Because laws are perfect and everyone should always follow all of them no questions asked, i mean we should just stop having court trials, since laws are mostly clear enough. If anyone threatens me online(game/forum etc), I should track them down and let them arrest him. All of this clearly won't lead to a world were no one speaks about anything even slight controversial in fear of being locked up, truly a precedent we want to exist. /sarcasmSarge034 said:
Petition to Free Jailed League of Legends Player Reaches 100,000 Sigs
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Unless we've all been magically transported back to the Medieval ages, I'm pretty sure you can say whatever you want and whenever you want. Putting people in jail because of "dumbass comments" is not an indication of a healthy society.emeraldrafael said:
What threat? Which school did he threaten? "A school," is not specific enough for a threat. "LOL, JK" is actually an excuse, because it shows sarcasm/that he was joking. It's an important distinction because there is no longer much grey area in regards to intent, especially on the internet, where tone is hard to decipher. "LOL, JK" should be equated to a sarcastic tone if speaking in person.Sarge034 said:
Even if I did agree with you that there should be a trial for this kid, we should agree that he does not deserve months in jail, being constantly abused. He has suffered a bunch of abuse and was apparently on suicide watch. This is, if not a violation of the first amendment (which I believe it is), a violation of the sixth amendment, and maybe the eighth.
Signed this a few weeks ago.
Honestly, this isn't really the epitome of stupidity. If that's your reason, there are a lot of people far worse out there (the Republicans who defined pregnancy as before conception, anyone?). It wasn't even really a "joke", just pure sarcasm: a perfectly legitimate flavor of speech. He even explicitly stated as such in the original comment; that's more than most do.
You should say, "We heard you threatening to X, we are using that as grounds for a warrant to investigate such X."
You should not say, "We heard you saying X, you're not allowed to say that so we're hauling you in because of it."
Honestly, this isn't really the epitome of stupidity. If that's your reason, there are a lot of people far worse out there (the Republicans who defined pregnancy as before conception, anyone?). It wasn't even really a "joke", just pure sarcasm: a perfectly legitimate flavor of speech. He even explicitly stated as such in the original comment; that's more than most do.
This is actually one of the main I flaws I see with the First Amendment. From a more rational perspective, the threat alone should be protected, as the threat itself practically does no harm. The consequence of the threat, however, would be evaluated as potential evidence for intent to cause harm. Hell, yo could even argue that threats are good, at least they're kind enough to tip you off.Sarge034 said:
You should say, "We heard you threatening to X, we are using that as grounds for a warrant to investigate such X."
You should not say, "We heard you saying X, you're not allowed to say that so we're hauling you in because of it."
Folks: The terrorists always win.
Terrorists do rude things to get people to change their attitudes and declare war on the people around them, rather than the ones that did the scaring. Freedoms are lost hour by hour because no one is thinking about finding the folks that deliver bombs and lead slugs to the innocent.
They're thinking about the idiot with a keyboard saying outrageous things in a bid to get attention. Saying "loljk" after shouting "FIRE!" in a crowded theater won't get you out of charges of creating a panic.
But it also won't get you sent to prison for somewhere between eight years and the rest of one's natural life for "terroristic" activities, even if the net result is similar. Kid's an idiot, not a terrorist. Turn him loose, tell him to grab a steaming mug of STFU, and keep an eye on him for the next six months. After that, bring him in again for a psych eval. A hundred hours of commserv, and send him on his way. Don't waste a pile of money prosectuing him. Not worth your time or taxpayer money.
If Homeland Security can't be bothered, why are they? Oh, yeah. Prosecutors make careers out of this kind of case. A solid conviction can pave the way to a state or federal-level bench.
"Terroristic." Wow... That's such a new word that even my spell-checker is taking issue with it. What is our lexicon coming to?
Terrorists do rude things to get people to change their attitudes and declare war on the people around them, rather than the ones that did the scaring. Freedoms are lost hour by hour because no one is thinking about finding the folks that deliver bombs and lead slugs to the innocent.
They're thinking about the idiot with a keyboard saying outrageous things in a bid to get attention. Saying "loljk" after shouting "FIRE!" in a crowded theater won't get you out of charges of creating a panic.
But it also won't get you sent to prison for somewhere between eight years and the rest of one's natural life for "terroristic" activities, even if the net result is similar. Kid's an idiot, not a terrorist. Turn him loose, tell him to grab a steaming mug of STFU, and keep an eye on him for the next six months. After that, bring him in again for a psych eval. A hundred hours of commserv, and send him on his way. Don't waste a pile of money prosectuing him. Not worth your time or taxpayer money.
If Homeland Security can't be bothered, why are they? Oh, yeah. Prosecutors make careers out of this kind of case. A solid conviction can pave the way to a state or federal-level bench.
"Terroristic." Wow... That's such a new word that even my spell-checker is taking issue with it. What is our lexicon coming to?
You're misleading yourself if you think this is somehow new.chikusho said:
But they sometimes do and you get nothing for not trying.A3sir said:
When's the last time you shouted "fire" in a crowded theater or made a joke about a bomb at an airport?McKinsey said:
"Whatever and whenever" never existed. Let's not pretend otherwise.
The first time I truly realized the mob ruled anywhere was after Columbine. I was and am a big geek, and this was the 90's. Geeks still thought Trenchcoats were cool. This is important become the Columbine killers called themselves the Trenchcoat Mafia [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eric_Harris_and_Dylan_Klebold], a piece of info the media made sure we heard over and over again.
My friend Mike went to school the next day in his trenchcoat, as it was cold and grey and that's what he had to wear. We were outside ready to play some frisbee when one of the prinicpals came out. He told Mike to either take off the coat or get a detention. For really no reason than people thought he could be apart of the Trench Coat Mafia.
At this time, I should tell you that I went to High School in White Plains, New York. A brief trip to google displays that there is a 1,811 mile (2914 km) distance in between the two cities. People were just that paranoid and it allowed ignorance and knee jerk reactions take over. Mike decided to take a stand, he got a suspension.
I didn't agree with Mike at that point. I thought it was a small thing. He could have taken off the coat in respect. Now... I still don't agree with his actions. He came off a little childish, even if he was right. He could have tried to reason better instead of sounding condescending. But in reality, Logic is only a valid defense when the false security blanket we call 'civilization' is working correctly. You know, when people can be reasoned out of petty biases, closed mindedness, and when all have the general drive to make humanity better for all.
so, you know... it's never a valid defense.
We are scared little animals in nice clothes. We harness electricity and make marvels to look at the past and gloat about how enlightened we all are. But with the metaphysical lights go out, we're just as cowardly and afraid as the cavemen shivering at the sky when it throws loud light flashes at them.
The truth is there is really no defense to anything in the world. We can check and recheck planes, and something like San Francisco sadly happens. We can have countless million of legal gun owners in the US, and from Columbine to Sandy Hook, you have 29 mass shootings in the US alone [http://thinkprogress.org/justice/2012/12/14/1337221/a-timeline-of-mass-shootings-in-the-us-since-columbine/?mobile=nc]. Although every fucking death is tragic, with millions of gun owners in the US... we are damn lucky it isn't worse. Every major social event that happens in the US for at least the next two decades or next attack (which ever comes first), the first thing that 80% of the attendees and 100% of the organizers will think of is the Boston Marathon.
The sky is flashing. And it's flashing. And it's Flashing. And we just want it to stop. We will hit and bang and offer any sacrifice to the Sky Gods to make sure we can live in our cave, safe in our heads and terrified it will never be enough... so we are more than ready to offer more to the Sky Gods.
Until we can ever come to grips that we are no longer safe, and it's up to us for our own safety and realizing hell, that won't even be enough... Expect more. I hate to quote Men in Black, but it's so true, and that's why you'll see more NSAs and more Justin Carters as sacrifices.
My friend Mike went to school the next day in his trenchcoat, as it was cold and grey and that's what he had to wear. We were outside ready to play some frisbee when one of the prinicpals came out. He told Mike to either take off the coat or get a detention. For really no reason than people thought he could be apart of the Trench Coat Mafia.
At this time, I should tell you that I went to High School in White Plains, New York. A brief trip to google displays that there is a 1,811 mile (2914 km) distance in between the two cities. People were just that paranoid and it allowed ignorance and knee jerk reactions take over. Mike decided to take a stand, he got a suspension.
I didn't agree with Mike at that point. I thought it was a small thing. He could have taken off the coat in respect. Now... I still don't agree with his actions. He came off a little childish, even if he was right. He could have tried to reason better instead of sounding condescending. But in reality, Logic is only a valid defense when the false security blanket we call 'civilization' is working correctly. You know, when people can be reasoned out of petty biases, closed mindedness, and when all have the general drive to make humanity better for all.
so, you know... it's never a valid defense.
We are scared little animals in nice clothes. We harness electricity and make marvels to look at the past and gloat about how enlightened we all are. But with the metaphysical lights go out, we're just as cowardly and afraid as the cavemen shivering at the sky when it throws loud light flashes at them.
The truth is there is really no defense to anything in the world. We can check and recheck planes, and something like San Francisco sadly happens. We can have countless million of legal gun owners in the US, and from Columbine to Sandy Hook, you have 29 mass shootings in the US alone [http://thinkprogress.org/justice/2012/12/14/1337221/a-timeline-of-mass-shootings-in-the-us-since-columbine/?mobile=nc]. Although every fucking death is tragic, with millions of gun owners in the US... we are damn lucky it isn't worse. Every major social event that happens in the US for at least the next two decades or next attack (which ever comes first), the first thing that 80% of the attendees and 100% of the organizers will think of is the Boston Marathon.
The sky is flashing. And it's flashing. And it's Flashing. And we just want it to stop. We will hit and bang and offer any sacrifice to the Sky Gods to make sure we can live in our cave, safe in our heads and terrified it will never be enough... so we are more than ready to offer more to the Sky Gods.
Until we can ever come to grips that we are no longer safe, and it's up to us for our own safety and realizing hell, that won't even be enough... Expect more. I hate to quote Men in Black, but it's so true, and that's why you'll see more NSAs and more Justin Carters as sacrifices.
Kay said:
Just for the record, he's been charged, bail has been set, and he's even rejected a plea bargain. Ironically, the 8 years people keep citing comes from the plea that he rejected.Kamille Bidan said:
I agree. Trying to say this is an issue solely because of Newtown misses the point that tossing "JK" or "LOL" on after something doesn't make it less threatening. It downplays the nature of a threatening statement in a public venue.
Freedom of speech doe not equal freedom from consequences of what you say. With that in mind, this is way out of line. At most, his folks should have been called and they should have been the ones to sort it, as that should have been the worst consequence.
Please remind me of the last time shouting "Fire!" or "Bomb!" on the Internet led to someone being crushed under the heels of a panicked mob. Now that we can't actually hurt anyone in this new public space of the future, maybe we should leave that "crowded theatre" thinking behind?Zachary Amaranth said:
I have no love for the LoL community, and this guy's comment was the height of poor taste. That said, it was clearly sarcasm and should have warranted nothing more than a slap on the wrist, something minor to remind him that the authorities do take this stuff seriously. At this point I'd say reduce his sentence to "time served" and be done with it.
This basically means terrorism won as far as America is concerned. The point of terrorism is to spread mass fear, paranoia and panic, right? Well, it's done. It worked.
Regardless of whether the kid goes free or not, his life is fucked. Completely and absolutely ruined.
He's got enough negative press to the point that nobody will be willing to employ him when he grows up, the criminal accusation is going to stay...he might even be kicked out of school on grounds of the school not wanting him around.
Regardless of whether the kid goes free or not, his life is fucked. Completely and absolutely ruined.
He's got enough negative press to the point that nobody will be willing to employ him when he grows up, the criminal accusation is going to stay...he might even be kicked out of school on grounds of the school not wanting him around.
The way i see it, Should he have been punished for what he said? Yes, i feel that too many people hide behind the internet, thinking they can say whatever they want without consequence. However, 8 years in jail or more? That is total overkill.
Too many people don't really realize the consequences of their actions on the internet (both in the sense of this person, as well as costing possible future employment). Most people don't seem to understand that when you put something on the internet (particularly on Facebook or whatever) It's going to be there for a very long time, or forever. In this case the consequences were much more literal, and too overzealous, however I feel that comments such as the one he made should be punished in some manner. (just not for 8 years unless they find that he was actually going to act on it *ie: finding guns under his bed and a layout of the school or whatever*, 8 years is simply far too extreme for the situation.
Too many people don't really realize the consequences of their actions on the internet (both in the sense of this person, as well as costing possible future employment). Most people don't seem to understand that when you put something on the internet (particularly on Facebook or whatever) It's going to be there for a very long time, or forever. In this case the consequences were much more literal, and too overzealous, however I feel that comments such as the one he made should be punished in some manner. (just not for 8 years unless they find that he was actually going to act on it *ie: finding guns under his bed and a layout of the school or whatever*, 8 years is simply far too extreme for the situation.
You are clearly racist towards retarded schmucks, so I think we have a hate-crime here and as we all now freedom of speech nor context matters so /sarcasmfi6eka said:
What I actually meant was not that specific line, but your attitude in general, you just scream the kind of person who would make a personal threat if pushed far enough on the internet.
Srsly, think a little before you take a over-reacted stance just because someone was a jerk do you on the internet frequently or recently and your funneling that anger.
Some people here have stated that the law wants to "set an example" by punishing this kid. What example? What is that example supposed to mean? Sarcasm is now outlawed? Even that route to justify the actions of the law enforcers is completely wrong.
If this sort of thing happened in Europe, the guy would have been on the news for having caused a fuss, be fined for falsely putting the police on alert, everyone would laugh at him and continue on their merry ways.
If this sort of thing happened in Europe, the guy would have been on the news for having caused a fuss, be fined for falsely putting the police on alert, everyone would laugh at him and continue on their merry ways.
Everyone involved in his arrest and imprisonment should lose their jobs, it's absolutely disgusting what they have done to him and they should be ashamed of themselves for letting it get so far.
The fact that the mother is apologizing for what he said makes it even worse, is it really a society we want to live in that we have to live in fear that something we say might earn us jail time?
The fact that the mother is apologizing for what he said makes it even worse, is it really a society we want to live in that we have to live in fear that something we say might earn us jail time?
And... so... what makes you think I believe this is something new?Zachary Amaranth said:
Shouting fire in a crowded theater might get you a fine for inciting panic. Making a bomb joke at an airport might get you apprehended, questioned and searched due to (misguided) suspicion. Silly as it may be, in both of these instances there's at least a direct correlation between the joke and the location.McKinsey said:
But apparently making a facebook joke is enough to put someone in prison for 8 years.
You are misleading yourself if you think your examples are proportional to this situation.
