Poll: Do you think I stand a chance?

[Mr.Mattress]

1) Sex-specific uniform is sexist, because it encourages treating the sexes differently, and it splits the school into two factions and discourages socialisation between the two.
2) Sex-specific uniform discriminates against transgendered pupils and forces them to conform with their birth-assigned sex.
3) To deny certain clothing to some pupils because of their random event at their birth, is discriminatory.

I'd hate to be that guy that needs to say "There are some reasons this is preferred to that", but I guess I am going to:

1) Sex-Neutral uniforms are also sexist, because it ignores the fact that there are differences in the sexes, and ignoring these difference could be very bad (I can't remember the specific word for when you don't take sexes into account, but exists).
2) Sex-Neutral uniforms discriminates against people with defined genders and forces them to dress neutrally so that "Everything is Equal" (As much as I want to say Everything is Equal, in the real world, people aren't equal. Some are sheep and some are herders, as much as I don't like it, that's how the world works)
3) I don't know what you mean by that one, so I am gonna skip.

In my Opinion, you should petition to get rid of Uniforms completely. Conformitiy sucks and everyone should be allowed to express themselves freely. Seeing as how you obviously go to a Private School, I guess I'll support your Sex-Neutrality Dress Code cause it's at least a step closer towards ridding of School Uniforms. But I don't think you'll get it passed.

 

[orangeban]

1) Sex-specific uniform is sexist, because it encourages treating the sexes differently, and it splits the school into two factions and discourages socialisation between the two.
2) Sex-specific uniform discriminates against transgendered pupils and forces them to conform with their birth-assigned sex.
3) To deny certain clothing to some pupils because of their random event at their birth, is discriminatory.

I'd hate to be that guy that needs to say "There are some reasons this is preferred to that", but I guess I am going to:

1) Sex-Neutral uniforms are also sexist, because it ignores the fact that there are differences in the sexes, and ignoring these difference could be very bad (I can't remember the specific word for when you don't take sexes into account, but exists).
2) Sex-Neutral uniforms discriminates against people with defined genders and forces them to dress neutrally so that "Everything is Equal" (As much as I want to say Everything is Equal, in the real world, people aren't equal. Some are sheep and some are herders, as much as I don't like it, that's how the world works)
3) I don't know what you mean by that one, so I am gonna skip.

In my Opinion, you should petition to get rid of Uniforms completely. Conformitiy sucks and everyone should be allowed to express themselves freely. Seeing as how you obviously go to a Private School, I guess I'll support your Sex-Neutrality Dress Code cause it's at least a step closer towards ridding of School Uniforms. But I don't think you'll get it passed.

I think I'll have to edit my original post to emphasise that ideally I want a gsystem where you can pick-and-choose elements from both uniforms, but I'll address your points anyway.

1) I suppose it's a balance of harms, in my opinion making people behave differently because of their sex is totally sexist (that's the point I was getting at with number 3)
2) Unfortunately that is just a problem with uniform in general, it suppresses freedom of expression.
3) See 1.

 

[4RM3D]

So Escapist, lately at my school, I've been organizing a petition. The aim of the petition is to get a gender-neutral uniform put in place. Currently, girls have to wear skirts ...

I stopped reading there. Damn, I went to the wrong school in the wrong country! Oh wait, that was not the point.

Nope, I don't think a petition is going to work. Nonetheless, if you strongly feel you should do something, then you should still try the petition. Even if you fail, you at least know you have tried.

 

[Henkie36]

Since 2 of 5 arguments center around transsexuals, this should also be more or less the devide at your school. Which I highly doubt, but please, prove me wrong if I am. If this isn't the case, drop the arguments based on that.

Plus, you need more petitions. That may be a concern for later, but 1 in 8 is not enough.

 

[Verlander]

I don't think many people would appreciate you for this anyway, so you might be fighting a lost cause. If you were to have a petition where there was an opt-in optional gender neutral uniform, you might get more sympathy, but the whole thing is an expense and a headache with suppliers, and you'll find that both boys and girls do not want to be wearing the same uniform. So yeah, I'd wish you luck with your petition, but frankly it's a waste of time and money. Sorry.

 

[krazykidd]

So Escapist, lately at my school, I've been organizing a petition. The aim of the petition is to get a gender-neutral uniform put in place. Currently, girls have to wear skirts and boys trousers (along with various other differences), but I hope to change that. Ideally I want a system where you can pick and choose between either uniform, but I'd also settle for a single gender-neutral uniform. I plan to send this petition to the powers-that-be in my school, along with a letter detailing my arguments, these arguments being:

1) Sex-specific uniform is sexist, because it encourages treating the sexes differently, and it splits the school into two factions and discourages socialisation between the two.
2) Sex-specific uniform discriminates against transgendered pupils and forces them to conform with their birth-assigned sex.
3) To deny certain clothing to some pupils because of their random event at their birth, is discriminatory.

If you want to know more details, I go to a private Scottish school, my petition has about 100 signatures in a school with around 800 kids, and this kinda thing is unprecedented.

What do you think?

Edit: Thought of a way to make my points better.

1) Not only does it divide pupils, but it encourages people to look at and treat the two sexes differently.
3) By having a gender-neutral uniform, this firstly de-emphasises genders importance so a transgendered/gender-confused pupil would feel less self-conciouss about it all, and it would make it easier for them to experiment.

Double Edit: Please note that what I really want is a system where you can pick certain items of clothing from either of the current uniforms. I do not want a single gender-neutral uniform, but I'd prefer that to the current system.

My question to you is ( and please don't take this the wrong way ): in your petition , you want girls to be able to wear trousers and have a unisex uniform , but can girls still decide to wear skirts? And can BOYS decide to wear skirts if they wish ? If the answer to either of these is no , then you are being a tad bit hypocritical .

 

[orangeban]

So Escapist, lately at my school, I've been organizing a petition. The aim of the petition is to get a gender-neutral uniform put in place. Currently, girls have to wear skirts and boys trousers (along with various other differences), but I hope to change that. Ideally I want a system where you can pick and choose between either uniform, but I'd also settle for a single gender-neutral uniform. I plan to send this petition to the powers-that-be in my school, along with a letter detailing my arguments, these arguments being:

1) Sex-specific uniform is sexist, because it encourages treating the sexes differently, and it splits the school into two factions and discourages socialisation between the two.
2) Sex-specific uniform discriminates against transgendered pupils and forces them to conform with their birth-assigned sex.
3) To deny certain clothing to some pupils because of their random event at their birth, is discriminatory.

If you want to know more details, I go to a private Scottish school, my petition has about 100 signatures in a school with around 800 kids, and this kinda thing is unprecedented.

What do you think?

Edit: Thought of a way to make my points better.

1) Not only does it divide pupils, but it encourages people to look at and treat the two sexes differently.
3) By having a gender-neutral uniform, this firstly de-emphasises genders importance so a transgendered/gender-confused pupil would feel less self-conciouss about it all, and it would make it easier for them to experiment.

Double Edit: Please note that what I really want is a system where you can pick certain items of clothing from either of the current uniforms. I do not want a single gender-neutral uniform, but I'd prefer that to the current system.

My question to you is ( and please don't take this the wrong way ): in your petition , you want girls to be able to wear trousers and have a unisex uniform , but can girls still decide to wear skirts? And can BOYS decide to wear skirts if they wish ? If the answer to either of these is no , then you are being a tad bit hypocritical .

Yeah, my proposed system would allow girls to wear trousers and boys to wear skirts (they can even call the skirts "kilts" if it makes them feel more comfortable).

 

[orangeban]

Since 2 of 5 arguments center around transsexuals, this should also be more or less the devide at your school. Which I highly doubt, but please, prove me wrong if I am. If this isn't the case, drop the arguments based on that.

Plus, you need more petitions. That may be a concern for later, but 1 in 8 is not enough.

I don't understand, I've only proposed 3 arguments here (the edit shows elaborations on two of the original arguments, not new arguments).

Anyway, I disagree with you, I think if it could possibly improve the well-being of transgendered or just plain confused students, then those arguments deserve just as much air-time as the other arguments.

 

[hazabaza1]

It probably won't work and you'll probably get laughed at because people will think you want to wear a skirt. (Assuming you're a dude though)
Good luck, I guess.

 

[Shifty Tortoise]

Gender neutrality is boring, why would you want everyone to be the same?

 

[The_Waspman]

So the chicks at your school aren't allowed to wear trousers? Man, I left school over half my lifetime ago, and we abolished that 'girls must wear skirts rule' back then.

 

[DEAD34345]

Sounds pretty pointless to me. I'm certainly not against the idea, I just don't personally consider it to be worth getting worked up about.

That's just me though, if you're really passionate about this... issue, then you might as well try. Even if it goes nowhere (which I'm afraid to say it probably will), there's no harm done, and you can feel better about yourself for supporting a cause you believe in.

 

[Charles McGuffin]

Don't ask here, just do it.

 

[Henkie36]

Plus, you need more petitions. That may be a concern for later, but 1 in 8 is not enough.

I don't understand, I've only proposed 3 arguments here (the edit shows elaborations on two of the original arguments, not new arguments).

Anyway, I disagree with you, I think if it could possibly improve the well-being of transgendered or just plain confused students, then those arguments deserve just as much air-time as the other arguments.

Ok, fair enough, they were elaborations. But do you really think that an argument like that is going to hit home? It might be a real argument, but the usefulness is dictated by the amount of people connected to it. And you still haven't awnsered my question, which I have to adjust by now: Is 1/3 of the school transsexual? Then it would strike some serious gold.

 

[Vykrel]

im not sure whether or not you have a chance. it seems that most of the time, the schools get their way.

personally, i think uniforms are freaking stupid to begin with. uniforms in school stifle creativity and originality. i cant help but think of robots when i see mass amounts of students in uniforms. the ones wearing pants are male units, and the ones in skirts are female units.

 

[Vykrel]

im not sure whether or not you have a chance. it seems that most of the time, the schools get their way.

personally, i think uniforms are freaking stupid to begin with. uniforms in school stifle creativity and originality. i cant help but think of robots when i see mass amounts of students in uniforms. the ones wearing pants are male units, and the ones in skirts are female units.

 

[lRookiel]

Why wear uniforms at all? I think it's such a dated prospect, how about trying to get the freedom to choose what you wear instead.

Good luck anyway

 

[godofallu]

I don't understand why you would fight for this, or why you would think you can "win". That said let's say you do win and guys are suddenly allowed to wear skirts too. Would anyone actually do that?

I guess a few girls might wear pants now. What a change.

 

[theriddlen]

This thread is just another example of people going too far when fighting for a theoretically good cause. And things like that are beginning to be frequent lately.

Yes, it is wrong to discriminate one of genders, claim one of them is superior, but we have to remember, that men and women are different. You can scream and shout all you want, but it won't change the fact that men and women are built bit differently, and we have to take these things in account. You can't just pretend like girls don't have breasts and men don't have penises, and even if you could, what's the point? Most people like who they are, and if some don't, well, they should try to work on themselves not try to bend everyone to their vision of society.

Also, I never got the point of school uniforms existence. In my country we don't have them and nothing bad happens because of it.

 

[fleurdust]

im not sure whether or not you have a chance. it seems that most of the time, the schools get their way.

personally, i think uniforms are freaking stupid to begin with. uniforms in school stifle creativity and originality. i cant help but think of robots when i see mass amounts of students in uniforms. the ones wearing pants are male units, and the ones in skirts are female units.

I miss having a uniform, I hate having to think of new outfits every day. Love that I have a work uniform