I'm quite sure he's talking about instances where men have gone to bed with transwomen and then killed them when they realized the woman wasn't biologically female.the silence said:
Obsidian accused of transmisogyny in Pillars of Eternity
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The very act of someone still classifying a trans person as their original physical gender is enough to be labeled as transphobic by some SJWs, even if its only to the extent of sexuality and sexual acts without any prejudice, bigotry or discrimination.Creslin321 said:
Which as someone who doesn't have objection to having a relationship with a transexual person I think is damn wrong, respect and rights go both ways (no pun intended) and if someone is uncomfortable with the idea and expresses it then it should be respected.
That you're suffering from a bout of internalized transmisogyny? I could be wrong, the list of pronouns is expanding so quickly it's hard to keep up.Uratoh said:
TotalBiscuit gives a rational opinion on this fiasco:
https://soundcloud.com/totalbiscuit/pillars-of-transphobia
And is promptly mobbed on Twitter by SJWs telling him to #ShutTheFuckUpTotalBiscuit.
Difference is that stuff like that in Bioshock Infinite and Game of Thrones actually serve a purpose within the story and help convey what sort of world it is. This poem does not do that. It is completely detached from the game world and seems to add nothing to it, existing instead as nothing but an insensitive joke someone decided to slip in there. Now I would say that it could be a lot worse, but when actual transgendered people get murdered in today's world just for being transgendered, it's still not exactly promoting acceptance or entirely appropriate. Legitimately tie it into the games world building and I wouldn't have an issue with it, but there's no argument for artistic integrity I can see here. It serves no valid purpose and probably should be changed or removed.ToastiestZombie said:
So what I will say will sound extremely dumb. But I think it is important:bluepotatosack said:
Are there sources on this type of murder? It sounds like something that could be a great urban legend without an instance of it really happening.
Because it assumes that these Transgenders are so careless, that they would try to sleep with someone before disclosing the fact. The story is kind of transphobic.
Who are you to say that it doesn't add anything to the world? The world of PoE isn't 2015 where bigots are ostracized (or just anyone who isn't offended at everything, in the case of TotalBiscuit), it's a fantasy-medival society that would be rife with bigotry of all kinds. Go listen to TB's response, a guy who's definitely played the game inside out, and he mentions that there is explicit homophobia and the murder of innocent men, women and children en mass. It's not like this joke has been placed as an easter egg in Mario.Vivi22 said:
And I know that transgenders get murdered because of who they are, and that's atrocious. But a joke that doesn't even imply transgenderism explicitly in a small corner of a massive 100-hour RPG with novels of flavor text isn't going to affect that in any way. In fact, if it weren't for the offended parties bringing it to the attention of everyone nobody would have ever cared and to be frank all this will actually do in the end is just reaffirm the beliefs of many that transgenders, feminists, etc are thin-skinned and want to censor whatever they don't like.
It served the purpose of getting extra money out of the backers ... they got the money, the backers got their epitaphs.Vivi22 said:
The only legal way to change or remove it at this point is to get the backer to amend their contract ... the producers will probably tell Josh to just let it blow over, but if Josh makes enough of a fuss for them to actually try to get it removed they'll probably try to bully the backer into it. If he's smart he'll tell them to f*** themselves unless they want to make him a good offer, I'd try to hold out for a hundred or so steam keys or a thousand bucks.
It means you've got a sense of humor! You are a perfectly average person!(I mean that sincerely, you are a perfect example of unexceptional behavior, you are the very model of the standard standard, a midsize typically normal individual who exceeds in absolutely nothing!) Or that you've internalized your trans....something -ibia-ogyny-hodgedy-podgedy...I have very little idea of the words being used here honestly.Uratoh said:
If you cannot tell people without the ability to giggle like a school[s/]girl[/s]child(Was thumped mightily over the head for that one by the roaming feminists, they even allowed their male members do all the heavy lifting, it was glorious!) or are so out of touch with their emotional core(that little piece of you you know is probably on the highway somewhere) that do not realize it, everything preceding this was mostly another big joke.
Well yeah...but how does it makes this gravestone transphobic? I mean, nine out of ten people say gangbangs are the best things in the world(some even say ten out of ten!), it's a funny joke about gravestone epitaphs, people, and their preconceptions. If you're not allowed to make fun of something because it might reference something bad in the real world, our comedy would still be stuck in the knock,knock day and age...except we wouldn't, because home invasions have started with door knocking before...bluepotatosack said:
The game's character creation screen pretty much spells out that men and women are NOT equal in the game world: "In the Aedyr Empire, Vailian Republics, and the Dyrwood, women occupy many domestic, educational, and organizational roles. They are the primary hunters, soldiers, and leaders of the tribes in Naasitaq." Basically, in the game world's dominant cultures women are expected to "stay in the kitchen" (Naasitaq is one island). There are comments in the game about lesbians not being welcome (though I haven't seen that yet. Maybe I need to talk to villagers more).Vivi22 said:
In short, the world is sexist and homophobic. HOW is a rhyme that adds transphobia to the list detached from the world?
[quote/]Now I would say that it could be a lot worse, but when actual transgendered people get murdered in today's world just for being transgendered, it's still not exactly promoting acceptance or entirely appropriate.[/quote]
By tying this to real-world trans issues you're implying that games influence our perceptions. You know where that road ends? "Games promote violence! Games promote misogyny!"
This was a joke before the medical profession had the knowledge to perform sex changes.
But sure, blow this out of proportion, of course Sir'am, Obsidian deserves so much more than, sensitive people bangin' on doors, like when Techland had it's code leaked and called women whores. It's absurd, you had me laughin' at, ev-ery word, I'm never perturbed, Obsidian, will not be disturbed. If those turds want to chase it-take it- up with Vivendi, and the courts'll kick your ass out faster than you can say 'free speech'.
But sure, blow this out of proportion, of course Sir'am, Obsidian deserves so much more than, sensitive people bangin' on doors, like when Techland had it's code leaked and called women whores. It's absurd, you had me laughin' at, ev-ery word, I'm never perturbed, Obsidian, will not be disturbed. If those turds want to chase it-take it- up with Vivendi, and the courts'll kick your ass out faster than you can say 'free speech'.
it doesn't bother me if people are transgender, gay, bi or intersex but its just good manners to tell someone that you where once a guy/girl before the pants hit the floor. i don't know about you lot but if i take a girl home i expect that girl to have two x chromosomes.
I just want to quote this to reiterate why some people are considering this offensive.MarsAtlas said:
This is a sentiment you see all of the time, sometimes to the extent that people will attack and beat the person who "duped" them. Usually it's just used to ridicule them or demonize them for daring to sleep with you without telling them you were really a man. Because god forbid a transexual individual want a sexual encounter as their preferred gender.
It's not the most offensive poem (They were classy enough for him to kill himself instead of her), but I'd say it's pretty tasteless. In a world where this belief wasn't so god damn pervasive maybe I'd assume that the joke was on the man for being intolerant and insecure, but it really comes across as "Ha! You got tricked into sleeping with a man, now isn't that embarrassing?"
What if you have a really small dick? Or you have an unsightly gut that doesn't show under your shirt? Or maybe an unattractive medical condition, like burns?Cptn_Ab said:
Should you be obligated to tell your potential partners beforehand of all the qualities they might find undesirable as a similar courtesy?
Pretty sure he's blaming the person that sleeps with random individuals without telling them anything and not knowing how they might react to it. I'd say the same thing to a straight guy sleeping with a straight girl and getting some kind of debilitating STD or the married person sleeping with the unmarried and not telling them they have a spouse, who also is a vengeful and jealous little brat.MarsAtlas said:
you know, I could be alot more sympathetic to this if there was some sort of threat and/or it wasn't at the expense of the man who ran off the cliff.
it's just impressive to me that someone can get their jimmies so rustled over a very very small poem in a very very out of your way text in a game, when there are millions of other horrible things that would relatively *deserve* that ire and concern.
it's just impressive to me that someone can get their jimmies so rustled over a very very small poem in a very very out of your way text in a game, when there are millions of other horrible things that would relatively *deserve* that ire and concern.
Here comes the histronics. I swear this forum lives for this kind of crap.Vivi22 said:
The limerick in question doesn't state that the transgendered person in the limerick was harmed in any way, so to take that limerick and turn it around and say "Well TG people get murdered for being TG"....uh...okay, your point is generally valid but not to the current debate? In fact the fact that Jim Sterling switched it around like that....really makes me lose a bit of respect for Jim.
The poem doesn't promote the idea of murdering anyone, it simply says a man ran off a cliff when he bedded a woman that turned out to be a man.
Lets be fair, yes, TG people can be murdered for being TG...but to even address the fact that a straight man who found out he spent all night making out with a transgendered individual could end up killing himself because of it...because thats what the poem is about. And I'm sure there are occurrences of that happening too. The fact that people want to flip it around and make a harmless poem into a cry of victimization when the "victim" in the fictional scenario was the straight man.
Jim's tweet makes no sense. People flipping the scenario around make no sense.
Can I ask a sane question? I have no problem with transsexual individuals wishing to live as their preferred gender but don't they have a responsibility to be honest with their potential partners about this? Its one thing to respect someones wishes to be who they want to be, but its another entirely to achieve that desire in a dishonest fashion.The Almighty Aardvark said:
Lets take a completely different example. If I spent all night with a really hot woman, and then after she invited me to her place, she took off a wig, pulled out a set of full dentures to reveal a bunch of meth addict tooth stubs and had a bunch of open sores all over her body where I couldn't see them before she took off her clothes...am I the asshole for suddenly deciding to slow it down and call it a night?
Those are two situations that can actually be harmful to you, I don't think they're the least bit comparable. Any "damage" done is simply because the person who was "tricked" considers it undesirable. Better comparison would be small penis or unsightly medical condition.Redryhno said:
Frankly, if you feel the desire to beat up or kill someone after you find out they intended to have sex with you using a micropenis, I think you're the one with the problem, not them.