Nintendo Failures seem exaggerated

[Panzer Camper]

People have already pointed it out but Nintendo has really screwed the gamer in every department except in the core titles. People (myself included) love their games. Of my top five games of all time at least two would be a Mario 64 and Ocarina of Time. However, they make really really bad consoles that deprive you of basically every third party title so I avoid the Wii and Wii U.

If MS had a console that made quality GOW titles and Halo titles only I would never buy it but be very mad at MS for basically taking good games hostage. That is how I feel about nintendo. I want their games, but they are douches as they refuse to even pretend to back the third parties and make a normal console. So many of us are just crossing our fingers praying for their terrible console choices to cost them big so they are forced to go the route of sega or actually make a real console I can justify buying. Either way I win and get to play my fill of Mario and Zelda without having to buy two consoles.

Personally if either Ms or sony went of the gaming market it wouldn't kill me because MOST of the games in my library are cross platform and I could just jump ship to the other console so I don't really care if they go out.

3RD party support is a duel edge sword because the way COD was handled last generation with better treatment on the Xbox with early DLC and all round better game. Although they did try to make a good game on the Wii. The PC and PS3 ports had a lot problems. Also people are still pissed that Bayonetta 2 is a exclusive even though Nintendo is flipping the bill. People are mad monster Hunter 3 ultimate didn't go to the PSP and I believe that is because Sony didn't want to pay for the localization.

I had never heard of major problems with the PS3 and PC ports of cod but to be fair I never bought them for those platforms. I would hazard a guess the Pc/ps3 version were at least very close in quality to the xbox360 and I assume the graphics on the PC were superior.

The reason the Wii version cannot get off the ground is because their online component was just gut wrenchingly awful and it was too weak a system to run the game at any remotely decent level. They ran into this problem again for the Wii U. Developers will develop games for the X1 and ps4 while making them shine on the pc. However the Wii U is weak for power once again and they will refuse to take the time to make the game run for the Wii U since not many active online players own one. I would bet the next cod will have to be reviewed separately on the wii u since it will be such a subpar version of the game. Xbox/PC/ps4 all manage third support just fine with a few notable exceptions, the fact that the wii u refuses too because they are focused only on their 1st party development is a slap to my and many others face.

Nintendo will not get out of their hole by getting more exclusive games that you mention. Most exclusives just makes everyone angry when your core system is crap. I don't need one or two exclusive games to make me love my console. I need all the great third party multiplats. The vast multiplats are the cake, exclusives are just the icing. Icing by itself kind of sucks.

Oh and just to clarify, yes they did "try" by bringing in ghosts and AC4 and batman but we all know the weak powerhouse of that system will prevent those games from going to the wii u a year or two down the road. They made a weak system that has the exact same problems as the wii which outraged many core gamers, and then doubled down on the strategy for the casual market.

 

[Aiddon_v1legacy]

Their TV industry has coughed up $7.8 billion over the last decade[/link] due to competition from Samsung and LG, forcing them to sell it off. They're also closing shop on their PC division for similar reasons. They also threw a lot of their money into a big gamble on smartphone technology, but are still failing to gain much ground against Samsung and Apple.

So, essentially, gaming is the only industry in which Sony isn't doing too badly. But even with that success, if Sony continues to lose money as it has been in other industries, they'll eventually collapse.

That is the thing, while MS is still fine as a whole, their console business has been one giant black hole whose existence is becoming very difficult to justify. Meanwhile, Sony might have a lot of assets, but their gigantic debts and liabilities kind of put a damper on that. When they're having to outright sell divisions and lay off thousands, that's NOT the sign of a healthy company.

 

[kilenem]

People have already pointed it out but Nintendo has really screwed the gamer in every department except in the core titles. People (myself included) love their games. Of my top five games of all time at least two would be a Mario 64 and Ocarina of Time. However, they make really really bad consoles that deprive you of basically every third party title so I avoid the Wii and Wii U.

If MS had a console that made quality GOW titles and Halo titles only I would never buy it but be very mad at MS for basically taking good games hostage. That is how I feel about nintendo. I want their games, but they are douches as they refuse to even pretend to back the third parties and make a normal console. So many of us are just crossing our fingers praying for their terrible console choices to cost them big so they are forced to go the route of sega or actually make a real console I can justify buying. Either way I win and get to play my fill of Mario and Zelda without having to buy two consoles.

Personally if either Ms or sony went of the gaming market it wouldn't kill me because MOST of the games in my library are cross platform and I could just jump ship to the other console so I don't really care if they go out.

3RD party support is a duel edge sword because the way COD was handled last generation with better treatment on the Xbox with early DLC and all round better game. Although they did try to make a good game on the Wii. The PC and PS3 ports had a lot problems. Also people are still pissed that Bayonetta 2 is a exclusive even though Nintendo is flipping the bill. People are mad monster Hunter 3 ultimate didn't go to the PSP and I believe that is because Sony didn't want to pay for the localization.

I had never heard of major problems with the PS3 and PC ports of cod but to be fair I never bought them for those platforms. I would hazard a guess the Pc/ps3 version were at least very close in quality to the xbox360 and I assume the graphics on the PC were superior.

The reason the Wii version cannot get off the ground is because their online component was just gut wrenchingly awful and it was too weak a system to run the game at any remotely decent level. They ran into this problem again for the Wii U. Developers will develop games for the X1 and ps4 while making them shine on the pc. However the Wii U is weak for power once again and they will refuse to take the time to make the game run for the Wii U since not many active online players own one. I would bet the next cod will have to be reviewed separately on the wii u since it will be such a subpar version of the game. Xbox/PC/ps4 all manage third support just fine with a few notable exceptions, the fact that the wii u refuses too because they are focused only on their 1st party development is a slap to my and many others face.

Nintendo will not get out of their hole by getting more exclusive games that you mention. Most exclusives just makes everyone angry when your core system is crap. I don't need one or two exclusive games to make me love my console. I need all the great third party multiplats. The vast multiplats are the cake, exclusives are just the icing. Icing by itself kind of sucks.

Oh and just to clarify, yes they did "try" by bringing in ghosts and AC4 and batman but we all know the weak powerhouse of that system will prevent those games from going to the wii u a year or two down the road. They made a weak system that has the exact same problems as the wii which outraged many core gamers, and then doubled down on the strategy for the casual market.

I don't think the Wii U is that Week EA ported the PC version of most Wanted to the Wii U. Although Crietion did amazing Job with that game. It was great on the VITA also. Even the most Jadded need for speed fan has to admit Need for Speed Most Wanted 2012 VITA is the definitive racing game for handheld. Not counting Mario Kart that is a Kart racer. The Cri team said they said they had the CRY engine 3 running on the Wii U. Also project Cars is suppose to be pretty good on the Wii U.

I think Devs just release bad ports like the orange box for PS3. The PS3 and PC ports of Black OPS were horrible and people complained so much Trearch threatened to turn off those servers. The PS3 version of MW3 had missing sound files for the gun at launch. MW3 on the PS3 was unplayable for me at launch and it was a completely different experience then Playing Black Ops at launch on 360. I stopped buying COD after MW3 on PS3.

 

[kilenem]

There weren't very many ways Microsoft could have positively spun everything they did. Basically, their only way to have avoided that would have been to properly research their markets before making those huge mistkaes. They're still surprised that consumders don't want those things.

This was pretty much rumors and never confirmed but if you actually could trade digital games that would've probably helped them out because that would've been something that was next gen and something that PC rarely does. I belive you can trade some games on Green man gaming. I didn't really care about the family share rumor thing because you can already do it on the PS3,and PSP. Its probably against the user agreement but you can login into PSN on a different profile on the PS3 download content and any user on the PS3 has access to that content. The PSP is a little bit tricky. The PSP will ask you to save your profile don't do that because if you do someone esle can't log into their account and download content you have to wipe the PSP but not the memory card and you then you can log into multiple accounts. They say you only can download a game to 3 different systems and up to five time total but it isn't true. I'm pretty sure its unlimited.

 

[VG_Addict]

Here's a question: How does Nintendo fix the fact that their core audience keeps shrinking? Do they just go third party, or just work harder on the next console?

I think 2014 will be a good year for the Wii U, with Tropical Freeze coming out next week (21st), MK8 coming on May 30th, Smash Bros, X, and Bayonetta 2. I can't wait to see how they'll integrate Miiverse into MK8 and Smash Bros, as well as StreetPass in the 3DS version of Smash Bros.

 

[9thRequiem]

Methinks people who want Nintendo to "fail" are willfully ignorant of the status of Sony and Microsoft. They think both companies are doing great, when the reality of the situation is that both are closer to Death's door than Nintendo is.

Nintendo is posting a net loss, but it's something around $240 million. Both MS and Sony are posting far, far larger losses, as the links below will demonstrate. Yet people are quick to point out that MS and Sony are totally fine and they can take the hit, but Nintendo (a company with over $10 billion in the bank) totally can't handle losses that are merely a quarter of the size of the ones MS/Sony are dealing with.

For example, this user demonstrates exactly what I'm talking about:

Microsoft loses a billion dollars on Xbox, they can easily take it and await future returns playing the longer game.

Uh, what? No, they most definitely can't afford to lose a billion dollars and hope that they'll make it up "eventually". They've already lost $3 billion dollars on the brand over a ten year span (from 2002 to 2012). And now they're projected to lose at least one billion more in FY 2013 alone, purely on the back of the Xbone? Those kinds of losses are not sustainable forever.

...

Actually, that was exactly what I was talking about.
Note that I mentioned "perceived size". The middle paragraph (the section you quoted) was an illustration of popular opinion; the ones around that show that I was, of course, talking about how people see the three companies, rather than how they actually are. I guess I should have been a little clearer with what I meant.
Of course a sufficient loss in the gaming sections of either company would make that part drop. But people forget that, and just see two massive companies. Meanwhile, Nintendo is seen as much smaller than it actually is.

 

[Pink Gregory]

Here's a question: How does Nintendo fix the fact that their core audience keeps shrinking? Do they just go third party, or just work harder on the next console?

To be honest, I don't really know what the 'core audience' even means anymore.

 

[chozo_hybrid]

Here's a question: How does Nintendo fix the fact that their core audience keeps shrinking? Do they just go third party, or just work harder on the next console?

I think 2014 will be a good year for the Wii U, with Tropical Freeze coming out next week (21st), MK8 coming on May 30th, Smash Bros, X, and Bayonetta 2. I can't wait to see how they'll integrate Miiverse into MK8 and Smash Bros, as well as StreetPass in the 3DS version of Smash Bros.

I think this year will tell us who's sitting where this generation, I think the Wii U will make a recovery, heck, it's sold over 2 million more units then the Xbox One, I know the Wii U has been out about a year, but the PS4 is less than a million away from the same number of units sold, shouldn't people be thinking Xbox may be the one in trouble if it doesn't pick up soon?

I have the Wii U, younger brother has the PS4 and older brother has the Xbox One, I'm the one who has more games and plays theirs more. They're bored and just waiting for stuff to come out, meanwhile, I'm having fun and looking forward to new titles, I think the Wii U is doing okay, it's just not sold as well as predicted, based on the Wii sales, they were a bit silly to tell their investors lightning would strike twice, at the same magnitude.

Nintendo are going through what Sony did with the PS3, people thought that machine was doomed for a good while, two years after it really picked up and made a name for itself. We'll just have to wait and see.

 

[VG_Addict]

I can't be the only one who finds it amusing that any news of Nintendo brings out all the armchair business analysts who say it would be better for them to go third party, even though it didn't work for Sega or Atari.

Nintendo doomsayers don't seem to realize that doing (or in this case, saying)the same thing over and over again and expecting a different result is the definition of insanity.

 

[VG_Addict]

I can't be the only one who finds it amusing that any news of Nintendo brings out all the armchair business analysts who say it would be better for them to go third party, even though it didn't work for Sega or Atari.

Nintendo doomsayers don't seem to realize that doing (or in this case, saying)the same thing over and over again and expecting a different result is the definition of insanity.

I can't wait to see their reaction if/when the Wii U turns around and more games are released for it.They'll probaly make excuses by calling it's late bounce back a fluke or something.

Those same people say Nintendo would be better as a third party because they have more heavy hitter IPs than Sega, even though that won't mean much when all they make are Mario and Zelda. Sega had some great IPs too, but after they went third party, pretty much all they made was Sonic.

They think they'd still make games like Metroid as a third party, when Metroid has always been a niche franchise.

 

[Something Amyss]

It seems like when ever something bad for goes for Nintendo its bigger news then problems at Microsoft and Sony. People start jumping to conclusions like its the Death of Nintendo. In comparison Microsoft lost a billion dollars this year on the Xbox brand and that is a improvement. Sony is set to lose 1 billion this year and has laid off 5000 people. It seems like those two are doing worse.

You may have noticed, Nintendo is the only one of the three that's specifically a gaming company. Their failures are more specific. Microsoft can better afford to take a loss on the Xbox brand, and Sony doesn't seem to give a crap how much it fails.

Difficult to say but I know a lot of people are annoyed about the path Nintendo took with the Wii and that it alienated a lot of core gamers. People who were Nintendo fans pretty much stopped supporting them soon after they bought the Wii as it didnt offer much for them and tbh besides a handful of excellent titles I agree it didnt offer much at all beyond a gimmick that soon got old.

It doesn't hurt that their new console is also a gimmick for the sake of a gimmick. It also doesn't hurt that they're still putting in friend codes and half-assing online and HD. It also doesn't hurt that even as they're seeing losses, the company's attitude is one of "the people will like what I tell them to like." It doesn't hurt that they sell they sell their consoles based on their own franchises and then wait to bring them out, basically demanding blind faith (because they want those day one sales). Or that they've been alienating third parties since the N64.

Honestly, they're still alienating gamers.

How will they bounce back? I don't see how they can after the Wii U. It will ruin their brand name.

This isn't much different from the Gamecube scenario, and they bounced back from that.

There is some difference, mind.

 

[VG_Addict]

It seems like when ever something bad for goes for Nintendo its bigger news then problems at Microsoft and Sony. People start jumping to conclusions like its the Death of Nintendo. In comparison Microsoft lost a billion dollars this year on the Xbox brand and that is a improvement. Sony is set to lose 1 billion this year and has laid off 5000 people. It seems like those two are doing worse.

You may have noticed, Nintendo is the only one of the three that's specifically a gaming company. Their failures are more specific. Microsoft can better afford to take a loss on the Xbox brand, and Sony doesn't seem to give a crap how much it fails.

Difficult to say but I know a lot of people are annoyed about the path Nintendo took with the Wii and that it alienated a lot of core gamers. People who were Nintendo fans pretty much stopped supporting them soon after they bought the Wii as it didnt offer much for them and tbh besides a handful of excellent titles I agree it didnt offer much at all beyond a gimmick that soon got old.

It doesn't hurt that their new console is also a gimmick for the sake of a gimmick. It also doesn't hurt that they're still putting in friend codes and half-assing online and HD. It also doesn't hurt that even as they're seeing losses, the company's attitude is one of "the people will like what I tell them to like." It doesn't hurt that they sell they sell their consoles based on their own franchises and then wait to bring them out, basically demanding blind faith (because they want those day one sales). Or that they've been alienating third parties since the N64.

Really? I think they're making a step in the right direction with their latest plans they announced at the investors' meeting, and yesterday's Direct, where they showed more X and Bayonetta 2, and announced a release date for MK8.

Other than the account thing, there's nothing wrong with the Wii U's online. And they've obviously figured out HD, judging by Wind Waker HD.

 

[Something Amyss]

Really? I think they're making a step in the right direction with their latest plans they announced at the investors' meeting, and yesterday's Direct, where they showed more X and Bayonetta 2, and announced a release date for MK8.

Didn't you just ask how they could recover?

Regardless, steps in the right direction doesn't change the overall trend of alienating people. When a Mario game can't move consoles in Japan, something's wrong.

Other than the account thing, there's nothing wrong with the Wii U's online. And they've obviously figured out HD, judging by Wind Waker HD.

Other than it being an inferior service that's lagging more than a generation behind.

And Wind Waker? The game where people massivekly complained about the HD? Doesn't seem like a very good example of Nintendo having it figured out.

 

[VG_Addict]

Somewhat OT, but according to NeoGAF, XB1 only sold 143k last month. I don't think I've ever seen such a big drop in sales, especially this early into a new gen.

Meanwhile, DCKTF comes out next week, so I expect a boost in Wii U sales.

Really? I think they're making a step in the right direction with their latest plans they announced at the investors' meeting, and yesterday's Direct, where they showed more X and Bayonetta 2, and announced a release date for MK8.

Didn't you just ask how they could recover?

Regardless, steps in the right direction doesn't change the overall trend of alienating people. When a Mario game can't move consoles in Japan, something's wrong.

Other than the account thing, there's nothing wrong with the Wii U's online. And they've obviously figured out HD, judging by Wind Waker HD.

Other than it being an inferior service that's lagging more than a generation behind.

And Wind Waker? The game where people massivekly complained about the HD? Doesn't seem like a very good example of Nintendo having it figured out.

OK, I'll bite. How is Miiverse an inferior service?

Give me sources of people complaining about HD. Because I've been hearing lots of people talk about how great the game looks, including our very own Yahtzee.

SM3DW has sold 655,000 LTD in American so far. People seem to forget that Nintendo's games have legs.

 

[Something Amyss]

How are they alienating gamers?

You mean other than exactly what I just said?

if I were Nintendo I'd tell the ones who constantly ***** about everything the company does to fuck off since they have constantly bashed Nintendo no matter what they do.

And Nintendo effectively did that. Now they've lost consumer confidence, investor confidence, sales, and stock price. They want the current guard fired and they want smart phone development. See what the "fuck off" attitude gets people?

Also the 3DS disproves your assertion that Nintendo has alienated third parties,if anything Nintendo had basically extended a olive branch to some third party devs only to have it slapped out of their hands when several backed out.

Use of an example of a virtually monopolised market doesn't disprove anything. It means that they get more action because they're almost literally the only game in town.

Also, there really is no need for revisionism. If you like Nintendo, that's fine. But don't pretend anyone was offering an "olive branch" here.

 

[VG_Addict]

How are they alienating gamers?

You mean other than exactly what I just said?

if I were Nintendo I'd tell the ones who constantly ***** about everything the company does to fuck off since they have constantly bashed Nintendo no matter what they do.

And Nintendo effectively did that. Now they've lost consumer confidence, investor confidence, sales, and stock price. They want the current guard fired and they want smart phone development. See what the "fuck off" attitude gets people?

Nintendo will NEVER do smart phones. I don't know why people keep suggesting that. Doing that would cannibalize their handheld sales.

 

[Something Amyss]

OK, I'll bite. How is Miiverse an inferior service?

Have you ever played on a non-Nintendo console?

Because I've been hearing lots of people talk about how great the game looks, including our very own Yahtzee.

Well if Yahtzee likes it, then nobody ever can possibly have a complaint.

SM3DW has sold 655,000 LTD in American so far. People seem to forget that Nintendo's games have legs.

And now you're trying to shift the points away from the ones which are detrimental to your view of Nintendo. Come on, we've been here before.

Nobody's "forgetting" anything here. You're tackling a different argument entirely because ponies.

Nintendo will NEVER do smart phones.

The inanity of saying "NEVER" aside, please point to where I said they would.

I don't know why people keep suggesting that.

Because the shareholders are pushing in that direction and Nintendo is beholden to them?

Doing that would cannibalize their handheld sales.

And?

 

[EvilRoy]

Nintendo doomsayers don't seem to realize that doing (or in this case, saying)the same thing over and over again and expecting a different result is the definition of insanity.

Wait, so what is it called when Nintendo makes the same decisions over and over to pursue their traditional business practices in the face of decreasing consumer confidence, and steadily dropping stock price.

I'm sitting here matching news stories to stock prices trying to figure out why Nintendo keeps losing me money and 'doing the same thing over and over and expecting a different result' seems to be accountable for most of it. You can claim up and down that this or that 'might' be bad for Nintendo, but what they're doing now IS bad for Nintendo.

 

[VG_Addict]

OK, I'll bite. How is Miiverse an inferior service?

Have you ever played on a non-Nintendo console?

Because I've been hearing lots of people talk about how great the game looks, including our very own Yahtzee.

Well if Yahtzee likes it, then nobody ever can possibly have a complaint.

SM3DW has sold 655,000 LTD in American so far. People seem to forget that Nintendo's games have legs.

And now you're trying to shift the points away from the ones which are detrimental to your view of Nintendo. Come on, we've been here before.

Nobody's "forgetting" anything here. You're tackling a different argument entirely because ponies.

[/qupte]

The inanity of saying "NEVER" aside, please point to where I said they would.

I don't know why people keep suggesting that.

Because the shareholders are pushing in that direction and Nintendo is beholden to them?

Doing that would cannibalize their handheld sales.

And?

I don't have a Wii U, and I didn't use online on the Wii. Can't you just give me a direct answer?

How is saying that SM3DW sold less in America shifting away points?

Nobody said anything about "ponies" (I assume you're referring to the derogatory term for Sony fanboys). Nobody even mentioned Sony.

And? What "and" is needed? That's simple business. Putting their games on mobile would cannibalize their handheld sales. What else do I need to say? I'm saying that it would be a bad idea.

 

[Something Amyss]

Nintendo gave third party devs the chance to develop games for the Wii U and where did that get them?Several devs backing out with bullshit excuses for why they can't develop for the system.

Well, maybe Nintendo should take their ball and go home. And let's see how well that does for them, when less than four months of PS3 sales has almost caught up to the one year head start of the Wii U.

Maybe not designing a console that's a big "screw you" to everyone not Nintendo would have helped, rather than simply "giving them the chance."

And sorry but considering the sales and number of games for the 3DS Nintendo has not lost any consumer confidence,the only thing they lost are some of the hardcore gamers and quitely frankly they don't need a bunch of ingrates who consistently bashed the company for everything.

Well, except sales for even the 3DS are below expectations and have had to be revised down multiple times. Oh, and the loss of stock price. Oh, and actual consumer feedback.

Again, trying to dismiss legitimate concerns is why Nintendo is where they are in the current gen. Why defend it?