Male Perspective Needed

[cleverlymadeup]

No problem, all help appreciated, and a little evil humour helps me feel better.

1: It's a pain in the arse getting him to meet face to face, but we'll have to do it sometime, and that's probably the best way to do things.

doesn't have to be face to face, while i disagree that any question is a deception, mostly cause there is a good clarification one, so be as clear as possible, ie "who is that girl on your facebook?"

3: Very typical of him, his father is a misogynistic git and he has some strange ideas about what it takes to be a strong man.

actually that's common with most ppl, also depends on the root of the problem as well

4: The attack was around a year and a half, or two years ago, sorry it wasn't clearer.

ok that does make a bit more sense, it did sound like it was 10+ years ago

 

[Blue Sonnet]

No problem, all help appreciated, and a little evil humour helps me feel better.

1: It's a pain in the arse getting him to meet face to face, but we'll have to do it sometime, and that's probably the best way to do things.

doesn't have to be face to face, while i disagree that any question is a deception, mostly cause there is a good clarification one, so be as clear as possible, ie "who is that girl on your facebook?"

Good point - I was mainly thinking of the face to face as an option because I'm better at reading people that way, but the phone will be good too - I'm not keen on IM'ing again, he was a little too loath to change clients to Yahoo, which wasn't dropping at the time.

I would love to kick him up the arse over this, as he has blatantly lied about something, but his history, plus the possible reasons behind doing so mean that I have to tread carefully. It's weird because I've known him for so long - when we were together we literally didn't spend more than a week apart, but in the end we were just together because that's what we always did, and for me it died once I realised that. If his reason for splitting was different, then almost anything could have triggered what he might be feeling now.

It's nearly 4am and that's basically what I've been thinking. But again, everyone is really helping.

 

[ContemporaryStudent]

But I don't know, I'm no Freud.

Apologies, but I'm a nit-picker. The works of Jung would be more appropriate here. From what you've described, Blue, he seems like Jung's format of the 'introvert feeling'. Emotionally inaccessible and considerably esoteric with thier lives - Supposedly self sufficient, but perhaps the breakdown is forcing him out of that kind of psychoanalytical shell, explaining why he is going for your attention so much.

Coincidently, the 'Introvert Feeling' is generally attracted to 'powerful extroverts of the opposite sex'... if you were saying your Sister said his new girlfriend was plainer than you, this could be another factor.

That and it's thought that the first relationship is one you never forget.. His first was an engagement as well. You've got quite a decision on your hands, and despite my initial advice, this may be worth salvaging if you see a great friendship there.


::Edit:: Apologies for the early morning psychoanalysis - this is good for me, My university dissertation is a Freudian/Jungian analysis of South Park. ^^

 

[Blue Sonnet]

But I don't know, I'm no Freud.

Apologies, but I'm a nit-picker. The works of Jung would be more appropriate here. From what you've described, Blue, he seems like Jung's format of the 'introvert feeling'. Emotionally inaccessible and considerably esoteric with thier lives - Supposedly self sufficient, but perhaps the breakdown is forcing him out of that kind of psychoanalytical shell, explaining why he is going for your attention so much.

Coincidently, the 'Introvert Feeling' is generally attracted to 'powerful extroverts of the opposite sex'... if you were saying your Sister said his new girlfriend was plainer than you, this could be another factor.

That and it's thought that the first relationship is one you never forget.. His first was an engagement as well. You've got quite a decision on your hands, and despite my initial advice, this may be worth salvaging if you see a great friendship there.


::Edit:: Apologies for the early morning psychoanalysis - this is good for me, My university dissertation is a Freudian/Jungian analysis of South Park. ^^

Interesting, especially as I could never understand the reasoning behind most of Freud's theories (more of a Jungian myself). I once got applause from my psychology teacher when she asked someone to describe Freud in one sentence, and I said that he was a bloke who fancied his mother and thought everyone else did too. That may have been more for my guts than my analysis.

The introvert/extrovert part is interesting too, as when we were together I was the introvert and he the extrovert, and now we have both switched roles it may have caused him to see me, and any relationship we have in a new light.

We are really good friends, we both know things about each other that literally no-one else does, and we can talk about that freely. Thats why I got so upset by his apparent deception, especially since we've been apart for so long.

After we split, he told me, very frankly, about his new relationship with the girl we split over (basically he thought it was ok to spend the night in a caravan, in the same bed as, and naked, with another girl, who was blatantly after him from what he told me of the holiday at the time. I did not think it was ok). He wrote a really nasty e-mail to me, angry because I was upset that he'd ended up with this girl after the grand total of one week's separation from a four year engagement.

That might in theory be why he is hiding the new girl from me, but we went out occasionally whilst they were still together and talked about her. That said, she literally went ballistic at him when she found out that we had a fast food meal together. I remember that he absolutely hated that relationship, she was hideous to him throughout.

 

[ContemporaryStudent]

In that case, 'borrow' Cleverlymadeup's bucket of ice water and set him straight. As long as you can stick to your convictions that you won't let him sucker you into his way of things, then you can probabaly maintain a strong, friend based relationship - providing you don't nanny him too much.

And on that note - I'm going to hit the sack for a few hours.

Good night/morning folks.

 

[theklng]

But I don't know, I'm no Freud.

Apologies, but I'm a nit-picker. The works of Jung would be more appropriate here. From what you've described, Blue, he seems like Jung's format of the 'introvert feeling'. Emotionally inaccessible and considerably esoteric with thier lives - Supposedly self sufficient, but perhaps the breakdown is forcing him out of that kind of psychoanalytical shell, explaining why he is going for your attention so much.

Coincidently, the 'Introvert Feeling' is generally attracted to 'powerful extroverts of the opposite sex'... if you were saying your Sister said his new girlfriend was plainer than you, this could be another factor.

That and it's thought that the first relationship is one you never forget.. His first was an engagement as well. You've got quite a decision on your hands, and despite my initial advice, this may be worth salvaging if you see a great friendship there.


::Edit:: Apologies for the early morning psychoanalysis - this is good for me, My university dissertation is a Freudian/Jungian analysis of South Park. ^^

i wouldn't say self sufficient if only given the information that he is introvert feeling. you'd have to take into account intuition and lifestyle. although i do agree on that he is feeling.

may i inquire about your dissertation?

 

[TaborMallory]

A boy never forgets a girl if the breakup was peaceful.

I've been in situations like this before, particularly with the whole "he didn't tell you about his new girlfriend" deal. Maybe he doesn't want to hurt your feelings. I've hidden things from girls, but it's not out of spite, but rather out of care for their feelings (sometimes I wonder if any girl alive understands this...). Then again, I tend to do things like this on a regular basis, and not all guys have this same mindset.
I've had a very rough time in the past about things like this, and believe me, it's not easy for a guy to give up on a girl. Some girls could see this as obsessive; sometimes it is, but most of the time, he's just trying not to forget you.

 

[vid20]

I haven't read all the replies.. so sorry if this has already been said..

But what if he and this new girl had broken up.. or are on a break.. it could be he is just regressing to you (maybe for a booty call) I hate to think that's the case.. but I'm naturally a pessimist about these things. I mean.. if they ARE broken up it would make a bit of sense wouldn't it? *shrugs*

 

[Blue Sonnet]

A boy never forgets a girl if the breakup was peaceful.

I haven't come across this before - could you elaborate at all?

I've been in situations like this before, particularly with the whole "he didn't tell you about his new girlfriend" deal. Maybe he doesn't want to hurt your feelings. I've hidden things from girls, but it's not out of spite, but rather out of care for their feelings (sometimes I wonder if any girl alive understands this...).

I definitely do, and I think that most others do as well, it is something that I have wondered about, especially in view of how he announced his previous relationship.

That said, he knows I'm intelligent, that I know about computers and the internet, and that it's bloody obvious when someone changes privacy settings just after speaking to you.

Actually, I don't think he's realised that the first two items automatically result in the last one. It's not a terribly clever thing to do if you think about it properly.

 

[mark_n_b]

This is messed up. Based on your story I am certain that this dude isn't the most socially well adjusted of individuals. Not dangerous or anything, but, you were his first girlfriend and engaged to him? Failed engagement to boot. And he doesn't have any other friends now because he got a mortgage? but he's dating another girl? What?

Frankly, a serious engagement is not exited to a casual friendship (maturity issues?) as for the dogs, you gave them up on the break-up, let them go. The fact that he is not talking about his current girlfriend suggests there is an issue there that he does not want to talk about (did he break up with her, is he about to?)

Going out drinking with him and listening to "you look good, would it work out if we got together now?" is kind of telling as well.

A lot is not being told by him to you or you to us, it makes it difficult to give any sort of advice worth while. If you want to break up with him, do it, drop the constant IMing, following his social life on facebook, going to the pub and occasional phone call. If you don't, then get back together. If you want him to be friends and not lover, you shouldn't have slept with him in the first place, that's not an option, you can't go back. Especially if he has no experience with those sorts of emotions.

As it stands, I'd lay money he and said girl never went out at all, it sounds like he wanted to date her, I'd be willing to bet what's going on is that he asked her out and she shot him down and people are misreading the courtship as an actual relationship.

Male perspective, the problem sounds like it is totally coming from you, whatever feelings your harboring, you don't sound like you're being completely honest with yourself.

Besides, asking questions like this, you have already made up your mind about what your going to do and just want one of us to say that it is the right decision. We've all been there.

 

[Honkifyoulovepeaceandquiet]

First, I have to agree with Optimus. Look out for yourself first. He didn't mention his other girl to you because he has tasted the other delicacies out there and maybe didn't like what he found as much as he likes you. I will tell you the all-powerful truth about most guys: they will try to cover their ass on all points before they open up. He may be insecure about the fact that since he has a girl, you may not want him back. This may or may not be the truth, but you have to rid him of any insecurities he has about YOU. This is why most relationships fail- lack of communication. At the same time, since you were together so long, he might be insecure about how well you know him. Make use of that and talk to him. Just don't let him drag you into a love triangle or worse, because since he has or has had drug dependencies, those will most often come first and complicate things. Trust me, I have a few of my own demons in that department. But me and my gal have been together for nigh on 5 years now, so let that lend credit to my words.

 

[cobra_ky]

as a random guy on the internet, i say you send him an ultimatum. tell him you value his friendship but it's only going to work if you're honest with each other. if he's not wiling to do that then cut him off. if he's posting pictures of this girl on facebook he's obviously not trying very hard to hide her, which makes the fact that he's hiding it from you all the more suspicious. if i had to guess i'd say he entered another relationship to avoid being alone, but he's unhappy with it and doesn't want you to find out because he's afraid of burning bridges.

that said, friendships with exes can work, but it sounds like this one might not. i have years of experience of being A Guy on the Internet to back me up on this.

A boy never forgets a girl if the breakup was peaceful.

i was going to agree until i realized there was one girl i completely forgot about. i don't pursue relationships, so usually it's either some girl that threw herself at me or a friend. if she isn't bat-shit crazy mad at me after the break-up, it seems like a silly thing to end a friendship over so i still make an effort. generally over time we grow apart, over the course of a few months/years.

That said, he knows I'm intelligent, that I know about computers and the internet, and that it's bloody obvious when someone changes privacy settings just after speaking to you.

Actually, I don't think he's realised that the first two items automatically result in the last one. It's not a terribly clever thing to do if you think about it properly.

i seriously doubt he's thinking about anything properly right now.

Best of luck. I fear for your chinchillas. ;_;

 

[Same River New Water]

He wants to get back with you, on an emotional level if not a rational one. That's why he's affectionate after a few drinks.

Your mother and sister, and many of the people in this thread, are overreacting: he's not dangerous, just lonely. You should be friendly, but don't encourage him at all. Don't ever go with the flow of his suggestive talk about relationships; don't do anything to lead him on (or follow him on) while kidding yourself that it's harmless. Always act like a friend would, never a potential lover, and you'll be fine.

If you need to stop seeing him, fine. Cutting all ties is overkill, though. There's no reason you can't be acquaintances at least, as long as he doesn't abuse the privilege and keep contacting you when you don't want him to.

EDIT: It also sounds like you're the only person he feels he can talk to. That's not uncommon for men: most of us don't talk to our friends about emotional things under normal circumstances, so a girlfriend is often the only person available. If he's unhappy in his current relationship (assuming it IS a relationship, and not you misinterpreting some photos...) that only leaves you for him to speak to.

Like every other guy, I'm still a little bit in love with my first girlfriend. I never see her anymore, but if I was compelled to speak to her, especially if I was unhappy, especially if I was in a bad relationship, especially under the influence of alcohol, my instincts might override my judgement about the two of us, if you see what I mean. This guy sounds the same: he wants you because you're his only emotional connection in the world.

 

[Yami Blade]

You said that you were his first girlfriend yes? That would mean that you are a significant figure in his life as (most likely) the first co-dependant relationship, therefore, you are a person whom he feels he can trust with his problems. If he is seemingly cutting off methods of communicating about personal matters it is likely that he either has some feelings for you, is disappointed about how the matter ended or, most likely, is embarrassed about his own personal life.

As for if you should cut off all ties I believe the only way to answer that without regret is to ask yourself that question. If you are apprehensive about the matter it is probably best to confront him and ask why he seems to view you as a lifeline. If the thought of cutting him off makes you sad or angry its probably best not to and wait till you are more sure of what to do and if you feel no remorse about cutting the ties its probably best to ask yourself why you have been putting up with it for so long

Anyway thats just my humble opinion. Hope it helps

 

[jasoncyrus]

Well from a male perspective who knows how proper males work (proper meaning the highest common version of them, the grunting wheezing "Me crush" variety)

Tell him to grow a pair first off. That should rattle his cage enough to get him to respond.

Secondly, Subtly doesn't work on most guys, so simply saying her name with a question mark will simply get ignored since its base response is "huh?". Be blunt and forward and ask him outright "I thought we agreed to tell each other if we started seeing someone."

Men are simple creatures and somewhat lack the conniving vindictive secretive nature of the female species.

Men are also very territory specific creatures and paranoid.

surely you can lean on her for this type of thing?

No he can't because it might make the relationship spontaneous combust in his face. He speaks to you about it first because you are the waters to test his problems in, you dont directly affect his life by being told and so its a good place to start finding a solution. It's an honor to be this person.

Also...asking mutual friends is actually a good idea if you bother to explain the situation properly and come across as genuinely concerned about his behaviour being self detrimental.

I assume chinchillas are a pet of sorts. Be brash and heartless and ask them if he killed them. That'll shake him to his foundations and provoke an aggressive response. At which point you can respond with something that inspires guilt in everyone "Well what else am I supposed to think if you refuse to let me see them?"

I know this type of character very well...because I am one

Give him a poke with a rough sharp stick every so often to remind him he needs to let you through his thick skin every once in a while.

 

[Blue Sonnet]

Thank you again for your replies, every one has helped me. I just want to make clear that we haven't been out for drinks for a long time - every time in the past year that I have seen him he has literally just turned up at the door unannounced.

He seems to be hiding at the moment and hasn't been online or called. I know he's been online recently because of the following:

He DID reject my friend request on Friendfinder. I told him I was going to and that I'd find out if he did this.
Now I'm really not happy with him. When I speak to him next I'm going to have to hash it out, I've done too much for him to let him mess around with me like this, regardless of his depression - he's getting treatment for it, and if he wants me to carry on as a friend then he's going to have to come clean.

I'll send him an e-mail asking what's going on, that way I'll know it's arrived and he can't faff on about MSN messing up or texts disappearing (another phenomenon that happened yesterday, although it was one of those long four-parters).

If he values the friendship he'll contact me, and if he doesn't he'll avoid me and any conflict which might get difficult for him.

 

[JWAN]

get a tazer, change the locks and cut him off until he REALLY straightens himself out.