Nintendo Puzzled Over Other M's Poor Performance

[Johnny Noon]

To be honest besides the switching to first person I don't hate the controls or gameplay. However Samus Aran portrayal in the game really really disappointed me. She was a total wimp I won't use a power cause Adam won't tell me, and this is from one of the few people who knew who Adam Malkovich was in the game series. I can understand following a mission directive or not using a certain power on a level or floor but she came off as the 1 female character that team ninja produces immensely Generic female characters who frankly should be offensive to female gamers (all 10 of you j/k). Samus Aran was one of the rare exceptions when you can be overly badass, and I don't mean that female overly cold mission focused badass female like in Halo: Reach I just mean a general Bad ass, an interesting character with a complex past, which is what she has her entire family was murdered by a space pterodactyl and she was raised by birds.......how can you not make the story of that at least interesting?! I really wish these classic characters would start talking and having real deeper more realized stories. Can you image a zelda trilogy where idk we followed a link to the end of his life? all these games start the same charged to get the Master sword, defeat Ganon, and save the princess, but honestly my favorite Zelda games are the ones that hint he's already done that, that he is now on his own journey, to truly become a selfless hero, Like Majora's Mask or Link's awakening, or even oracle of time/seasons (remember those games? blast from the past). Idk until nintendo brings back the epic and hardcore in their games I'm going to keep playing ps3 and xbox 360 with the occasional wii disapointment. Also we all need to give up our preconceived notions on classic characters, because in the end we'll have a much cleaner and clearer view of who the character actually is and the world they live in.

 

[CheckD3]

The problem was Samus...that was my beef with it. I couldn't take her voice actress, the way she talked, and the story in general. Trying to tell me how I'm supposed to feel felt forced, where the sense of adventure game in the Prime trilogy just by the music, the cutscenes, just the visuals.

Having someone say something about a giant monster making them scared doesn't necessary make you scared, giving us a smooth background then dropping the monster in front of us, closing up on his snarling, monstrous face, then having the only dialog in the scene the creature's roar of disgust, that's a recipe for scary

Giving Samus a voice wasn't a bad thing though, just make her sound like a battle hardened vet., not a 20 year old sorority college girl =/

 

[Quaidis]

It's clear that Nintendo took a chance by giving a good title under their wing temporarily to a disconnected game developer to see what newness would come out of it. Something fresh and exciting. It was worth the attempt even if it didn't pan out to be a brilliant game like, say, Metroid Prime 3.

Now, unless they signed a 3 game contract with Team Ninja (which is very possible), I have a feeling that Nintendo is going to revert and make their next Metroid game either back in home turf, or try a completely different developer this time. There will also be controversy over giving Samus a voice in following titles - much like they did when Link was given a voice a long time ago.

 

[Electrogecko]

It may have been one of the worst games in the series (unless you're looking for an action-combat game) and one of the worst 1st party games in the last 5 years, but it was still an excellent game that was unfairly judged (by people like you who've never played it and talk trash about it) because it had the Metroid name to live up to.

If the game had been a new IP, nobody would've thought poorly of it....unless they're stupid.

Well, it wasn't a new IP, and thus it's going to be judged in comparison to the rest of the series. How is it unfair to compare it to other games in a series that it shares a name with? The series has a reputation to live up to, and MoM failed to live up to that reputation.

I think that makes the judgements completely fair. Especially as, in your own words, it's arguably "one of the worst games in the series" and "one of the worst 1st party games in the last 5 years".

Personally, those two lines alone gives me the impression you're just being defensive and trying to make excuses.

What the hell are you talking about? So, according to your logic, Sonic Colors is an insanely awesome game because it was a huge step up from every installment in recent memory?

It's okay to compare a game to other installments in the same franchise, (for god's sake I said it may be the worst Metroid game ever) but when it comes to determining a games overall quality, one must remain objective and compare it to all games released accross all platforms. Other M is a high quality solitary experience that is also an incredibly successful gameplay experiment the likes of which none of us have ever seen before....and then I go to the Escapist and hear a bunch of tools (most of which have never touched the game) posting that it's crappy garbage and Nintendo never does anything new.

And to my comment "one of the worst 1st party games in the last 5 years"- Name one recent Nintendo game that wasn't exceptional. (and don't say Mario Party 8)

 

[ark123]

Here's what puzzles me. They know how to make a successful Metroid game. All they have to do is look at Castlevania: Symphony of the Night. Make a side scroller platformer/action game in 2d with a bunch of weapons, armor upgrades, the ability to explore a giant map and a solid story. None of this "3d when you want to shoot missiles" garbage. Make a regular god damn Metroid game and we'll buy it.
We don't need another FPS. Stop with this nonsense and give us what we want.

 

[Spikkle]

Here's what puzzles me. They know how to make a successful Metroid game. All they have to do is look at Castlevania: Symphony of the Night. Make a side scroller platformer/action game in 2d with a bunch of weapons, armor upgrades, the ability to explore a giant map and a solid story. None of this "3d when you want to shoot missiles" garbage. Make a regular god damn Metroid game and we'll buy it.
We don't need another FPS. Stop with this nonsense and give us what we want.

Bye bye innovation, we don't need you any more! *chucks out of the window*

FINALLY, we can just get on and make the same game 200 times for the next 10 years. All this trying to be new and exciting was just getting on my nerves too.

In all seriousness, this kind of talk is dangerous. The Other M team made some damn stupid decisions, and there's no way that I'm going to defend them individually. But, and I know I'm probably going to sound like I'm parroting an episode of Extra Credits here, if developers in general don't take these kinds of risks then nothing's going to be pushing the industry forward and we'll forever be complaining that the classic, breakthrough titles of ye olden dayse of video gaming have all but evaporated.

Oh no, wait, we'll all just do that anydangway.

 

[Space Jawa]

And to my comment "one of the worst 1st party games in the last 5 years"- Name one recent Nintendo game that wasn't exceptional. (and don't say Mario Party 8)

Super Paper Mario

I actually liked Super Paper Mario, personally. But to each their own.

What the hell are you talking about? So, according to your logic, Sonic Colors is an insanely awesome game because it was a huge step up from every installment in recent memory?

It's okay to compare a game to other installments in the same franchise, (for god's sake I said it may be the worst Metroid game ever) but when it comes to determining a games overall quality, one must remain objective and compare it to all games released accross all platforms. Other M is a high quality solitary experience that is also an incredibly successful gameplay experiment the likes of which none of us have ever seen before....and then I go to the Escapist and hear a bunch of tools (most of which have never touched the game) posting that it's crappy garbage and Nintendo never does anything new.

Well, if it doesn't want to have to fill certain expectations about what people want out of a Metroid game, it shouldn't be a Metroid game. Are people suppose to ignore the changes being made to the upcoming X-COM title if it manages to be good and avoids being just another generic shooter, despite everyone saying it's X-COM in name only?

Personally, I don't get your Sonic Colors argument.

And the rest of your argument sounds like you're being defensive and making excuses. I have a hard time making an argument when there's nothing solid there for me to bounce off of with a counterpoint. How are you qualifying it as a "high quality solitary experience"? What's so successful about its gameplay? What makes it stand out as something "none of us have ever seen before"? And have you considered that some of us might have a good reason for calling it a bad game and not purchasing it?

 

[ark123]

Here's what puzzles me. They know how to make a successful Metroid game. All they have to do is look at Castlevania: Symphony of the Night. Make a side scroller platformer/action game in 2d with a bunch of weapons, armor upgrades, the ability to explore a giant map and a solid story. None of this "3d when you want to shoot missiles" garbage. Make a regular god damn Metroid game and we'll buy it.
We don't need another FPS. Stop with this nonsense and give us what we want.

Bye bye innovation, we don't need you any more! *chucks out of the window*

FINALLY, we can just get on and make the same game 200 times for the next 10 years. All this trying to be new and exciting was just getting on my nerves too.

In all seriousness, this kind of talk is dangerous. The Other M team made some damn stupid decisions, and there's no way that I'm going to defend them individually. But, and I know I'm probably going to sound like I'm parroting an episode of Extra Credits here, if developers in general don't take these kinds of risks then nothing's going to be pushing the industry forward and we'll forever be complaining that the classic, breakthrough titles of ye olden dayse of video gaming have all but evaporated.

Oh no, wait, we'll all just do that anydangway.

Innovation? Yes, it was really daring to set Metroid as a FPS nowadays. I mean, the audacity!
There are ways to make a 2d side scrolling action platformer innovative. Mario does it every other year.

 

[Arawn.Chernobog]

Because Samus felt like she'd just want to go home and bake muffins for Adam and her "baby"...

Why can't I get any "warrior girls" in video games any-more? We had one here that WASN'T dressed in a metal bikini and Team Ninja goes ahead and decides to make her submissive...

THERE ARE POINTS IN BETWEEN:

Fully dressed and Submissive House-wife Stereotype & Warrior Girl with physics defying 8008s protected by metal cups

 

[SilverUchiha]

Hey, Nintendo! Just so you know, I refuse to buy this game because I refuse to update my Wii. Maybe if you stop making updates that kill Homebrew Channel, I'd be more obliged to buy your newer games. As it stands, I won't until I either get a new Wii or you stop ruining my ability to play Super Smash Bros. Brawl - Minus.

Sincerely,
Crazy Guy on the Webbernet

 

[BrunDeign]

You'll freak out when coming face to face with a great white shark (which would be a helluva lot less scary than a real life Ridley) no matter how many times you've seen one that close, even if every time you meet that SAME SHARK WITH THE SCAR ABOVE THE EYE THAT HAS A KNACK FOR TRACKING YOU EVERYWHERE (like how Ridley has a knack to always be where Samus is) you manage to kill it. Imagine that shark coming back the next time your in the ocean, despite you obviously killing it the first time, except this time it is a ROBO SHARK WITH FREAKING LASER BEAMS. That may sound like an exaggeration but in real life you'd all be crapping your pants. That's basically what Samus goes through with Ridley except, you know, WORSE. And even though she freaks out she still gets over it enough to fight him again (I would think but I haven't played Other M so I don't know). Unless I had the things she had (Space suit, laser arm cannon, heat-seeking missiles, GIGANTIC balls) I would probably freeze up out of fear or, at best, try to frantically swim away. And I bet all of you would do the same (Robo shark or not).

Well, unlike you, Samus is armed with those things (Space suit, laser arm cannon, etc).

And no, I don't think I'd freak out "no matter how many times" I went into a situation like that. Sure, the first time I would probably get freaked out, and the second time I could see freaking out if I had reason to believe it's the exact same shark, but I think that if I developed a habit of kicking shark butt, I might be in a position to switch from 'AH! A Shark!' to 'Just die already, alright?' by the third or fourth encounter, especially if I was armed with a super powered scuba suit (space suit), an automatic harpoon gun (laser arm cannon), and a load out of torpedoes (heat-seeking missiles). And that's even before I was given the kind of training and guts that Samus had before MoM came around.

Look at yourself and what you're capable of, then compare yourself to Samus. Or even anyone who might serve as a real-life analogue to Samus. You really think that just because you would have a never-ending freak out habit that the same would apply to everyone else?

Context or not, your comment about "Robot Sharks" is weak at best.

Yeah robot shark isn't the best example. So we'll just stick with Ridley himself. Giant Flying Lizard Dinosaur Humanoid. Killed your parents. And your friends. Burned down the only home you had ever known. When you were TEN. That is prime phobia-inducing age. Well technically any age can be prime phobia-inducing age but I digress. Regardless of your power suit you will always have a fear of him. And if Ridley were to get the drop on you, you would have a freaking heart attack. You wouldn't be like "Oh look it's Ridley good day sir." You would freak out to a good degree, compose yourself, then kick his ass. I'm trying to prove that you'll always be afraid to some degree, not that every time the fear will induce a coma.

Maybe Samus shouldn't have freaked out as bad as she did, that much I can somewhat agree with. Simply changing the time during which this game takes place would have made the story SO much more believable.

However, fear is natural. Think about some basic fears. Drowning for instance. If you almost drowned as a child, a super powered suit (or just proper scuba gear) isn't going to put that fear to rest. It just helps you conquer the fear and get in the water. The fear will still be there, you just choose to go against that fear.

 

[EarthBoundGiygas]

I'll say giving Metroid to Team Ninja is like giving Transformers to Michael Bay. We know how it went.

Metroid to team ninja was a nice change, but Transformers to Michael Bay you hit on the spot.

Irony is that the the Transformers movies have done well with the public (selling a lot of tickets and making a lot of money) while not getting the greatest of reviews from critics, while MoM did well with critics but isn't doing so well with consumers.

Just something to think about.

Thats what I call ignorance, the critics were right on both things mentioned. But people are ignorant and dumb. Theres nothing that can stop that.

 

[toastmastah_extravaganzah]

Thats what I call ignorance, the critics were right on both things mentioned. But people are ignorant and dumb. Theres nothing that can stop that.

I call that an example of game critics setting the bar too low when it comes to the quality of storytelling. In the same way that they roll over and is impressed when War FPSes give lip service to the tragedy of war for a few minutes before turning right around and being all "War, F**k Yeah!" for the entire rest of the game, they accept bad storytelling because it is par for the course, these days.

To reiterate the point we (the detractors) are making: What they have done to Samus is not characterisation. Sure, they've filled in some blanks. They've filled those with cheap clichés of womanhood. Samus is not A woman, she is not THE woman, M:OM reduces her to being simply WOMAN, because as we all know, all WOMEN think exactly alike.

A lot of male artists that are otherwise good get bad when it comes to females. David FINCHER, otherwise excellent, can't write women worth crap, for instance. What makes M:OM especially bad is that everything is told from the viewpoint of a woman who has no individuality and defines everything about herself in relation to a man. To make a female who is our window into the story, define herself as THE OTHER and consider the male Non Player-Character the true centre of the story is a very, very nasty form of misogyny.

 

[mjc0961]

Maybe it's because of gigantic bugs that cause you to have to send an SD card to Nintendo with your save file on it to get it fixed, or start the game over and hope it doesn't happen again.

Or maybe it's because the Metroid franchise is just awful.

 

[Physics Engine]

Dear Nintendo.

See "Shadow Complex" and "Bionic Commando: Rearmed"

That is all...

 

[Space Jawa]

Thats what I call ignorance, the critics were right on both things mentioned. But people are ignorant and dumb. Theres nothing that can stop that.

Ignorance on the part of critics, maybe, since the Michael Bay's Transfomers seems to have given audiences what they wanted while MoM hasn't.

Transformers gave people giant robots beating each other up and explosions - people wanted this from the movie, got what they wanted, and didn't have too many things they didn't want pushed at them. MoM tried to give people a big story with confusing plot points and strange gameplay decisions - people didn't want this from Metroid, and didn't get enough stuff they did want from the game.

The critics who reviewed each work may have been correct in their personal assessments, but when it came to saying whether people would like them or not, they clearly were wrong.

 

[chibivash]

I haven't played through Other M myself, though i have played Super Metroid and the Metroid Prime games. I think they should characterise Samus primarily, if not entirely through her actions. I think her choosing not to kill the last baby metroid in one of the earlier games is one of the greatest expressions of her character and that's without the need for all that dialogue and cinematic effect. We don't need her whiny life story and we don't need a voice actress so dull and sedated that it sounds like she's trying to force out every single line. Grrr, i didn't need to play the game to know how annoying that was.

Exactly. They should of used Jennifer Hale again, yet I can only assume they didn't to cut even more costs from the game. The whole thing reeks of lazy design. I've seen Moviebob's statement for it, and honestly refuse to watch it more than once, as he refuses to actually examine it, pushing aside everything valid that people bring up, by blanketing it with the whole "You all just don't want her to have personality and be your misinterpreted idea of stoicism" rant.

Yahtzee, on the other hand, is completely right to me. Samus has thus far given us an idea of her personality, through her actions, and the snippets of voice work in the GBA titles.
What we got in Other M was some 2-bit work handled for a more cheese-cake fashion with little, if any care, to the script, voice work, or even logic behind the game's storyline and dropped plots.
She's striked down Ripley several times before Other M, so why break down now?
She has all her powers active, so besides being a closet masochist, why wait til one insignificant character says its fine to activate something vital to your own survival, and nothing else?
And for the love of god, did they even observe the acress for Samus when she did her lines? Or did they just throw her in the closet and left her alone, without checking how it was read? Even an untrained child could handle the voice work better.

And, because I have to bring it up every time when one refers to the game.
"What's past, is prologue"
Pure. Unadulterated. Genius. Really. Someone should let that man write a bloody novel. Oh yeah... Stephanie Myer did with Twilight, or Dan Brown with some chunks of his writing.

Even Ninja Gaiden had better writing than Other M.

alright, everyone keeps blaming the voice actress of other m, but it was all recorded at the behest of Sakamoto. he was that told her to be lifeless and dull. she was only doing as she was directed.

If Sakamoto actually told her to be "lifeless and dull" as you say, that's all the proof I need to say he needs to get better at his job...I mean c'mon! "Lifeless and dull" do not a good game make.

i'm starting to question his direction as well. he might need to take a step back and rethink some things.

 

[MBurner 93]

It's clear that Nintendo took a chance by giving a good title under their wing temporarily to a disconnected game developer to see what newness would come out of it. Something fresh and exciting. It was worth the attempt even if it didn't pan out to be a brilliant game like, say, Metroid Prime 3.

Now, unless they signed a 3 game contract with Team Ninja (which is very possible), I have a feeling that Nintendo is going to revert and make their next Metroid game either back in home turf, or try a completely different developer this time. There will also be controversy over giving Samus a voice in following titles - much like they did when Link was given a voice a long time ago.

"Well, excuuuuuuuuuuse me, Princess!"

OT: Honestly, I have no problem with Samus getting a voice and character. It's THE voice and character she got that pissed me off.