PAX East 2010: PC Gaming Is In Partially Vegetative State

[Skaraa]

The smoothness of a mouse will never be matched by a controller. I've played with the Wii motion plus and it's still feels clunky, and I've played my share of FPSs on consoles and it's just not the same. And on the piracy issue, I really don't know what to say. I have a pretty large collection of games in physical form and even more on Steam and yet most of them I've played before buying. Maybe there are only a few people that do this, maybe not.

Also I hate MMOs with every fiber of my being. I fail to see the point in playing these games yet WoW, Aion, Eve and whatever is popular now, draw in a lot of people. I guess the social aspect is appealing to most players.

 

[SimuLord]

"If the console cycle goes too long, you can really see a resurgence of PC as developers want to target the visual high-end," said Kriener. "It really depends on how long [the console generation] goes."

Except for one small problem. When you target the visual high-end, you're getting out of the realm of people who buy games and into the realm of people who pirate them. There's a lot of overlap between "graphics whore" and "pirate".

To be quite honest, I'd like to see PC gaming "die" if by dying you mean EA, Ubi, and 2K taking their business and their DRM over to consoles and leaving Stardock, Paradox, and the open-source community to handle single-player PC gaming.

 

[ben---neb]

Gentlemen, I give you: Team Fortress 2

[/thread]

 

[The Great JT]

Yeah yeah, people whining about how WoW is popular, haven't heard that before...

 

[Koganesaga]

I blame all pirates that can't be bothered to pay for at least half their games.

 

[Deathfish15]

"The state of PC gaming industry right now is directly in response to World of Warcraft," said Kreiner. "You guys are all playing World of Warcraft, except for you, sir, you are the only one."

What a bunch of shit. He's saying that a) all PC gamers want to play is MMOs and that b) because of that, everyone who does play an MMO won't want to touch another game.

PC game sales rose by 3% last year, did they not? And 2009 was a bloody drought!

Maybe if people didn't feel like they were being shunned at every corner (I don't think we are particularly, but a lot of people do) then they'd be more willing to buy games.

Bad ports and DRM are what's causing this supposed "vegetative-state", not us who play on the platform.

So true, so true. The PC games are great when they're not stuck with ****ty DRM that prevents the player from actually playing the ****ing game they purchase.

It's not just the DRM, there are some games with pretty crappy set up systems that prevent enjoyable play. Red Faction Guerrilla, for example, had a great singleplayer game, but it's multiplayer setup (although it may work well with Xbox Live on consoles) sucks for PC and makes getting a game going take forever, if at all. Still, as I said before, the singleplayer is great and for that I purchased it and love it as they actually didn't screw it up when ported over to PC (usually ports have very, very bad problems that mess with the game).

 

[CanadianWolverine]

You see, DRM is only bad if its implemented wrong. Games that restrict you from installing on as many PC's as you wish, CD-Keys, that's all fine. Maintaining a CONSTANT internet connection is fucking retarded. Its meant to stop piracy, something that is MUCH harder to do on a console. I think I speak for the common working man when I say I earn my money and happily buy my multimedia products with the satisfaction they'll actually WORK when I install them on my computer.

Have to heavily disagree there, limited installs is by far one of the worst possible DRM methods (if not the worst IMHO) certainly equal to required internet connections at least.

The amount of installs it gives you only dictates how long it'll take you to screw you over.
For instance my spore disc was essentially bricked by limited installs the second day i had it. whilst the 15 instals bioshock2 has for instance would take longer to impact, it doesn't stop it happening.

DRM does far more to promote piracy than it does prevent it, most gamers agree [http://kotaku.com/5500495/kotaku-census-2010-the-results-in-full]:

Thank you very much for that Kotaku visitors census link, especially telling is Part 3 - The Personal Computer. Steam / Valve and Indy Developers must be laughing at the fools in this panel all the way to the bank.

 

[Keivz]

Yeaaah, explains why the newest PCs are more powerful than consoles and games like Dragon Age, Battlefield BC2, Mass Effect 2 and even the insulting Assassin's Creed 2 (with a 2.4 user score on Metacritics) sell extremely well.

The first three won over by offering superior versions of the games. Take a little more effort when porting or making a game, you'll get the effects you want and you'll shut up about "vegetative state" bullcrap.

PC gaming will always for me being secondary behind consoles and handheld, but it'll always be there. Some games simply put are far superior with a mouse and keyboard, while others better with a controller. I'd never want to play Dragon Age on console or FIFA on PC.

You do know that you CAN use a pad on a PC to play FIFA? And that FIFA has been on the PC since... the beginning?

I'm curious, how do you know these games have sold 'extremely well'? Any actual numbers or do you just have a feeling they sold well?

You mean except for the developer who said few days ago that there are more PC players than all console players put together?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battlefield_bad_company_2#Reception

By the end of March 18, the game sold 2.3mln on all consoles. Assuming that PC sold exactly twice as much as either Xbox or PS3, it gives about 1.53 millions. More if you include things like the Squad Pack on Steam, for instance.

Also I'm basing it on the sales in Polish stores. On all consoles, it's a top 1, including PC. Since Assassin's Creed 2 sold well... well, BFBC 2 sold even better. And it's still on top of the Steam sellers, even higher than Torchlight after 75% discount, Just Cause 2, new Command and Conquer or Dragon Age: Awakening.

Your information is outdated and inaccurate. First of all, the developer was misquoted: they never said that there were more PC players than consoles players combined. They said that 3 days after the game was released, there were more PC players playing online than on either console (a situation that changed 3 days later as the X360 then took the lead).

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/x360-bad-company-2-crowd-is-biggest

That says nothing about game sales. Hence your calculations regarding the 2.3 million sold 15 days after release are inaccurate as well. And looking at the steam charts or any other chart ranking says nothing about actual numbers. Comparatively, some PC games are selling better than others but that tells you nothing about total game sales.

Truth is almost no one in the public knows how well PC games sell because the numbers are rarely reported.

Wait, what? You want a forced, round-the-clock Internet access requirement in all games? And if there is a power outage on the other end of the world, a DDoS attack, they suddenly turn off servers for maintenance, or in 5-6 years they shut down the servers... Not likely? They don't earn as much as Blizzard, they can't afford to keep a game alive for 10 years and make patches for it. Hell, I remember that they STILL haven't patched Assassin's Creed I issues, like the one with lag when riding the horse...

I stand by what I said. I've had no issues with AC2. And yes, I don't think it's unreasonable to think that if they plan on shutting down their servers permanently then they'd release a patch to make their games playable offline (like valve said they'd do with steam). Citing unpatched game bugs as an example of why they wouldn't do this is not pertinent especially when valve games still have unpatched old bugs as well (like the can't jump bug at the end of HL2).

 

[Weaver]

I don't play WoW, yet if I have a choice I get the PC version of any game.

 

[Nimzar]

The problem that PC gaming faces is that the piecemeal upgrading of a gaming rig is simply more complicated than buying a console. People tend to go for what is simple. Yes, a complete gaming computer can cost $1000+ (I bought mine 5-6 years ago for $1000, and have poured another $400 since).

But the overall cost really isn't that much if you are buying a computer anyway. You can get decent graphic cards (if you don't go top of the line) for less than $100... If you are on a machine with Windows 7 you probably have several gigs of ram already. So from a the perspective of upgrading your video card... PC gaming isn't really that expensive. But you have to have the technological confidence and competence to open up your machine to install the new hardware and update drivers

I don't own a current gen. console. For me PC gaming is just more affordable at this point in my life. I already have a computer that can run (albeit barely) current games like Dragon Age. When I have the money to upgrade my graphics card I can do so for about $150 (vs $200 for a 360 or $300 for a PS3 w/out any games for it).

That said, I love my PS2 and there are console exclusive games that I am interested in. I am saddened that I haven't been able to sample any of the current gen jRPGs. Uncharted, Assassin's Creed, and GoW3 are also on my list of games I want to play but can't. So I wouldn't say that I'm an elitist PC gamer. I see the value of console gaming and wish I had the money to afford it at this point.

Each platform has its strengths (I would never play a fighting game on a PC, or a FPS on a console).

 

[Weaver]

The problem that PC gaming faces is that the piecemeal upgrading of a gaming rig is simply more complicated than buying a console. People tend to go for what is simple. Yes, a complete gaming computer can cost $1000+ (I bought mine 5-6 years ago for $1000, and have poured another $400 since).

But the overall cost really isn't that much if you are buying a computer anyway. You can get decent graphic cards (if you don't go top of the line) for less than $100... If you are on a machine with Windows 7 you probably have several gigs of ram already. So from a the perspective of upgrading your video card... PC gaming isn't really that expensive. But you have to have the technological confidence and competence to open up your machine to install the new hardware and update drivers

I don't own a current gen. console. For me PC gaming is just more affordable at this point in my life. I already have a computer that can run (albeit barely) current games like Dragon Age. When I have the money to upgrade my graphics card I can do so for about $150 (vs $200 for a 360 or $300 for a PS3 w/out any games for it).

That said, I love my PS2 and there are console exclusive games that I am interested in. I am saddened that I haven't been able to sample any of the current gen jRPGs. Uncharted, Assassin's Creed, and GoW3 are also on my list of games I want to play but can't. So I wouldn't say that I'm an elitist PC gamer. I see the value of console gaming and wish I had the money to afford it at this point.

Each platform has its strengths (I would never play a fighting game on a PC, or a FPS on a console).

SF4 on the PC is great. Though you'd be a fool to try to play with the keyboard (IMO).

This is what I never got about the price of PC games.
1) You probably need a computer for day to day activities.
2) Why not just slam a video card in it? Even a 200 dollar video card will be able to play almost everything out there, though not at max.
3) Games are WAY cheaper. Console only gamers literally have no idea what they're missing out on with steam deals.

This is a perfect example: http://store.steampowered.com/sub/2539/

THAT pack around october of last year, was on sale for HALF FUCKING OFF. Thats right, $50 dollars bought you this:

Company of Heroes
Company of Heroes: Opposing Fronts
Company of Heroes: Tales of Valor
Frontlines?: Fuel of War?
Full Spectrum Warrior
Full Spectrum Warrior: Ten Hammers
Juiced 2: Hot Import Nights
Red Faction
Buy Red Faction Guerrilla
Red Faction Guerrilla
Red Faction II
S.T.A.L.K.E.R.: Shadow of Chernobyl
Saints Row 2
Titan Quest
Titan Quest - Immortal Throne
Warhammer® 40,000?: Dawn of War® II
Warhammer® 40,000: Dawn of War® - Dark Crusade
Warhammer® 40,000: Dawn of War® - Gold Edition
Warhammer® 40,000: Dawn of War® - Soulstorm


If you were to buy each of those games it would cost $354.82 USD
I got it for $49.99 USD.


Bayonetta costs more than that!
And PC gaming is somehow expensive? I don't understand.


How about this? Torchlight is on sale right now for $5 damn dollars.
FIVE
DOLLARS
http://store.steampowered.com/app/41500/

It's not even a very intensive game. I promise you that almost EVERYONE on the escapist could be playing torchlight right now for 5 bucks.

o OS: Windows XP or later
o Processor: x86-compatible 800MHz processor
o Memory: 512MB
o Graphics: DirectX-compatible 3D graphics with at least 64MB of addressable memory (such as an ATI Radeon 7200, NVIDIA GeForce 2, or Intel GMA 950)
o DirectX®: 9.0c
o Hard Drive: 400MB

Why not get a steam account and try it out? Steam is free! I have about 35 hours clocked in torchlight. Surely that's worth $5?!?

I guess I'm so tired of everyone being "LOL PC gaming sucks and every PC gamer is a huge douche" when the instigator has never even DONE any PC gaming.

Try it! Right now!

 

[Kevlar Eater]

One reason why I stick to console gaming is because of two things: the cost of building one (or buying a pre-assembled one) and my fear of messing up on said PC. Touch or attach a part wrong, configure the wrong setting, or misread a direction on a major component (graphics card, RAM, motherboard) and you blow away hundreds of dollars and wasted time.

 

[Mr. Mike]

I stopped PC gaming almost before I started. When I saw how much it would cost to have the sort of gaming PC needed to run these things I knew that even if I did have the money, I would much rather spend it on things that I would use more often, like guitars and food.

I've never espoused one over the other really, and I think it would be a shame if PC gaming were to die, since so many people still clearly enjoy it, but they really need to expand their marketing techniques. I've seen ads for consoles, I've seen ads for games, but I have never seen an ad for PC gaming outside of PC gaming websites, which leads me to suspect that either the companies are trying to get along on the back of their existing fanbases, or they can't come up with a good advert for PC gaming, which says something.

You see, the thing is that while consoles are owned by a single company, PCs aren't really owned by any particular organisation. You get ads from Microsoft advertising Windows 7, you get ads from Apple advertising Macs, but there isn't a set company releasing all the games and advertising them for PC.

And in the same vein, there would be no point advertising PC parts because the only people that would actually be interested in building/upgrading their computers would be fairly learned in that area.

 

[RhombusHatesYou]

Well I just bought parts for a gaming computer which cost me $1,600, but that's partially because I had to buy the monitor, keyboard, mouse, Windows 7, etc. The system itself was about $1,000.

My last upgrade was 2 1/2 years ago, cost me around AU$1000 (near to complete full rebuild - only case and drives kept), and only now has started showing it's age. I'll probably get another 18 months out of it before I need to upgrade anything. Sure, I want to upgrade it right now. I always want to upgrade my machine but I rarely need to.

A lot of the fear for switching to PC as a gaming platform I think comes from newer generation gamers who just aren't very tech-savvy.

Damned kids never had to carve their own CPUs out of wood!

 

[Naheal]

PC gaming isn't even remotely close to dead yet. Sorry, folks, I'll defend the RTS genre on a PC any day, but I can't bring myself to defend it on the console for an extended period of time.

 

[RhombusHatesYou]

Being a 3D artist I need to keep my machine reasonably well specc'ed, so it makes a pretty good gaming platform and costs me nothing extra to what I already needed for other purposes. That means for me PC gaming is infinitely cheaper than console gaming.

The only draw back is I can't game while I render 3D work... but that's what books and movies are for or even, in a rush of madness, sketch out other concept work.

 

[-AC80-]

you know this is true and it shall stand