To me at least it makes the original feel kind of unfinished. I mean what with the new enemies and items(not just weapons). It's like Left Four Dead was just testing the waters to see if this would be sucessful.
Left 4 Dead 2 not different? Yeah right
- Thread starter Vanguard_Ex
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Vanguard_Ex said:LoL thanksAcaroid said:FUCK YOU YOU'RE WRONGVanguard_Ex said:WellllllllAcaroid said:GOODVanguard_Ex said:
I played through the short demo a few times now and I have to say this
If you liked L4D you will love this one, the improvments are good, more weapons (and melee, I found it satisfying killing a charger with a guitar), different zombies, slightly update graphics, a little bit different "feel" to it and I really damn good into movie!!
BUT
those like myself who didnt really find the first one that interesting (it was good for about a week, then I just got sick of it), you wont find alot here to draw you into the series, it is the same formula so people on the outside will see it as just same #$%@ different shovel.
I kid
That's probably the fairest summary I've seen of the demo, well put.
I will be interested what the full game is going to be like, because I have a feeling that there are going to be some plesant suprises when it comes out!!
This also made me smile.Vanguard_Ex said:
Anyways great demo, but when I tried playing with my friends it was laggy as I'll get out, which is wierd cause we live close to each other and have been playing borderlands together as well as left 4 dead, we even went back to the old one and our connection was fine.
It's very different. The new infected just fit (apart from the Jockey, who I think is quite pointless), you can't all start off with the same weapon, the music is just about the best part of it, the new SWAT zombies are awesome, the wound detail and gibbing is first-rate, the melee weapons feel like they have the right weight and power behind them as does bashing them with your primary weapon.Vanguard_Ex said:
It's more challenging than the first, there's more than one mission now... I could go on, but I'll stop raving about how great it is. Glad I preordered (just hoping we can uncensor the real game the same way as the demo).
Ah yes, me and a friend had this. He told me yesterday that if you set the game to local, the lag disappears and it runs fine. Try that if you happen to play it againRogueRunner said:
The boycott only had to do w/ their concern that population migration would make the original obsolete & kill the modding scene.Vanguard_Ex said:
But Valve has made L4D2 backward compatible w/ L4D for maps, mods & servers. So they boycotters got what they wanted & every1 is happy.
Exactly. Good old ValveCaptain_Caveman said:The boycott only had to do w/ their concern that population migration would make the original obsolete & kill the modding scene.Vanguard_Ex said:
But Valve has made L4D2 backward compatible w/ L4D for maps, mods & servers. So they boycotters got what they wanted & every1 is happy.
I just cant think of it as a sequel. Youve got 3 new zombies and new places, yes, but the weapons are the same as before, just theres two different types for each (except of the course the sniper and grenade launcher), and from what i can tell the only difference between them is the model and colour.Assassinator said:
And im not particularly fond of the melee weapons. Sure they're fun and useful and fun in singleplayer and campaign, but i can see them being a real ***** in mulitplayer - watching your horde being beaten to death by a frying pan as a boomer wont be too fun.
Also they dont make much sense - you get the "worn out" timer thing when you shove enemies away, but you never get it with melee weapons.
Also, its a frying pan! how does it kill a bunch of zombies with one hit? Give them a headache yeah, but death?
Also the jockey seems pointless to me, unless one attacks you at the same time a spitter spits on your feet.
Also, for some reason i cant put my finger on, (and i have been trying) it just doesnt seem as good or fun as the first game.
So in short, theres not enough actually new or good stuff to make it seem like a sequel to me.
Sorry for using also at the beginning of every sentence, did that without realising.
I kind of second bagodix here, what else do you need before L4D2 is a sequel in your eyes? A clanmate of mine basically said the same thing as you did, this is how I responded:TimbukTurnip said:
All you're basically saying is "All these features belong in an expansion pack" but on what ground? With that many features and upgrades, what else do you want before you see L4D2 as a true sequel? It has:
- A (though not massive, but what else did you expect?) graphical update
- New weapons and gadgets (main guns, new pistols, melee weapons, new throwing weapons and the defib)
- New Special infected, and the old one's got a bit of a revibe (the Witch wanders around, a female skin for the Boomer, the Smoker looks even worse)
- The totally new Uncommon infected
- Completely new setting
- 2 New game modes
- New cast
- Upgraded AI Director
- New campaigns, plus the campaigns will be less linear and work more in conjunction with the AI Director, it's important to realise that we haven't seen a lot of this yet, mostly because we've only played a small portion of óne campaign.
And I might've missed a small thing or two. I mean, what else do you want?! Aren't you acting a bit spoiled perhaps? It's not like the game will completely play the same, especially in the Versus mode things will most definitely change with the new Special infected and new weapons. If you say that all these things are common in addon packs, what dóes constitute as a sequel then, I'm confused.
Did you expect a 180 degree shift of the whole formula? Why would you even expect that? Do remember that you haven't played a large portion of L4D2 yet, only a very small part of the most basic game type of all, I wouldn't be so quick to judge.
'Bout the frying pan: you bash the zombie's skull in. Really, a frying pan is solid metal, try smashing someone's head with that with full force.
'Bout the Spitter and Jocky thing: that's exactly what I'm talking about, have you played the Versus mode yet? No you haven't, only a wee little bit from one campaign map, have you got any idea how the new Infected and weapons will effect Versus tactics? A lot, you just pointed one out, and I'm quite sure Versus will play pretty differently. And don't forget the 2 other gameplay types, have you played those? I can understand why you're feeling that way, the standard Campaign mode isn't the one anyone expected to change a lot, but it's like you're forgetting that there is a lot more to this game.
Left4Dead 2 is NOT a sequel, it's a bunch of DLC's put together.
Let me explain. There's only 3 new infected(The Charger, the woman-that-spits-acid infected and the jockey).
They added a melee combat system. This could have been included into a DLC also(And all they had to do is updated the original maps to have melee weapons).
New characters were not needed.
New AI director. AGAIN, a fucking DLC would have done it.
All of these factors DO NOT justify a new game. ALL of this can be included in a DLC.
They could release these 4 new unique maps and group all the maps. "West Coast" and "East Coast" campaigns has an example.
"Oh but Andy, the new infected do not fit the old campaigns!"
So? They could be restrained to the 4 new maps. Each set of map would include unique infected.
Vale is becoming greedy.
Let me explain. There's only 3 new infected(The Charger, the woman-that-spits-acid infected and the jockey).
They added a melee combat system. This could have been included into a DLC also(And all they had to do is updated the original maps to have melee weapons).
New characters were not needed.
New AI director. AGAIN, a fucking DLC would have done it.
All of these factors DO NOT justify a new game. ALL of this can be included in a DLC.
They could release these 4 new unique maps and group all the maps. "West Coast" and "East Coast" campaigns has an example.
"Oh but Andy, the new infected do not fit the old campaigns!"
So? They could be restrained to the 4 new maps. Each set of map would include unique infected.
Vale is becoming greedy.
a couple new games modes, a point to picking a character!and maybe more levels.bagodix said:
it just feels like they could easily do more. especially for console owners who aren't getting any cool community mods, or updates.
I'd like to point to my previous post [http://www.escapistmagazine.com/forums/read/9.153477?page=5#3720819] in this thread. First of all, you're missing quite a few things, other than that, what wóuld make L4D2 a true sequel then? L4D2 adds a lot to the original L4D formula, you can't get around that, and you haven't even played the other game modes.AndyFromMonday said:
You're getting new game modes! Haven't you checked out the demo yet? Or followed the news? We're getting the Scavenge mode and Realism mode.RoseBridge said:
Picking a character...gee, that doesn't sound too shabby actually, but why jump on the "lets add RPG elements" bandwagon again? I think Valve has had their fill with that with TF2 and I think they like L4D being a straight-forward shooter. If you ask me, there aren't enough of those games, everything has to be complicated these days. But that's taste.
This ladies and gentlemen is a fine example of what I've been pointing out for a while now (ever since the "Boycott L4D 2" movement).AndyFromMonday said:
Valve has been putting out DLC for most of their games (look at TF2 on PC with its class upgrades and etc). They were never REQUIRED to do this for us, hell most devs don't bother releasing DLC unless you need to pay for it! Now Valve decided to not release that much DLC for L4D and people are complaining that "Valve screwed us".
My reply to that is that they haven't screwed us any more than any other developer, who releases half made games at full price and sells the rest of it in fractions (looking at you EA), or devs that only wait for expansions to release new playable content! In fact, I think Valve has screwed us less than those other devs, even with L4D.
Valve has unfortunately turned it's community into something that resembles a mob of bratty spoiled children by releasing content for free like this. So before they realize that were an ungrateful community, some people should stop and look at what Valve HAS done for us and be appreciative instead of bitchy about what they haven't done.
You know, you can send letters to Valve about how you APPRECIATED their previous free DLC, instead of complaining about how you hate them now for not giving us enough. Maybe that approach will yield better results for DLC in future Valve titles.
Your points are these:Assassinator said:
1. A graphical update.
They did not updated the graphics in any way, shape or form. The game only looks better because it's not night anymore. They choosed to make it in daylight for a reason, so that they can actually showcase the graphics a bit more.
2. New weapons and gadgets:
Defib and grenade launcher. The rest are re-skinned old weapons.
3. All of this could have been done with a DLC. No need for a whole new game.
4. Again, DLC maybe?
5. The setting is more or less the same. Those 4 new maps could have been released one by one using something called DOWNLOADABLE CONTENT...D.L.C.
6. The game modes seem interesting. From what I understand one is completely new and the other is a combination of all the modes. So in truth there's only one new and original game mode. Again, a DLC could have done this.
7. DLC...Updating something doesn't necessitate a whole new game.
8. New campaigns. Neither you or I can say if these are exactly like the old ones or not since the demo only shows 50% of the first map scenario.
What constitutes has a sequel? I'll give Starcraft 2 has an example. It completely revamped the whole game. Yes, it's an RTS, but we're talking what constitutes has a sequel here.
A sequel should actually have improvements over the last game. BIG improvements, not just a few re-skins. Left4Dead is barely an improvement over the last game. New infected, new AI director, new uncommon infected. That does not justify a sequel.
"Did you expect a 180 degree shift of the whole formula? " No, but I expected more than ideas which could have been easily put together in DLC's and released one after another.
The infected more or less play the same. The Jockey is the new smoker. He will keep the player in place and do damage. The only difference here is that you need to get close to the target now, meaning it's going to be quite a useless infected unless you combine it with the spitter. The spitter being the only new infected. The charge is the new hunter. It has the same idea. The hunter jumps on a target and keeps it in place whilst dealing damage, the charger charges to a target and deals damage to it whilst keeping it in place.
xxcloud417xx said:
Ungrateful? The community calls bullshit on ONE single game and we're now spoiled brats eh?
Left 4 Dead 2 FEELS completely like it could have been done my DLC. There's 2 improvements made over the original game: AI director 2.0 and melee weapons.
Everything else is a re-skin of the last infected. The Charger is the new hunter(The hunter jumps and pins down the target, the charger charges and pins down the target). Same goes for the Jockey, he keeps players immobilized and deals damage whilst the other one keeps the target immobilized and deals damage. The difference between the 2 is the way they reach the target.
2 improvements and re-skins DO NOT justify a whole new game.
Double post, my bad.