Lovecraft vs. Warhammer!

[ScreamingNinja]

Or Khorne would just lay waste to his face and make him sad and die. Problem soooolved!

I don't think you understand Azathoth cannot be harmed in any way as soon as something comes in contact with Azathoth, or Azathoth even notices it exists, it no longer exists. Azathoth is an infinite being, an amorphous blight of nethermost confusion which blasphemes and bubbles at the center of all infinity beyond space and time on a curiously environed black throne at the centre of Chaos. He created everything and if he ever becomes aware of it he will destroy it.

And yet, Khorne would rip what passes for a face off it, and spit down what is left of what it has as a neck. Winning!

 

[ScreamingNinja]

I think... I think I know what everyone is trying to say. What everyone is trying to say here is that The Chaos Gods will pollute the Eldar Gods and turn them into pawns.

 

[triggrhappy94]

I'm curious to see how many people actually took the time to read the Necronomicon, it's fucking huge.
I was tempted to read it over the summer, but decided against it and settled for At The Mountains of Madness. I'm half way through The Dream Quest of the Unknown Kadath, for those of you who know what I'm talking about.

Spoiler

If I remember correctly, what's his face has just gotten to the place where the people who look like gods live.

 

[Seanfall]

Cthulu is technically the 'preist' of these gods isn't he? I remember him being mentioned as some kind of priest in 'call of Cthulu'. And yet he's still enough to wipe humanity out. But yeah...the elder outer gods? They aren't the stuff of the nightmares. Their the stuff nightmares WISH they could be. Really the Lovecraft verse and Warhammer verse work on two different power scales.

 

[Darknacht]

Or Khorne would just lay waste to his face and make him sad and die. Problem soooolved!

I don't think you understand Azathoth cannot be harmed in any way as soon as something comes in contact with Azathoth, or Azathoth even notices it exists, it no longer exists. Azathoth is an infinite being, an amorphous blight of nethermost confusion which blasphemes and bubbles at the center of all infinity beyond space and time on a curiously environed black throne at the centre of Chaos. He created everything and if he ever becomes aware of it he will destroy it.

And yet, Khorne would rip what passes for a face off it, and spit down what is left of what it has as a neck. Winning!

Nope, that was just the delusion he had as he passed out of existence.

 

[Joseph Alexander]

Or Khorne would just lay waste to his face and make him sad and die. Problem soooolved!

his dreaming is reality, killing him would just end up wiping out reality.

but really, this is like setting a man(WH40K) in a death match against superman(lovecraft mythos).
its a "what the fuck do think was going to happen you idgit?".

and anyways, the original always beats out the cheap knockoff.

 

[Korak the Mad]

Team Mythos for the win.

To be perfectly honest, the 40K pantheon is rather weak, compared to the products of an imagination fueled by a mixture of Pulp stories, horrific nightmares, hydrophobia and almost hilariously outdated racism, even for its time. There's a core of terrible earnestness in Lovecraft's Mythos, whereas Games Workshop's baby reminds me of myself when I used to obsess over poorly conceived D&D campaigns.

"Oh, um... That Evil God's name is... um... KHORNE! And stuff! And he... um... needs blood! BLOOD FOR THE BLOOD GOD! Yeah! Yeah, that sounds badass. Probably..."

Azatoth and Shub-Niggurath are where it's at.

Also, as someone else has so aptly explained through a nifty 'shop job; Khorne?! That's the dumbest name ever for any god!

I cannot take that guy seriously. With all due respect, 40K fans, I'll give the Imperium a shot when I won't feel one of your mythological concepts is Cap'n Crunch's long-lost cousin.

Oh Man that is funny, and I agree with you.

The mythos have always struck a cord with me, because the way lovecraft described how some of these being would exist, is entirely possible. They are Metaphysical beings, They CANNOT be destroyed.

Lovecraft also explained how certain things could be done, like time travel, in the most likely way. He described that time travel is not done physically, but mentally. My favorite story of his "The Shadow Out of Time" and I bet the Yithians could switch minds with the chaos gods and cause them to destroy one another.

 

[nasteypenguin]

I'm curious to see how many people actually took the time to read the Necronomicon, it's fucking huge.
I was tempted to read it over the summer, but decided against it and settled for At The Mountains of Madness. I'm half way through The Dream Quest of the Unknown Kadath, for those of you who know what I'm talking about.

Spoiler

If I remember correctly, what's his face has just gotten to the place where the people who look like gods live.

You'll excuse me if I'm too stupid to see what you did there, but the Necronomicon isn't a real book. Theres a lovecraft collection that called itself the Necronomicon, which I have but haven't finished the last few stories of, but the book itself is something entirely different within the fictions.

Also, did you mean to choose two of his longest works? Most of Lovecrafts stuff are short stories but you've started with his novellas, not that it's a bad thing but you might be a bit jarred when you see the shortness of his other stuff.

 

[Malty Milk Whistle]

Or Khorne would just lay waste to his face and make him sad and die. Problem soooolved!

I don't think you understand Azathoth cannot be harmed in any way as soon as something comes in contact with Azathoth, or Azathoth even notices it exists, it no longer exists. Azathoth is an infinite being, an amorphous blight of nethermost confusion which blasphemes and bubbles at the center of all infinity beyond space and time on a curiously environed black throne at the centre of Chaos. He created everything and if he ever becomes aware of it he will destroy it.

Show him a mirror then.
OT i think that it would be... incomparable, because when comparing entity's from 2 different fictional universes, there is no way to actively compare them.
On the other hand, seeing nurgle and an old god duke it out would be vastly entertaining.

EDIT: The chaos gods are pure emotion...and since they themselves feel emotion...There's some practical immorality for ya.

 

[IamLEAM1983]

Lovecraft also explained how certain things could be done, like time travel, in the most likely way. He described that time travel is not done physically, but mentally. My favorite story of his "The Shadow Out of Time" and I bet the Yithians could switch minds with the chaos gods and cause them to destroy one another.

While this does sound highly badass, I doubt it would actually be possible. The Yithians are still physical beings; they're pretty much aliens on the same sense than any other Sci Fi storyline with aliens. I don't really feel like giving points to Games Workshop here, but gods are kinda intangible or exist as abstract concepts made up by the squishy ones like ourselves.

So going by that logic, a Yithian trying to possess a Chaos God would be like me trying to close my hand around thin air. The Yithians could try the same thing with an Elder God and it wouldn't work for the same reason.

Yay for overthinking?

None of this really matters, anyway. GW lifted things off of Michael Moorcock and Lovecraft is being cut apart and copy-pasted like nobody's business. We've even gone from Great King Chtulhu to Chibi-thulhu, available in green plush in about forty berjillion Etsy vendor accounts and your usual slew of big-name geek-related stores.

Besides, even the Chaos Gods and the 40K universe get occasionally Disneyfied.

Oh, and by the way, doesn't "Blood for the Blood God" actually come from somewhere else, too? Like, some sort of Viking war cry? I'm really not sure and I don't remember where I heard that, but I read somewhere that this is actually some sort of protective Norse saying. Basically it's a supernatural and religious way to justify raping and pillaging or something. Like, "Hey, we're doing this for an actual reason! Okay, so it's theological, but that's better than nothing, right?"

I'm probably floundering, here.

 

[triggrhappy94]

I'm curious to see how many people actually took the time to read the Necronomicon, it's fucking huge.
I was tempted to read it over the summer, but decided against it and settled for At The Mountains of Madness. I'm half way through The Dream Quest of the Unknown Kadath, for those of you who know what I'm talking about.

Spoiler

If I remember correctly, what's his face has just gotten to the place where the people who look like gods live.

You'll excuse me if I'm too stupid to see what you did there, but the Necronomicon isn't a real book. Theres a lovecraft collection that called itself the Necronomicon, which I have but haven't finished the last few stories of, but the book itself is something entirely different within the fictions.

Also, did you mean to choose two of his longest works? Most of Lovecrafts stuff are short stories but you've started with his novellas, not that it's a bad thing but you might be a bit jarred when you see the shortness of his other stuff.

Well, can't a collection of stories still be called a book, it really just seems like semantics. The physical Necronomicon I mean. And as you can probably tell I haven't read the stories that the Necro appears in, so I only knew about the physical one. I didn't neccesarily mean to start with one of his longer 'story compilations', I actually think I had a thread on here about which 'compilation' I should start with. Mountians seemed like a good place to start and I think it was. I really won't mind the stories being shorter as long as they stay just as good.

 

[Gottesstrafe]

Cthulu is relatively weak when compared to Lovecraft's Outer Gods Azathoth and Yog-Sothoth.

Look at this artist's interpretation of Azathoth.

When I look at this, I imagine him as unfathomably immense. At the center of all infinity.

They're called cosmic entities for a reason. Metaphysical chaos given form and an agenda. Unbound by the laws of flesh, host to thoughts and motivations eons beyond the scope of simple human morality. A fraction of one second of what passes through their hallowed minds is more dense than the combined life histories of our entire planet. There is no benevolence at work here, the best one can hope for is apathy or disinterest.

The Warhammer chaos gods have discernible motivations, though wide in scale they are fairly simplistic enough to divide into pantheons. They require followers and armies, they measurably struggle against each other and the forces of entropy. Show me a "Chaos God" that threatens all of existence passively by merely being awake.

 

[Joseph Alexander]

Or Khorne would just lay waste to his face and make him sad and die. Problem soooolved!

his dreaming is reality, killing him would just end up wiping out reality.

but really, this is like setting a man(WH40K) in a death match against superman(lovecraft mythos).
its a "what the fuck do think was going to happen you idgit?".

and anyways, the original always beats out the cheap knockoff.

warhammer ripped off Michael Moorcock not Lovecraft

Moorcock's conception of Chaos also heavily inspired, and in some cases was lifted verbatim by Games Workshop in the creation of its Warhammer and Warhammer 40,000 fictional settings. Notably, however, they only briefly used Moorcock's conceptions of Order or the Balance. The descriptions of Chaos, of the eight-pointed star, of the Chaos Lords, the strange multicolored hues of energies, mutations and warping of matter and flesh, and so forth found in the Warhammer settings are all derived directly from Moorcock's works.

indeed they are, but warhammer 40k didn't just pull from moorcock.
and while i will agree they did not pull directly from Lovecraft they did pull the same elements that Moorcock pulled(which he did change greatly in attaching singular themes to them).
but it also took elements from both Heinlein and Tolkien as well.
Tolkein's influence is a given even if it is more present in the "ye olde" WH.
Heinlein's is a couple key elements and a race, the totalitarian fascist human empire, the imperial troopers(the red shirt army) and the tyranids(even after the cosmetic change that made them also alien ripoffs) are all pulled from starship troopers.

 

[karchevs lawyer]

But Azatoth? No way man...No way. As far as I'm aware, his attack ranges from "Destroy the very fabric of the universe and plunge everything into nothingness" to "Destroy the very fabric of the universe and plunge everything into nothingness" with no room in between...

Si...El Correcto.

 

[Zen Toombs]

Spoiler

Cthulu is relatively weak when compared to Lovecraft's Outer Gods Azathoth and Yog-Sothoth.

Look at this artist's interpretation of Azathoth.

When I look at this, I imagine him as unfathomably immense. At the center of all infinity.

Why, yes, isn't it a beauty? I personally like this picture of Shub-Niggurath more, but Azathoth is not without its merits.

That forest down there? With the fleshy nightmarish tree thingies? And that small stone circle among them? The black specks there would be people. Welcome to Lovecraftland. My money goes on the things that are more powerful than the Chaos gods, while not being actual gods. And, no Cthulhu isn't really that powerful. Nyarlathotep loves messing with people but I don't know if ol' Crawling Chaos there

Spoiler: artist's interpretation

can beat some of the WH40K thingies. I'm betting it can. Or at least would mess with them. He is very Deceiver-ish, as far as I'm aware.

Oooh, pretty elderitch horrors. *yoink*

Also, I recognice that middle one from a TVtropes page.

Whoever wins, you lose, mortals!!

But we can just worship a Chaos god if they win, no?

As a mortal, you have a very interesting definition of "not losing".

Toombs concurs with your analysis.

 

[Zen Toombs]

-DOUBLE POST, CURSE CAPTCHA-

 

[Zen Toombs]

Oh, and by the way, doesn't "Blood for the Blood God" actually come from somewhere else, too? Like, some sort of Viking war cry?

Harriers for the Cup!

More OT:I think this is incorrect. However, if someone has a source for this I'd be highly interested.

But Azatoth? No way man...No way. As far as I'm aware, his attack ranges from "Destroy the very fabric of the universe and plunge everything into nothingness" to "Destroy the very fabric of the universe and plunge everything into nothingness" with no room in between...

Si...El Correcto.

Hi, and welcome to the Escapist! Just so you know, that post would qualify as a "low content post" which could get you a warning. Do your best to add a bit more to the discussion when you post, because I'd like to keep seeing you around!

Have a great day,
Zen Toombs

 

[kouriichi]

Next week on GOD FIGHTS: EXTREME EDITION, Cthulhu, the master of madness wrestles the Pain Bringer, the Destroyer, and our raining champion Khorne "Sits on A Throne of Skulls" Blood God! GET YOUR TICKETS NOW ON PPV, or miss out on the greatest fight in history!

Honestly? Its to close of a tie for me. I mean, Azathoth is a boss and everything, but Papa Nurgle holds a special place in my heart.

 

[Dogstile]

I say warhammer purely because I don't like the idea of gods that can just go "derp, i win" and press the destroy universe button. Its a tad boring.

 

[Lord S. Binkleheimer]

I say warhammer purely because I don't like the idea of gods that can just go "derp, i win" and press the destroy universe button. Its a tad boring.

Actually, in Azathoth's case it's more like.

"Oh, look! A universe to make frien- Aww. It's gone now."