Nintendo's 3DS Specs Too Low for Epic's Unreal Engine

[Delusibeta]

You seem so in love with a term "next-gen" without actually understanding what it means. Next generation doesn't really have to be more powerful than competitors - it just has to be more powerful than previous iteration (like Nintendo DS).
The thing is DS's hardware was horribly outdated to begin with, and now 3DS contains something not much faster than PSP. It's probably on par with iPhone 3GS, but with no programmable shading support and 4 times less RAM. This means less memory for textures and geometry and also simple lighting (in comparison with what can be achieved on iPhone 3GS).

Of course, a gaming console like 3DS has an advantage of fixed hardware (not like iPhone/iPod with a crapload of generations and different specs) and very little overhead due to simple OS and thin APIs, so it'll have games like nothing on the iPhone 3GS in terms of visuals. And of course these games will be much more advanced, "big" and proper due to big budgets (and higher price of "real" games, unlike iPhone's cheap apps) and other factors.
But still, hardware is weak in comparison with iPhone 4, and nothing can be done about it - there's simply no point in porting Unreal Engine 3 to 3DS, because there won't be direct game ports from home consoles there (I damned hope so).

Source please, otherwise I'm going to assume that you're talking out of your arse.

 

[aaaaaDisregard]

Source please, otherwise I'm going to assume that you're talking out of your arse.

"3DS is powered by twin ARM11 CPUs clocked at a relatively meagre 266MHz, while overall system storage (sans SD card) is 1.5GB. Onboard RAM is 64MB, with 4MB of video memory. DMP's PICA-200 graphics chip is said to be running at a relatively lightweight 133MHz."
http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/digitalfoundry-3ds-techspec-exploration-blog-entry

and behold
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IPhone#Models
800MHz Cortex CPU for iPhone 4/1GHz for iPad
512MB RAM for iPhone 4/256MB for 3DS
PowerVR SGX535 as video chip.
http://www.anandtech.com/show/2782/3
which supports OpenGL ES 2.0 with fully programmable shading
http://www.imgtec.com/demo_room/
http://www.imgtec.com/factsheets/SDK/PowerVR%20Technology%20Overview.1.0.2e.External.pdf

So in terms of pure hardware power iPhone wins. But as I've said earlier, most games for 3DS will be visually better than iPhone ones due to better art, low overhead and better optimization - all thanks to higher budgets and 3DS's gaming focus - let alone gameplay-wize better.

 

[Cryo84R]

What...? I don't get it.

So you're telling me that the Iphone is a more powerful gaming system than the 3DS?

Wtf?

Yes, it is. iPhone 4 and the new iPod touch have quite a lot going on under the hood. Even six-axis control.

I also call bullshit. Frankly, the 3DS should be more than capable of topping an iPhone, it's just that Epic don't give a damn.

Have you even used an iPhone 4/iPod touch? Do try to get your hands on one (even if it's just trying out Epic Citadel).

Otherwise it's just baffling that a GAMES CONSOLE coming out in 5 months time can't match a PHONE that's been out for aaaaages.

3GS came out in 2009, the iPhone 4 came out in June 2010 and the 4th gen iPod touch came out last month.

 

[jamesworkshop]

What...? I don't get it.

So you're telling me that the Iphone is a more powerful gaming system than the 3DS?

Wtf?

Iphone 4

Apple A4 is based on the ARM processor architecture. The first version released runs at 1 GHz and contains a Cortex-A8 CPU core paired with a PowerVR SGX 535 graphics processor (GPU)built on Samsung's 45 nm process.

The Cortex-A8 core used in the A4 is thought to use performance enhancements developed by chip designer Intrinsity (which was subsequently acquired by Apple)[10] in collaboration with Samsung.[11] The resulting core, dubbed "Hummingbird", is able to run at far higher clock rates than other implementations while remaining fully compatible with the Cortex-A8 design provided by ARM. Other performance improvements include additional L2 cache. The same Cortex-A8 CPU core used in the A4 is also used in Samsung's S5PC110A01 SoC.

The A4 processor package does not contain RAM, but supports PoP installation. The top package of the A4 used in the iPad & iPod touch 4th gen contains two low-power 128 MB DDR SDRAM chips for a total of 256MB RAM. For the iPhone 4 there are two chips of 256 MB for a total of 512 MB. RAM is connected to the processor using ARM's 64-bit-wide AMBA 3 AXI bus. This is twice the width of the RAM data bus used in previous ARM 11 and ARM 9 based Apple devices, to support the greater need for graphics bandwidth in the iPad.

PowerVR SGX 535

PowerVR's SGX series is used in many popular devices, including the Apple A4 (which powers the iPhone 4, iPad, iPod touch, and Apple TV) and Samsung's Hummingbird (in Galaxy S and Galaxy Tab devices) and Motorola's Droid phone. It features pixel, vertex, and geometry shader hardware, supporting OpenGL 2.0 and DirectX 10.1 Shader Model 4.1.

Intel uses the SGX 535 as its GMA 500 & GMA 600 integrated graphics chips.



The iphone 4 is a serious piece of tech

 

[Impluse_101]

Awww.

Unreal Engine is awesome. Oh well.

 

[Jacob.pederson]

We'll see what they say after Carmack hacks up a version of Rage running at 60fps in 3D on the night after he gets the dev kit

Ok . . . so maybe 5am the night after.

 

[AverageBob]

The funny thing is the specs.

CPU:
The iphone has had a CPU that's a 300-400Mhz(iPhone), 400Mhz(3G), 600Mhz(3Gs), or 1Ghz(iPhone 4) ARM CPU. The GPU handles OpenGL ES 1.1 (iPhone, 3G) or OpenGL ES 2.0 (3Gs, iPhone 4).

The DS lists a dual CPU, both ARM (So similar architecture) at 67 and 33 Mhz. The DSi, however, is 133Mhz/33Mhz. The 3DS specs I couldn't find on CPU, but since rumors of the GPU mention 400Mhz, I assume that the CPU would be similar.

The Wii, Gamecube, PSP, and Playstations use different architectures, so speeds aren't comparable.

RAM:
The iPhone ram, not flash disk space, has been 128MB (iPhone, 3G), 256MB (3Gs), and 512MB(iPhone 4). The OS takes a good chunk for mulitasking, but an application can be guaranteed to have at least 15-30MB of RAM all on its own, even on the first iPhone.

The DS ram has been 4MB for the DS, and 16MB for the DSi. Perhaps the 3DS has up to 32 or 64MB of RAM?

The Gamecube and Wii have 86 and 91MB RAM; Main, buffer and texture ram combined.

The PSPs, since 2007, have 64MB RAM

The PS2 and PS3 have 36 and 512MB RAM; Main, buffer, and texture ram combined.

It's worth noting that Epic Castle on the iPad (which has 256MB RAM like the 3Gs) barely fits (IE, it forces Safari and Mail to make room in RAM) so it may be that RAM alone excludes the 3DS. Perhaps even the Wii won't be able to handle it.

The game binary itself, in terms of application ipa is 82.3MB as of version 1.02. Uncompressed, it's about 134MB.

If you want real heresy, consider that Carmack said that the iPhone kills the prev gen consoles, and is not far from latest gen consoles (PS3, XBox360), with no comparison to handhelds at all. ( http://kotaku.com/5611523/id-unleashes-rage-on-the-iphone )

 

[Megacherv]

Surely they can use the Unreal 2 engine, probably version 2.5. That's good enough for me

 

[lightsier]

I don't believe anything from Mark Rein, he's back tracked from his statements too many times in the past.

 

[Timbydude]

What? Surely the 3DS is more powerful than the iPhone.

The 3DS is more powerful than the Wii, which is more powerful than the iPhone. My powers of deduction tell me that Epic is either lying or lazy.

 

[Cryo84R]

What? Surely the 3DS is more powerful than the iPhone.

The 3DS is more powerful than the Wii, which is more powerful than the iPhone. My powers of deduction tell me that Epic is either lying or lazy.

May want to actually look at the iPhone 4 specs.

 

[jamesworkshop]

What? Surely the 3DS is more powerful than the iPhone.

The 3DS is more powerful than the Wii, which is more powerful than the iPhone. My powers of deduction tell me that Epic is either lying or lazy.

Guess again

 

[Judgement101]

That slightly confuses me, shouldn't a console be able to outpreform a glorified MP3 player

Yes, but the DS is a glorified iPod Touch.

 

[Rad Party God]

Bah, so much for an engine... I really don't care if it doesn't work on the 3DS or if an iPhone is better than the 3DS. In the end, nobody will give it a shit. It's good for comparisons and the e-peen factor, but really, IF Epic could get the UE3 working on the 3DS, would he even bother to release an Unreal Tournament on the 3DS? (that would be awesome...)

 

[Xanthious]

Color me shocked, yet another underpowered Nintendo console. I can't believe Nintendo, a company who hasn't even made the jump to high definition (a move even my grandmother has made at this point), would release yet another system that is painfully behind the times and relies on a shitty gimmick to mask it's obvious shortcomings.

Maybe five or six years from now Nintendo will put out something on par with the 2 year old devices of today. Sure it will be terribly behind the times yet again but Im sure you will be able to control it using a hamster or your tongue or maybe it will have the first ever "smell-o-vision". I miss the Nintendo of the early 90s that didn't hide behind gimmicks to get their systems over and focused on quality gaming.

 

[TLatshaw]

Oh, no. Nintendo's handheld system is underpowered compared to other pieces of machinery! It's going to be just as bad as all their previous systems!

...Oh, wait. That was never bad at all.

 

[Nevyrmoore]

Color me shocked, yet another underpowered Nintendo console. I can't believe Nintendo, a company who hasn't even made the jump to high definition (a move even my grandmother has made at this point), would release yet another system that is painfully behind the times and relies on a shitty gimmick to mask it's obvious shortcomings.

Is this including the DS? I'm a bit unsure, though I doubt it considering the fact that it's been ruining the PSP's shit for the past several years.