Lawyer Destroys Arguments for Game Piracy

[rob_simple]

I pirate to try a game. I will pirate of the anti-piracy measures are over the top. Screw everyone else, I'm arguing -my- case. There is nothing wrong with what I do.

Cool story bro, it's still illegal.

 

[rob_simple]

I pirate to try a game. I will pirate of the anti-piracy measures are over the top. Screw everyone else, I'm arguing -my- case. There is nothing wrong with what I do.

Cool story bro, it's still illegal.

Depends on where he lives, laws are different in different places you know.

I'll suppose. Can I have 'morally objectionable' instead?

 

[Something Amyss]

Oh yeah because the PS3 didn't manage to stop piracy for a good few years, as well as having an incredibly low rate of piracy.
Piracy can be stopped, but they need a new, hardware based approach to it, or use more systems like Steam.

Ofcourse, that hardware base is the issue. The two reasons piracy weren't abound was because of the new technology, which cost Sony a TON to establish, and the fact that with otherOS, people were happy to sandbox in it rather than jailbreak their units.

Sure, so all they need is to introduce expensive new hardware and media every couple of years. And while we're cutting off our noses to spite our faces...

Note Steam still has plenty of piracy. Note Steam has commented on it. I'm not sure what Steam-Like systems would do, expect take away our control of the content. Which, really, is what corporations want, but doesn't really punish anyone except you or I, the legal, legit customer.

 

[rob_simple]

I pirate to try a game. I will pirate of the anti-piracy measures are over the top. Screw everyone else, I'm arguing -my- case. There is nothing wrong with what I do.

Cool story bro, it's still illegal.

Depends on where he lives, laws are different in different places you know.

I'll suppose. Can I have 'morally objectionable' instead?

I suppose I could allow 'Morally Objectionable to me'. Those nations that allow piracy naturally have no moral stigma against it.

I personally have no moral objection to piracy, but then again my moral compass is far out of alignment and could use a tuneup.

I don't know, I mean I can understand some of the pirating defenses, for example I see no problem with ROMs of old SNES games for the same reason I wouldn't pay for a CD of the Moonlight Sonata: they're old as fuck; it seems unlikely that anyone involved with the original product would be profiting from the re-release.

And with music piracy, you can at least argue that musicians never make a huge profit off the CD's but from touring.

People who pirate brand new games though, that I don't get. How can you justify that, aside from throwing up two middle fingers and requesting that we 'spin on it'?

 

[brainslurper]

but in the meantime it means a financial loss for the developer

NO, it does not. That logic is incredibly erroneous.

Yes it does. They worked hard on something, and what would be a paying customer got it without paying for it, depriving the developer or their profit.

I didn't buy Psychonauts till the Steam sale. That doesn't mean Double Fine or even Valve lost money until I bought it, it means they just didn't get any from me for it till the other day.

edit: Note that I'm not a pirate or defending them, but that I'm just showing you the flaw in your argument.

It's not so much an economic argument as it is a moral one. You could argue that everyone not buying something is depriving the developer of their profit just as much as pirating is, and that would be mostly correct. But do we really want to be people who siphon off of other people's hard work and give them nothing in return? I don't see any justification for that.

... Since when did international corporations get the moral high ground?

Since a serious portion of their consumer base decided it was fine to use their stuff without paying them?

 

[ResonanceSD]

I pirate to try a game. I will pirate of the anti-piracy measures are over the top. Screw everyone else, I'm arguing -my- case. There is nothing wrong with what I do.

And it's because of wonderful, well thought out arguments like this one that the majority of game companies don't even bother negotiating with the userbase. If they don't see what they do as legally or morally wrong, why should the onus be on the industry to get gamers to get their shit together?

 

[ezaviel]

but in the meantime it means a financial loss for the developer

NO, it does not. That logic is incredibly erroneous.

Yes it does. They worked hard on something, and what would be a paying customer got it without paying for it, depriving the developer or their profit.

The problem is you assume they WOULD be a paying customer. With or without piracy existing,there is no money that would go to the developer.

It is wrong to call it a lost sale. The sale doesn't exists, would not exist if piracy wasn't a thing.

Isn't a sale which doesn't exist what a lost sale is?

Whether a pirate would have bought the game if they didn't pirate is immaterial, they now have a copy, for which no sale was made.

This is not to say that pirates don't buy some games later. I'm sure many people have pirated a game and gone on to buy it (though I doubt many pirate a game, and then buy it at full price). Though I feel that people who "try before they buy" seem rather uncommon, compared to straight out pirates.

 

[UsefulPlayer 1]

Same thing I posted on the other article on the same topic:

"Kinda surprised at the volume of people who so "valiantly" defend their thievery. How you guys think enjoying content people have worked long and hard to create for free is fair is beyond me."

I can't imagine how people can believe that piracy, generally speaking, has not done any harm to the video game industry. I mean if everyone could get in the movie theatre for free and there where unlimited perfect seats.....do you really think the movie industry along without a hitch?

 

[Rpground]

maybe if we got DEMOS of the game so we can TRY it before purchasing things wouldnt be so bad now would it. yeah remember DEMOS,the things that let you try a game before your bought it? yeah those were the days...in truth thats what i pirate for (yes im admitting i do it) but i do that to demo the game. not just out right say "fuck you developer". if i like the game ill buy it. if i dont like it they dont deserve my money,ill just uninstall the game and leave it at that. i wouldnt do this as much if i could only get a free demo.even its its just a 1-2 hour demo of the game we would at least get a glimpse of how the game works,if we like it,if its actually FUN...if this was done more often there would be alot less pirating going on,cause i know there are more people like me out there...

 

[rob_simple]

I pirate to try a game. I will pirate of the anti-piracy measures are over the top. Screw everyone else, I'm arguing -my- case. There is nothing wrong with what I do.

Cool story bro, it's still illegal.

Depends on where he lives, laws are different in different places you know.

I'll suppose. Can I have 'morally objectionable' instead?

I suppose I could allow 'Morally Objectionable to me'. Those nations that allow piracy naturally have no moral stigma against it.

I personally have no moral objection to piracy, but then again my moral compass is far out of alignment and could use a tuneup.

I don't know, I mean I can understand some of the pirating defenses, for example I see no problem with ROMs of old SNES games for the same reason I wouldn't pay for a CD of the Moonlight Sonata: they're old as fuck; it seems unlikely that anyone involved with the original product would be profiting from the re-release.

And with music piracy, you can at least argue that musicians never make a huge profit off the CD's but from touring.

People who pirate brand new games though, that I don't get. How can you justify that, aside from throwing up two middle fingers and requesting that we 'spin on it'?

I would consider it a comparison between the new and the old for justification.

Lets take an older game like Baulders Gate 2, it gave you dozens of hours of enjoyment for about 40 dollars brand spankin new. Now compare it to something like Modern Warfare 3 that, as a single player gamer, that you pay 60 dollars for to get a 4-6 hour game that would pass for an expansion pack for 20 dollars only a few years ago.

Some people may not feel inclined to pay the better part of a hundred dollars (Or more than a hundred in some nations) for something they will beat in less than a day and never look at again.

Well in that case they shouldn't play it at all. I mean that's like saying I'm happy to pay for a trip to Canada because I love it there, but I should be able to get all the free trips to Somalia I want because there's a good chance I'll be murdered by pirates.

And with games like Modern Warfare, the value is in the multiplayer which people rack up hundreds of hours in. There's no illusion or chicanery going on here: everyone knows that MW is a multiplayer-heavy series and that, even though there's clearly a lot of effort put into the single player, it isn't the biggest part of the game. Just because it isn't tailored to the needs of a specific set of gamers doesn't mean they then have the right to steal it.

At the end of the day, it should come down to if you're not prepared to pay then you don't deserve to play. I agree that games are ludicrously over-priced these days, but that's why I'm careful with my spending. I really don't understand this obscure sense of entitlement that a lot of gamers seem to have.

 

[xdiesp]

"Self described game lawyer" made my day. I would have locked the topic after that just for the dignity of it.

 

[OniaPL]

Ethics and morals are meaningless.

 

[DELTA440]

I think the developers need to Promote Demos just like i stated in my previous post. with the advent of online gaming and internet updates you have seen a larger than usual amount of games with huge bugs in them some game breaking others less annoying but should not have gotten past Q/A. and i have noticed demos have gone away almost completely some games still have them alot more of them dont. It may help curb some piracy if they used demos more often im not saying every pirate is like this example but here it goes. Ah a new game they have a demo now i can try it and see if the games shit so dont waste my 60$ on a game i dont like case in point Dead Island the gameplay sucked and it was nothing like the trailer made it out to be. we all know you cant sell a game back after you bought it unless its a console game so if they promoted demos before release then people will buy the game cause they checked it out now they will know if the game is good or its the type of game they were looking for and if the game didnt release with bullshit glitches, im not saying it will stop piracy but it will help curb it by having demos.

 

[Jabberwock xeno]

Was this ever debated seriously?

Piracy IS bad.

The debate was, as I am aware, if it SHOULD be bad, is it AS bad as actual theft, and how it's handled.

IMO, it's kinda, no, and it's being handled horribly.

Ideally, digital goods should cost nothing. After all, you essentially have the power to make infinite amounts of something. The creators would get payed by donation.

Sadly, this is not the case. Our socioity just doesn't work that way. Which makes me worried, if we ever can copy physical things, that there would be legal crap for that, too.

I think we can all agree that people going to jail for many years, fined hundreds of thousands of dollars, and sued for getting a non-physical copy of something is stupid and foolish, though. No jail time, a fine no more than 2x-3x the total worth of things pirated, and maybe some type of forced class.

 

[the clockmaker]

Ethics and morals are meaningless.

I knew I guy who said stuff like that once. I punched him in the face and walked off with his wallet. I gave it back a few minutes later, but he never talked like that again.