non Americans: do you think we are violent?

[CrystalShadow]

honestly? Yes.

As someone who has never visited the US, and knows it only from media depictions and talking to people online, it seems like a place that is especially dangerous in terms of violent crime.

It also seems to glorify and fetishise violent things, (such as the obsession with private gun ownership and the 'right' of people to shoot 'criminals' in 'self defense')


Then there's the whole military industrial complex thing.
Which honestly, at times makes the US as a country look like it's run by bloody-minded warmongers.

It's especially ironic because it's closely attached to the idea that America is the 'good guy'.

Yeah, sure. The giant bully who by virtue of being the biggest and strongest thing around has repeatedly shown it's willingless to threaten people into doing what it wants is of course, the 'good guy'.

Mostly in the sense that the people that think otherwise probably feel like they can't say so out loud because they feel like America has a gun to their heads.

Yes! Yes! Of course you're the good guys, and have perfectly good and honourable intentions and such.
That sounds a little hollow coming from someone that essentially has a metaphorical gun to their head...

The relationship with it has with it's smaller, less powerful allies, when you dig into it also starts to look a little like stockholm syndrome...

Or massive dependency. Does Australia really agree with America as readily as it seems to? Or is it just that we are too small to defend ourselves, and need to suck up to someone or other that might be big enough to hold back someone else...

Yeah... That's um... OK, probably a bit over the top. But seriously, if you look at America's behaviour without rose-tinted glasses, and dig into the history of how they behave towards other countries, it can start to look very much like a lot of it consists of dysfunctional relationships resulting from massive power imbalances...

 

[Joost Klessens]

tl;dr: Yes!

I do think America as a nation/society is (one of) the most violent in the developed world. However, I get most of my information second hand from news bulletins, movies/tv, and a few friends/acquaintances who visit or live there. And I would never assume that any individual American was violent. It's just that I feel Americans have a really strange way of thinking about people/countries outside of their own, especially compared to a Western European way of thinking (I'm from The Netherlands FYI). The way Americans come across over here is that they are, for lack of an other word, indoctrinated from a young age to think America is the best! USA number one, and all that... And it seems like most Americans know very little of countries outside of their own, and, based on Americans I've met, seem to think they are the best country in the world and that everybody loves them, except for, maybe, Muslim countries.

Furthermore Americans, to me, come across as honoring and adoring soldiers and everything to do with fighting for their country. While, over here, soldiers are mostly respected of course, but still, they are just doing their job and they get paid for it. So why should they get more respect as anyone else who works, and pays taxes and such to keep our country/the world going. This, combined with Americas tendency to first go to war, over working things out peacefully, makes it seem like America is a pretty violent war-mongering nation.

And, as has been said before, Americans have a strange preoccupation with guns and gun control. Which is very hard to understand for someone who lives in a country where even cops aren't allowed to always carry guns. Guns kill people. So, basically, less guns is good, IMO. While it seems that a lot of Americans think that less guns is bad, and that they should be able to kill someone if necessary. This combined with America's history of violence on the street and cop violence, etc, makes me think that besides being aggressive and violent towards other countries, America is also very aggressive and violent withing its own borders.

Lastly from our perspective, which is probably tainted by movies and tv, America seem to have a lot of strange religious groups/cults, racist groups/cults, and gangs, which often encourage violence. So all in all, yeah I think America is a lot more aggressive and violent than most developed countries. However, I'm not particularly scared of that, as I do realize that it mostly a preconception and that most individual Americans are probably not violent or aggressive at all.

What I find interesting in all this, however, is why America seems to be okay with all kinds of violence, for example on tv and in games and such, but is such a stickler when it comes to nudity/religious views/'racist' words/etc. I mean, IMO, violence should be a bigger taboo than nudity, sex, or anything really.

 

[Cowabungaa]

Oh yes, definitely. Of course, it varies from state to state, I realize that, but looking at the US as a whole, your history and all that's been going on; oh yeah, your culture is very gun-ho. And it makes sense, looking at so many factors. It's a young country born out of proto-capitalist expansion (colonialism) and revolution and then expanded very quickly, mainly through force. You can't expect that past to just go away in a century or so.

Honestly, your global cultural, political and economical influence frightens me. It's thanks to the US that the world now suffers under the yoke of neo-liberalism, arguably one of the most terrible things to ever happen to humankind as a whole. The economic violence inflicted upon billions of people caused (in a large part, because never is there just one cause) by the spread of that ideology makes the situation with IS almost seem trivial (read: it isn't though).

But even on a smaller scale, the institutionalized nature of violence in American society honestly shocks me. The way your police forces employ violence is insane. Hell, the fact that guns are largely somehow seen as defensive tools is just plain crazy. When I consume American fiction (and I do so a lot, because yay third-wave imperialism) violent solutions are treated with a casualness I don't see anywhere else in the Western world at least.

So yeah, to a Dutch guy living in Belgium your culture seems very violent. But as individuals, there's of course plenty of cool people there just like in any other country. But I can't deny certain institutionalized problems that reside in the culture psyche of the US as a whole.

And I realize that this rant seems pretty incoherent. Woops.

No more violent than any other society that has easy access to guns.

Y'see, that's the thing; that ain't true. Both Canada and Switzerland, for instance, have as easy or maybe even easier access to guns. Yet gun violence is way lower in those countries.

 

[Steve Waltz]

And, as has been said before, Americans have a strange preoccupation with guns and gun control. Which is very hard to understand for someone who lives in a country where even cops aren't allowed to always carry guns. Guns kill people. So, basically, less guns is good, IMO. While it seems that a lot of Americans think that less guns is bad, and that they should be able to kill someone if necessary. This combined with America's history of violence on the street and cop violence, etc, makes me think that besides being aggressive and violent towards other countries, America is also very aggressive and violent withing its own borders.

To clarify the gun issue:

The anti-gun Americans agree with you thinking that having guns legal leads to violence. They point at other countries have that outlawed guns and try to make the point that, since they have less violence, guns that the true evil. The second amendment to the US constitution states that citizens have the right to carry guns to be able to create a militia if ever needed. Anti-gun advocates claim that this is an outdated right, and, thanks to public shootings, they think that this right has been abused and needs to be taken away. I?m not really well-versed in the anti-gun advocate arguments.

There are multiple motivations for why some Americans are pro-gun. My favorite one is because of business. Guns create SOOOO many jobs. Guns salesmen, gun range owners, gun accessory designers, etc. If we banned guns, A LOT of people would lose their jobs; that alone is a good reason for why America should keep guns.
The front-runner reason is for self-defense, although this is strongly argued with anti-gun Americans. Personally, I agree that it?s good for self-defense and I have a shotgun for this. But in practice I really do think an armed society is a polite society. In the USA, citizens really can go full-cowboy and carry a gun in a holster without a license or anything. Buy a pistol and holster at a sporting goods store and citizens can walk out of the store wearing them in the open like a new pair of shoes. Seriously though, if I was a woman walking around at night, I would totally open carry a pistol. If a rapist sees a woman carrying a gun around her waist, he should know not to mess with her unless he wants a bullet in his chest. You need a license to conceal a weapon, though.
The third most popular reason as for why Americans want guns is for protection against an oppressive government. Just like most of the posters in here, a lot of Americans also don?t trust the government. If the next Hitler somehow sneaks his way into power, Americans citizens still have our guns to pull a revolution and take our country back. Anti-gun Americans say that the Check-And-Balances system is enough to protect from any oppressive government, but I feel that guns are our lifeline security from having the next Stalin from taking control of the strongest army in the world.
Lastly, a lot of people just want their guns for fun. They enjoy shooting at targets or go hunting. It?s a hobby for some and that generates business (constantly buying bullets, safety equipment, etc.), so it?s OK by me.

 

[Dandark]

Yes you are all evil monsters that we British foolishly released upon the world but the day soon approaches when we take back our colonies with musket and impractical hat!

I don't think the people over there are particularly more violent than people elsewhere in the world but there are a few differences that make Europeans view you a bit negatively. Other than the stereotypical self righteous "Best country in the world" attitude some people seem to find you have(I think it mostly comes from your politicians rather than your people) the constant chant of "FREEDOM! WE ARE THE NATION OF FREEDOM" makes people expect America to really have a focus on freedom, a view that is shattered when they see some of the anti-freedom police state things that go on over there.

I don't know about others but your Police force is what scares me the most about your country. This may just be me buying into the media narrative but your Police force is ****ing scary. I've lived in Britain my whole life and I'm just not used to the idea of the police being so heavily armed from the standard patrol officer having a gun to use in most situations to police responding to protests with military equipment. Couple that cultural difference with the constant barrage of news stories about officers shooting people when they really shouldn't be, unlawfully killing them, and then getting away with no repercussions and the country sounds like a scary place to be.

TL;DR I don't think the American people are individually more violent than others but the country seems like a place where violence is much more routine and accepted than it is over here.

 

[Thaluikhain]

Use of nuclear weapons in warfare. Use of biological weapons in warfare. And use of depleted uranium based weapons in warfare.

Nuclear weapons twice, 70 years ago, biological weapons, not for longer, and DU isn't that bad, it's used because it's denser than lead (and otherwise not that useful).

However, conventional weapons are quite horrific as they are.

 

[The Lunatic]

I don't know, honestly. America certainly has a history of violence.

I guess I wouldn't say I consider that average American to be a violent person, but, I would say that in society, people in America have issues with violence.

I'm not particularly sure why. America is a very large place with very many different issues depending upon where you are inside of it.

Racial tensions in some areas, ideological differences and class disputes in others. It's a difficult area to tackle.

 

[maffgibson]

Speaking as a British person with a huge soft spot for Americans, yes and no.

Are Americans a nation of orcs, constantly enacting violence on one another? No. The vast majority of Americans I have personally met are intensely lovely and friendly people.

On the other hand, there are certain founding myths which (I believe) dispose Americans and their institutions to violence in certain situations. As an example, the "wild west" mythos: In terms of actual shootouts, lawlessness and good guy with a gun vs. bad guy with a gun, it never really existed in the way that it is portrayed in movies and TV. Even if it had, the applicability of "frontier survival" to a settled civilisation is pretty minimal.

Despite this, this cultural imprint seems (to a European) to have had massive effect on the way the American police force operates (clue: the emphasis is on "force"), as well as the abusability of "self-defense" laws. This attitude of the "virtue of lethal force wielded by the virtous" can also be seen scaled up by the foreign policy hawks in US politics.

That said, the British had a pretty strong similar idea (from very different roots) when we were an imperial power, so maybe it is just a phase that America is going through? The kids grow up so quickly...

 

[The Lunatic]

That said, the British had a pretty strong similar idea (from very different roots) when we were an imperial power, so maybe it is just a phase that America is going through? The kids grow up so quickly...

Certainly! Before we know it, they might even have an empire of their own!


How horrifying.

 

[Mister K]

I don't think that Americans are violent, although I do think that you are tollerant towards media violence and quite, um, uncomfortable with anything erotic (opposite of your steretypical European). Plus, I think that some of you like your automatic rifles way too much.

 

[maffgibson]

That said, the British had a pretty strong similar idea (from very different roots) when we were an imperial power, so maybe it is just a phase that America is going through? The kids grow up so quickly...

Certainly! Before we know it, they might even have an empire of their own!


How horrifying.

Yes, and in this dark future, we will host numerous American military bases, get roped into sketchy wars, and my computer will autocorrect my spelling to the American style no matter how much I fiddle with the damned language settings...

*Edited for silly grammatical mistake*

 

[Scars Unseen]

English guy here. I heard it said once that the world views the US the same way the US views Texas. Make of that what you will. As for my personal opinion, I don't think the US is violent. Really all the US government needs to do is not be so defensive of guns and corporations and it'd be treated the same as any other first world nation.

That seems like a fair comparison. Goes the other way around too. Texas views itself the same way the US does: the best around with little justification. I have a bit of a joke about the state that goes something like this: "How can you tell that someone's from Texas? They'll tell you." It's kind of like part of our introduction. "Hi, my name's Scars Unseen, and I'm from Texas. Nice to meet you!"

 

[RedDeadFred]

Well it seems you guys frequently elect people who want war, but no, I don't think you're more or less violent really than any other first world country. Probably less than a lot TBH.

 

[darkside-goldstein]

I live on a country that's in on the top 10 most violent in the world,i would love some US level of security applied here ,and fiction don't cause violence

in here we had anything from other countries banned until 1989 and killings and kidnappings skyrocketed during the military coop


fiction is a necessary catharsis

 

[AwesomeHatMan]

From NZ. Yes. I also wonder if the percentage of 18+ citizens carrying handguns on their person in the US is higher than the percentage of police officers in NZ (if you get what I'm trying to say)... Partially due to the fact I think common practice in NZ is to keep police firearms locked in the vehicle I think, but I don't know... Still hopefully that gets the point across... A police or gang related shooting where I'm from is pretty rare...

 

[Hagi]

I don't think it's so much violent as megalomaniac.

It seems a culture that glorifies power. Be it through threat of violence, money or other means. With a decent bit of paranoia throw in that others seek to take said power for themselves.

 

[Sanderpower]

I think you're bloody psychopaths. I won't even go to America because I'm afraid I'll get shot. Your cops are racist, state-sponsored murderers and half your people think a gun is more important than a child's life.

Yes, I know I'm judging the majority by the actions of the minority, but I think that's the only way to do things. When people's lives are at stake, you should judge things by their worst aspects, not their average. If a man lives a totally blameless and generally good life except for that ONE time -it was only once, mind- he raped and murdered a child, you don't give him a pass as a good man "on average".

First and foremost, there is a huge difference between judging individuals and judging groups, especially groups you can't choose to be in such as nationality, race, gender, etc.

With your logic, everybody is horrible. British colonization and enslavement of Africa. Blacks in various African countries such as Uganda and Somalia committing genocide. Whites created nuclear bombs and were the only people to ever use them. Japanese raped and murdered many citizens of the Asian countries they occupied during WW2.

Now you may say "well that happened in the past". Well if you're going to compare individuals to groups, then you can't necessarily ignore the past because things are better now. Does a man whose 80 years old be excused for being in charge of a Nazi death camp and slaughtering thousands of Jewish men, women, and children?

You may argue that current good deeds overwrite past bad ones. Does a wealthy doctor who was very generous to the sick and poor, saved many lives, and was mostly a very compassionate and kind person, still be considered a good man even if he raped and murdered a child?

Now you can say we should judge groups by the worst of there CURRENT actions. Well I'd like to point out that a number of Hispanics in Latin America are involved in drug trade and are a major cause of violent crimes. Should we now judge all the Hispanics as being dangerous? What about citizens in drug-war torn countries such as Mexico? What about Muslims and the minority who are terrorists? You see where i'm going with this?

You judge nations by there actions as a whole and you also keep in mind mitigating factors such as cultural differences, citizen's power in there government, how democratic or authoritarian the country is, etc. Even then, you don't generalize all the citizens in that country as being "bloody psychopaths". That's just a gross generalization that borders on bigotry and is definitely prejudiced.

 

[Zykon TheLich_v1legacy]

I think that the spread of US media round the world and the levels of violence within said media maybe give off the impression that America is a horribly violent place, coupled with the fact that a lot of the time the news that we get from the US outside of specific topics is concentrated on shootings etc i.e. the headline grabbing stuff. We don't get the stories of "nothing remotely interesting happened in 99% of the US today, everyone is safe and enjoying a nice burger and beer in front of the superbowl (which, I am led to believe, is what all Americans do when they aren't drag racing their hot rods and shooting their 6 guns in the air to scare off injuns).

 

[L. Declis]

Oh god yes.

Let me put it like this. I live in China. A Communist, Facist state. I have never felt threatened by any police officer here.

But when I was in America, I was extremely aware that every single cop is a bloody threat and if I act strange, they will shoot and kill me without a single worry. I have never been so thankful I am white and I am extremely British-sounding, which seems to relax them more for some reason.

I have never seen a country that manages to be so obsessed with freedom while being happy to trade away those freedoms; so obsessed with democracy despite only two choices; so brave while being too scared to allow liberty. I have also seen more poverty in some parts of the U.S. than I have in China, a third world country.

Not only did I fear for my life, I knew that if I was shot, my best bet would be to bandage the wound and get a flight back to the U.K. because otherwise, even with insurance, the healthcare of the richest country in the world would bankrupt me because, while it's fine to create a military force stronger than the next 26 countries combined, it's too communistic to accept universal health care.

I have never met a country that so loves it's many cultures and backgrounds but bastardises them because variety is bad for the American palate. I've met more Irish people in America than in Ireland (despite the fact they aren't Irish for several generations) and they're obsessed with their country and won't admit a single wrong-doing of it. Have you tried American Chinese food? Far too sweet, and far too much pork.

A country where Janet shows a nipple is a national outrage that must require apologies but the multiple breaks of the American Constitution aren't even noticed anymore.

It's the country that invented the phrase "What Bleeds, Leads". Of course it's dangerous.

Don't even get me started on its foreign policy.