Poll: Do we nice guys still stand a chance?
- Thread starter Mr S
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THIS THIS THISNerf Ninja said:
Take it from an ex-"nice guy", (I gonna blow your mind here) SOMETIMES THE STUNNERS AREN'T THAT INTO YOU. I'm not just talking about external attractiveness either. Most of us "nice guys" want the girl with some backbone. That upfront,take-what-I-want behavior you keep seeing in their partners is probably pretty prevelant in them, too. You are just too lovestruck to see it. If your a hopeless romantic, you are probably going to seem like a prude and bore to these types (There are exceptions, I'm sweeping the board here). The ones you get along with best are the people who have the same delusions that you do. If one of the two of you can actually muscle up the courage to start a relationship, you have the best chance to make it work. It's much better than being a deadweight to someone who is unable or unwilling to go at the pace of a relationship that you want.
Hope this helps.
I have a girlfriend who was actually involved with another boy who she described as "more attractive" than me, when we first started going out. It was an open relationship. Eventually, I just asked her what she really wanted, the sexual desire or the loving relationship. Now we are REALLY into each other.
You just have to be able to get girls to go on dates with you. You're going to have to start thinking about your wardrobe and be prepared to get plenty of "no's". And look for girls in places that you wouldn't expect. Yes, dating websites can be useful if you have plenty of spare time, but you never really do know when the one that says "yes" will pop up. ALWAYS be on the prowl.
Nice guys, you may not have the devilish looks or those qualities that gets girls to say "yes" the first time, but after that first yes they'll ALWAYS be back for more.
You just have to be able to get girls to go on dates with you. You're going to have to start thinking about your wardrobe and be prepared to get plenty of "no's". And look for girls in places that you wouldn't expect. Yes, dating websites can be useful if you have plenty of spare time, but you never really do know when the one that says "yes" will pop up. ALWAYS be on the prowl.
Nice guys, you may not have the devilish looks or those qualities that gets girls to say "yes" the first time, but after that first yes they'll ALWAYS be back for more.
I was identified as a nice person by my friends before I met my girlfriend. I maintained leadership over the nerds on campus basically, and since she works on campus eventually noticed it. Kind of weird when it's the guy that gets asked out by the girl though, especially when afterwards you find out one of you're oldest friends considers her to be his sister (not by blood) x.x.i7omahawki said:
You can be nice, but be confident, and have control.
You do need a bit of an edge or else you're just boring, but there's no need to be a dick.
The same goes for girls, they can be too nice to. There needs to be some sort of spark there and, sad though it is, wet blankets don't give off too many sparks.
The same goes for girls, they can be too nice to. There needs to be some sort of spark there and, sad though it is, wet blankets don't give off too many sparks.
Girls are into good guys.....about 1/10th of the time. The other 9/10ths are jerk lovers. Makes me sad.
UGH I thought we'd gotten over these threads by now! I am sick of the generalizing commentary. Some women like "nice" guys, some like "not nice" guys, some like "not" guys, GET. OVER. IT.
Redford's Girlfriend says:
I am a girl who dated/been around guys who were jerks and I HATED it. Redford, though I know he's gonna read this, is one of the nicest guys that I have ever known and has been that way since the day I met him. Most of my friends prefer guys like him because nice guys treat girls right while jerks as just that... jerks.
I am a girl who dated/been around guys who were jerks and I HATED it. Redford, though I know he's gonna read this, is one of the nicest guys that I have ever known and has been that way since the day I met him. Most of my friends prefer guys like him because nice guys treat girls right while jerks as just that... jerks.
Considering I'm pushing 30, am married, and have been around the block once, allow me to share some of my old man experience:
Uncle Gamer_Parent's guide to nice guys and dating
On "Nice Guys" and "Jerks"
First of all, dispel the notion that all guys are divided in this way. Niceness and jerkiness are not qualities that is absent in one and present in another. Every person, in the right circumstances, has the propensity to be a saint or a monumental jerkwad. There is no exception to this.
If you're being nice because you want something from a girl, you're niceness is charge with ulterior motives and you're not really that nice to begin with... and that's okay. We are all influenced by our desires in one form or another, whether we like it or not. But you need to own up to it, or else you're just lying to yourself. And yes, that kind of behavior is still kind of jerky. Own up to it.
On asshole behavior
Being a dick is not inherently attractive behavior, not unless you're talking about some girls with some serious issues, in which case you're better off without them anyway. But you know what IS attractive? Having a backbone. Oh it's that whole confidence crap again, isn't it? Yes, yes it is. A lot of nice guys make the mistake of being basically a walking carpet, all the while being REALLY passive aggressive about it. It's really really pathetic. I'm not saying you SHOULDN'T be a gentlemen and all, I'm saying what a lot of nice guys lack is some self-respect. Self-respect here does not mean some vaguely chauvinistic attitude about what you're willing to do for her, it's about your values and how much you believe in them.
You know why a lot of girls like guys who are a bit of a jerk? Because for girls it's a signal that said guy actually knows who he is, and isn't afraid to show it. You see, the act of relationships is really confusing for girls. For guys, it's often just a matter of trying your best. For girls, they often have to figure out what a guy's intentions are and what kind of material is he. (dating or one night stand? marry or just fling? etc) It's like trying to piece together a whole picture when you can only see a corner thumbnail. It's difficult work. And so they have to rely on tail-tell signs and other heuristics. Seeing as confidence is like, the number one quality that women are attracted to, in general, an indication of that is a good sign for them. This is why all those Pick Up Artist douchebag communities are all about being assholes, because that's essentially what it is, showing signs of confidence. Yeah, they're not about subtlety there.
On Confidence
"It's all about confidence" is just about the most useless adage out there for guys. OF COURSE it's about confidence. A chimp who uses his feces as facial products can tell you that!
What people DON'T tell you, however, is what you need to do to get it. And I'm sorry, but... if you just FAKE confidence, or you just try to puff yourself up inside, you're not being confident, you're being an egotistical blowhard. Confidence takes real work. Confidence, in a word, is faith. Not "I go to church 3 times a week" sort of thing, but faith in the qualities that you exemplify. However, said faith needs to be justified too. Confidence, like respect, is earned, not given freely. I'm not saying you all need to workout like crazy, earn mad bank, and then buy empty status symbols. (Though, let's be honest, those things don't hurt if you have them) I'm saying you need to really dig deep and understand who you are and what you're good at first before you can get any true confidence. If all you are is a passive aggressive obese basement dweller who still lives with his mother of fairly subpar intellect, you have nothing to be confident about. The good news is that most of us AREN'T like that. Most of us, dare I say, have qualities that are worth being proud of.
The irony in all of this is that through course of doing so, a lot of you will probably decide that you don't REALLY need a relationship to feel good about yourself, and yet that is exactly when you find yourself surrounded with more options than you'd need.
So, what does this all mean? Don't be an ass, be comfortable in your own skin.
well, that's all well and good, but that doesn't tell me much about how I go about attracting a girl
Why, I'm so glad you mentioned that, theoretical reader! Most of what I said thus far is really about bettering yourself rather than the act of getting a date. So what exactly can you do today to help yourself get a girl? In no particular order:
- don't be afraid of rejection. It's going to happen, in dating and in life. Being all pissy about it doesn't help you, neither does letting the possibility paralyze you from taking action. (more on that later)
- don't pussyfoot around. If you're interested in her, let her know loud and clear. You don't have to make some super grand gesture for her first date. (you don't want to come on too strong is what I'm saying) However, you need to give her a clear indication of your interest. A girl's job is hard enough as it is. Don't make her work so damn hard to figure you out.
- if you don't exercise, start. If you do exercise, well, keep up the good work.
- if you don't know how to dance, learn. Seriously, this helps in SOOO many ways. Men who can dance tend to be more confident about themselves, have better body language, and are better at expressing themselves physically. Of course, there's caveat to this. Until you're confident about what you're doing, don't do it in public except in a safe setting. This is actually REALLY important since a guy who can't dance but tries will have his efforts SEVERELY backfire on him.
- if you dress like a slob, get a new wardrobe. Again, there are limits to these things. I'm not talking about going to the point of being a goddamn peacock, I'm saying you need to look presentable. Not in the "oh I'm going for a job interview" sort of way, but just that you know how to dress for the occasion.
- if you're interested in something, really pursue it. This is part of how you develop confidence. You get that by being good at stuff.
- try new things if you have spare time. What have you got to lose? It's not like you're using that time for something constructive anyways, and you might meet some new people. Lord knows that's how I met my wife.
- one liners, don't do them, unless you're doing them ironically. and even then, know when to not push the limits.
- learn how to entertain. I know this sounds like a douchebaggy thing to say, but all people like to have fun. that's the kind of thing that associates you with a warm glowing memory.
- Don't come on too strong. First date is NOT a good time to give her a huge bouquet of flowers, get a limo, and then declare your love for her. Save that for your one year anniversary. Being on the receiving end of such super heavy emotions early on is very stressful. It's okay if they observe that as part the peripheral as opposed to being on the receiving end of it. (i.e. watching you play a love ballad as part of a performance for a huge audience? awesome. watching you play that musical ballad for her exclusively on your first date? too much)
- learn to read physical language. Here's one thing that the pick up artist guys tend to do fairly well. this is pretty important since it tells you when it's safe for you to make a move and when not to. Here's one that I've learned over the years. If you ever finding yourself sitting on a couch with someone, and you're both settling in quite comfortably, here's what you do... play with her hair. Not dig your fingers deep, just the tip. If she gets uncomfortable with that, you can back off quickly without having gone in too deep and make things awkward. If she's okay with it, that's a sign that she's comfortable with you physically. Make a move, man.
that should do for now.
Uncle Gamer_Parent's guide to nice guys and dating
On "Nice Guys" and "Jerks"
First of all, dispel the notion that all guys are divided in this way. Niceness and jerkiness are not qualities that is absent in one and present in another. Every person, in the right circumstances, has the propensity to be a saint or a monumental jerkwad. There is no exception to this.
If you're being nice because you want something from a girl, you're niceness is charge with ulterior motives and you're not really that nice to begin with... and that's okay. We are all influenced by our desires in one form or another, whether we like it or not. But you need to own up to it, or else you're just lying to yourself. And yes, that kind of behavior is still kind of jerky. Own up to it.
On asshole behavior
Being a dick is not inherently attractive behavior, not unless you're talking about some girls with some serious issues, in which case you're better off without them anyway. But you know what IS attractive? Having a backbone. Oh it's that whole confidence crap again, isn't it? Yes, yes it is. A lot of nice guys make the mistake of being basically a walking carpet, all the while being REALLY passive aggressive about it. It's really really pathetic. I'm not saying you SHOULDN'T be a gentlemen and all, I'm saying what a lot of nice guys lack is some self-respect. Self-respect here does not mean some vaguely chauvinistic attitude about what you're willing to do for her, it's about your values and how much you believe in them.
You know why a lot of girls like guys who are a bit of a jerk? Because for girls it's a signal that said guy actually knows who he is, and isn't afraid to show it. You see, the act of relationships is really confusing for girls. For guys, it's often just a matter of trying your best. For girls, they often have to figure out what a guy's intentions are and what kind of material is he. (dating or one night stand? marry or just fling? etc) It's like trying to piece together a whole picture when you can only see a corner thumbnail. It's difficult work. And so they have to rely on tail-tell signs and other heuristics. Seeing as confidence is like, the number one quality that women are attracted to, in general, an indication of that is a good sign for them. This is why all those Pick Up Artist douchebag communities are all about being assholes, because that's essentially what it is, showing signs of confidence. Yeah, they're not about subtlety there.
On Confidence
"It's all about confidence" is just about the most useless adage out there for guys. OF COURSE it's about confidence. A chimp who uses his feces as facial products can tell you that!
What people DON'T tell you, however, is what you need to do to get it. And I'm sorry, but... if you just FAKE confidence, or you just try to puff yourself up inside, you're not being confident, you're being an egotistical blowhard. Confidence takes real work. Confidence, in a word, is faith. Not "I go to church 3 times a week" sort of thing, but faith in the qualities that you exemplify. However, said faith needs to be justified too. Confidence, like respect, is earned, not given freely. I'm not saying you all need to workout like crazy, earn mad bank, and then buy empty status symbols. (Though, let's be honest, those things don't hurt if you have them) I'm saying you need to really dig deep and understand who you are and what you're good at first before you can get any true confidence. If all you are is a passive aggressive obese basement dweller who still lives with his mother of fairly subpar intellect, you have nothing to be confident about. The good news is that most of us AREN'T like that. Most of us, dare I say, have qualities that are worth being proud of.
The irony in all of this is that through course of doing so, a lot of you will probably decide that you don't REALLY need a relationship to feel good about yourself, and yet that is exactly when you find yourself surrounded with more options than you'd need.
So, what does this all mean? Don't be an ass, be comfortable in your own skin.
well, that's all well and good, but that doesn't tell me much about how I go about attracting a girl
Why, I'm so glad you mentioned that, theoretical reader! Most of what I said thus far is really about bettering yourself rather than the act of getting a date. So what exactly can you do today to help yourself get a girl? In no particular order:
- don't be afraid of rejection. It's going to happen, in dating and in life. Being all pissy about it doesn't help you, neither does letting the possibility paralyze you from taking action. (more on that later)
- don't pussyfoot around. If you're interested in her, let her know loud and clear. You don't have to make some super grand gesture for her first date. (you don't want to come on too strong is what I'm saying) However, you need to give her a clear indication of your interest. A girl's job is hard enough as it is. Don't make her work so damn hard to figure you out.
- if you don't exercise, start. If you do exercise, well, keep up the good work.
- if you don't know how to dance, learn. Seriously, this helps in SOOO many ways. Men who can dance tend to be more confident about themselves, have better body language, and are better at expressing themselves physically. Of course, there's caveat to this. Until you're confident about what you're doing, don't do it in public except in a safe setting. This is actually REALLY important since a guy who can't dance but tries will have his efforts SEVERELY backfire on him.
- if you dress like a slob, get a new wardrobe. Again, there are limits to these things. I'm not talking about going to the point of being a goddamn peacock, I'm saying you need to look presentable. Not in the "oh I'm going for a job interview" sort of way, but just that you know how to dress for the occasion.
- if you're interested in something, really pursue it. This is part of how you develop confidence. You get that by being good at stuff.
- try new things if you have spare time. What have you got to lose? It's not like you're using that time for something constructive anyways, and you might meet some new people. Lord knows that's how I met my wife.
- one liners, don't do them, unless you're doing them ironically. and even then, know when to not push the limits.
- learn how to entertain. I know this sounds like a douchebaggy thing to say, but all people like to have fun. that's the kind of thing that associates you with a warm glowing memory.
- Don't come on too strong. First date is NOT a good time to give her a huge bouquet of flowers, get a limo, and then declare your love for her. Save that for your one year anniversary. Being on the receiving end of such super heavy emotions early on is very stressful. It's okay if they observe that as part the peripheral as opposed to being on the receiving end of it. (i.e. watching you play a love ballad as part of a performance for a huge audience? awesome. watching you play that musical ballad for her exclusively on your first date? too much)
- learn to read physical language. Here's one thing that the pick up artist guys tend to do fairly well. this is pretty important since it tells you when it's safe for you to make a move and when not to. Here's one that I've learned over the years. If you ever finding yourself sitting on a couch with someone, and you're both settling in quite comfortably, here's what you do... play with her hair. Not dig your fingers deep, just the tip. If she gets uncomfortable with that, you can back off quickly without having gone in too deep and make things awkward. If she's okay with it, that's a sign that she's comfortable with you physically. Make a move, man.
that should do for now.
I found out a cool trick when I was 16. If she's hot and she wants to tell you all her problems, she's closer to fucking Harvey Keitel than she is to actually being in a relationship with you, and she's either assuming you're a friend that isn't secretly pining for her or she's insecure and wants male attention without actually being attracted to you. Either way, if you don't want to be the best friend that watches her fuck everything with a pulse, make your feelings known and if she's not receptive (and she probably won't be) then remove yourself and don't go back.
That's really commenting on the general topic, responding specifically to the OP: Don't fake it, just keep looking. If you're exceptionally nice, that's going to be a turn-off for some girls. As a young adult male not currently in a relationship, I personally wouldn't want a relationship with a girl that's going to tell me how good I look when I wear my shittiest jeans and don't shave for a week, or tell me about how good my taste in music and literature is when it's obviously the shit I read and listen to, or offer to watch the extended version of Apocalypse Now even if I know she didn't like the original, it'd be awkward at first and really grating a few weeks in.
That's really commenting on the general topic, responding specifically to the OP: Don't fake it, just keep looking. If you're exceptionally nice, that's going to be a turn-off for some girls. As a young adult male not currently in a relationship, I personally wouldn't want a relationship with a girl that's going to tell me how good I look when I wear my shittiest jeans and don't shave for a week, or tell me about how good my taste in music and literature is when it's obviously the shit I read and listen to, or offer to watch the extended version of Apocalypse Now even if I know she didn't like the original, it'd be awkward at first and really grating a few weeks in.
I feel the same way man I've observed that girls tend to go for guys that are D bags 8 outta ten times. Now I'm I nice guy but seeing all these animals succed in getting the girls attention kinda ruffles my feathers alil bit. Drawing the conclusion that nature is trying to breed humanity into stupidity, an Idiocracy if you will
sylekage said:
Don't you love the "We can be friends" speech. The friendzone is the deadzone nothing happens ever
Soooo, 2 things. First, I consider myself a nice guy and I meet a girl 8 months ago. We are still together and it's wonderful, so it isn't impossible.Mr S said:This question is for all the ladies (especially the Dutch ones):
Are girls still interested in nice guys or is there really no more hope for us?
It has recently (past 17 years) come to my attention that a lot of men act like jerks in front of women, and the women seem to be enjoying it. Which leads me to think that women nowadays are attracted to complete douches.
(Un)fortunately, I don't belong to that specific group, and I consider myself to be a nice and confident guy.
In fact, my last date said it wasn't gonna work out because I was too nice.
Now I've tried to be a jerk, but I don't like myself anymore when I do that.
And neither do other people, so it would seem I am doing something terribly wrong.
Is there still any chance for us? We are just regular guys, except for that we aren't complete douches.
Also I've noticed that especially city girls are attracted to jerks, please comment on that too
Ok, I've read the replies and I'd like to delve deeper in the "some do like nice guys, some like jerks" thing. Now I believe that. Problem is I can't seem to find the ones that like nice guys. I just run into jerk-loving girls OR girls that already are in relations with other nice guys.
Second, and most important to you I think, there is always someone who is interested. Seriously. You just need to start looking around, maybe at the girls you've never considered before. Most guys, me especially, are oblivious to the small signs girls give out when they have an attraction to someone.
Now, I'm not saying you should just try to go out with anyone just because they have an attraction to you, but you may want to get to know them more. You know, just to check if you two click.
Some advice.
Just be completely honest with the women your after.
If they can see your not full of shit and tell it like it is that can attract the chicks as well.Best part is you dont have to compromise your self proclaimed 'nice guy' tag.
You wont get every woman your after but you'll get enough not to starve.
Just be completely honest with the women your after.
If they can see your not full of shit and tell it like it is that can attract the chicks as well.Best part is you dont have to compromise your self proclaimed 'nice guy' tag.
You wont get every woman your after but you'll get enough not to starve.
The answer is simple. Whether (strait) women admit it or not, or even realize it, they are sexually draw to men who appear strong.Mr S said:
In our current society, physical strength is not as essential a trait, so women want a man of social strength or intellectual strength (the latter is how I won my wife-to-be, by delivering academic beat-downs in the philosophy and comparative politics classes we shared).
The women who are drawn to "douchbags" are really women who've been mistrained (by women in their lives) and fail to understand the difference between manipulation or assholery and meaningful strength.
So ask yourself, are you "nice" or just weak?
My advice to you is this: stand up for yourself, be self-reliant, and find something useful to get damn good at, and don't to pander to random girl's needs for attention.
Make a man out of yourself and the women WILL come
Hopefully the RIGHT woman will find you
**I really don't want to sound like an ass, (of course I will though) but the tone of this post suggests you may be the "pandering to their need for attention" type
so yeah, BUILD YOURSELF and stop worrying
I went out with a lot of bad boys as a teenager but I've been settled with a genuinely "nice" guy since I was 18 now.
I think as a teen you like the danger these guys can bring. Those sorts of boys are still attractive, but only in movies or on TV for me. You don't want a bad boy for the long run.
So don't change at all, if you're a genuinely nice guy you'll find a woman who wants you for what you are and doesn't give a shit about any of these trends x
I think as a teen you like the danger these guys can bring. Those sorts of boys are still attractive, but only in movies or on TV for me. You don't want a bad boy for the long run.
So don't change at all, if you're a genuinely nice guy you'll find a woman who wants you for what you are and doesn't give a shit about any of these trends x
ha no big deal, i also was thinking and i remembered i didn't get my license until i was a junior in high school so there was no way in hell i'd be 15 or 16 in middle school lolartanis_neravar said:
still, fun information is fun to learn i suppose.