Jimquisition: Too Cool To Be Cool

Baresark

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And here I thought we were passed getting outraged by Duke Nukem till the game at least came out. Whine Whine, he's such a jerk, I don't like him, he isn't ironic enough, whine whine. If you take Duke seriously, you are mentally deficient. I have never seen or played a Duke Nukem game (and I've been playing them since the first ones came out) where I thought he was so bad ass. I mean, in the first games, he didn't even have a character really. By 3D he did, but at no point did anyone actually think he was cool. The character of Duke enhanced the gameplay experience, but it wasn't the end all be all of the game. I would imagine this is gonna be the same with DNF. Sonic Colours did well, not because Sonic all of the suddenly was less serious or idiotic, but because it's the first game in a while that didn't do 3D. It was a 3D world, but Sonic moved on a 2D plain. You should pick up a review because they all mentioned how great Sonic is on a 2D plain and that is why the game is fun.

I think you missed the point completely, games aren't movies or novels or any other medium where character is the primary focus. In games, the characters always hold second fiddle to the actual game play mechanics. Sonic failed for years because it didn't translate to 3D well at all. Duke is a character that will gladly punch the aliens in the balls to get a job done, but it's all about getting the job done and how fun it is to get it done. I remember the good old days when the only characterization was what you read about them in the game manual. That is not to say that better characterization hasn't enhanced games, but it's still not the primary focus.

Once again, if you take Duke seriously, you're a complete dumbass. Because, at no point was Duke ever actually cool. He did cool things and was mostly lucky not to get killed in the end.
 

Varya

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Nov 23, 2009
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I agree with your point, but not the example. Duke Nukem works because they play it straight. He becomes ironic because he acts like a total douche, and no one calls him out on it. He is the main character in his world and the fact that he is aloud to be that without "reality" calling him out on his ridiculousness is what makes him funny.
Otherwise, great episode.
 

OblivionSoul

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I agree with a bunch of his points here, but as a couple other people here have also said, I do not agree with his vision of Duke Nukem. I think by supposedly playing the character straight, they make a great satire of the genre he mocks.
 

Mike Laserbeam

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I liked it.
I certainly find Jimquisition MUCH easier to stomach than a lot of the stuff on this site. (Not ZP, Movie Bob or Extra Credits though)
 

SoranMBane

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This is pretty much what I've been thinking for a while now. I really don't like Duke Nukem as a character, and it's not just because he's a misogynistic douchebag, but because he's a misogynistic douchebag who never receives and karmic backlash for being a misogynistic douchebag. If bad things were to happen to him for his bad behavior, a bit like a video game equivalent of Johnny Bravo, then I'd be fine with the idea of him being some sort of parody. Unfortunately, that doesn't happen, so all we're left with is an asshole who we're apparently supposed to admire for all the things that make him so horrible and it just doesn't work.
 

Slash47

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Leveling... Tbh I don't think Duke Nukem should be 'explained' and I don't think you should point out you're not 100% serious. I do agree that Dante in Devil May Cry 3 was spot on in this regard, although I somewhat doubt it was on purpose.
 

Skyy High

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I honestly can't decide if this video was serious, in which case it hilariously missed the point of Duke Nukem, or if it's supposed to be so awfully wrong that it's obviously not supposed to be taken seriously.
If the former: hell no, we don't need hipster "irony" seeping into anything else. It should be possible to know to not take something seriously without the creators winking at you the entire time. I don't know if it's just people trying to be PC, or the saturation of our culture with terrible attempts at being "ironic" that subtlety is completely alien to most people, but seriously, just because Duke isn't self-deprecating doesn't mean he's supposed to be an "idol".
If the latter: well played. I'm giving the benefit of the doubt and going with the latter interpretation, because a) it's funnier, b) I like the Escapist and I don't think they'd give airtime to someone who seriously wants to "cheese up" Duke, c) it fits with the rest of the video, and d) it'd be some of the goddamn best trolling I've ever seen.
 

daftnoize

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JoJoDeathunter said:
Great, these episodes just get better and better, I agree that Sonic is seriously annoying how he tries to be cool all the time. Keep 'em coming Jim!
I completely agree. I'm so glad that Jim has blatantly stated that he is portraying an uber arrogant image. As for duke nukem, i'm still really ashamed by it. I think that its ultimate lack of irony (which "gamers" will try and defend until the sun explodes)and its willfully stupid nature is appalling. I don't want to play that game its designed for an immature mind and if you try and defend it as satire then you fully deserve the title pretentious.

I feel really strongly about this and am not simply trying to flame. We need less of duke nukem figures in gaming.

Iff it were blatantly ironic then maybe i'd have time for the game.

Well done on the episode Jim you've earned a loyal follower.
 

Triforceformer

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Gotta say, you've really gotten better with these videos lately, Jim. While I do agree with you on the Sonic thing, I'm sort of uncertain regarding the Duke. Because while being openly sarcastic would work great for Sonic, Duke isn't really about that. The absurdity of everything, Duke's jokes, and twin-girl blowjob, is played straight, but only from Duke's perspective. Everything that happens in Duke's world happens because it makes sense in there. It's when we apply our filter of reality to whatever the fuck is going on in the game does it become amusing, humorous, and sarcastic.

Randy Pitchford doesn't really expect us to idolize Duke Nukem, but more to play along with the Duke, humoring his corny one-liners and extreme alien prejudice. I know this doesn't make alot of sense, but open sarcasm and self-deprecation may not turn out too well for Duke. At most you might have the EDF troops that accompany Duke going "Eh, that's a little weak" to one of Duke's lines or something without it getting too bad. It's sort of like how Metalocalypse can be seen as a show that openly mocks and attacks celebrity worship and the trouble it brings.

Overall, good episode, but I don't really agree with you in regards to Duke Nukem.
 

alexbaxthedarkside

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May 21, 2009
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Nice Episode Jim, i admire your guts in pointing this out. Calling out the haters that they are reading to much into it is great :D

Myabe more winkin at camera would be nice from Duke, we shall see.
 

AceAngel

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The point Jim is trying to raise (which I think he could have done better by the way, not a nay sayer, just saying the video could have expanded better in this area) is that although Duke is the King of his world, no one questions him, not a single person, not even the enemies.

Before I go one, I would say the humor is better as of now, I liked it MUCH better.

Take for example Malcom in the Middle, that show is the perfect example of what I mean, craziness usually called out by something more realistic or crazier to the crazy before hands, and Duke doesn't have this, they go for the middle ground formula without an aid to help the humor, which is very dangerous as it can stale pretty fast, and Borderlands is the proof for this, save for the fact that the player doesn't have a persona, so that enables personal proxy to the game.

Another example: having a Chief Commander say how impressive Duke's strategy is when he drew a dingle berry on the white-board, only then to have the player hear by proxy that soldiers are dieing and Commander still insisting they use Duke's phallus as their holy guide, or a soldier, rookie, questions Duke's strategy only to have the Commander smack talk him, are other examples of how Duke's humor can be aided in being funnier and by proxy, being something the player can relate to in someway to our world. Hell, if a boss which can speak asks Duke on why he does what he does, and shakes it's head in dismay, or tries to out-rude Duke only to have Duke mock himself and the enemy in turn, that's another way to get to it, and work wonders.

It's funny how people thought this was the best episode so far from Jim, when for me, while he had a good points, didn't expand to much. Not blowing my own horn here, but honestly, between the Facebook comments and the one in this thread about the points he made, are people misunderstanding Jim, or has my brain grown so much overnight that I'm living in the world of Idiocracy and I'm the last hope to sire a capable offspring?

NOTE: If you're going to quote me for the last paragraph of my post to have a battle-royale, I suggest you save your clicks for something else.
 
Dec 27, 2010
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I dont think people understand what he's saying about DN, its not that he's a serious character, it's that in the game world he's taking to seriously, as in nobody in the world looks down at him. Anyway, I'm not saying to agree with him, I'm saying to discuss what he meant, not what you misunderstood.
 

mronoc

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If irony is too obvious, why bother? Irony is only funny if it has it's brief moments where it fools you into thinking it's being completely serious. Duke Nukem's irony spreads beyond the character and into the entire universe. Duke Nukem is like Captain Hindsight from the Coon and Friends trilogy in South Park. We all realize that his powers are completely useless, but no one in the show ever acknowledges that fact. Seriously, does Jim really need other characters to tell him how he's supposed to feel about Duke Nukem?
 

dontlooknow

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As Jim Stirling stumbles blindly towards his conclusion, I can?t help thinking about the biggest problem I had with the Jimquisition in pervious episodes, and this one in particular ? the complete lack of evidenced irony. Stirling is not a man we?re meant to pity or laugh at or be discussed with in anyway; he makes awful jokes and he?s a podgy fool with no sense of taste. But rather than make that a point of comedy with the character, we?re supposed to actively think he?s a brilliant and wonderful guy. To me this is the fundamental difference between Stirling and Yahtzee. One is played straight, the other not so much; Yahtzee actually is an arrogant dick and we?re not supposed to think otherwise, when Stirling makes a terrible joke, he?s never called out on it, the joke is played straight and we?re meant to laugh. I think it?s embarrassing to see a character with such forced arrogance that we?re supposed to think is cool.

Indeed Mr Stirling, I must be a fucking idiot.
 

endnuen

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I find this hard to take seriously.
Duke is the ludicrous fantasy of macho man-ism. The absolutely right way.
 

Baresark

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mjc0961 said:
CINN4M0N said:
If what you say is true, it's everyone else who is missing the point of Duke. Pretty much all of his fanbase does take him seriously and act like he's a great character. People parrot off "I've got balls of steel." and "I'm here to kick ass and chew bubble gum, and I'm all outta gum." like they're scripture or something. People do treat Duke as an idol, so if you're sure that they aren't supposed to, then nearly everyone is missing the point.
You honestly take Duke seriously? The things Duke say are things that get repeated around friends when no one is being serious. That should give you some kind of clue that it's not meant to be taken seriously. No one idolizes Duke, it's a strange concept all together.

Also, he parroted that line from an action movie starring Rowdy Roddy Piper. I mean, if you just watch the movie They Live, it's pretty much Duke on film. Big muscular guy, rough around the edges, doesn't give a damn what anyone thinks. His character was created after the 80's action movie started losing popularity. He isn't trying to keep it alive, he is a parody of it.
 

Woodsey

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Zabriskie Point said:
I don't think I've met a single person who actually takes Duke seriously. Gearbox definitely doesn't. I mean, come on, you can throw literal shit in the game. You can pick up turds and throw them. That may be the least serious game mechanic I've ever seen.
That's more game mechanics though, not the character himself. The character himself takes himself seriously and is viewed in a positive light seriously in the game.

OT: I kind of agree. I think people do view him as a cool character - a fucking stupid one too, but nevertheless cool. He could definitely do with the whole self-parody thing now though, given how irrelevant what he's already parodying now is.

This segment has grown on me considerably by the way - several laughs along the way in this video.
 

jhlip

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emusega said:
Alright you've got a point. Not bad this episode.
I think it's a little sad that you need to point out that your persona is meant in an ironic way. Not because you want to, but because people wouldn't get it.
I fully agree with this statement.