Movie, TV, Web Series, and Music Hot Take(s).

[Dalisclock]

So I've grumbled before how Lucas/Star Wars doesn't understand military tactics pretty much at all and I mostly am able to enjoy the movies by just ignoring that remembering its written to be exciting pulp stories and not actual warfare.

Wizards and Warriors(an Offshoot of Kings and Generals) has been doing a series of videos about the galactic civil war, starting with the battles from Rebels(spoilers for people who never watched the show) and the latest one is the battle of Yavin.

So I guess I either never noticed or never cared before that the rebels are being dumb here. Yes, the bombing craft needs to be in the trench to get a good shot at the exhaust port. There's very little reason for the escorts to be in the trench too, other then avoid the turbolaser batteries which already fucking suck at hitting them anyway and that's presumably the job of the escorts to clear them out Wild Weasel style(as well as keep the TIEs away from the bombers).

So what do they do? They jump in the Trench with the bombing craft so any imperial craft can get in behind them and they have no fucking way to maneuver or fire back, basically being glorified meat shields for the lead craft. A smarter plan would have been for the escorts to fly ABOVE and BEHIND the craft on the bombing run(out of the trench) so they can more easily intercept TIEs attempting to attack the bomber. Even better, if(when)the first craft missed, one of the others, being behind, could drop down into the trench and attempt it's own shot at the exhaust port. Ironically, this the only thing that Saves Luke in the end is that Han and the Falcon pull exactly that trick by attacking from above and behind because Vader and his escorts stupidly got in the trench with no covering fighters.

Thank you for attending my TED TALK.

 

[Gordon_4]

So I've grumbled before how Lucas/Star Wars doesn't understand military tactics pretty much at all and I mostly am able to enjoy the movies by just ignoring that remembering its written to be exciting pulp stories and not actual warfare.

Wizards and Warriors(an Offshoot of Kings and Generals) has been doing a series of videos about the galactic civil war, starting with the battles from Rebels(spoilers for people who never watched the show) and the latest one is the battle of Yavin.

So I guess I either never noticed or never cared before that the rebels are being dumb here. Yes, the bombing craft needs to be in the trench to get a good shot at the exhaust port. There's very little reason for the escorts to be in the trench too, other then avoid the turbolaser batteries which already fucking suck at hitting them anyway and that's presumably the job of the escorts to clear them out Wild Weasel style(as well as keep the TIEs away from the bombers).

So what do they do? They jump in the Trench with the bombing craft so any imperial craft can get in behind them and they have no fucking way to maneuver or fire back, basically being glorified meat shields for the lead craft. A smarter plan would have been for the escorts to fly ABOVE and BEHIND the craft on the bombing run(out of the trench) so they can more easily intercept TIEs attempting to attack the bomber. Even better, if(when)the first craft missed, one of the others, being behind, could drop down into the trench and attempt it's own shot at the exhaust port. Ironically, this the only thing that Saves Luke in the end is that Han and the Falcon pull exactly that trick by attacking from above and behind because Vader and his escorts stupidly got in the trench with no covering fighters.

Thank you for attending my TED TALK.

At the risk of asking a stupid question, was that a World War II escort tactic? Because everything about fighter combat in Star Wars OT is rooted entirely in the doctrines of World War II. Even now X-Wings appear to have no BVR radar for missiles. Nor do TIE Fighters in fairness.

 

[Dalisclock]

At the risk of asking a stupid question, was that a World War II escort tactic? Because everything about fighter combat in Star Wars OT is rooted entirely in the doctrines of World War II. Even now X-Wings appear to have no BVR radar for missiles. Nor do TIE Fighters in fairness.

I got the impression Star Wars was based on WW2 movies more then actual WW2 tactics. The death star attack is specifically based on the Dambusters and 633 squadron.

Id have to check how WW2 escorts worked but flying into a trench wasn't standard aerial tactics I'm pretty sure

 

[TheMysteriousGX]

The Trench Run specifically was based on The Dam Busters, which was about a bunch of bombers who had to, well, title drop. The idea in The Dam Busters is that they had a new type of bomb that would skip along the water to hit the bottom part of a dam in a valley, ergo a trench run. EDIT: The historical attack didn't have a fighter escort

So no, it doesn't make sense for fighter escorts to act like that, but is the safest strategy for a bomber formation.

It's just that George Lucas is kind of a hack. Exciting though

 

[Dalisclock]

The Trench Run specifically was based on The Dam Busters, which was about a bunch of bombers who had to, well, title drop. The idea in The Dam Busters is that they had a new type of bomb that would skip along the water to hit the bottom part of a dam in a valley, ergo a trench run.

So no, it doesn't make sense for fighter escorts to act like that, but is the safest strategy for a bomber formation.

It's just that George Lucas is kind of a hack. Exciting though

Thanks for pointing this out. In the film(and I believe IRL), they couldn't bring a fighter escort with them all the way to the target because of range so the final run was entirely bombers making passes at the target. It wasn't a trench though, it was a fairly flat area over water because they were SPOILER trying to blow up a dam.

Also, to show just how much "Homage" Lucas paid to the Damnbusters.

 

[TheMysteriousGX]

Thanks for pointing this out. In the film(and I believe IRL), they couldn't bring a fighter escort with them all the way to the target because of range so the final run was entirely bombers making passes at the target. It wasn't a trench though, it was a fairly flat area over water because they were SPOILER trying to blow up a dam.

Also, to show just how much "Homage" Lucas paid to the Damnbusters.

It might not've been a physical trench, but there were precise attack angles that made for a narrow attack vector. The skipping bomb wouldn't've worked otherwise

 

[Dalisclock]

It might not've been a physical trench, but there were precise attack angles that made for a narrow attack vector. The skipping bomb wouldn't've worked otherwise

Fair enough.

 

[TheMysteriousGX]

Fair enough.

That said, at the very least the Y-wings should've had guns that shoot backwards

 

[XsjadoBlayde]

12 bar blues bands. I despise them and everything they stand for. Doesn't matter if they're talented, charming, altruistic, all-giving gods of our inhibited divine temptations...if the genre they've loyally committed to is defined literally by writing the same song over and over with minimal variations, they've creatively fated themselves to little more than glorified assembly line operators. A full sized album is nowt other than an hour's indistinguishable static of vaguely catchy deja Vu.

While generally, it's not something I'd go out of my way to complain about, it's just recently downloaded the most recommended album of a beloved cult band to have a listen after hearing a fairly enticing song of theirs last night, only to grow suspicious of the first few tracks using the exact chord progressions as the song last ni...and oh no, they're one of them too! Le détrônement des oreilles!

 

[BrawlMan]

I would not call 6 Undeground a better Suicide Squad, than Suicide Squad (2016). While there are only two entertaining actions scenes, the rest are the standard Bayisms and Bay shits. Incoherent action scenes and the rapid fire editing that does most fight scenes no favors. The only reason certain critics or cineaphiles say that is out of spite for SS (2016), Ryan Reynolds, or because to them 6U looks "good" by comparison due to the R Rating. I would still watch SS (2016) over 6U. Says what you will about the former, bu I like the characters there and find them more memorable, or at the least, more entertaining. Plus, David Ayer knows how to film action. Bay is still stuck in the 2000s. With SS2 now out and about, these claims about 6U hold even less weight. It's a movie I am never going back to watch, and everyone else should do the same.

 

[Specter Von Baren]

The Trench Run specifically was based on The Dam Busters, which was about a bunch of bombers who had to, well, title drop. The idea in The Dam Busters is that they had a new type of bomb that would skip along the water to hit the bottom part of a dam in a valley, ergo a trench run. EDIT: The historical attack didn't have a fighter escort

So no, it doesn't make sense for fighter escorts to act like that, but is the safest strategy for a bomber formation.

It's just that George Lucas is kind of a hack. Exciting though

I feel like saying he's a hack is kind of missing the problem. A single writer working on a book in their spare time can afford to research every little detail and spend a long time getting things just right but once that author is on a deadline there comes a point where even if they wanted to get everything right, there isn't enough time for it and the rewards are also not that great unless that story becomes a big hit.

Now put this in a movie with even more moving parts and time schedules etc etc etc and it becomes an even bigger problem.

It's great when someone CAN make everything make sense and have a full realised world but most people aren't capable or have the resources to do that. Add to that that, especially in movies, most people aren't going to notice or care about that and you end up having to ask yourself wether that time and effort would even be worth it in the end.

 

[TheMysteriousGX]

I do not know who Book of Boba Fett is for. And them hiding a secret episode of The Mandolorian in it is doing exactly what I hate American comic books for.

 

[BrawlMan]

After viewing the Best of the Best franchise, and seeing 1 and 2 again after not seeing them in so long. These movies are nowhere near as bad as critics made them out to be. These movies have a cult following, that I know of, but the hate the first film got from "professional" critics is astounding. I don't know how their feelings are nowadays, but it does not matter to me. I liked the first two movies back in the day, and they still make me smile now. 3 & 4 are weirder directions, but are still good, fun, and entertaining. Cheesy moments? Yes, but the good kind.

The first movie is still the best, followed by 2 being the best of the sequels. 3 is good, and 4 is fine, but it's pretty clear the idea well was running dry. Without Warning definitely has a one more time feel, and Tommy Lee definitely wants to just live his life and not be the action hero. Yet he is one final time. As far as martial arts films that went from theatrical to straight to VHS/DVD, Best of the Best is one of the best in this regard. Compared to the shitty sequels to Bloodsport and Kickboxer, the BotB sequels actually went somewhere. Bloodsport sequels were copying the first film verbatim and less interesting. Each Kickboxer sequel made the past movie pointless, because Tong Po lives, and protagonist from the last movie dies off-screen (most of the time) in the next movie. Though Kickboxer 5: The Redemption avoids this, but might as well be it's own movie, but the main character from Kickboxer 4 dies from something else and Mark Dascascos becomes the main character. So if anything, skip all of the Kickboxer sequels, except for 5. If you want to see the awesomeness of Mark and check the rest of his filmography.

....Ok, got sidetracked. Point being, Best of the Best is one of the better action franchises from the late 80s and 90s to hold its own. The only other action franchise to do accomplish this is Undisputed. From boxing to MMA.

 

[TheMysteriousGX]

Lmao

 

[Bob_McMillan]

Lmao

I saw comments on YouTube alluding to how they were going "woke". Because there were women in the trailer maybe??? From what I remember of the trailer it was just a lot of pretty scenery, they didn't show much.

 

[Gordon_4]

I saw comments on YouTube alluding to how they were going "woke". Because there were women in the trailer maybe??? From what I remember of the trailer it was just a lot of pretty scenery, they didn't show much.

Considering Halo borrows a shit load of its look and feel (and at least one character wholesale) from Aliens, which legendarily has two very well regarded women characters, this complaint is even more baffling.

Plus, the Covenant are coming to extinguish the human race as I understand it; in that situation if you can hold a gun, you’re probably gonna be holding one.

 

[Bob_McMillan]

Considering Halo borrows a shit load of its look and feel (and at least one character wholesale) from Aliens, which legendarily has two very well regarded women characters, this complaint is even more baffling.

Plus, the Covenant are coming to extinguish the human race as I understand it; in that situation if you can hold a gun, you’re probably gonna be holding one.

And from what I remember, they made women pretty prominent in Halo games after the first one. In the books, they even make it look like men and women are evenly distributed across the UNSC. Especially after, as you said, the Covenant threatens humanity with extinction.

Although I haven't bothered to check exactly what has them so up in arms. Maybe it doesn't have to do with women. I'm pretty sure if I do try to find out, my cookies are going to make sure I see nothing but alt-right content for a week.

 

[Specter Von Baren]

Considering Halo borrows a shit load of its look and feel (and at least one character wholesale) from Aliens, which legendarily has two very well regarded women characters, this complaint is even more baffling.

Plus, the Covenant are coming to extinguish the human race as I understand it; in that situation if you can hold a gun, you’re probably gonna be holding one.

Ehhhhh? Aside from the look of the Elites, the aesthetic really looks nothing alike. The Alien series has a really grungy "punk" look to it with its ships and such while Halo has always had a really clean look, the aliens have very shiny and advanced technology while the humans have clean gunmetal gray vehicles and weapons.

 

[BrawlMan]

Ehhhhh? Aside from the look of the Elites, the aesthetic really looks nothing alike. The Alien series has a really grungy "punk" look to it with its ships and such while Halo has always had a really clean look, the aliens have very shiny and advanced technology while the humans have clean gunmetal gray vehicles and weapons.

Definitely true, but Aliens and Starship Troopers had a huge influence on Halo. All the more ironic, because the cast of Aliens had to read Starship Troopers before getting into their roles.

 

[Bob_McMillan]

Ehhhhh? Aside from the look of the Elites, the aesthetic really looks nothing alike. The Alien series has a really grungy "punk" look to it with its ships and such while Halo has always had a really clean look, the aliens have very shiny and advanced technology while the humans have clean gunmetal gray vehicles and weapons.

I think Gordon was talking about the Flood maybe.