Right, because your not basing any of your points on opinions at all, and your applying a liberal amount of facts here too right? Right...? I mean, you had evidence to back up that people don't keep their games? I'm just saying anecdotal evidence is better than what you have, which is none. I mean, I keep my games instead of trading them in, so I can replay them. But that's just my experience so it obviously doesn't matter. I mean, your complaints about lack of evidence really is kind of strange when you have hardly any evidence for what you said. Also, what evidence do you have for Steam users not having Dial-Up, because I used Steam with Dial-Up at one point. Sure, downloads were painful, but at least I could play games.Akalabeth said:Holy Snip...
All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing.Jimothy Sterling said:But surely the fact I *do* bite the hand that feeds me is better than me playing nice with it to get review copies. Fact is, I say shit like this, at the risk of my other job, and yes I do so proudly. I don't see it as a conflict. In fact, one episode explicitly is about loving games as art and hating them as a business. Jimquisition attacks the business, as a reviewer I discuss the art. And in games where business impacts the art, I let rip.AWAR said:First of all, any kind of exposure from your part can be considered promotion. I don't follow you outside of the escapist, but you do seem to have quite a sizable audience that watches your reviews.Jimothy Sterling said:-snip
The reason I called you a hypocrite, and yes I'm aware of its meaning, is because for the past few weeks all you rave about is how bad Microsoft, EA, Sony et al are screwing us gamers. The way I see it, since you are a game reviewer after all and not a consumer advocate, is that you seem to bite the same hand that feeds you, making a show out of it and being proud of it. In my opinion the best kind of defense against these terrible business practices is ignoring them and moving on to different, less terrible things. Provided of course you want them to stop.
But maybe you are right, I should wait until it's out and you have your way with it before criticizing you. Some negative exposure might do the trick. Maybe. I really doubt it though.
Frankly, my not covering the Xbox One could ONLY help Microsoft, giving it one less potentially bad review. People call for people like me to shut up and say nothing, but that's not helping ANYone.
As you said, you only watch Jimquisition, so you probably aren't qualified to tell me what I'm a hypocrite on as far as anything else I do goes. You're really assuming the worst and using it as a strawman which, in all fairness, is a logical fallacy.
That is not what I said. In future please try to take into account the person I'm quoting before quoting me. I really don't care if people like things that I don't. What I was getting at is that people who are willing to take it up the ass (metaphorically speaking) as long as they get spoon fed their favourite franchise(s) are idiots.Lightknight said:So then, anyone who plays a game that they enjoy and you don't must be an idiot? Man, I wish I had that world view, it'd make disagreements with people so much simpler. "*gasp* you prefer chocolate to vanilla? You must be an idiot!", "*gasp*, you prefer historical fiction to bibliographies?! You must be an idiot!" If only I could get planetary bodies to also revolve around me then I'd be all set.canadamus_prime said:In other words idiots, frat boys, and kids.
To anyone who enjoys COD, and there are a lot of those people, more than the ones that enjoy pretty much any other game (as far as gamers' wallets indicate), please note that it's also sold on the ps4 which is looking to be a promising system.
On the other hand, people who only play COD have to connect to the internet anyways. So this wouldn't be such a problem for them.
I don't think it will. Forums like this and the users that populate them represent a tiny minority of the gaming public. Most people do not follow developers, publishers, hardware, and similar things. Even E-famous personalities like Jim Sterling and Yahtzee reach a very small number of gamers overall. At the end of the day most people who go out there and buy an X-box will be totally unaware of these kinds of details, and by the time they find out they will already be committed.Antari said:I really can't wait to start seeing some numbers on how bad this hurts them.
/End argument. Something like this is about what I was going to say. Akalabeth couldn't be more obviously wrong if he drummed up a committee to come up with the worst forum arguments possible, and yet he keeps arguing.TheSpyIsASpyWDZ said:Right, because your not basing any of your points on opinions at all, and your applying a liberal amount of facts here too right? Right...? I mean, you had evidence to back up that people don't keep their games? I'm just saying anecdotal evidence is better than what you have, which is none. I mean, I keep my games instead of trading them in, so I can replay them. But that's just my experience so it obviously doesn't matter. I mean, your complaints about lack of evidence really is kind of strange when you have hardly any evidence for what you said. Also, what evidence do you have for Steam users not having Dial-Up, because I used Steam with Dial-Up at one point. Sure, downloads were painful, but at least I could play games.Akalabeth said:Holy Snip...
Not really. When other industries do crap like this they at least TRY to hide the fact that they're screwing their customers all the time, they couldn't get away with being this exploitive AND being this blatant about it, and if it's revealed to the world that they do crap like this, they quickly reverse things or end up dying out. However, the gaming industry not only treats it's customers like nothing more than walking wallets, they flaunt the fact that they do this and yet SOMEHOW get away with it. No other industry could do this and stay afloat, but the gaming industry gets a pass for some reason.beef_razor said:Crony Capitalism runs the entire Western civilization, not just the gaming industry. Are people really surprised that the industry is taking this route? Really? The more lucrative and mainstream gaming becomes (and this isn't an argument to keep gaming for 'hardcore' gamers) the more BS they'll peddle to make even more money.
I have to disagree with this. By buying the product, you are supporting it. If you sincerely mean what you are saying here, you would refuse to buy it, and put that stance ahead of your job as "game reviewer." It also seems that you have plenty of potential income as a commenter on the games industry without having to directly review games. Your Jimquisition episodes are very popular here, and none of them have been an actual game review.Jimothy Sterling said:You could call me a game reviewer, since that's my job.
And you, uh, realize reviewing a system isn't the same as promoting it, right? It's not hypocritical to review a product, especially if I go on to criticize the very practices I'm attacking. The ONLY way this would be hypocrisy would be if, when reviewing the system, I praise the very policies I find so disturbing. I don't intend to do that at all, should I end up reviewing the Xbox One.
That's a Bandwagon fallacy. Just because there are a large number of people who DO sell their games doesn't mean that there isn't a large number of people who don't.Akalabeth said:Evidence that people don't keep their games?
HAVE YOU BEEN IN A STORE? Do you not see an ENTIRE WALL devoted to used games? Do you not see bins full of used games? Or entire stores that sell nothing but used games?
Man alive.
You're accusing people of using anecdotal evidence while also doing the same. Just because YOU don't give a rat's ass about backwards compatibility doesn't mean that there's no value in it. Consoles break, discs get cracked or smudged or whatever, cartridges fall apart, maybe people want to be able to sell their old consoles to pay for new ones, or just because their taking up too much room. Sure, maybe someday someone will emulate the 360 or whatever and you'll be able to play it on your computer, or maybe like with the original Xbox it'll turn out to be all but impossible for even the ORIGINAL DEVELOPERS to be able to effectively emulate it or maybe like with the Wii it'll have a control scheme that's difficult if not impossible to replicate on a computer.Akalabeth said:Good for you. Now with the xbox one, you can do EXACTLY the same thing, play your games.
As for your old games, what are you going to throw out your 360? I have a Sega Master System, I don't complain that I can't play those cartridges on my 360. I didn't complain that I couldn't play Atari games on my Master System.
And yes, the EARLY 360s were notably unreliable, the later models are not. The 360 will be around for a long time. And if at some point it happens to die out, then I'm sure some guy is gonna throw together an emulator and you can play them on PC or the popular ones will get rereleased in cheap bundles or whatnot.
If someone worked on cars and ended up needing a wrench from a manufacturer that he disliked in order to service a customers car, do you think it's fair to tell the customer "sorry, can't fix your car because I don't like the wrench manufacturer?" I sure as heck don't. Further more, we just had a good finish to the day with E3, can we not argue about something that ultimately comes off as petty?Aardvaarkman said:I have to disagree with this. By buying the product, you are supporting it. If you sincerely mean what you are saying here, you would refuse to buy it, and put that stance ahead of your job as "game reviewer." It also seems that you have plenty of potential income as a commenter on the games industry without having to directly review games. Your Jimquisition episodes are very popular here, and none of them have been an actual game review.Jimothy Sterling said:You could call me a game reviewer, since that's my job.
And you, uh, realize reviewing a system isn't the same as promoting it, right? It's not hypocritical to review a product, especially if I go on to criticize the very practices I'm attacking. The ONLY way this would be hypocrisy would be if, when reviewing the system, I praise the very policies I find so disturbing. I don't intend to do that at all, should I end up reviewing the Xbox One.
So, I think you should put your money where your mouth is. If you disagree so vehemently with what Microsoft is doing, then you should not support them financially by buying their games, consoles, or Operating Systems. That just enables the policies you supposedly despise.
And what of your viewers/readers? Those of us who aren't game critics don't have the excuse of "it's my job." If you enjoy a Xbone game, do we get moral absolution to buy the Xbone, despite us not being employed as game critics? Apart from the financial support you would be providing Microsoft, any positive review you would give of an Xbone game would equate to promoting the platform.
I think hypocrisy is a very appropriate word to use here, because you want to use your pedestal to be outraged, while simultaneously enjoying the system without guilt.
By putting out negative reviews of their system and games, Jim is causing people to not buy into their B.S., which far outweighs the "support" that he's giving by buying the system and it's games to accurately give out these reviews. Jim is HURTING these practices he's against by rallying against them far more than he's helping them by buying one measly console and a few games, and he's getting paid for it in the bargin. It's a win win for him and consumers.Aardvaarkman said:I have to disagree with this. By buying the product, you are supporting it. If you sincerely mean what you are saying here, you would refuse to buy it, and put that stance ahead of your job as "game reviewer." It also seems that you have plenty of potential income as a commenter on the games industry without having to directly review games. Your Jimquisition episodes are very popular here, and none of them have been an actual game review.Jimothy Sterling said:You could call me a game reviewer, since that's my job.
And you, uh, realize reviewing a system isn't the same as promoting it, right? It's not hypocritical to review a product, especially if I go on to criticize the very practices I'm attacking. The ONLY way this would be hypocrisy would be if, when reviewing the system, I praise the very policies I find so disturbing. I don't intend to do that at all, should I end up reviewing the Xbox One.
So, I think you should put your money where your mouth is. If you disagree so vehemently with what Microsoft is doing, then you should not support them financially by buying their games, consoles, or Operating Systems. That just enables the policies you supposedly despise.
And what of your viewers/readers? Those of us who aren't game critics don't have the excuse of "it's my job." If you enjoy a Xbone game, do we get moral absolution to buy the Xbone, despite us not being employed as game critics? Apart from the financial support you would be providing Microsoft, any positive review you would give of an Xbone game would equate to promoting the platform.
I think hypocrisy is a very appropriate word to use here, because you want to use your pedestal to be outraged, while simultaneously enjoying the system without guilt.
It would be nice to see games reviewers adopt the position of "It's on the Xbox One. 0/10", but that'll never happen.DTWolfwood said:Would be nice to see the gaming press to show a bit of solidarity to the consumer by not covering the system and its exclusives upon release.
Having it die a pitiful death from lack of coverage is the best way to say fuck you to Microsoft and their new xbox.
I'll do my part in not buying the system, but alas me and my kind only make a small percentage of xbox customers.