Poll: Do you support evolution?

Recommended Videos

gamernerdtg2

New member
Jan 2, 2013
501
0
0
uro vii said:
gamernerdtg2 said:
I believe that the things we create can evolve. Art, technology and so on can evolve. But it's a shame how scientists who believe in intelligent design are being taken out of the picture. I couldn't believe that Bill the science guy and Lavar Burton (who I grew up watching reading rainbow with) passed off creationism as meaningless, antiquated fallacy.

I find that modern science is boring. The museum of Natural History is without wonder now because we can somehow explain everything. I don't want to know everything, and I certainly don't want to be able to explain everything. I want to socialize with people who have studied things that I haven't studied, and see where our knowledge connects.

I blame the extreme conservative people. They have no idea who they are representing - they represent themselves and call that God. It's ridiculous. So many people have been turned off by this extreme stance that we now have the opposite extreme - angry atheists who are just as bad.

This jaded desire to explain everything has crept into art and also video game design. Everyone wants things to be explained down to the minute detail, otherwise it's drivel. I'm not into it.

So I vote for Creationism b/c I really don't want to know everything that there is to know. I want to be kept informed, I want to continue learning, but I also want to be blown away when I learn something new. I don't want to be like Darwin who said quote: "A scientific man ought to have no wishes, no affections - a mere heart of stone".



I can not get down with that. It's called lying to yourself. What are we doing when we take our affections out of the equation entirely?
To be honest, anything without any empirical basis has no place in science, which certainly does include intelligent design. Though that's certainly not to say you are in any way obliged to find the scientific explanations interesting or correct. Also, though I disagree with your dislike of the scientific community's attempts to explain and understand as much as they can, I will say the universe is enormous, we probably hardly understand the even smallest fraction of it at this point, I really don't think there is any danger of science taking the mystery out of it quite yet.
I am more about the atheist undercurrent within science.
I totally agree that there is a very thick, black line between faith and empirical evidence. We can't ask the scientific community to "believe", nor can we ask the religious community to neglect faith and be empirical in all things.
 

IamLEAM1983

Neloth's got swag.
Aug 22, 2011
2,578
0
0
Put me down for Team Science, and I don't agree that we're sucking all the wonder and awesomeness out of the universe. If anything, the little boom in terms of Modern Fantasy and/or Supernatural books and TV shows tells me that for all of the answers we get, we still like to stuff the dark little corners of the Earth with all sorts of unknowable creepy whatsits. I don't need to toss Science aside to think the world is mysterious and even scary. I can believe in Darwinism and gravity and, well, pretty much every single major scientific discovery made in the last few centuries, and still think that there's room somewhere for ghosts and ghoulies and vampires and whatnot.

And that room, that space? It's what we make of it. It's ours to control. Cultivating a rational outlook on things doesn't mean you have to stop playing Pretend if you don't want to.

Fuck, I'm thirty and I still scare myself shitless around my darkened house, at night. :)
 

DutchAssassin8

New member
Mar 11, 2010
185
0
0
I believe it was Neil Degrasse Tyson who said: "The beauty about science is that it is true wether you believe in it or not"

I think this speaks for itself
 

Lightknight

Mugwamp Supreme
Nov 26, 2008
4,860
0
0
Quaxar said:
Lightknight said:
It is somewhat comical that evolution is considered a theory still. It's a bit like calling gravity a theory.
And cue the explanations of what a scientific theory is.
Well, there are principles, there are forces, there are processes and then there are theories that make up those things. I'd say evolution is every bit as much an observable process as gravity is an observable force. Example, I am being pulled into my seat by a force known as gravity and I, despite being a man, have two nipples exactly where women do despite mine not having any particular purpose thanks to the trait not being maladaptive enough to have evolved away.

Lightknight said:
I, for example, reject the necessity that the speed of light is some noble constant despite it being prominently used as such in relativity calculations. I've seen a number of things, such as gravity impact, impede and even bend light in such a way that I'd call C (of E=MC^2 fame) a local (such as solar system local or galaxy local) constant/approximation at best. I'm not even quite sure that gravity can't pull it faster and reject the notion that the speed of light is somehow tied to time travel aside from appearing to travel through time in relation to others. What has this rejection of an accepted value have to do with rejecting "SCIENCE"?
Uh, that's what we have Special Relativity for? But who am I to argue against you, with that name...
Hah, hadn't considered my moniker in this discussion. I made up the name years ago when first venturing out into the dank dark interwebs to play chess online.

But yes, that's exactly my point. The equation assumes a constant speed of light and yet we have math to account for variances of the "constant". I was using what I felt to be a more than adequate example.
 

Shadowstar38

New member
Jul 20, 2011
2,204
0
0
SmokingBomber465 said:
Hey, look, 11 people are wrong! Don't let anyone fool you, there is NO argument against evolution. You are just wrong.

Not believing in evolution is like not believing in gravity.
11 people are not wrong. 11 people simply have beliefs counter to your own.

-

This as why threads like this go to R&P.
 

Amir Kondori

New member
Apr 11, 2013
932
0
0
"Believe in" seems a weird phrasing. Do I accept that the evidence points in favor of the theory of evolution? Yes. Do I "believe in evolution" to the exclusion of any new evidence that may come out that does not support the theory of evolution? No.
 

Snotnarok

New member
Nov 17, 2008
6,308
0
0
Believe it or not, it's basically proven with the exception of being able to show something evolve in real time. Hence why it's a theory ...like gravity, and the earth orbiting the sun, yes, they are theories. For some reason many seem to think a theory means a hypothesis, it's not.
 

Shadowstar38

New member
Jul 20, 2011
2,204
0
0
Master of the Skies said:
Lol, yeah, might as well go up to the professor after you get an answer wrong on an exam and declare "I'm not wrong, I just have beliefs counter to your own!" It'd make as much sense.
Funny story relating to that(funny or sad. You pick). When I was in Middle school, we had to learn basic evolution shit in science class. Though a Christian student made such a fuss, everyone was given the option to opt out for those weeks.
 

Amir Kondori

New member
Apr 11, 2013
932
0
0
Shadowstar38 said:
SmokingBomber465 said:
Hey, look, 11 people are wrong! Don't let anyone fool you, there is NO argument against evolution. You are just wrong.

Not believing in evolution is like not believing in gravity.
11 people are not wrong. 11 people simply have beliefs counter to your own.

-

This as why threads like this go to R&P.
Well some number of people are definitely wrong. Whether it is 11 or 788 or both groups of people I don't know for sure. But either the organisms of earth have come to be the way they are as described by the theory of evolution or in some similar way, or a divine creator made them as is, or something else entirely. All of these things can't be true. We don't know for sure which is describing what actually happened but we do have some evidence to support at least one of them.

This whole idea that all beliefs are equal is just not true. There is such a thing as truth.
 

Silk_Sk

New member
Mar 25, 2009
502
0
0
I'd answer the poll with "Yes, I believe in evolution: Go Science" except that seems to preclude that I am not a creationist, which I am. I just don't see evolution and creation (or indeed, religion and science as a whole) as being in conflict with one another.

Why does no one consider that god created evolution? Say he did throw the whole universe together in seven days. How long it took him doesn't matter. God is a being outside of time with unlimited power. 20,000 years ago (or whatever ridiculous age the extreme zealots claim the earth is) God created everyting, but he designed it to be a couple bazillion years old when he did, with all evolutionary paths intact. It's like Game of Thrones. Just because the story started a few years ago from it's current point doesn't mean that whole world is only a few years old. Centuries of history take place before we come to the point when the story starts. Why can't creation be like that? See? Both parties are satisfied.

Actually no, they're unsatisfied because they can't accept that being right doesn't have to mean the other party is wrong.
 

frizzlebyte

New member
Oct 20, 2008
641
0
0
thaluikhain said:
What I find particularly frustrating is that, IIRC, it is more controversial now than when Darwin first published. At the time, most Christian either didn't care, or found it interesting to some degree. It didn't threaten their worldview, it wasn't something they had to hush up.

But then the Monkey Trial happened in Texas, and it became something that many Christians felt they had to oppose, because it somehow became part of their religion, for no good reason that I can see.
Actually they were opposed to it, very much so, it is simply that it was not taught in the public schools and so they didn't feel they were being forced to teach what was, in their view, a lie to their children.

And the Scopes trial was in Tennessee, not Texas.

As for my part, yes I support and accept evolution, based on a preponderance of both documented and readily observable evidence. I also believe that religion and science can, and should, exist together.

I heavily subscribe to the idea that, even if something seems random to us, it might not be to an outside observer, based on the idea that if one knew or could calculate the position and movement of every atom in the universe, one could, in effect, predict the movements of said atoms, precluding the idea that events are random. So for our own purposes evolution (and by extension pretty much every other thing that happens in the universe) is random, but may not be, in fact, random, but also not guided by said outside observer.

Just for the record, I am Christian.
 

omega 616

Elite Member
May 1, 2009
5,879
1
43
I don't think you need belief in evolution, I think belief is what you have when you have no evidence to support something. I say evolution is a thing, like aging is a thing ... it just is and to deny it is a refusal of evidence.

I would say that since evolution and belief is usually only brought up when religion is uttered, it should be in that section.

It is a very flammable subject.
 

Lightknight

Mugwamp Supreme
Nov 26, 2008
4,860
0
0
Master of the Skies said:
Snotnarok said:
Believe it or not, it's basically proven with the exception of being able to show something evolve in real time. Hence why it's a theory ...like gravity, and the earth orbiting the sun, yes, they are theories. For some reason many seem to think a theory means a hypothesis, it's not.
That's untrue. We have viruses evolving in real time, and someone has pointed out a rather interesting thing about certain mosquitoes that changed so far when they moved underground that they can't even interbreed anymore.
Well, Snotnarok also said that gravity and the Earth orbiting the sun were theories too, soo...
 
Feb 28, 2008
689
0
0
Barciad said:
When the Chinese et al. look at the things us westerners tie ourselves in knots over, they must feel very content indeed.
The Chinese that still feel that rubbing a rhinoceros horn over your genitals cures erectile dysfunction? or having shark fin soup relieves cancer? That same, sane race of people? Westerns are probably the least religious or superstitious people on the planet.
 

masticina

New member
Jan 19, 2011
763
0
0
Some_weirdGuy said:
You wanna know the real kicker in these debates?


Evolution isn't the theory, which is something that BOTH sides seem to forget.
When people say 'the theory of evolution', it's actually just a nickname for 'the theory of evolution through natural selection'.



Evolution is not a theory, not even under the scientific definition of theory. Evolution is a phenomenon, and natural selection is the (scientific)theory to explain why/how evolution happens.


((same for gravity ladies and gents, gravity is no theory, 'general relativity', 'quantum gravitation' or the earlier newtonian 'universal gravitation' are the theories))
Thank you that was very useful, yes we need to use the right words. Some words mean different things in different situations.
 

Olas

Hello!
Dec 24, 2011
3,226
0
0
Rastelin said:
OlasDAlmighty said:
I'm a catholic, the Catholic church has never denied evolution, we fully embrace it along with nearly all branches of Christianity and Judaism. Only the most extreme religious groups I would think still refuse to believe in evolution.

And I find this "Team God" and "Team Science" thing pretty offensive.
The Catholic church does not embrace it scientifically. It embraces evolutionary creation which they have
slowly arrived to since Darwin's The Origin of Species was published in 1859. This has nothing to do with evolutionary science what so ever. You do not introduce untestable things as gods in to science and say you are on the same side. Science does not work like that.
No shit, which is probably why the Catholic church doesn't call itself a scientific institution. But the fact remains that it's never flat out denied the theory of evolution even back when it was first proposed.

Believe it or not it's possible for some of us to hold scientific beliefs and religious beliefs and understand the difference between them.
 

Meatspinner

New member
Feb 4, 2011
435
0
0
Shouldn't this thread be in the "Religion and Politics" forums?

MasterOfHisOwnDomain said:
Westerns are probably the least superstitious people on the planet.
By which measurement?
 

gamernerdtg2

New member
Jan 2, 2013
501
0
0
Master of the Skies said:
gamernerdtg2 said:
I believe that the things we create can evolve. Art, technology and so on can evolve. But it's a shame how scientists who believe in intelligent design are being taken out of the picture. I couldn't believe that Bill the science guy and Lavar Burton (who I grew up watching reading rainbow with) passed off creationism as meaningless, antiquated fallacy.

I find that modern science is boring. The museum of Natural History is without wonder now because we can somehow explain everything. I don't want to know everything, and I certainly don't want to be able to explain everything. I want to socialize with people who have studied things that I haven't studied, and see where our knowledge connects.

I blame the extreme conservative people. They have no idea who they are representing - they represent themselves and call that God. It's ridiculous. So many people have been turned off by this extreme stance that we now have the opposite extreme - angry atheists who are just as bad.

This jaded desire to explain everything has crept into art and also video game design. Everyone wants things to be explained down to the minute detail, otherwise it's drivel. I'm not into it.

So I vote for Creationism b/c I really don't want to know everything that there is to know. I want to be kept informed, I want to continue learning, but I also want to be blown away when I learn something new. I don't want to be like Darwin who said quote: "A scientific man ought to have no wishes, no affections - a mere heart of stone".

I can not get down with that. It's called lying to yourself. What are we doing when we take our affections out of the equation entirely?
Voting for a position on any basis other than truth is lying to yourself. Not once did I see facts to back up your position, only the desire to not know everything.
But science says that voting for a position on any other basis than empirical evidence is lying to yourself. Sometimes the truth and the empirical evidence don't agree.
 

80sboy

New member
May 23, 2013
167
0
0
Go team Science? Since when did it become about picking sides?

I believe in evolution because it's a theory that's been around for almost 2 centuries now and makes sense. There's also a lot of shit I don't believe that scientist think now because the idea hasn't been put through the ringing as much as evolution has in debating and arguing and research. String Theory for one.

Question? What difference is there in a scientist telling us what we should think, compared to a priest telling us what we should thing? If we decide not to be critical about it...since when did become about science vs religion? It's true that they both bud heads a lot, but I find that stupid, it's no different than centuries ago when people would wage war to prove their gods were the real ones.

Science is about critical study to draw conclusion, it's not some stupid tag team in Westlmania taking on religion.

Ugh!

>>
 

Yopaz

Sarcastic overlord
Jun 3, 2009
6,087
0
0
Not only do I believe in evolution, I actually have a decent understanding of it unlike the majority of those I have seen on this site. I'll admit that I don't know enough to say I am confident enough to teach what I know, but I know enough to recognize the bullshit some people think is how it works. Yeah, I am talking about those who say that evolution is all a product of random mutation.