Marines Desecrate Insurgent corpse, urinate on it

[tsb247]

It's war. War isn't pretty, and it can make people do horrible things.

I too believe that we should hold ourselves to a higher standard than our enemies. However, the fact is that this sort of thing will happen in a wartime scenario. Whether or not we will hear about it is debatable. This time, we heard about it.

 

[Crazy]

Wait, we're concerned about a soldier taking a pee pee on a dead guy, who happens to be against said soldier? We should be more concerned about the people dying.

 

[maninahat]

It was proven and documented that the Taliban used torture techniques. While this isn't acceptable at all it's not like there saints either. True, we used torture to but...you know what? Nobody is innocent in all of this. Does it really matter? I can't prove it but I wouldn't have a hard believing that there wasn't at least one Taliban member who pissed on captured soldiers. I'm sure there's a long un-storied history of soldiers peeing on enemy soldiers dead. Is this a deplorable act to do and film? Yes. Have much worse more disrespectful things been done by both Taliban and American forces? Yes. I still don't have much sympathy for anyone who is a member of a group where strapping bombs to one's self and exploding themselves in crowded areas filled with civilians isn't somewhat looked down upon but this still shouldn't have happened. Has it happened before? Probably. Will it happen again? Probably.

The point is that we should do what we can. That includes condemning individuals who casually mistreat others, even if those others who commit substantially more terrible acts. It isn't a question of sympathising with the dead, or whether some crimes outweigh others. It is about condemning/repremanding immoral acts whenever possible, whatever shape or size they come in.

 

[BlazeRaider]

Yes actually shit like this DOES increase the amount of attacks the Taliban are capable of inflicting. The Taliban forces are not a regular army, they don't have stable recruitment and their numbers are very closely tied to how much the general population hates their enemies at the time.

The thing is the Taliban actually have very little real supporters, most of the insurgents the coalition forces are fighting are either very poor farmers (ironically many of whom only fight because they lost their livelihoods due to coalition bombings or raids) who resort to fighting for the Taliban part time like a sort of minimum wage mercenary to make ends meet, or militia belonging to villages or tribes that choose to side with the Taliban due to a common hatred against the Americans. Its also not just Afghans, Arab groups from other parts of the middle east, as well as Africa also send fighters to the war to aid the Taliban primarily because the US is seen as an enemy of their religion. Each atrocity that coalition forces commit convinces these people that they are just as bad or worse then the Taliban, this isn't an enemy you can beat by killing. By rebuilding the country and providing a means of feeding their family other then as a part time fighter or heroin grower and by showing the populace you aren't composed of complete monsters the Taliban will have a smaller and smaller network of support and will wither away.

I can imagine the Taliban showing this footage to villages that were either neutral or unsure towards the americans and BAM, hundreds of new village militia will now shoot coalition forces on sight, all cause these idiots needed a laugh.

 

[PinochetIsMyBro]

Hmm.... ok

So let me get this straight. Some US Marine guys decided to pee on some dead guys who represent an organization that has a penchant for burning down girls schools, committing honor rapes, and generally having no compunctions about killing large numbers of civilians to achieve their goals.

Pretty much this. Who cares? I certainly don't.

Where were all of you when the Taliban were killing young girls for trying to learn how to read and treating women in general like disposable cattle? Oh wait, they still do and you still don't care.

If it were up to me we'd be dumping insurgents into mass graves full of pig's blood. Their culture and the cult they follow are both inferior and barbaric, and both need to be eradicated.

 

[Yureina]

Hmm.... ok

So let me get this straight. Some US Marine guys decided to pee on some dead guys who represent an organization that has a penchant for burning down girls schools, committing honor rapes, and generally having no compunctions about killing large numbers of civilians to achieve their goals.

Pretty much this. Who cares? I certainly don't.

Where were all of you when the Taliban were killing young girls for trying to learn how to read and treating women in general like disposable cattle? Oh wait, they still do and you still don't care.

If it were up to me we'd be dumping insurgents into mass graves full of pig's blood. Their culture and the cult they follow are both inferior and barbaric, and both need to be eradicated.

I'd simply just burn them, so they couldn't even have graves and no remnant of their physical existence could ever be found.

 

[greatcheezer2021]

its a war zone, what little could you expect?

at least they're not putting heads on a pike, eating bodies, sodomizing dead bodies with knives, or filming rapes. its not like the Nanking Massacre or the Fall of Berlin where the Russians mercilessly desecrated the surviving populace. Worse things have happened, and thru the evidence of videotape, we've seen a much worse end to Ghaddafi, and he probably had more done to his body than be pissed on.

its not a honorable thing to desecrate a dead body, but in reality when you're overseas and supposed to be "helping" a country that doesnt expect "help", you'll let your inhibitions let loose. especially when they're trying to kill you and your dudes in their neighborhood.

personally in war, if anyone shot at me and i felt threatened and got a confirmed kill on the assailant id probably piss on em. only once tho, another 4 times and your asking for trouble AND i would not make the mistake of having anyone film me. i think like most other people, i wouldnt do anything physically to a body, on contrary to spouting something like, "thank god that my GOD is on my side".

 

[sonofliber]

GOOD! The Marines have every right to do what they want to Terrorists, some of their friends might have been killed by the Taliban, so they can do whatever they want to them, they are protecting our world for Terrorism.

kind of an irony, america kind of helped a lot of the terrorist (osama in the 80, saddam in the 70s), when it suited them).and lets not forget a lot of the most bloddy dictator of south and central america, trained in the U.S.

 

[Gordon_4_v1legacy]

Hmm.... ok

So let me get this straight. Some US Marine guys decided to pee on some dead guys who represent an organization that has a penchant for burning down girls schools, committing honor rapes, and generally having no compunctions about killing large numbers of civilians to achieve their goals.

*shrugs* Sorry, but I just can't bring myself to care about this. Sure it's gross to pee on dead people, but... these were some pretty bad people. I could think of much worse things to do to these jerks.

I think there's a few misconceptions running around; I don't care that they've done this either since as Marines they're all big boys who can make their own decisions. What I do care about is that they fight with their brains as well as with their rifle.

No one here is arguing against the fact that the Taliban aren't a bunch of stone age barbarians with AK-47s (which they are); but the slippery slope starts with shit like this. I expect disgraceful conduct such as this from the Taliban because they're but a few steps away from animals. I do not expect this kind of adolecent bullshit from a U.S. Marine who should know better.

 

[Yureina]

Hmm.... ok

So let me get this straight. Some US Marine guys decided to pee on some dead guys who represent an organization that has a penchant for burning down girls schools, committing honor rapes, and generally having no compunctions about killing large numbers of civilians to achieve their goals.

*shrugs* Sorry, but I just can't bring myself to care about this. Sure it's gross to pee on dead people, but... these were some pretty bad people. I could think of much worse things to do to these jerks.

I think there's a few misconceptions running around; I don't care that they've done this either since as Marines they're all big boys who can make their own decisions. What I do care about is that they fight with their brains as well as with their rifle.

No one here is arguing against the fact that the Taliban aren't a bunch of stone age barbarians with AK-47s (which they are); but the slippery slope starts with shit like this. I expect disgraceful conduct such as this from the Taliban because they're but a few steps away from animals. I do not expect this kind of adolecent bullshit from a U.S. Marine who should know better.

Fair enough. I certainly can see where you are coming from. You seem to have a fair amount of respect for US Marines and the US military in general. If that is the case, it is something that you and I share.

With that said, I still don't really care that they did this. It does not cross my personal threshold into the realm of unacceptable behavior (though... my threshold is pretty loose in this regard >_>).

 

[SillyBear]

This stuff happens. I'm sure it happened in World War 2 too - they just couldn't film it.

It's a war. It's horrible. Blah blah blah.

 

[SillyBear]

Not seeing the problem here. The dead guys were already dead, they aren't gonna mind. The people who are getting annoyed about this have absolutely no moral high ground to stand on.reprisal attacks? Like the insurgents need a reason to attack coalition forces or civilians.

The problem is this:



Doesn't match up with this:

When does advertising ever match up to the reality of the service/product?

 

[Gordon_4_v1legacy]

Hmm.... ok

So let me get this straight. Some US Marine guys decided to pee on some dead guys who represent an organization that has a penchant for burning down girls schools, committing honor rapes, and generally having no compunctions about killing large numbers of civilians to achieve their goals.

*shrugs* Sorry, but I just can't bring myself to care about this. Sure it's gross to pee on dead people, but... these were some pretty bad people. I could think of much worse things to do to these jerks.

I think there's a few misconceptions running around; I don't care that they've done this either since as Marines they're all big boys who can make their own decisions. What I do care about is that they fight with their brains as well as with their rifle.

No one here is arguing against the fact that the Taliban aren't a bunch of stone age barbarians with AK-47s (which they are); but the slippery slope starts with shit like this. I expect disgraceful conduct such as this from the Taliban because they're but a few steps away from animals. I do not expect this kind of adolecent bullshit from a U.S. Marine who should know better.

Fair enough. I certainly can see where you are coming from. You seem to have a fair amount of respect for US Marines and the US military in general. If that is the case, it is something that you and I share.

My feelings on the US Military are complicated. I resent that occasionally they get used as a bludgeon for the wrong reasons (such as Iraq) and the really bizzare sort of 'complex' that gets built around them. As my dear old nan said to a particularly rude priest, 'Just because you wear the uniform, doesn't get you automatic entry into heaven'. While the act of swearing an oath that may mean you will die for your nation and your allies is brave in ways I will never fathom, it isn't some automatic sheild from critisism or oversight for your actions either. On the other hand, I'm aware that they've chosen to shoulder a massive burden: and I really hate to see the legacy built by their forebearers in places like Iwo Jima or my own forebearers at ANZAC Cove and Tobruk tarnished by wankers.

However, the matter at hand is whether Corporal Dipshit and his buddies in the video violated the rules and regulations which govern his branch of the armed forces. If they have, whatever I can think of to call him will pale in comparrison in to what their commanding officers will call him or do to him.

 

[Wicky_42]

Couldn't care less. Deficate on them too for good measure. Have you seen what the locals do to the corpses of marines? Now thats barbaric. When you allow your children to pull them to pieces and batter them with sticks and stones all while chanting "Allah Akbhar".

When we're condemning a country for their actions to the point of war, we can't just turn around and start acting like them.

This. It would almost be like bombing a country because its regime was violently cracking down democratically-minded protesters, then turning round and doing the same thing to your own citizens...

...

OH WAIT :/

Typical American liberal. The Middle East has been murdering protesters for almost a year, and you describe a few Occupiers getting pepper-sprayed as a 'violent crackdown.' Seriously, get some perspective.

Yeah, I'm so American I actually visited the country for two whole weeks!. Fail. Typical Right-wing propagandist response. Again, quoting news articles featured on the Escapist. You do realise that, although they do have a fine selection of hats, the escapist isn't the only source for news?

Very well, scratch "American" from my post. It doesn't change the fact that a "violent crackdown" and pepper spray are not even close to the same thing. And there are other sources for news around me, but they're either the uselessly sensational Fox News, the boring as hell CNN, or Al Sharpton-approved MSNBC. Three fantastic choices.

Except that you have the internet and all of the associated free news publications that go with it. I don't know of any broadsheet or tabloid that doesn't have an online component.

When I speak of "violent crackdowns", I'm speaking of press being detained and prevented from reporting, not just of actions that would have been war crimes if done on enemy combatants and not your own citizens.

 

[Peteron]

I've seen far worse from what the Taliban have done to other soldiers. Sure, its not right, but people are blowing it out of proportion. We all know it happens, we don't need a camera to figure that out. Many soldiers just go to war to shoot people, so how can we not expect something like this on occasion? Its wrong, everyone knows it. Punish the soldiers, there is no additional discussion required.

 

[internetzealot1]

Because God forbid soldiers hate the people trying to kill them.

 

[Jaythulhu]

Because God forbid soldiers hate the people trying to kill them.

So what, acting like a bunch of uncivilised, filthy barbarians because you hate a group of people is ok? Groovy, I'm gonna go out and start pissing on every conservative and god-botherer I can find.

--------

OT: Perhaps they're all just former Hackmaster players? Pissing on an enemy's corpse in view of his friends is a +10 honor xp bonus.

 

[Enslave_All_Elves]

Very well, scratch "American" from my post. It doesn't change the fact that a "violent crackdown" and pepper spray are not even close to the same thing. And there are other sources for news around me, but they're either the uselessly sensational Fox News, the boring as hell CNN, or Al Sharpton-approved MSNBC. Three fantastic choices.

Pepper spray? Oh yeah we're all fired up over pepper spray hardass.

No a violent crackdown is when you give a veteran brain damage by firing a fucking grenade into his head, then fire more gas into the group of people shouting for help from a paramedic (which, oddly enough, is what the pigs should have been calling for themselves, but why do your job if your asshole friends will cover for you). In New York they were beating people in another veteran's group, and there's any number of videos showing them beating on people restrained on the ground. I don't say "beat" for one measly cheap shot or a punch or two. Those protestors are adults and they can take it (and should if they believe in what they're doing). I mean clubbing motherfuckers repeatedly while other cops hold them down. The cops also make deliberate attempts to break cameras in direct violation of free speech because those idiots know they need to eliminate any evidence possible. On top of that they removed protestors in cities where the protest had prior government approval and the protestors were peaceful. In one case they pepper sprayed an old woman. Frankly, if I saw a cop hurt an old lady I'd strangle him with his own intestines and laugh at his family crying.

I'll concede our news channels suck. But there's no excuse for you not being able to look up one of the hundreds of protestor taken videos before talking out of your lazy ass.

As for pissing on dead Iraqis? Who cares? Don't want to get shot or pissed on then don't fucking shoot at me. I'll even take it a step further: I don't give a shit if they mutilate our corpses or piss on our soldiers. If someone invaded your country you'd do the same thing and probably much worse if you had the time.

 

[The Long Road]

Very well, scratch "American" from my post. It doesn't change the fact that a "violent crackdown" and pepper spray are not even close to the same thing. And there are other sources for news around me, but they're either the uselessly sensational Fox News, the boring as hell CNN, or Al Sharpton-approved MSNBC. Three fantastic choices.

Pepper spray? Oh yeah we're all fired up over pepper spray hardass.

No a violent crackdown is when you give a veteran brain damage by firing a fucking grenade into his head, then fire more gas into the group of people shouting for help from a paramedic (which, oddly enough, is what the pigs should have been calling for themselves, but why do your job if your asshole friends will cover for you). In New York they were beating people in another veteran's group, and there's any number of videos showing them beating on people restrained on the ground. I don't say "beat" for one measly cheap shot or a punch or two. Those protestors are adults and they can take it (and should if they believe in what they're doing). I mean clubbing motherfuckers repeatedly while other cops hold them down. The cops also make deliberate attempts to break cameras in direct violation of free speech because those idiots know they need to eliminate any evidence possible. On top of that they removed protestors in cities where the protest had prior government approval and the protestors were peaceful. In one case they pepper sprayed an old woman. Frankly, if I saw a cop hurt an old lady I'd strangle him with his own intestines and laugh at his family crying.

I'll concede our news channels suck. But there's no excuse for you not being able to look up one of the hundreds of protestor taken videos before talking out of your lazy ass.

As for pissing on dead Iraqis? Who cares? Don't want to get shot or pissed on then don't fucking shoot at me. I'll even take it a step further: I don't give a shit if they mutilate our corpses or piss on our soldiers. If someone invaded your country you'd do the same thing and probably much worse if you had the time.

I'll reiterate what I said earlier: A violent crackdown is what happened in Egypt and Syria and Libya. Military or paramilitary troops with live rounds and automatic weapons backed up by armored vehicles. It's when the big stories are fatalities, not injuries. It's when people can't post videos of what happened because the government won't allow it. It's when the government is afraid of full-scale rebellion and tries its last-ditch intimidation tactics.

A violent crackdown is NOT the removal of the Occupy movement from the parks and streets they had been denying the rest of the taxpaying citizenry. Was there violence? Yes, and OWS would have been a shitty protest if it had simply packed its bags as soon as somebody said it was time to leave. But public opinion soured against the crowds, and politicians are (supposed to be) subservient to the will of the public. (Note that I do not say public opinion turned against OWS in general, only to its physical presence as an obstacle) City police had to be dispatched to carry out court orders to remove the protesters.

As Orwellian as the tactics to remove them may have appeared, they were necessary when metro PD's were outnumbered 100 to 1 or worse. Cities didn't have battalions of faceless soldier-cops to herd OWS out, they had their already overtaxed police departments. The only option when outnumbered so badly is shock and awe, and it's a testament to police departments across the nation that things went as smoothly as they did. Non-lethal systems were employed to great effect, but when those didn't work, officers defended themselves and their fellow policemen when necessary. As is the case with any and every protest removal, there were cases of unnecessary force. It's just what happens. Those involved were disciplined as the law demands.

The big difference between the removal of OWS and a "violent crackdown" is the lack of corpses. Those injured by the police are still walking and talking and generally not being dead. I wish I could see the look on the families of the Egyptians, Syrians, and Libyans killed in the Arab Spring as you describe Occupy's removal as violent. I'm pretty sure they'd end up pissing on your corpse.

 

[internetzealot1]

Because God forbid soldiers hate the people trying to kill them.

So what, acting like a bunch of uncivilised, filthy barbarians because you hate a group of people is ok? Groovy, I'm gonna go out and start pissing on every conservative and god-botherer I can find.

The keyword is "kill." As in, you know, the worst possible thing you can do to a person.