leads them to still do things like having alternate costumes still be things you unlock in-game, rather than buy as DLC.

OT: As much fun as that was Jim, :/ I'm afraid to say I don't really agree with you.

Not that pre-orders can and have been used very poorly to drive up sales, or be used as meat for the hype-machine grinder.
I just don't think this pre-order deal is as bad as you say. Though, I understand why it would anger you in this way.

That said this is an good example of pretty bad "day one DLC". Having the original cast missions be DLC doesn't seem so bad to me, but having the DLC made before the game is even out isn't right. After all, if it's done, the only reason they don't add it to the rest for all copies is to keep it separate to make extra money.

I can understand why they would want to do that, but I also think they should have had something else as pre-order DLC and made this one later to be sold just as normal DLC. Heck, they could make it like Far Cry: Blood Dragon, or Dragon Age: Awakening and sell it as something that can even be played without the regular game. People probably would have bought just the DLC if it was priced right.

Thank God for you, Jim.