Me, Myself and I - A thread for we few fans of ALIENS: Colonial Marines

[MeChaNiZ3D]

I'm sorry, but it just isn't ok to show exemplary preview footage and then release an AT MOST mediocre game. Nothing you've said in your OP about the single player is telling me I should buy the game. If anything, I now know that it is better than AvP2, whatever significance that is meant to have.

 

[Rowan Tritton]

I'm sorry, but it just isn't ok to show exemplary preview footage and then release an AT MOST mediocre game.

Do you mean this one from 12 months ago http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LBXfZWIG3ks?!? because that's 90% accurate and one of the oldest single player previews. The (single-player) inaccuracies come from a lot of multiplayer footage being sliced in; the third person view when cutting the marine free; and the CRP being performed in the hanger (that was there but moved to the side of the door the player was already on).
Alternatively you're probably referring to this one of about the same vintage http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NZHA58-_2Eg which is more or less the reveal pitch. For those people who continue to refer to this version though, I've pointed out that it's a complete on-rails work in progress simulation and that to recreate the action in the finished product to the same standard would, in my opinion, require crazy advanced AI which could compensate for when the player's actions screw with scripted events. As for the graphics in this version, of course they're at maximum capacity, it's the reveal pitch done a year ago, why show your crappy work in progress stuff when you can show a highly polished, amazing looking concept video?!?

I'd also like to mention that many, including Jim Sterling who hit hard in regards to the WIO gameplay from video, admitted that they'd played alpha builds of the game, which weren't too far off the finished product. Now whilst I appreciate that they were subject to non-disclosure contracts in regards to those alpha builds, but it makes the idea of Jim's outrage in the A-LIE-ns video all the more ridiculous. He'd already played what the game was more or less going to be, why did he imagine it to be so far removed from the alpha build and instead more like a year old reveal pitch video?!?

Nothing you've said in your OP about the single player is telling me I should buy the game.

I've never said anyone should by this game, nor is my original post or the thread title anything geared towards making others purchase this game. The closest I have come is by strongly insisting people play through the game (and maybe some of its co-op and multiplayer) before they try to argue the merits of the finished product. What use are 2nd, 3rd and even 4th hand developed opinions, especially in a thread dedicated to fans of the finished product sharing their good experiences with it?!?

If anything, I now know that it is better than AvP2, whatever significance that is meant to have.

I never said it was better than AvP2+PH, that game is considered by many of us as the best FPS of the franchise released so far. The only things I said were better in A:CM was the graphics, which is understandable considering their respective release years; and the inclusion of thematic game mechanics (lets repeat this again...), like motion trackers that aren't a HUD element; welders that seal/open doors; and powerloaders you can drive. The significance comes from the aforementioned fact that fans of the series think AvP2+PH is superior to the rest, and that's still true in terms of story, weaving 6 character narratives together in a satisfying way.


Cheers
Rowan/LSWSjr

 

[MeChaNiZ3D]

snip

Yes, that's exactly the footage I mean. And while it's difficult to discern plot and those sorts of things from a preview, and admittedly also from what I've played of it, the difference in atmosphere, animations, and at the risk of sounding petty, graphics, is really obvious. Just everything to do with visuals is inferior. It's accurate in that it shows what happens, but it looks a lot better. They did away with the fog, the AI seems worse...I suppose the former is a design decision, but still, a poor decision for atmosphere I think. I don't really care for scripted moments either, but they were done fluidly in the preview and in the final game they didn't even try. The turret does nothing, for example. I'm going to level with you, I haven't played the whole game, and there may be some good moments further down the track that need to be experienced in person, but initially, and since it's not my copy that's probably all it's going to get, it's not just disappointing in regards to the preview, but bad as far as games of its assumed quality are concerned. It's good that someone is enjoying it though.

I'm not an Aliens fan, so I don't know about what lore it was meant to contradict and I don't know what AvP2 is like. And I can't account for Jim either, he probably played the alpha and knew exactly what he was going to do when the game was released and looked like it does.

 

[maddawg IAJI]

Its a public forum. They can go where they please and can post where they please provided they are not breaking any of the rules. And before you ask, no, posting their opinion, even if it does differ from yours, is not against the CoC.

They're not trolls. They're trying to have a debate, which is something we like to encourage.

How are they having a debate? The ones I was responding to were simply saying the game is bad/terrible/etc without giving reason, and generally without giving evidence of having first-hand experience with the game. In the case of those who have wanted to actually post more than a sentence or two of bad mouthing the game, I've happily responded in kind and explained my reasons in the course of an actual debate.

Here's a selection of the so-called debate's you seem to be referring to, and that I was responding to at the time:

there is no way a game like this can be defended.am an aliens fan and i wont support the maker for making a game like this

It actually looks a little bit like someone from Gearbox made an account to try and sell this game.

haha if only had they put in half as much effort in actually making the game better

PS i really wish u pirated the game so me and other sentient consumers arent forced to bare to such money grabbing scams by you simply showing your approval to such tactics

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And I can see plenty of posts from people who are looking for debate, but my point still stands. You don't control where people post.

 

[Rowan Tritton]

I decided to do this as a separate post just because I wanted to warn anyone who hasn't played the game, and who also doesn't know what the whole 'messing with the cannon' issue is about, to read this. So consider yourself warned, spoilers and spoiler-based speculation follow.

Spoiler

The return of a living Corporal Dwayne Hicks - one of this game's biggest alleged crimes and the worst retcon ever, apparently...
Okay, let's start with a bit of background, Hicks was one of the only survivors of ALIENS, the only surviving marine, and the love interest of Ripley. He was popular enough that he featured prominently in Dark Horse's comic sequel to the film and some drafts of Alien 3 actually had Hicks as the lead or co-lead character. A lot of people disliked Alien 3 for killing of Newt and Hicks (including actor Michael Biehn), there was even Indoctrination Theory style projects that worked to prove Alien 3 was a nightmare of Ripley's just to invalidate the events of the film, up until Alien Resurrection came out that is...
So here we have a character, who's death was hated by a large number of fans, and who is popular enough that GearBox thought it worth their time to pay Michael Biehn and agree to bring the character back to life, in what was most likely to make a ton of fans happy. So why did it go wrong?
Personally I don't know why it went wrong, probably because of the theory that 'whatever you do, you can never please the fans', still onto how the game handles this retcon.
-----Plot Spoilers Below, Last Chance To Click Away-----
So the game opens with a distress call sent by a head bandaged Hicks (some time after the final battle with the Queen in ALIENS) to USCMC HQ saying that things went to hell, and it is this message that causes your ship to go looking for the Sulaco in the first place. Later in the game you discover information that confirms that a marine from the Sulaco's mission to LV-426 is being held prisoner by Weyland-Yutani forces on the planet and you are to rescue them. The marine turns out to be Hicks who reveals that as the last of the military personnel onboard the Sulaco the computer awakened him early from cryo-sleep when Weyland-Yutani mercenaries invaded the vessel. He glosses over who was in his cryo-chamber in the EEV, but goes on to say he was captured and interrogated by Michael Weyland (from Alien 3, finally confirmed to be a synthetic) over a period of about 18 months regarding the events of ALIENS.
-----Speculation on what just happened (which sources) and why I think it isn't a cannon destroying retcon-----
Okay, my theory is a rather simple one, it even works in point-form:
+Alien eggs are on the Sulaco, which the computer is aware of along with WY (Alien 3)
+Company sends nearby WY mercenaries to intercept and board the Sulaco (A:CM)
+Ripley gets facehugged (Alien 3)
+Hicks is awoken and sends the distress call (A:CM)
+Hicks fights off a mercenary and puts them in his cryo-chamber (Speculation, most likely source of replacement body)
+Second facehugger starts the electrical fire (Alien 3)
+Ripley's facehugger has left her by the time she's loaded into the EEV (Alien 3, according to A:CM it averages 1 hour to implant the embryo)
+EEV is jettisoned over Fiorina 161 before WY mercenaries can get a hold of Ripley (Alien 3/A:CM)
+Hicks is captured by WY mercenaries (A:CM)
+'Not-Hicks' dies in the EEV crash (Alien 3/A:CM)
So the above is obviously not the Word of the Cannon God, but it's based on information from the 'cannon' sources and only has a single unexplained element to fill in with logic, so I have to ask, how does this damage the cannon? The body seen in Alien 3 is too damaged to identify and they didn't have the facilities to confirm the identity via dental records or a blood sample, so the only evidence it was Hick's body was that the cryo-chamber had Hicks logged as its occupant (and Hicks probably wouldn't be nice enough to reprogram it for his attacker).

Personally, as a fan, I'm happy it happened.

Cheers
Rowan/LSWSjr

 

[Rowan Tritton]

And I can see plenty of posts from people who are looking for debate, but my point still stands. You don't control where people post.

No, but I can still prefer that they post somewhere more appropriate and not put down people for enjoying a game, and I'm just as free to voice that opinion. What they do after that is up to them.

Cheers
Rowan/LSWSjr

 

[Alternative]

And I can see plenty of posts from people who are looking for debate, but my point still stands. You don't control where people post.

No, but I can still prefer that they post somewhere more appropriate and not put down people for enjoying a game, and I'm just as free to voice that opinion. What they do after that is up to them.

Cheers
Rowan/LSWSjr

Now i haven't played the game or read any reviews on it and while ive seen the first two alien films i wouldnt call myself a fan of the series.
But your defense of it is doing a fair job of convincing me not to get it.

What i can boil down your argument is

The graphics are better then any other aliens game (except the previous one which came out 3 years ago)
The game play isn't generic, its just like any other shooter on the market.
The characters are bland and the story is uninteresting.

those three things alone turn me off buying the game.

Im not a fan of the lore so i wont be buying it for that.
The story is bland so i wont be buying it for that and the game play is generic so i wont be buying it for that.

All up your defense of the game has done a better job then all the controversy in convincing me to not buy it.

 

[Iwata]

Im not a fan of the lore so i wont be buying it for that.

Well then there goes most people's motivation for buying it in the first place. If you're not a fan of Aliens, it stands to reason you won't be too interested in buying an Aliens game in the first place.

All up your defense of the game has done a better job then all the controversy in convincing me to not buy it.

Well, then, how about this:

I won't go into a detailed defence of the game, because frankly, with the sheer amount of negative bandwagon-ism going on, it's way past being given a break. Which is a shame. I bought the game. I bought the Collector's Edition, even. Then I started reading reviews and these forums. And I got scared I'd wasted my money. But you know what I found instead? A perfectly functional game, and a fun game at that. I found absolutely none of the issues, bugs or glitches described by others, the graphics are perfectly alright, the story is just fine, and in all, it sounds like the vast majority of the criticism being levelled at the game is being done so by people who've never actually played it, while other criticism is petty to say the least ("The game is too easy"? You have 4 difficulty options, champ. Play it in something other than Recruit).

We all know that a large segment of gamers take some form of pleasure in seeing a game fail, especially if it's been so long in development. And while I'm sure there is plenty of valid criticism to be aimed at it, most of it seems driven by a will to see it crash and burn. Just look at the whole "Gearbox outsourced the game" controversy. It's been pretty much discredited from the start. A single "anonymous source" posted "claiming to work for Gearbox"? Yeah, that sounds convincing... I'm sure no one could log into a forum, create an account, and make such a ridiculous claim, one that is then taken as fact by the gamers who thrive on this sort of issue.

In the end, it doesn't really matter. I bought the game, I'm having a blast playing it, and I don't really much care if others buy it or not. It just saddens me to think many people will pass up on it due to word of mouth that is mostly unjustified.

 

[Loonyyy]

And I can see plenty of posts from people who are looking for debate, but my point still stands. You don't control where people post.

No, but I can still prefer that they post somewhere more appropriate and not put down people for enjoying a game, and I'm just as free to voice that opinion. What they do after that is up to them.

Cheers
Rowan/LSWSjr

A tip: You might not want to argue with the moderators when they're letting you off lightly for what could be considered flaming.

You like the game? Fine! It's ok to like things that most don't, or are shitty. I like shitty frat boy comedies and stoner films. Some people like slasher films. And it doesn't matter.

Your thread however, comes across as argumentative towards the criticism, and defensive, and close to insulting in your dismissal of views you don't agree with, which, along with the odd typing style, relatively recent beginning of posting, and the inane habit of signing your posts, you know, like company staff do, has made some think you might be a Gearbox/Sega staffer (Which has happened with some studios on other sites, there was a big thing about it on Metacritic a while ago with Telltale I believe). It's not helped by the reply to Zhukov where you ask him why he's not buying the game at launch, which seems like nagging. For someone's who's proud of his own opinion, you don't have much respect for that of others, and that rubs people the wrong way, and you manage to look a lot like a boilerplate post of an employee of a publisher or developer on their own forums.

Of course, in your own words, you were looking for yes men though. There's no way you can phrase it apart from: You wanted to discuss the game, but exclusively in positive terms, and no-one is to criticise it. Which just doesn't work.

I'll tell you why I'm not getting it. I've seen enough footage to know that it's nothing to write home about, and John Walker's critique on RPS seals the deal. The fact that less than half of the levels in an Aliens game are dedicated to fighting non-aliens is ridiculous. If I wanted to play through a poorly executed Call of Duty cash-in, I'd reinstall Homefront. Which, I actually didn't mind, but was panned by a rather large amount of people. And I got over it.

 

[Rowan Tritton]

A tip: You might not want to argue with the moderators when they're letting you off lightly for what could be considered flaming.

I'm don't actually how to tell who's a moderator and who's not, but I don't know how that would effect my response even if I did, after my first warning I've tried to be careful not to use the T-word for starters.

Your thread however, comes across as argumentative towards the criticism, and defensive, and close to insulting in your dismissal of views you don't agree with, which, along with the odd typing style, relatively recent beginning of posting, and the inane habit of signing your posts, you know, like company staff do, has made some think you might be a Gearbox/Sega staffer (Which has happened with some studios on other sites, there was a big thing about it on Metacritic a while ago with Telltale I believe).

I am defensive towards the game because I enjoyed it, I also dislike people giving strong opinions without providing substantial evidence to back them up (preferably 1st hand) and I've tended to dismiss opinions that lack such evidence or that appear to be attacks against myself or others who enjoyed the game.
I don't find my typing style odd, but then I suffer from Asperger disorder so many things I do are sometimes considered odd, I can't tell the difference, furthermore whilst the signing of posts may typically be associate with industry professionals, for me including my name and handle at the post of my is simply habit for me, my emails, status updates and posts all over the internet all end in the same way 99% of the time.

It's not helped by the reply to Zhukov where you ask him why he's not buying the game at launch, which seems like nagging.

I was asking why, in his opinion, the game wasn't worth buying at $60, but was, in his opinion, worth buying at $10?

For someone's who's proud of his own opinion, you don't have much respect for that of others, and that rubs people the wrong way, and you manage to look a lot like a boilerplate post of an employee of a publisher or developer on their own forums.

As I have mentioned a number of times, I don't feel like people are giving me their opinions, more that they are parroting the opinions of others. I admittedly don't have any respect for those who merely parrot others instead of taking the time to experience something for themselves.

Of course, in your own words, you were looking for yes men though. There's no way you can phrase it apart from: You wanted to discuss the game, but exclusively in positive terms, and no-one is to criticise it. Which just doesn't work.

That's true to a point, I prefer that posters in this thread by fans of the game in question, that's the purpose of this forum, it's indicated in the thread title and my original post. However I've also addressed the complaints of those who post in this forum, and try to explain my perspective on the issues, I am doing this with you right now. I've also addressed some of the sillier arguments leveled at this game, such as that by others and myself buying and enjoying the game, we are supporting the 'behavior' of Gearbox and for others to do the same thing, something that even someone negative to the game agreed was a silly concept.

I'll tell you why I'm not getting it. I've seen enough footage to know that it's nothing to write home about, and John Walker's critique on RPS seals the deal. The fact that less than half of the levels in an Aliens game are dedicated to fighting non-aliens is ridiculous. If I wanted to play through a poorly executed Call of Duty cash-in, I'd reinstall Homefront. Which, I actually didn't mind, but was panned by a rather large amount of people. And I got over it.

I have no problem with what you're saying, I'd prefer you had some playtime with the game (and no folks I'm not suggesting anyone buy the game) before making your final opinion, but you're free to do what you want and I have no designs to stop you or anyone else.

Cheers
Rowan/LSWSjr

 

[Loonyyy]

A tip: You might not want to argue with the moderators when they're letting you off lightly for what could be considered flaming.

I'm don't actually how to tell who's a moderator and who's not, but I don't know how that would effect my response even if I did, after my first warning I've tried to be careful not to use the T-word for starters.

The Blue name, the redguard title, I think there's a list somewhere, the fact that they're warning you about your infractions.

Your thread however, comes across as argumentative towards the criticism, and defensive, and close to insulting in your dismissal of views you don't agree with, which, along with the odd typing style, relatively recent beginning of posting, and the inane habit of signing your posts, you know, like company staff do, has made some think you might be a Gearbox/Sega staffer (Which has happened with some studios on other sites, there was a big thing about it on Metacritic a while ago with Telltale I believe).

I am defensive towards the game because I enjoyed it, I also dislike people giving strong opinions without providing substantial evidence to back them up (preferably 1st hand) and I've tended to dismiss opinions that lack such evidence or that appear to be attacks against myself or others who enjoyed the game.

The problem is tone. You can start a thread about enjoying it, but when you start it with implications about those who don't like it: Expect them. When you mention the criticism, people will continue to do so. You'e passive aggressively calling them out, and they'll react to it. Avoid referencing them, and then they ARE out of place.

I don't find my typing style odd, but then I suffer from Asperger disorder so many things I do are sometimes considered odd, I can't tell the difference, furthermore whilst the signing of posts may typically be associate with industry professionals, for me including my name and handle at the post of my is simply habit for me, my emails, status updates and posts all over the internet all end in the same way 99% of the time.

Indeed, we often sign emails and the like. In business dealings. Usually you don't sign personal emails unless you're doing it for a laugh. Since to most of us, it's unclear what it even means, and because it appears on a forum which gives you a Username and an avatar, it's odd.

The sentence structure is oddly formal. That's not a criticism, I don't have a problem with it. It's better than many posters, and it's clear you're putting effort into communicating. But it is how communications are usually conducted in formal situations, like business ones. The way you present makes people think you're just a developer sock puppet. I'm not saying that you are, indeed, I don't believe that you are, just that it's an easy conclusion to come to.

It's not helped by the reply to Zhukov where you ask him why he's not buying the game at launch, which seems like nagging.

I was asking why, in his opinion, the game wasn't worth buying at $60, but was, in his opinion, worth buying at $10?

Which, given its brutal reception, will probably take all of about two months.

Nothing you've said even comes close to convincing me to pay $60+ of my hard-earned dollars on this game.

Perhaps that it has had a brutal reception, and he is unconvinced of the games quality? The default position on whether or not to acquire something is to not, and we require convincing. Clearly, he thinks the risk of the quality is not worth $60, and has no problem with risking the $10. Picking out that one response, which did say he would buy it, is odd, and especially since your quibble is with the price. Since you're focussed on people having fun presumably, and not the developers bottom line, why harrass people who will play the game later?

For someone's who's proud of his own opinion, you don't have much respect for that of others, and that rubs people the wrong way, and you manage to look a lot like a boilerplate post of an employee of a publisher or developer on their own forums.

As I have mentioned a number of times, I don't feel like people are giving me their opinions, more that they are parroting the opinions of others. I admittedly don't have any respect for those who merely parrot others instead of taking the time to experience something for themselves.

They may respect those opinions, which you're disrespecting, so my point still applies. Some have also played it, and others may have seen footage. Simply saying "Spend $60 American or $100 Australian on a gamble of a game which has been almost universally panned, including by your favourite critics, or your opinion is completely worthless" is insulting, and pointless. Of course people form opinions without playing it. That's the developers problem for not having a playable demo. Regardless, you can see it, in numerous places. There are many reviews with footage. Here's one for you: I don't value the opinion of someone who's opinions I have no experience of. I respect it, but it's worthless to me, because I don't know if we like the same things. I know I like the same things as Yahtzee often, I usually agree with John Walker, Shamus Young and Campster, so these are what I'll make choices off, and assume are similar to the views I will form. If I insult a critic you like, who's views are usually similar to your own, and insult those views, you'll feel sore. It goes to the antagonistic tone. Ignore the people who don't like the game, and don't make a thread that caters to them. If they nag at you in threads that you make which are more neutral, and you ignore them, they'll be moderated against.

Of course, in your own words, you were looking for yes men though. There's no way you can phrase it apart from: You wanted to discuss the game, but exclusively in positive terms, and no-one is to criticise it. Which just doesn't work.

That's true to a point, I prefer that posters in this thread by fans of the game in question, that's the purpose of this forum, it's indicated in the thread title and my original post. However I've also addressed the complaints of those who post in this forum, and try to explain my perspective on the issues, I am doing this with you right now. I've also addressed some of the sillier arguments leveled at this game, such as that by others and myself buying and enjoying the game, we are supporting the 'behavior' of Gearbox and for others to do the same thing, something that even someone negative to the game agreed was a silly concept.

To be frank: That was a tongue in cheek comment. I was giving you the shaft for calling people yes men in a thread where you're looking for yes men. But yes, the argument that buying the game is supporting the behaviour is silly, to an extent.

I'll tell you why I'm not getting it. I've seen enough footage to know that it's nothing to write home about, and John Walker's critique on RPS seals the deal. The fact that less than half of the levels in an Aliens game are dedicated to fighting non-aliens is ridiculous. If I wanted to play through a poorly executed Call of Duty cash-in, I'd reinstall Homefront. Which, I actually didn't mind, but was panned by a rather large amount of people. And I got over it.

I have no problem with what you're saying, I'd prefer you had some playtime with the game (and no folks I'm not suggesting anyone buy the game) before making your final opinion, but you're free to do what you want and I have no designs to stop you or anyone else.

And I'd prefer that you didn't present playing the game as the holy grail to understanding criticism, and understanding that I've seen much of the gameplay (It's all over youtube), and that most of us can tell what we'll enjoy. I could make an entire critique of the game by watching a half hour of lets plays if you prefer, and then post it here? I wouldn't, because that's not fair to the thread you wanted to make, but don't get annoyed if people don't like it without playing it.

Cheers
Rowan/LSWSjr

Stop doing this. I know your name is Rowan. It appears on every one of your posts. The rest is meaningless, and even if I knew what it meant, it wouldn't matter to the forum.

 

[Andy of Comix Inc]

Here's my question. If you don't care that they hate it - or, are annoyed that they hate it - then why the hell do you think your loving it will be given anything but a similar reaction? You've made very much aware that you care little for what they think, or will ignore what they think. Why shouldn't they respond to you in kind? What makes your opinion so worth listening to that it's worth quelling the opinion of others on the issue?

I was really loving this game at first. You know what made me stop having fun? Everybody complaining about it. Every time I play the game now all I can think about is the complainers. So yeah, thanks for sucking all the fun out. Why do half these people care, most of them haven't even played it.

Because they're fans of Aliens and don't like having a sub-par product - especially not one that has been as hyped as this one - released as a blemish on the franchise.

 

[Chairman Miaow]

Here's my question. If you don't care that they hate it - or, are annoyed that they hate it - then why the hell do you think your loving it will be given anything but a similar reaction? You've made very much aware that you care little for what they think, or will ignore what they think. Why shouldn't they respond to you in kind? What makes your opinion so worth listening to that it's worth quelling the opinion of others on the issue?

I was really loving this game at first. You know what made me stop having fun? Everybody complaining about it. Every time I play the game now all I can think about is the complainers. So yeah, thanks for sucking all the fun out. Why do half these people care, most of them haven't even played it.

Because they're fans of Aliens and don't like having a sub-par product - especially not one that has been as hyped as this one - released as a blemish on the franchise.

But if they haven't played it, how can they judge? I hadn't played it and thought it would be awful. I played it, and found myself really enjoying it.

 

[Rowan Tritton]

The Blue name, the redguard title, I think there's a list somewhere, the fact that they're warning you about your infractions.

Thank you for the information and I'll see if I can find that list.

The problem is tone. You can start a thread about enjoying it, but when you start it with implications about those who don't like it: Expect them. When you mention the criticism, people will continue to do so. You'e passive aggressively calling them out, and they'll react to it. Avoid referencing them, and then they ARE out of place.

I think I understand what you're saying, but even so it's most likely too late to modify this thread to a more neutral tone, but even then the purpose of this thread was to present a more positive tone in the face of overwhelming negative criticism.

Indeed, we often sign emails and the like. In business dealings. Usually you don't sign personal emails unless you're doing it for a laugh. Since to most of us, it's unclear what it even means, and because it appears on a forum which gives you a Username and an avatar, it's odd.

Stop doing this. I know your name is Rowan. It appears on every one of your posts. The rest is meaningless, and even if I knew what it meant, it wouldn't matter to the forum.

I can't do that, perhaps saying it was a habit last time was a bit misleading, it is a compulsion when I'm typing just about anything online, even whilst exhausted, it will always end with the one of the following:
----------
Sincerely
Rowan Tritton
----------
Cheers
Rowan/LSWSjr
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I cannot stop this behavior, and ultimately this post will end in the same manner.

The sentence structure is oddly formal. That's not a criticism, I don't have a problem with it. It's better than many posters, and it's clear you're putting effort into communicating. But it is how communications are usually conducted in formal situations, like business ones. The way you present makes people think you're just a developer sock puppet. I'm not saying that you are, indeed, I don't believe that you are, just that it's an easy conclusion to come to.

Mostly this is me trying to keep my posts closer to a neutral tone, it's not perfect and depending on how agitated I'm feeling it may get more hostile and sarcastic, but in general it's to keep from going too far into a unorganized rant, which hardly helps my position either and is no doubt more likely to see my posting limited or suspended with no way to continue this thread.

Perhaps that it has had a brutal reception, and he is unconvinced of the games quality? The default position on whether or not to acquire something is to not, and we require convincing. Clearly, he thinks the risk of the quality is not worth $60, and has no problem with risking the $10. Picking out that one response, which did say he would buy it, is odd, and especially since your quibble is with the price. Since you're focussed on people having fun presumably, and not the developers bottom line, why harrass people who will play the game later?

I asked because I was interested in his motivations, ultimately he wasn't willing to respond, although I didn't think that the way I asked would be considered harassment.

They may respect those opinions, which you're disrespecting, so my point still applies. Some have also played it, and others may have seen footage.

I'm not trying to disrespect the original sources of the information, but I have issue with those who use those opinions as if they are their own. Nor do I intend to disrespect those who played the game and didn't enjoy it, however to my knowledge only one poster (MeChaNiZ3D) is in that situation.

Simply saying "Spend $60 American or $100 Australian on a gamble of a game which has been almost universally panned, including by your favourite critics, or your opinion is completely worthless" is insulting, and pointless.

I've never suggested that, there are many ways to play games without buying them, rental and loaning are entirely possible options for console players (although PC doesn't have that option). Nor did I say those who didn't play the game had opinions I considered worthless, merely that I considered them valid to a lesser degree. In this regard I'd point back to my previous reply to you, which I feel applies to much that you responded to following this also (repeated below):

I have no problem with what you're saying, I'd prefer you had some playtime with the game (and no folks I'm not suggesting anyone buy the game) before making your final opinion, but you're free to do what you want and I have no designs to stop you or anyone else.

I may not like if people react to the game without 1st hand experience, but ultimately there's nothing I can do to change that. I can only post what I feel was good about the game and address criticisms I felt were too harsh or were somewhat unrealistic about the product, in my opinion.

Cheers
Rowan/LSWSjr

 

[RJ 17]

Snip.

I have to say it is a bit refreshing to see someone actually coming out and saying that they enjoyed the game. In most of the "OMG THIS GAME SUCKS!" threads I've been mentioning that I found the game to be overall enjoyable, that while I do like to think that I have a good grip on the timeline and story of the franchise I'm apparently just ignorant enough that the "great big canon-destroying twist at the end" had literally 0 effect on me. Granted it's been years since I've seen Aliens 3 so it might actually be a big deal but I literally didn't notice anything wrong or out of place.

But that seemed to be one of the biggest two complaints about the game: people didn't like it's story. Personally I found absolutely nothing wrong with it. I had no trouble at all following the story from plot-point to plot-point and it all made sense to me. So like I said, perhaps I'm just ignorant enough of the complete over-arching story that I didn't notice just how bad this game's story was, but whatever, I still liked it.

The other big complaint that unfortunately there's no way to argue again is "The Great Lie Of The Demo". Specifically: the graphics. You look at what was presented and look at what we received and they are, unfortunately, MILES apart in comparison. Now for this case, this was definitely an "in hindsight" type of deal for me seeing how I think the last time I watched one of the kickass gameplay demos with all the sweet graphics was months ago, allowing me to forget just how great the graphics look. By the time I picked it up on Tuesday, I had forgotten how it was SUPPOSED to look...and as such I really didn't have a complaint about the graphics. I wished they were better and there were a lot of technical glitches, but there's a lot of glitches in a lot of games. Long story short: the graphics really didn't hinder my enjoyment of the game until after I had beaten it and I started to watch some of those side-by-side "What they promised, what we got" videos on youtube at which point I had to say "Yeah, we definitely got jipped on the graphics department."

All in all, thouh, I still say it's an enjoyable game if you're a fan of the franchise.

Now onto some of your less related comments:

Indeed, AvP2 is the best game of the bunch across the entire franchise's history. Primal Hunt, ehhhhh, I wasn't nearly as impressed with it. Seemed a bit hollow compared to AvP2. As for it's predecessor, the only thing wrong with Rebellion's game was that there was almost no narrative to any of the campaigns, no crossing over. You just go throuh each level with the only knowledge being "New place to kill stuff, get to the end of it." while AvP2's storyline was robust and delicious. Each campaign being perfectly woven into the events of the others so that while you're playing through as the Marine, you see the effects of what you do as the Alien and Pred, and the same applies with them and the other campaigns as well. That's what my favorite part about it was, there was a very clear timeline and narrative established.

And sorry, but an EXO-Suit is literally a powerloader that's been retrofitted with military grade weapons, so this isn't the first game where you get to stomp around in a powerloader.

Fuck Rykov, Pred 4 Life!

 

[Iwata]

Here's my question. If you don't care that they hate it - or, are annoyed that they hate it - then why the hell do you think your loving it will be given anything but a similar reaction? You've made very much aware that you care little for what they think, or will ignore what they think. Why shouldn't they respond to you in kind? What makes your opinion so worth listening to that it's worth quelling the opinion of others on the issue?

I was really loving this game at first. You know what made me stop having fun? Everybody complaining about it. Every time I play the game now all I can think about is the complainers. So yeah, thanks for sucking all the fun out. Why do half these people care, most of them haven't even played it.

Because they're fans of Aliens and don't like having a sub-par product - especially not one that has been as hyped as this one - released as a blemish on the franchise.

And yet some of those fans probably like "Alien Resurrection" or the AvP movies.

This is quite simple, really: a lot of people are rallying against the game, and seem to be singling out people who liked it for some reason. All you have to do is look at the reviews. It's fine if the reviews bash the game, but as soon as someone points out that they liked it, the internet goes up in arms. The comments section are filled with insults. Topics in gaming forums are opened, saying "can you believe this asshole LIKED the game I hate, yet never played but people say it sucks?! There goes his credibility, amirite?!"

Or the fact that an "anonymous source" claiming to "have worked for Gearbox" posted a rumour in a single message board, and the people who dedicate themselves to hating this game took this flimsy "truth" and held it to be gospel, despite the fact that ANYONE can make such a claim with no proof whatsoever.

Because we all have to hate what others hate, and we all have to like what others like, and dissenting opinions to our own and the majority's will be met with cynicism.

Some of the criticism levelled at this game is downright petty or ignorant of the fact that previous, better-received games did the exact same things without people going up in arms. The internet loves to hate, gamers most of all. It's a safe bet that a LOT of the people bad-mouthing the game have never played it, which is a shame. The Aliens fans I do know, both in person and online, actually quite like the game, myself included, but hey... we know better than the try and argue with the internet.

Is this game the best thing ever? No. Not by any means. But it is a lot of fun, and it pretty much met my fairly-high expectations. I've played complete trainwrecks disguising themselves as games before, and this most certainly is NOT one of those.

 

[Schtoobs]

Well it's been 24 hours since you posted this thread and you haven't had much of a turn out supporting the game. Not a good sign. I ,admittedly, only played it for a short while on a friends computer but it was really poor and disappointing. It seems like the tools for a good game were there just not polished or in some cases (alien AI) not implemented at all. I will probably get it because I've been waiting too long for this game not to but I will wait until it is considerably cheaper... like 1/3rd of it's current price. Although I am loathe to do even that because I don't want to support shady and/or dishonest marketing practices. Gearbox are gonna have to do something pretty special to win me over and that extends to their entire future product line.

One of the things I was really looking forward to, other than the campaign, was the co-op survival "hold out against waves of AI aliens" type mode... which turns out to be paid DLC.. crock o' fuckin' shit.

OT: I liked the authentic sounds and the way the pulse rifle spluttered bullets was actually better than I imagined it could be. I REALLY hope either gearbox or modders shine the shit out of this turd so I can feel good about getting it.

 

[Andy of Comix Inc]

Because they're fans of Aliens and don't like having a sub-par product - especially not one that has been as hyped as this one - released as a blemish on the franchise. But if they haven't played it, how can they judge? I hadn't played it and thought it would be awful. I played it, and found myself really enjoying it.

Well, they're being responsible consumers. They see and hear that it's (by their standards) awful, and they make sure everyone else knows not to buy it. And I've never accepted "haven't played a game" as a shield against judging a game - if the quality they've presented with me thus far to get me to play the game hasn't worked, then I'll judge the game based on that instead. Either way, the game has taken a major misstep.

And it's hardly a convincing argument anyway, when a lot of the people who like the game admit they haven't touched single-player yet. Oh? Don't judge a game until you play it, huh? Alright. Well when you've finished the game, then come back and say that, hmm?

And yet some of those fans probably like "Alien Resurrection" or the AvP movies.

I pray you don't let any Aliens fans here you say that.

This is quite simple, really: a lot of people are rallying against the game, and seem to be singling out people who liked it for some reason. All you have to do is look at the reviews. It's fine if the reviews bash the game, but as soon as someone points out that they liked it, the internet goes up in arms. The comments section are filled with insults. Topics in gaming forums are opened, saying "can you believe this asshole LIKED the game I hate, yet never played but people say it sucks?! There goes his credibility, amirite?!"

Here's my biggest issue here: I don't think anyone is singling out people who liked the game. Jim Sterling himself says he envies people who can enjoy it because it left him bereft of joy and defeated - he said he envied the people that are enjoying the game. And that he is happy for them. Fancy that, the guy who gave it a 2.5/10! And he's glad you're having fun with the game you bought.

I understand the reasons why you'd try to "defend" yourself from "attacks" (that don't exist) - I loved Duke Nukem Forever and whenever the game was bought up in negative light, I felt personally taken aback by it. But there's a differnece between difference of opinion... and people outright attacking you for liking the game. And there's a difference between criticizing the enjoyment you're having... and criticizing the logic you're using to justify the $60 purchase. Y'know? It's easy to feel like eggs are being thrown at you when they're actually being thrown over you.

What an odd metaphor I chose to employ.

Or the fact that an "anonymous source" claiming to "have worked for Gearbox" posted a rumour in a single message board, and the people who dedicate themselves to hating this game took this flimsy "truth" and held it to be gospel, despite the fact that ANYONE can make such a claim with no proof whatsoever.

Luckily, the source was verified. And keep in mind - no-one is dedicated to hating the game. People looked forward to the game, were extraordinarily disappointed, and are trying to find out where the massively promising project went so wrong. There's a story to be told about why this game didn't turn out as so many people had been led to believe it would, y'know? And it's an interesting story.

Because we all have to hate what others hate, and we all have to like what others like, and dissenting opinions to our own and the majority's will be met with cynicism.

Some of the criticism levelled at this game is downright petty or ignorant of the fact that previous, better-received games did the exact same things without people going up in arms. The internet loves to hate, gamers most of all. It's a safe bet that a LOT of the people bad-mouthing the game have never played it, which is a shame. The Aliens fans I do know, both in person and online, actually quite like the game, myself included, but hey... we know better than the try and argue with the internet.

Criticism leveled at the game is not synonymous with criticism leveled at its players. I do hope you'll keep that in mind for me, alright?

A lot of people feel lied to about Aliens: Colonial Marines. Their anger stems from a feeling of sheer betrayal. They were offered the stars but ended up with ash in their hands - and they paid $60 for the privilege. You're right that the internet tends to band together to criticize a thing... but never has it been so unanimous as with Colonial Marines. And never has it been so obvious that at some point in development, something went wrong. The game Gearbox was showing off years ago is not the game that shipped, that much is true. And, yeah, okay, other games have taken similar missteps - I'll cop to that. But also, fewer games have such weight on their shoulders. Aliens. It's a classic movie that deserved a classic game - and when people didn't get it, with Randy Pitchford promising a true Aliens sequel and proclaiming his company's reverence for the franchise... there is so much good reason for hating the product that shipped, and it's exasperated by the circumstances surrounding it.

Is this game the best thing ever? No. Not by any means. But it is a lot of fun, and it pretty much met my fairly-high expectations. I've played complete trainwrecks disguising themselves as games before, and this most certainly is NOT one of those.

Yeah, a lot of fun. No-one wants to take that away from you, guy. If anyone does? They're an asshole, complete and utter, and you can disregard pretty much everything they have to say.

No. No-one wants to change your opinion here. No-one wants to change it so you're all of a sudden not having fun and start to regret your purchase and start eating yourself from the inside out. Of course not. What people are trying to do, I suppose, is make sure that you understand why it is that this game is being so poorly received - and they're trying to understand why you're loving it. In a way, all you have to say is "I'm having fun." That's all the justification in the world you'll ever need. It won't help an objectively broken product, it won't patch up Gearbox's lies during development - it won't make the game better for those who are finding it sub-par. But know this: no-one goes into a product wanting to hate it. And no-one wants to rip other people's fun away from them.

I think it's a case of letting bygones be bygones while the major shockwave that is the game's initial release dies down... and in a month or so, you'll be able to talk freely about it without people breathing down your neck. I do hope you understand their reasons for doing so - and I especially hope you get that their opinions are as valid and as correct as yours. There may be objective measures of quality that Aliens fails in. I wouldn't know but. But as far as subjective ones go - your personal enjoyment - there's very little anyone can say that can be wrong. Including you. Remember that!

 

[Elijin]

Well it's been 24 hours since you posted this thread and you haven't had much of a turn out supporting the game. Not a good sign.

Worth considering that many people who enjoyed it, either alone or with friends (myself included in there) arent really bothered by the fuss over it.

We sort of go "Oh okay, it was poorly received. I can see why on some of the points. Think its getting given a bit more flak that it deserved due to anger and disappointment over the expectations....but fair enough, each to their own. I enjoyed my time with it. On with my life."

So short version, the people who enjoyed it dont really feel the need to convince others we enjoyed it, and really really dont feel like being badgered by others trying to convince us we didnt enjoy it.

 

[Chairman Miaow]

Because they're fans of Aliens and don't like having a sub-par product - especially not one that has been as hyped as this one - released as a blemish on the franchise. But if they haven't played it, how can they judge? I hadn't played it and thought it would be awful. I played it, and found myself really enjoying it.

Well, they're being responsible consumers. They see and hear that it's (by their standards) awful, and they make sure everyone else knows not to buy it. And I've never accepted "haven't played a game" as a shield against judging a game - if the quality they've presented with me thus far to get me to play the game hasn't worked, then I'll judge the game based on that instead. Either way, the game has taken a major misstep.

And it's hardly a convincing argument anyway, when a lot of the people who like the game admit they haven't touched single-player yet. Oh? Don't judge a game until you play it, huh? Alright. Well when you've finished the game, then come back and say that, hmm?
!

I have. I enjoyed it a great deal. I see and hear everywhere that Will.I.Am does great music, should I convince everybody to buy his records? Fine if you make the decision to not buy the game, but stop driving people away, let them make the decision themselves, and stop telling people a game they like is objectively the biggest disaster since Chernobyl.